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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #41  
Old 03-29-2012, 1:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wash View Post
Awesome.

But what are NC's carry laws like?

If they are a may issue LTC only state this doesn't help very much. If they have no permit LOC, huge win.

Congratulations once again Mr. Gura.
They have no permit LOC and shall issue concealed carry.
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  #42  
Old 03-29-2012, 1:11 PM
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Originally Posted by bulgron View Post
More importantly to me, how long can the 9th hide from Second Amendment truths, anyway?
As long as they possibly can. They will only ever be overturned by the SCOTUS on 2A issues.
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Laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes...Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man.
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  #43  
Old 03-29-2012, 1:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Fyathyrio View Post
This is awesome news! Unfortunately I don't think that NC will appeal as they are pretty gun friendly there.

Now, let me see if I've been paying attention in class...

Presuming it's not appealed, this doesn't really help us yet in CA because it's a a District level case...right? But...it can be cited in other 4th Circuit cases, which includes Maryland...right? Maryland also has all kinds of nasty laws that need to go away, and many current cases against those laws. Thus, in a round-about fashion this will help us...in about

Do I get a gold star?
Who knows? Maybe NC will appeal this decision precisely because they're generally friendly to gun rights, ie thinking strategically to get this decision applied to the entire circuit and setting up a circuit split. If Alameda County can think strategic and "take one for the team" in Nordyke, why not NC?
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  #44  
Old 03-29-2012, 1:39 PM
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What's up with these district court judges suddenly ruling in favor of the 2A? The dyke is springing leaks, and the Bradys are running out of fingers to plug them with.
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  #45  
Old 03-29-2012, 1:50 PM
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Strict scrutiny standard is very very good indeed! Now we just need the 9th circuit and SCOTUs to agree that strict scrutiny applies and then we are off to the races!
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  #46  
Old 03-29-2012, 2:30 PM
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Looks like they typed the decision on a type writer! No wonder these things take time...
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  #47  
Old 03-29-2012, 3:19 PM
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The Notices of Supplimental Authority will be flying off the presses.... Winning!
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  #48  
Old 03-29-2012, 3:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CHS View Post
As long as they possibly can. They will only ever be overturned by the SCOTUS on 2A issues.
After some of the hideously misinformed and ignorant questioning by some on the Nordyke panel, I would agree. They were so unprepared, and substituted their own, blind anti-gun ideologue for preparedness of the issues and the case. It was, at times, disgraceful.
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  #49  
Old 03-29-2012, 3:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Big Ben View Post
What's up with these district court judges suddenly ruling in favor of the 2A? The dyke is springing leaks, and the Bradys are running out of fingers to plug them with.

Can you imaging the panic in the Brady headquarters after this one?
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  #50  
Old 03-29-2012, 3:55 PM
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Originally Posted by safewaysecurity View Post
This is a HUGE victory! Now we finally have a strict scrutiny decision for outside the home. Hopefully the CA agrees. Woohoo!
Albeit a District Circuit Court, a lower Federal Court, but enough of these build up, the pattern of legal reasoning becomes stronger.
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  #51  
Old 03-29-2012, 4:00 PM
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so happy with my recurring monthly donations to CGF and SAF. good work.
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  #52  
Old 03-29-2012, 4:10 PM
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Can you imaging the panic in the Brady headquarters after this one?
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  #53  
Old 03-29-2012, 4:11 PM
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And we all thought we'd lose all these district court cases

-Gene
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  #54  
Old 03-29-2012, 5:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Purple K View Post
The Notices of Supplimental Authority will be flying off the presses.... Winning!
This lol!
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  #55  
Old 03-29-2012, 5:54 PM
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Originally Posted by hoffmang View Post
And we all thought we'd lose all these district court cases

-Gene

In this instance, I like being wrong...
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  #56  
Old 03-29-2012, 6:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wash View Post
Awesome.

But what are NC's carry laws like?

If they are a may issue LTC only state this doesn't help very much. If they have no permit LOC, huge win.

Congratulations once again Mr. Gura.
When I was stationed in Bragg 03-08 it was a LOC state with easy to get Ltc.
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  #57  
Old 03-29-2012, 6:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Maestro Pistolero View Post
After some of the hideously misinformed and ignorant questioning by some on the Nordyke panel, I would agree. They were so unprepared, and substituted their own, blind anti-gun ideologue for preparedness of the issues and the case. It was, at times, disgraceful.
And entirely predictable.

