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Competition, Action Shooting And Training. Competition, Three gun, IPSC, IDPA , and Training discussion here.

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  #1  
Old 06-12-2016, 10:49 AM
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Default Double tap/ rapid fire prac in Los Angeles

Hi guys, I was wondering if you could recommend a range that allows rapid fire. I'd really like to get practice firing fast but all ranges that i have been to in LA have a lame 1 second rule.
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Old 06-12-2016, 10:49 AM
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Oaktree
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Old 06-12-2016, 10:50 AM
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Lightnight fast reply. Thanks bur. i'll check oaktree out. Any ranges near the 562? I am in Bellflower.
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Old 06-12-2016, 10:51 AM
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Thanks bud**
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Old 06-12-2016, 11:03 AM
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Angeles allows double taps.
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  #6  
Old 06-12-2016, 1:21 PM
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Default Double tap/ rapid fire prac in Los Angeles

Angeles allows one double tap every three seconds.

LAX Firing Range allows rapid fire too, I believe.
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Old 06-12-2016, 2:59 PM
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It is a bit of of a drive but Raahague's allows it. You get your own bay and can do all sorts of drills.
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Old 06-12-2016, 3:14 PM
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Double Taps Are Not A Crime.....
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Old 06-12-2016, 6:01 PM
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Double taps are not a crime!

Lax is a no go for double taps. Will the "controlled pairs" euphemism work at some of these places?
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Old 06-12-2016, 6:03 PM
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If you take a class of some sorts at Sharpshooters in Torrance, they will certify you to shoot from holster and concealed...
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Old 06-12-2016, 6:07 PM
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Sharpshooters in Torrance allows rapid fire.
They prefer to know you a bit to make sure you are in control.
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Old 06-12-2016, 6:09 PM
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Awesome, thanks guys. ill check them out.
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Old 06-12-2016, 6:34 PM
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Carbine and Multi-gun matches are a great venue for putting multiple rounds on targets of all kinds and ranges. A Training course would of course offer the opportunity for same.
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Old 06-19-2016, 6:58 PM
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Thanks spfa, I am actually looking for a place where I can practice for competetive shooting. I checked out sharpshooters and it was great. I really like that place and plan to train there often.
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Old 07-14-2016, 6:52 PM
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I sure had fun today at Burro. No clue what their policy is but I let her rip and the range guru didn't say anything as I mag after mag 9mm single stack 8-9 rds and my CCW .357 5 shot.

I loved it and don't usually save my targets but I was curious as to how well I did, so I brought it home and counted.

Probably 20% was weak hand and 40% double taps. All rapid fire 10 yrds.

Thank you Burro

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Old 07-14-2016, 7:07 PM
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Burro is awesome. If I shoot outdoors it is generally at burro. I am also a member there but my original post was to find a place I can shoot during the week. Burro is my weekend spot. They allow rapid fire as long as you are controlled and arent shooting at the rocks.
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  #17  
Old 07-15-2016, 2:18 PM
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If someone uses the phrase "double taps", chances are they have no firearms training and probably shouldn't be using a holster or firing quickly.

If the OP wants to learn how to shoot faster within the constraints of his local range, buy a shot timer, print this target and shoot this drill.



There's a lot more to shooting fast than pressing the trigger fast. There's technique involved that can be conveyed by a qualified instructor. Same with drawing from a holster.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sixoclockhold View Post
I sure had fun today at Burro. No clue what their policy is but I let her rip and the range guru didn't say anything as I mag after mag 9mm single stack 8-9 rds and my CCW .357 5 shot.

I loved it and don't usually save my targets but I was curious as to how well I did, so I brought it home and counted.

Probably 20% was weak hand and 40% double taps. All rapid fire 10 yrds.


Yikes.
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Old 07-15-2016, 3:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reckoner View Post
Angeles allows one double tap every three seconds.

