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2nd Amend. Litigation Updates & Legal Discussion Discuss California 2A related litigation and legal topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #41  
Old 12-23-2011, 5:00 PM
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Celebrating my wifes birthday today in Napa, St Helena & Calistoga. Shopping, olive oil tasting, WoodHouse Chocolates and wine tasting & Lunch at V Satui. I didn't think today could get much better.....I was wrong. This is great news. 2012 is going to be a good year. Thank you CGF, SAF ( if you could see my smile )
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  #42  
Old 12-23-2011, 5:06 PM
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Thank you, thank you, thank you. Time is money. I never thought I would get such a big Christmas present from CalGuns Foundation . . .
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  #43  
Old 12-23-2011, 5:06 PM
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Great news!!! Is the 1 in 30 mixed into this as well?
Cannot wait for the day that I can give someone money and leave with a gun.
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  #44  
Old 12-23-2011, 5:09 PM
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I had a feeling CGF had a nice holiday gift for us all. Thanks to CGF, SAF and all the plaintiffs on this. F'n sweet.
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  #45  
Old 12-23-2011, 5:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shooting4life View Post
Great news!!! Is the 1 in 30 mixed into this as well?
I don't see the 1-in-30 mentioned at all in this lawsuit.
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  #46  
Old 12-23-2011, 5:22 PM
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I had to explain the 10-day wait to my friend today.. he didn't understand why he needed a "cooling off" period when he already had registered guns at home. It's a stupid rule that is only in place to discorage and punish gun ownership.

Merry Christmas to us!
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  #47  
Old 12-23-2011, 5:23 PM
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Of course, this is obviously just step 1.

South Carolina wants to have voter ID.

The US Attorney General has opined that
Quote:
allowing the new requirement to go into effect would have “significant racial disparities.”
Gee, if ID is violating access to voting, wouldn't an ID requirement violate access to gun ownership? Civil rights are important - all of them.

(h/t to Instapundit)
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  #48  
Old 12-23-2011, 5:23 PM
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A toast! A toast to CGF!

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  #49  
Old 12-23-2011, 5:28 PM
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The bestest xmas gift ever... thanks, guys.

CGF ROCKS!!!
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  #50  
Old 12-23-2011, 5:34 PM
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Get on'em CalGuns... Get ON'EM...!

Daggum stupid ridiculous asinine 10-Day waiting period... freaking HATE IT...!!!!!
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  #51  
Old 12-23-2011, 5:45 PM
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so has long as the system shows you own a firearm we shouldn't have to wait 10 days right? it seems that if
CGF wins here it won't go into effect until 2014. otherwise how will the system know you already own a firearm?

currently only handguns are registered so that might be a problem.

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  #52  
Old 12-23-2011, 5:47 PM
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Not to be accused of being a curmudgeon...I can't see a 10-day wait - EVER - but so appreciate this latest action by CGF!!!!

Merry Christmas - donation coming!
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  #53  
Old 12-23-2011, 5:51 PM
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Great job guys! Thanks for all the hard work.
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  #54  
Old 12-23-2011, 5:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawk556 View Post
so has long as the system shows you own a firearm we shouldn't have to wait 10 days right? it seems that if
CGF wins here it won't go into effect until 2014. otherwise how will the system know you already own a firearm?

currently only handguns are registered so that might be a problem.

Sent from Los Alamos Nuclear Facility
why couldn't it go into effect tomorrow? Just because rifles aren't currently automatically registered with AFS doesn't mean that for us that do have firearms in AFS couldn't benefit from the elmination of the second waiting period. if you have never purchased a pistol, you might be able to do a vol-reg of a rifle to get you AFS'ed to earn the exemption (or you might have a RAW or .50BMG rifle that is in AFS that gets you the exemption even though you don't have any AFS'ed pistols.
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  #55  
Old 12-23-2011, 5:55 PM
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I'll get my local distiller to start aging some whiskey for celebrating it.
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  #56  
Old 12-23-2011, 5:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackhawk556 View Post
so has long as the system shows you own a firearm we shouldn't have to wait 10 days right? it seems that if
CGF wins here it won't go into effect until 2014. otherwise how will the system know you already own a firearm?

currently only handguns are registered so that might be a problem.

