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  #1  
Old 12-22-2011, 11:03 AM
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Default Fortress America Project NorCal

This is an intresting group that is active in Northern California. I went to one of their "FTX" and was very suprised how well put together it was they seem to have a focus on training without any political stuff. I had a very good time and thought some of you might like to check it out, they a a cool webpage.

www.fortressamericaproject.com

I took some pictures at the event and I will try to post them tonight.

Last edited by Grinder; 12-22-2011 at 11:22 AM..
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  #2  
Old 12-22-2011, 11:08 AM
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Default Pice I lifted from their webpage...





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  #3  
Old 12-22-2011, 11:10 AM
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and our leaders allow themselves to be spoon fed with foreign BS and have forgotten that the great majority of americans do not live in secluded gated comunities with private security 24/7 like they do, while the rest of us are subject to defending ourselves without Police escorts whenever we need it. they dont realize we are subject to different dangers than they are, and we must have and keep the right do defend ourselves!
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  #4  
Old 12-22-2011, 11:31 AM
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"The Fortress America Project is not ideological. We are open to people of any race, religion or political persuasion. We do not support or tolerate any type of revolutionary rhetoric or anti-government philosophy. We are a pro-government, pro-freedom, pro-Constitution militia who believe that the destiny of freedom lies in the safe and secure continuation of our Constitutional Republic."

So how do they avoid problems with California Penal Code Section 11460? I guess it's in the details of the PC that excludes thee groups.

Aside from that looks like fun. Might have to check it out.

Last edited by Zachs300zx; 12-22-2011 at 11:39 AM..
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  #5  
Old 12-22-2011, 11:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zachs300zx View Post
"The Fortress America Project is not ideological. We are open to people of any race, religion or political persuasion. We do not support or tolerate any type of revolutionary rhetoric or anti-government philosophy. We are a pro-government, pro-freedom, pro-Constitution militia who believe that the destiny of freedom lies in the safe and secure continuation of our Constitutional Republic."

So how do they avoid problems with California Penal Code Section 11460?
Funny you should mention this as I know about this law it aplies to:

(a) Any two or more persons who assemble as a paramilitary
organization for the purpose of practicing with weapons shall be
punished by imprisonment in a county jail for not more than one year
or by a fine of not more than one thousand dollars ($1,000), or by
both that fine and imprisonment.
As used in this subdivision, "paramilitary organization" means an
organization which is not an agency of the United States government
or of the State of California, or which is not a private school
meeting the requirements set forth in Section 48222 of the Education
Code, but which engages in instruction or training in guerrilla
warfare or sabotage, or which, as an organization, engages in rioting
or the violent disruption of, or the violent interference with,
school activities.


So as long as there is no training in: guerilla warfare, sabotage, roiting, or violent disruption of school activities you are ok.

Furthermore there is a law in California authorizing the assembly and training of militia units in the state. I will have to find the exact law but I have it saved here in my computer somewhere. There are at least six large militias in California I have been to see several and this one was by far the best. One of the members told me the reason that they have to use the word "Militia" is to avoid problems with 11460.

Last edited by Grinder; 12-22-2011 at 11:47 AM..
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  #6  
Old 12-22-2011, 1:59 PM
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That looks nice. Is there a fee or membership price? I'm in SoCal so it would be a trek to get up there for an event but would love to know more.
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  #7  
Old 12-22-2011, 3:27 PM
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Looks like a bunch of whacky nutjobs! Where do I join and where are they???
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  #8  
Old 12-22-2011, 3:45 PM
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The info is on the site, there is no fee to come out and check it out core members do pay a very small amount to cover some minor costs but I have not given any money. They meet in the field one time per month (first weekend) and BBQ once per month also. The "FTX" or field day is sometimes in northern California Sacramento or Stockton area. They also travel often to Reno, NV area to shoot. The info on events and contacts are on the homepage.
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  #9  
Old 12-23-2011, 11:03 AM
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In those pics, are those live fire exercises?

Are the trainers former military?
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  #10  
Old 12-23-2011, 11:13 AM
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Are they on private property?
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  #11  
Old 12-23-2011, 3:19 PM
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Originally Posted by pc_load_letter View Post
In those pics, are those live fire exercises?