LAX Firing Range allows rapid fire too, I believe.
Check with LAX. I go there a lot and I believe they don't mind but prefer you let them know. I've seen plenty of people rapid firing and occasionally have heard an announcement to that effect before the individual started. I have also heard them ask people to slow down. I think they just want to be aware of what you are doing and are more conservative when the place is busy and/or full of less experienced shooters.

I'd suggest giving them a call if you decide to go.
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Old 07-15-2016, 3:18 PM
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If I fired as slow as Ken, I would put 9-10 in the 10 ring of 10 shot. Personally I think one must be comfortable with their own technique as we will probably never know what we will do under extreme stress.

I'm realistic and believe I will probably "holy Sheet in my Flat Hat" and let them rip. I'm comfy I can point and shoot to make winning.

I didn't see him shoot weak hand?
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  #20  
Old 07-15-2016, 6:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HopetonBrown View Post
If someone uses the phrase "double taps", chances are they have no firearms training and probably shouldn't be using a holster or firing quickly.

****, that's probably why I'm stuck in USPSA Master class.
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  #21  
Old 07-16-2016, 6:08 AM
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I understand this section is about competition but it also says training and the thread specifically was talking about double taps and fast shooting.

I think it's important that most everyone should become familiar with their weapons enough that they can shoot quickly. Lets face it, no light brown guy simulating cardboard is going to stand there and say, "take your time, shoot me, I won't move".

Yikes? Really, I've been shooting 40 years and while I don't do competitive shooting, I have excellent hand eye coordination and consider myself a decent shot, slightly above average I suppose.

While I said 20% weak hand, it could of been 33%, I like weak hand training. And I said 40% double tap, it could have been 60%, I really wasn't counting. It certainly wasn't all supported strong hand, at most 50%. See I believe one must train for yikes. Like your a fat old man doing the best climbing a set of stairs with your left hand on the railing pulling yourself higher. Oh are you going to square off and supported strong hand on steps? Oh yeah thats a snub .357 with full house loads, weak hand and strong unsupported, lets see you play that game.

Please, this thread was about double tap and shooting fast, not training for a trophy, I get that and respect that. Do the drill rolling around on the ground, now that's real life training.

Last edited by sixoclockhold; 07-16-2016 at 6:12 AM..
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  #22  
Old 07-16-2016, 11:48 AM
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Part of action shooting competitions is putting two shots on target as fast as you can depending on the target distance and difficulty. Targets can be partial with hard cover or no shoots limiting the available target. Plus you are moving and shooting using doors ports and walks and moving target's. Much more practice of that type that most shooters can do on their own.

The other benefit is you can see how you do compare to other shooters who shoot regularly without assuming where you might rank. It's a lot of fun. Mark
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  #23  
Old 07-16-2016, 12:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by reckoner View Post
****, that's probably why I'm stuck in USPSA Master class.
I guarantee as a USPSA M you see a sight picture for every trigger press and track your sights. That's not a double tap.
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Old 07-16-2016, 1:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sixoclockhold View Post
If I fired as slow as Ken, I would put 9-10 in the 10 ring of 10 shot.
Great. Shoot the drill and tell us your score. Download the target here. 9 out of 10 in the 10 ring would be a score of 99 in 10 seconds or less at 10 yards.


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Originally Posted by sixoclockhold View Post
no light brown guy simulating cardboard is going to stand there and say, "take your time, shoot me, I won't move".
That target you posted wasn't moving.

I'm not trying to throw shade, but let's be honest; that target would make you last place in every IDPA/USPSA/IPSC match in the world; literally. Missing a lot is not gonna win you gunfights. Here's a well-respected former Delta operator on competition shooting.
Here's a vid of a soldier from the famed Army Marksmanship Unit shooting a USPSA match.



My unsolicited advice? Shoot at a speed and distance where you can get most of your shots in the yellow of your target. Once you can do that, increase speed and/or distance.
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Old 07-16-2016, 2:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HopetonBrown View Post
I guarantee as a USPSA M you see a sight picture for every trigger press and track your sights. That's not a double tap.