Have I not said in the past that the 9th Circuit is an enemy of the 2nd Amendment, and that they will attempt to foil us at every turn?
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The real world laughs at optimism. And here's why.

I hope I end up having to donate another $1000 to CGF... However, this $500 is one I hope to not have to donate...
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  #58  
Old 03-29-2012, 6:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hoffmang View Post
And we all thought we'd lose all these district court cases

-Gene
Question: does this go against the jurisprudence of the 4th Circuit? If so, then does this not prove that district courts are not bound by the jurisprudence of the circuit to which they belong when a Supreme Court ruling indicates (but does not flatly state) that the district court should rule against its circuit's jurisprudence?
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The real world laughs at optimism. And here's why.

I hope I end up having to donate another $1000 to CGF... However, this $500 is one I hope to not have to donate...
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  #59  
Old 03-29-2012, 7:05 PM
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Three cheers for Judge Howard!!! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Malcolm_Jones_Howard

And a tiger for Alan Guts Gura / SAF!!!
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False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.
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  #60  
Old 03-29-2012, 8:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kcbrown View Post
Question: does this go against the jurisprudence of the 4th Circuit? If so, then does this not prove that district courts are not bound by the jurisprudence of the circuit to which they belong when a Supreme Court ruling indicates (but does not flatly state) that the district court should rule against its circuit's jurisprudence?
Besides Heller and McDonald, he cited Masciandaro and Chester often, both 4th Circuit, and also Marzzarella, a 3rd Circuit case that Chester relied on.
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The world is filled with violence. Because criminals carry guns, we decent law-abiding citizens should also have guns. Otherwise they will win and the decent people will lose.
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  #61  
Old 03-29-2012, 8:58 PM
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Best thread of the day!
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  #62  
Old 03-29-2012, 9:10 PM
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what is Strict Scrutiny?
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  #63  
Old 03-29-2012, 9:30 PM
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what is Strict Scrutiny?
The holy grail of civil rights protection from gov't laws. Applying strict scrutiny really limits what gov't can do.

More info here.
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The world is filled with violence. Because criminals carry guns, we decent law-abiding citizens should also have guns. Otherwise they will win and the decent people will lose.
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  #64  
Old 03-29-2012, 9:41 PM
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Originally Posted by jimh View Post
what is Strict Scrutiny?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strict_scrutiny
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False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.
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  #65  
Old 03-29-2012, 9:54 PM
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Ttt
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False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.
-- Cesare Beccaria http://www.a-human-right.com/
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  #66  
Old 03-29-2012, 10:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Fyathyrio View Post
The holy grail of civil rights protection from gov't laws. Applying strict scrutiny really limits what gov't can do.
Actually, the holy grail of civil rights protection from government laws is categorical analysis. Which is to say, if there's an infringement, then the law in question is Unconstitutional, period. None of this scrutiny BS.

Strict scrutiny isn't nearly as strong as some people seem to think. See Fatal in Theory and Strict in Fact, by Adam Winkler. Infringing laws are upheld all the time under that method of evaluation.
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The Constitution is not "the Supreme Law of the Land, except in the face of contradicting law which has not yet been overturned by the courts". It is THE SUPREME LAW OF THE LAND, PERIOD. Your oath to uphold the Constitution is a joke unless you refuse to enforce unadjudicated laws you believe are Unconstitutional.

The real world laughs at optimism. And here's why.

I hope I end up having to donate another $1000 to CGF... However, this $500 is one I hope to not have to donate...
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  #67  
Old 03-30-2012, 7:56 PM
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Btt. TRIPLE CROWN!!!
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False is the idea of utility that sacrifices a thousand real advantages for one imaginary or trifling inconvenience; that would take fire from men because it burns, and water because one may drown in it; that has no remedy for evils except destruction. The laws that forbid the carrying of arms are laws of such a nature. They disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes.
-- Cesare Beccaria http://www.a-human-right.com/
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  #68  
Old 03-31-2012, 8:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by safewaysecurity View Post
NC is shall issue and I believe they have LOC.
Just got back from NC. Friendly LEO told me LOC is my Constitutional right and no permit needed, just look for posted signs on entrances to buildings and businesses.
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