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Centerfire Rifles - Semiautomatic or Gas Operated Centerfire rifles, carbines and other gas operated rifles.

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  #1  
Old 05-13-2012, 6:23 PM
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Default Best AR-15 for beginners?

I am looking for an AR-15 but I don't know which one I should get. Please help.
Thanks!
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Old 05-13-2012, 6:29 PM
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In order to make a better question tell the forum a little about you and even more about how you intend to use the AR-15.
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Old 05-13-2012, 6:29 PM
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S&W sport?
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Old 05-13-2012, 6:30 PM
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build one your self so you can learn everything about the gun.
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Old 05-13-2012, 6:33 PM
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S&W 15-22 period. You can practice for super cheap, super low recoil, operates exactly like a .223.
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Old 05-13-2012, 6:36 PM
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I'm a fan of midlengths gas system Ar's , I like the longer sight raidius ,but still handy short barrel. Here is one I assembled on a Noveske N4 lower with a delton midlength kit. I sent the barrel out to Adco firearms to have it full length fluted.



Last edited by torquefliteterror; 05-13-2012 at 6:43 PM..
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Old 05-13-2012, 6:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by artoaster View Post
In order to make a better question tell the forum a little about you and even more about how you intend to use the AR-15.
I just started shooting shotguns last year, bought a benelli nova 12 28 but it's too heavy.. couldn't swing it that well.. so I bought a remington 870 20 18 with knoxx spec ops stock.. I have no problems shooting clays with it..
just tried a Marlins (don't know if I spell it right) bolt action 17 and I think it's very accurate and it has no recoil.. I think it's easy to look through the scope too.. looking for similar gun in AR.. thanks!
oh.. and I'm just shooting targets and tin cans in 50 and 100 yards

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Originally Posted by h0use View Post
build one your self so you can learn everything about the gun.
I don't know how to build one ><

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Originally Posted by Leadmaster View Post
S&W sport?
is it same as the 15-22?
Quote:
Originally Posted by HK4113 View Post
S&W 15-22 period. You can practice for super cheap, super low recoil, operates exactly like a .223.
My friend also suggested me to get this one..
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Originally Posted by torquefliteterror View Post
I'm a fan of midlengths gas system Ar's , I like the longer sight raidius ,but still handy short barrel.
example please?

Thanks!
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Old 05-13-2012, 6:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HK4113 View Post
S&W 15-22 period. You can practice for super cheap, super low recoil, operates exactly like a .223.
The .223 / 5.56 doesn't have any notable recoil either.
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Old 05-13-2012, 6:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smurfette View Post
oh.. and I'm just shooting targets and tin cans in 50 and 100 yards


I don't know how to build one ><


is it same as the 15-22?

My friend also suggested me to get this one..

example please?

Thanks!
The M&P 15 sport is the .223 version of the 15-22. They are not the same.

The 15-22 is lighter and will allow you to shoot targets or cans at 100 yards for much cheaper than a full size .223 ar.

20 rounds of .223 costs 6 bucks on the low end, so 15-16 bucks for 100.

You can buy 100 rounds of good .22 ammo for 7-8 bucks for like CCI Mini Mags, or you can go to walmart and buy a value pack that has 500 or so rounds in it for 18 bucks. The value pack .22 will run perfectly fine in the 15-22.
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Old 05-13-2012, 6:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Press Check View Post
The .223 / 5.56 doesn't have any notable recoil either.
never heard of 5.56

are .22 and .223 a lot different?
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Old 05-13-2012, 6:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Press Check View Post
The .223 / 5.56 doesn't have any notable recoil either.
I will agree that it has very low recoil, especially with the PWS brake I put on mine, however you cannot deny that a .22 has less recoil, its simple physics.

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Old 05-13-2012, 6:45 PM
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Originally Posted by HK4113 View Post
The M&P 15 sport is the .223 version of the 15-22. They are not the same.

The 15-22 is lighter and will allow you to shoot targets or cans at 100 yards for much cheaper than a full size .223 ar.

20 rounds of .223 costs 6 bucks on the low end, so 15-16 bucks for 100.

You can buy 100 rounds of good .22 ammo for 7-8 bucks for like CCI Mini Mags, or you can go to walmart and buy a value pack that has 500 or so rounds in it for 18 bucks. The value pack .22 will run perfectly fine in the 15-22.
thanks.. .22 is a lot cheaper. but is it similar to .223? recoil wise
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Old 05-13-2012, 6:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smurfette View Post
never heard of 5.56

are .22 and .223 a lot different?
5.56 is very similar to .223 and for the purposes of this conversation we can say that they are equal.