As the saying goes, you see what you need to see. If the target is easy enough and your index and recoil control are good, what you need to see hardly counts as a sight picture.
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Old 07-16-2016, 2:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HopetonBrown View Post
Great. Shoot the drill and tell us your score. Download the target here. 9 out of 10 in the 10 ring would be a score of 99 in 10 seconds or less at 10 yards.




That target you posted wasn't moving.

I'm not trying to throw shade, but let's be honest; that target would make you last place in every IDPA/USPSA/IPSC match in the world; literally. Missing a lot is not gonna win you gunfights. Here's a well-respected former Delta operator on competition shooting.
Here's a vid of a soldier from the famed Army Marksmanship Unit shooting a USPSA match.



My unsolicited advice? Shoot at a speed and distance where you can get most of your shots in the yellow of your target. Once you can do that, increase speed and/or distance.
I'll pass signing up.

Here's a recent target with full house .357's, the (5) green on target @ 25 yards 2.25 " barrel in 5 seconds.

I like posting pics, makes a forum much more desirable.

Enjoy your plastique trophy

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Old 07-16-2016, 3:03 PM
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I thought
Double tap- you had 3 sight pictures
Hammer- i sight picture and 2 shots
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Old 07-16-2016, 3:23 PM
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To further complicate the picture.

I Like the comment: Jeff

"I disagree. I’ve shot 10s of thousands of hand gun rounds. I have taught myself to control the muzzle without needing to aim twice. Muscle memory? Speed? Strength? Whatever helps you sleep at night. My point is I can have 2 inch ‘double tap’ groups all day every day and never question myself squeezing the trigger. To claim that I am ‘jerking’ the trigger is crap. Some people understand how to shoot a gun without having a blog, a website, or a magazine to write for. Some of us aren’t navy seals or delta rangers who have skill. I didn’t wake up with skill, but have practiced and practiced then practiced some more. I’m not the only shooter I personally know who can accurately execute double taps with precision, so that tells me the world is full of them."

http://www.breachbangclear.com/doubl...trolled-pairs/

At some point you have to question the blog, the gear, the advertising buck and who's profiting off the garbally gook.
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Old 07-16-2016, 5:16 PM
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That target does not demonstrate the ability to shoot "2 inch double taps, all day everyday". Come on.
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Old 07-17-2016, 6:08 AM
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Quote:
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That target does not demonstrate the ability to shoot "2 inch double taps, all day everyday". Come on.
You've never gotten a trophy now have you? I would imagine even in this sport one must pay attention to achieve plastique.

I think the only thing I've claimed about the pink panther is that I had a lot of fun and that I was slightly above average. Does that qualify me for a trophy?

I got a lot of trophy's but they were for mostly bowling
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Old 07-17-2016, 7:25 AM
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In my personal journey as a shooter, I tried to get my shots in the X and 10 ring. It took me a LONG time and a lot of rounds. The close target at my range is set up at 10 yards. So, it took a bit more doing. Once I felt comfortable in being able to do that consistently and easily, I sped it up a bit. Then, I stretched it out to 25 yards. Much harder. Still working on it.

Unfortunately, my range doesn't allow rapid fire. I do try to get as close as I can without bringing too much attention to myself. 2, maybe 3 shots somewhat quickly. I'm ok at 10 yards. They land in the black of the target. So, I'm happy with that.

If it had a lot of shots out of the black, that's a rough day at the range for me.

I'd love to do some competition shooting, but time, money and life get in the way.

I'd also like more training. Same as above.

Happy shooting and be safe.
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Old 07-17-2016, 3:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XDJYo View Post
...
I'd love to do some competition shooting, but time, money and life get in the way.
...
You already have the weapon, the Les Baer. All you need is a holster, 4 mag holders and 5 mags and you can compete at a regular USPSA match in single stack division. Entry fee is about $30-$40 plus < 200 rounds of ammo, and time wise it is 6 hours or so on a weekend.