Sent from Los Alamos Nuclear Facility
Our lawsuit does not turn on the 2014 long gun registration. The reference simply highlights how irrational the law it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Prayer for Relief
An order preliminarily and permanently enjoining Defendants, their officers, agents, servants, employees, and all persons in active concert or participation with them who receive actual notice of the injunction, from enforcing Penal Code sections 26815 and 27540 as against those persons that may lawfully possess and acquire a firearm and possess proof of firearm possession or ownership in their name within the State of California and from enacting, publishing, promulgating, or otherwise enforcing any polices, rules, or procedures prohibiting or otherwise restricting the delivery of firearms to said individuals within ten-days of applying for the purchase of any firearms
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  #57  
Old 12-23-2011, 6:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shooting4life View Post
Great news!!! Is the 1 in 30 mixed into this as well?
No.

And you do have a workaround on that - get a C&R & COE.
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  #58  
Old 12-23-2011, 6:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ke6guj View Post
why couldn't it go into effect tomorrow? Just because rifles aren't currently automatically registered with AFS doesn't mean that for us that do have firearms in AFS couldn't benefit from the elmination of the second waiting period. if you have never purchased a pistol, you might be able to do a vol-reg of a rifle to get you AFS'ed to earn the exemption (or you might have a RAW or .50BMG rifle that is in AFS that gets you the exemption even though you don't have any AFS'ed pistols.

In a perfect execution of this, just walk into a gun shop with a gun you own.

California evidence code already says this is an indicator of ownership, etc
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  #59  
Old 12-23-2011, 6:06 PM
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Bravo!
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  #60  
Old 12-23-2011, 6:13 PM
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Very very
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  #61  
Old 12-23-2011, 6:13 PM
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Good stuff. I just contributed to both CGF and SAF.
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  #62  
Old 12-23-2011, 6:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OleCuss View Post
I dunno, it feels just a little like Christmas is two days early. And yeah, I know that final resolution will be a long way down the road.

But what I find most interesting is that (IIRC) this was a relatively low priority. This suggests to me that there has been (or this is) a strategic or tactical shift.
Well, this is battle, and battle is a fluid situation.

If this does indeed telegraph a shift in the strategy, then I for one am glad that our side has the flexibility to do such a thing when needed.




(It's almost Christmas, so I guess I'm feeling a bit more upbeat than usual. Enjoy it while it lasts. )
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  #63  
Old 12-23-2011, 6:22 PM
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Signature updated, and here is a PACER Link.

We're ROCKIN' THE BOAT!!!



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  #64  
Old 12-23-2011, 6:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Librarian View Post
Gee, if ID is violating access to voting, wouldn't an ID requirement violate access to gun ownership? Civil rights are important - all of them.
I had never thought about that...I am going to start using that.
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  #65  
Old 12-23-2011, 6:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CHS View Post
I still don't understand how ANY wait can survive strict scrutiny or any constitutional scrutiny. I have a right to self defense NOW, not 1, 3, or ten days from now. Plus, if the whole idea is to prevent crime and we've instituted background checks, well the background check is instant. And can the state actually show in court that a background check waiting period truly prevents the so-called "crimes of passion" that it seeks to get rid of? I doubt it.

Anyways. It's still great news. Merry Christmas to me, Merry Christmas to me!

Sometimes I think Gene, Bill, Jason, Brandon and CGF in general are just one big multi-part jolly Santa
I was thinking about this earlier today. I don't see a first wait surviving strict scrutiny either. Although we wouldn't be likely to get actual strict scrutiny, it'd probably be intermediate or somewhere in between. That's why it seems uncertain to me, scrutiny could go a few ways. Doing it this way makes sense though, subsequent waits after the first one shouldn't survive any level of scrutiny at all so this seems like low hanging fruit.

I'm really looking forward to seeing CA try to defend this one. They will be tripping over themselves trying to come up with justification.