This is a .223 on the right and .22 on the left. You can see how much gun powder they can hold.
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  #14  
Old 05-13-2012, 6:47 PM
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There are several .22 LRs out there that look and feel just like real ARs, and let you shoot for much cheaper than a .223 Remington. However, if you want a real AR it is impossible to go wrong with the S&W Sporters that Leadmaster mentioned. You can find them on sale in the $650 range most of the time. And they come with a lifetime warranty. I am a huge fan of building your own, but I know that isn't for everybody. The S&W gives you a lower price point for an entry rifle, and will stand up to many guns that cost more. And the warranty means that if something goes wrong with it, you have some recourse. Not so with a home build.

-Mb
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Old 05-13-2012, 6:47 PM
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Originally Posted by smurfette View Post
thanks.. .22 is a lot cheaper. but is it similar to .223? recoil wise
You will be able to handle a .223 no doubt. However I can definitely feel a difference between .22 and .223, and in my opinion a good beginner gun is one that you are going to be able to shoot and practice with a lot, and for me I can afford much more .22 to practice with.
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Old 05-13-2012, 6:48 PM
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.22 is a rimfire cartridge while the .223/5.56 is a centerfire so just that in inself is completely different....casing size is another huuuuuuuuuuuge difference
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Old 05-13-2012, 6:48 PM
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By the way, in my opinion, there's no AR for beginners. Other than caliber, they all essentially feature the same ergonomics. Pick a rollmark and have at it. At the end of the day, a beginners AR is whatever AR you can afford.
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Old 05-13-2012, 6:50 PM
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S&W M&P 15 Sport.
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Old 05-13-2012, 6:51 PM
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well most likely you have little/no experience with AR15's and how they function. but we've all been there.

now i can also assume you don't want to spend a whole ton of money (or maybe you do)

but the Smith and Wesson m&p15 would be a good start for buying a complete rifle.. it comes with a warranty and is a fair quality firearm for the price. it wont disappoint for the $

or there's the option of assembling your own. ( this is the route i went as to gain knowledge of the firearm and how its put together)

it might not be for you if you are not mechanically inclined because it takes a bit of work and skills with your hands. but if you're up to the challenge there is plenty of info on the web on the assembly of an AR15 and youtube videos helped me a ton with my build.

good luck on any route you take.
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Old 05-13-2012, 7:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HK4113 View Post
5.56 is very similar to .223 and for the purposes of this conversation we can say that they are equal.



This is a .223 on the right and .22 on the left. You can see how much gun powder they can hold.
huge difference...

Quote:
Originally Posted by gun toting monkeyboy View Post
There are several .22 LRs out there that look and feel just like real ARs, and let you shoot for much cheaper than a .223 Remington. However, if you want a real AR it is impossible to go wrong with the S&W Sporters that Leadmaster mentioned. You can find them on sale in the $650 range most of the time. And they come with a lifetime warranty. I am a huge fan of building your own, but I know that isn't for everybody. The S&W gives you a lower price point for an entry rifle, and will stand up to many guns that cost more. And the warranty means that if something goes wrong with it, you have some recourse. Not so with a home build.

-Mb
$650 is my range. I can go up to $1200 cuz originally I wanted to get a Benelli Montefeltro on top of my Remington 870 with Knoxx stock..


Quote:
Originally Posted by HK4113 View Post
You will be able to handle a .223 no doubt. However I can definitely feel a difference between .22 and .223, and in my opinion a good beginner gun is one that you are going to be able to shoot and practice with a lot, and for me I can afford much more .22 to practice with.
I shot a .40 today.. yes I could handle it, but I shot way off the target cuz I anticipated the recoil and the recoil really affected my accuracy..

Quote:
Originally Posted by drifter001 View Post
.22 is a rimfire cartridge while the .223/5.56 is a centerfire so just that in inself is completely different....casing size is another huuuuuuuuuuuge difference
I'm sorry. I don't even know what are rimfire and centerfire.. ><

Quote:
Originally Posted by Press Check View Post
By the way, in my opinion, there's no AR for beginners. Other than caliber, they all essentially feature the same ergonomics. Pick a rollmark and have at it. At the end of the day, a beginners AR is whatever AR you can afford.
true...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ir0nclash86 View Post
S&W M&P 15 Sport.
thanks!