So, not being able to compete due to time, money and life is just an excuse. I bet you watch TV for more than 6 hours during a whole month.

I'd say if you'd really love some competition shooting you can make it happen at a very minimal cost, probably less than the cost of a range trip.
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Old 07-17-2016, 6:06 PM
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Getting out in front of other shooters and testing one's self to find out how their ability rates, at the risk of being humbled, is more than most people's egos can take. A man does have to know his limitations. Mark
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Old 07-18-2016, 3:03 AM
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Every weekend is a very humbling experience for me but it is a rush every time.
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Old 07-18-2016, 7:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HopetonBrown View Post
If someone uses the phrase "double taps", chances are they have no firearms training and probably shouldn't be using a holster or firing quickly.

If the OP wants to learn how to shoot faster within the constraints of his local range, buy a shot timer, print this target and shoot this drill.



There's a lot more to shooting fast than pressing the trigger fast. There's technique involved that can be conveyed by a qualified instructor. Same with drawing from a holster.



Yikes.
That's a cute drill but if you want to shoot USPSA/IDPA just do the Bill Drill on a standard Metric Target and shoot for all A's

Shoot at the targets you are going to be shooting in comps. Get use to the sight picture you are going to see regularly.

Also do the Bill Drill at different distances. I use 5, 10, & 20 yards. Also don't use par times to start. Shoot the drill to get all A's and find your time to do that, find your rhythm, then push it to speed up in training. When shooting comps you have to know your limits. The biggest thing I see new shooters do is shoot too fast and drop Mikes all over the place. How fast can you shoot and still get 85 to 90% Alphas? That's what new shooters need to figure out. Using a Par won't help you figure that out.
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Old 07-23-2016, 1:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HopetonBrown View Post
If someone uses the phrase "double taps", chances are they have no firearms training and probably shouldn't be using a holster or firing quickly.

If the OP wants to learn how to shoot faster within the constraints of his local range, buy a shot timer, print this target and shoot this drill.



There's a lot more to shooting fast than pressing the trigger fast. There's technique involved that can be conveyed by a qualified instructor. Same with drawing from a holster.



Yikes.
Ok so I don't mind saying this whole yikes and questioning my shooting accuracy after 40 years behind the sights, and mind you, I don't use optics even on 200-300 yrd off hand rifle, has got me a little "Oh Really".

I've never owned a timer, although I have a pretty good conception of time, I have owned my own business for 40 years and time is how I make money in my service.

So here's the deal. I will not only do Kenny's liquid sunshine BS shooting, I will two up him at least. I will draw my SNUB 2.25" from a holster, SNAPPED IN, deliver (5) rounds, empty and load from a leather speed loader holder (5) fresh babies and deliver them pronto. I will start with 7 yards instead of 10 and hopefully work my way up to 10 but I see most you guys sport 5" and 6" long barrel with red dots, so... Leather speed loader is NOT snapped. Just trying to even it up some, I'm confident at 7 yards I will get Mr. Liquid Sunshine BS his 90. Then we can all go Yikes.....

I downloaded the timer app on my android so I won't be able to film it, but maybe someone will be with me to film next trip, although I usually shoot alone in Parker Az. I have no problem placing my attempt on the internet. I love competition.

I ran dry drills in my pad, best was 8.76 seconds, most running 9.5 average with 1 second draws, 3 second reloads and .28-.35 splits.

Lets the games begin.


Last edited by sixoclockhold; 07-23-2016 at 1:48 PM..
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  #37  
Old 07-23-2016, 6:47 PM
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Placing a video on the internet can show something of your ability, but it's not competition out in front of the other competitors. Mark
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Old 07-24-2016, 3:38 PM
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ISI Shootists in Piru runs IDPA, Speed Gun, and Steel Challenge matches. It's 80 minutes from Bellflower, but you can learn to move and shoot fast from a nice group of people.


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