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  #66  
Old 12-23-2011, 6:39 PM
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i just cried a little.. merry xmas to us all.. since i see this as a precurser to killing "the list"


Confirmation number: 7KM17153FU942394T
Donation amount: $10.00 USD
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  #67  
Old 12-23-2011, 6:43 PM
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Quote:
Plaintiffs challenge the State of California’s ten-day waiting periods for firearm acquisitions facially and as applied to individuals who already have at least one firearm registered in their name with the State of California.
OK, I'm a bit confused, so a quick ? (and I should probably know already)...

Is this a "facial attack" or an "as-applied challenge" on the statute, and what's the difference?

I've heard that the Roberts Court favors as-applied over facial. If that is so, why would that be?

Erik.
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  #68  
Old 12-23-2011, 6:45 PM
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Read closer.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Complaint
Plaintiffs challenge the State of California’s ten-day waiting periods for firearm acquisitions facially and as applied to individuals who already have at least one firearm registered in their name with the State of California. Said challenge is asserted as being in violation of the Second Amendment and the Fourteenth Amendment of the United States Constitution.
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  #69  
Old 12-23-2011, 6:48 PM
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Well, CGF has finally done it, it got me to dust off the credit card and send a donation to the CGF.
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  #70  
Old 12-23-2011, 6:48 PM
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Great work, CalGuns....Keep it up..
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  #71  
Old 12-23-2011, 6:50 PM
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I thought my holiday season was going to be crappy this year because of needing to work through it, but this surprise really makes up for it. Woohoo! I think I need to send a little Festivus present to CGF!
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  #72  
Old 12-23-2011, 6:54 PM
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OK, I didn't quite know that you could have "one with the other", but I'm still learning (even after all these years).

Erik.
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  #73  
Old 12-23-2011, 6:57 PM
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This is great news!
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Old 12-23-2011, 7:02 PM
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Outstanding news - a great bit of holiday cheer to start the season early.
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  #75  
Old 12-23-2011, 7:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kcbrown View Post
Well, this is battle, and battle is a fluid situation.

If this does indeed telegraph a shift in the strategy, then I for one am glad that our side has the flexibility to do such a thing when needed.




(It's almost Christmas, so I guess I'm feeling a bit more upbeat than usual. Enjoy it while it lasts. )

This made me laugh pretty good.

So you DO know that there are those if us who look forward to reading the results of your skills at highlighting potential issues with or defects in our 2nd Amendment lawsuits.


But certainly this in not a "shift in strategy." There are already similar CalGuns suits brought over the last few years. This is surely a continuation of ongoing strategy.
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  #76  
Old 12-23-2011, 7:13 PM
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Would a handgun bought in 1983 show up as registered in the current system?
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Old 12-23-2011, 7:15 PM
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The wisest money I've ever spent are my contributions to Calguns! Thank You again.
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  #78  
Old 12-23-2011, 7:16 PM
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good news, I love it. I will be praying that everyone brings their common sense with them during the trial (of course CGF will... everyone else on the other hand....)
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Old 12-23-2011, 7:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Librarian View Post
Of course, this is obviously just step 1.

South Carolina wants to have voter ID.

The US Attorney General has opined that

Gee, if ID is violating access to voting, wouldn't an ID requirement violate access to gun ownership? Civil rights are important - all of them.

(h/t to Instapundit)
I don't suppose Attorney General Eric H. Holder Jr., and his buddy Mr. Obama, who both hail from the Chicago area and are bonafide members of that corrupt political machine, would deign to impede anything that might block voter fraud. But now that those two have control of the Justice Department, they are using recently passed, and constitutionally questionable voting laws, to support voter fraud.
As that South Carolina suit moves through the courts it probably won’t be legally linked to our Second Amendment litigation but it might set up a two-pronged fight for our Constitutional rights. It should certainly call attention to an administration that’s been trying to castrate our rights and bastardize our laws.
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Old 12-23-2011, 7:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rossi357 View Post
Would a handgun bought in 1983 show up as registered in the current system?
If you bought it in CA from a dealer, probably yes. DOJ has been doing data-entry from older records.

You could always ask for your AFS report: http://oag.ca.gov/sites/oag.ca.gov/f...ateCitizen.pdf
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There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.

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