Quote:
Originally Posted by edwardjames View Post
well most likely you have little/no experience with AR15's and how they function. but we've all been there.

now i can also assume you don't want to spend a whole ton of money (or maybe you do)

but the Smith and Wesson m&p15 would be a good start for buying a complete rifle.. it comes with a warranty and is a fair quality firearm for the price. it wont disappoint for the $

or there's the option of assembling your own. ( this is the route i went as to gain knowledge of the firearm and how its put together)

it might not be for you if you are not mechanically inclined because it takes a bit of work and skills with your hands. but if you're up to the challenge there is plenty of info on the web on the assembly of an AR15 and youtube videos helped me a ton with my build.

good luck on any route you take.
yes, I don't know anything about it. trying to learn..
I won't really have time to learn how to build one cuz I work full time and I am in a band singing and playing keyboard. plus I'm learning guitar with another group. too busy.. but I would like to start learning how to shoot ARs.. @.@
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Old 05-13-2012, 7:09 PM
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Originally Posted by smurfette View Post
huge difference...

$650 is my range. I can go up to $1200 cuz originally I wanted to get a Benelli Montefeltro on top of my Remington 870 with Knoxx stock..

I shot a .40 today.. yes I could handle it, but I shot way off the target cuz I anticipated the recoil and the recoil really affected my accuracy..


yes, I don't know anything about it. trying to learn..
I won't really have time to learn how to build one cuz I work full time and I am in a band singing and playing keyboard. plus I'm learning guitar with another group. too busy.. but I would like to start learning how to shoot ARs.. @.@
If you are recoil adverse, there is hardly any caliber with less recoil than .22lr. For $650 you should be able to get your rifle as well as at least couple thousand rounds of ammo.
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Old 05-13-2012, 7:14 PM
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Originally Posted by HK4113 View Post
If you are recoil adverse, there is hardly any caliber with less recoil than .22lr. For $650 you should be able to get your rifle as well as at least couple thousand rounds of ammo.
I just looked at the S&W MP 15 22. there are so many different ones.. different stocks, different sights.. which one should I get? price is not a problem.. they only go up to $700 something.. I'm looking for easy sight adjustment... less recoil.. thanks!

Thanks!
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Old 05-13-2012, 7:17 PM
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Originally Posted by smurfette View Post
I just looked at the S&W MP 15 22. there are so many different ones.. different stocks, different sights.. which one should I get? price is not a problem.. they only go up to $700 something.. I'm looking for easy sight adjustment... less recoil.. thanks!

Thanks!
I bought the california compliant model from buds gun shop and had it shipped to my gun guy in california.

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/p...R+CA+Compliant
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Old 05-13-2012, 7:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HK4113 View Post
If you are recoil adverse, there is hardly any caliber with less recoil than .22lr. For $650 you should be able to get your rifle as well as at least couple thousand rounds of ammo.
Quote:
Originally Posted by HK4113 View Post
I bought the california compliant model from buds gun shop and had it shipped to my gun guy in california.

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/p...R+CA+Compliant
yes that one is the first one on the website. $519

wow only $425 on that website

is this one better for me or that Magpul stock and sight is not necessary?

http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/w...layErrorView_Y
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Old 05-13-2012, 7:21 PM
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Originally Posted by smurfette View Post
yes that one is the first one on the website. $519

is this one better for me or that Magpul stock and sight is not necessary?

http://www.smith-wesson.com/webapp/w...layErrorView_Y
The magpul version is cool, just harder to find and the magpul grip is sometimes too big for people with smaller hands.

Also BUD's only has non CA compliant MOE rifles and wouldn't ship one into california for me which is why I had to go with the Cali legal version.

You can also modify your rifle later if you wanted to and put on the magpul stock, grip and sights.
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Old 05-13-2012, 7:24 PM
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If possible, I strongly suggest taking a training class at your local range and use the rental guns that they have.
That way, you get to see how you'd like to setup your own gun while familiarizing yourself with the controls. In the end, you'll save money because you won't waste cash on mods/accessories that you'll realize you don't need.

You can't go wrong with an AR from a reputable manufacturer like Smith&Wesson or Spikes Tactical.
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Old 05-13-2012, 7:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HK4113 View Post
The magpul version is cool, just harder to find and the magpul grip is sometimes too big for people with smaller hands.

Also BUD's only has non CA compliant MOE rifles and wouldn't ship one into california for me which is why I had to go with the Cali legal version.

You can also modify your rifle later if you wanted to and put on the magpul stock, grip and sights.
so which sight is better? I'm more concerned about that than the grip.. thanks!
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Old 05-13-2012, 7:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brassbent View Post
If possible, I strongly suggest taking a training class at your local range and use the rental guns that they have.
That way, you get to see how you'd like to setup your own gun while familiarizing yourself with the controls. In the end, you'll save money because you won't waste cash on mods/accessories that you'll realize you don't need.

You can't go wrong with an AR from a reputable manufacturer like Smith&Wesson or Spikes Tactical.
I don't know where the training classes are in sf.

thanks.. I'm looking at the S&W guns..
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Old 05-13-2012, 7:28 PM
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so which sight is better? I'm more concerned about that than the grip.. thanks!
I prefer the magpul sights.
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Old 05-13-2012, 7:45 PM
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I prefer the magpul sights.
is the magpul stock adjustable?
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Old 05-13-2012, 7:49 PM
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is the magpul stock adjustable?
Yes
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Old 05-13-2012, 7:58 PM
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Yes
thanks. but 25-round magazine is illegal in CA.. where can i find one with 10-round?
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Old 05-13-2012, 9:33 PM
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The M&P15 Sport is a great starter AR if you are inclined to go with .223/5.56mm. Recoil is going to be a little more noticeable than a .22 but if you are already shooting a 20g pump shotgun then the .223/5.56mm round's recoil won't be an issue.

The M&P15-22 is a solid choice also. Lesser recoil, similar controls and feel to a "real" AR. They are a fun .22LR gun to plink and target practice with.

Another plus for the 15-22 is you can also use it at most indoor ranges if you like. Lots of indoor ranges wont allow .223/5.56mm rifles. If they do you usually have buy their expensive frangible ammo. Another point to consider.
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Old 05-13-2012, 9:55 PM
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Yes
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Originally Posted by Atekhed View Post
The M&P15 Sport is a great starter AR if you are inclined to go with .223/5.56mm. Recoil is going to be a little more noticeable than a .22 but if you are already shooting a 20g pump shotgun then the .223/5.56mm round's recoil won't be an issue.

The M&P15-22 is a solid choice also. Lesser recoil, similar controls and feel to a "real" AR. They are a fun .22LR gun to plink and target practice with.

Another plus for the 15-22 is you can also use it at most indoor ranges if you like. Lots of indoor ranges wont allow .223/5.56mm rifles. If they do you usually have buy their expensive frangible ammo. Another point to consider.
I shoot 12ga shotty too, but I prefer shooting 20ga.. i break more clays with a 20g a..
I'm still deciding whether I should get the real AR or just the 15-22

Thanks!
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Old 05-13-2012, 10:02 PM
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Don't think you can go wrong with an M&P15 (either .22 or .223). I agree that renting one of each at a range would definitely help you make the right decision. The difference between the two can only be fully understood by shooting both. I prefer shooting my AR (5.56/.223), but it's much more affordable to shoot my .22 during a full day in the desert.
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Old 05-13-2012, 10:10 PM
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S&W M&P 15 Sport.
+1 if you don't want to spend too much.
Or the H&K MR556 if you can afford to. I would just get the HK and be done with it.
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Old 05-13-2012, 10:24 PM
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+1 if you don't want to spend too much.
Or the H&K MR556 if you can afford to. I would just get the HK and be done with it.
and if anybody here is the paradigm of great decisions made by rookies...
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Old 05-13-2012, 11:16 PM
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I wouldn't recommend an HK even IF they could afford it. I'd much rather recommend LWRC
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Old 05-13-2012, 11:28 PM
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There's no such thing as an AR-15 for beginners Just " price conscious"/ no frills versions, completely decked out ones & everything inbetween.
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Old 05-13-2012, 11:40 PM
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#1, forget about brand names.

You want to shop by features.

You like a light gun so first look for a 16" mid-length pencil profile (0.625" at the gas block) barrel.

If you like scopes or think you might get one in the future, get a railed upper receiver (M4 style).

If you like short stocks, probably get a telescoping adjustable stock. There are many choices, I like the Magpul CTR as a nice $/performance compromise.

The difference between .22lr and .223 is that .22lr is a 150 yard max cartridge and with the right gun and ammo .223 can be a 1,000 yard cartridge.

If you are shooting only paper at 50-100 yards, they are about the same.

.223 recoil is not bad, quite light actually but in a rifle .22lr is almost nothing so there is a difference. Anyone weighing more than 60 lbs should be able to handle .223.

Some ARs will be sold without a rear sight so make sure it comes with a sight or you buy one to go with it.

It is entirely possible to get a decent AR for round $600 if you know how to shop a bit and don't mind doing a little assembly.

If you want a bit of quality, now is the time to put in an extra couple hundred in to the parts that will make it accurate and keep it running.
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