Are the trainers former military?
I hope so there seem to be fingers on triggers and dust and smoke from shooting. Looks like a guy changing mags as well. I do not know if the pics were taken on private or public land. I know a lot of the training is done in the Sierra Nevada Mts just about 1 mile into Nevada. The place I went was acording to my GPS like 4000 feet from the California border and they said it is one of the main places that they go, keeps it cool with the AR's.
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  #12  
Old 12-23-2011, 4:10 PM
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"Firearms stand next in importance to the Constitution itself. They are the American people's liberty teeth and keystone under independence ... From the hour the Pilgrims landed, to the present day, events, occurrences, and tendencies prove that to insure peace, security and happiness, the rifle and pistol are equally indispensable . . . the very atmosphere of firearms everywhere restrains evil interference - they deserve a place of honor with all that is good" - George Washington
This was the best part i found on their site. Too bad they're in Norcal. Anything of the sort down here in So-cal?

Good post.
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Old 12-23-2011, 4:17 PM
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seems interesting. Tagged.
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Old 12-23-2011, 6:59 PM
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Originally Posted by I_Love_My_.38 View Post
Looks like a bunch of whacky nutjobs! Where do I join and where are they???
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  #15  
Old 12-23-2011, 7:26 PM
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The Project will be at Sac Valley shooting center range 10 all day Sunday January 8th. It is a good place to meet new faces. Any wishing to stop by and say hi are welcome to. The Project is not what you would think of a militia, the members are profesional, patriotic, pro-Government, and serious about training. There is no extreme attitudes or crazy talk. The discription on the page of the values is exactly what I saw when I went, I was a little nervous that there would be anti-Government or anti-police type attitude there and because of my job I thought I might not fit in. This was not the case I posted this up on Calguns because I was so impressed with the people there and the way that they carried themselves. At least five of the people that were at the event I went to were veterans of Iraq and Afghanistan and there were others that also seemed to know a ton of info about this type of stuff. They were just above my expectations and I wanted to share it with other folks that might like this type of stuff.




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Old 12-23-2011, 7:34 PM
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Old 12-23-2011, 9:14 PM
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Interesting
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Old 12-23-2011, 9:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grinder View Post
Funny you should mention this as I know about this law it aplies to:

(a) Any two or more persons who assemble as a paramilitary
organization for the purpose of practicing with weapons shall be
punished by imprisonment in a county jail for not more than one year
or by a fine of not more than one thousand dollars ($1,000), or by
both that fine and imprisonment.
As used in this subdivision, "paramilitary organization" means an
organization which is not an agency of the United States government
or of the State of California, or which is not a private school
meeting the requirements set forth in Section 48222 of the Education
Code, but which engages in instruction or training in guerrilla
warfare or sabotage, or which, as an organization, engages in rioting
or the violent disruption of, or the violent interference with,
school activities.


So as long as there is no training in: guerilla warfare, sabotage, roiting, or violent disruption of school activities you are ok.

Furthermore there is a law in California authorizing the assembly and training of militia units in the state. I will have to find the exact law but I have it saved here in my computer somewhere. There are at least six large militias in California I have been to see several and this one was by far the best. One of the members told me the reason that they have to use the word "Militia" is to avoid problems with 11460.
I thought the second amendment also gives is the right to have a private well regulated militia outside the government as well? This law is a bunch of crap.
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  #19  
Old 12-23-2011, 10:27 PM
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Interesting
They are in your area...
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  #20  
Old 12-23-2011, 10:33 PM
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Reading their website, it's sad to see the number of spelling and punctuation errors. To me, this shows lack of professionalism. However, after reading through their site, I have a positive feeling about what they're doing.

Another interesting thing I noticed is that their arm patch is a backward American flag. I'm not quite sure what to make of that.
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Old 12-23-2011, 10:50 PM
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Originally Posted by vortec_cruiser View Post
Reading their website, it's sad to see the number of spelling and punctuation errors. To me, this shows lack of professionalism. However, after reading through their site, I have a positive feeling about what they're doing.

Another interesting thing I noticed is that their arm patch is a backward American flag. I'm not quite sure what to make of that.
its not backwards.

flags are to be worn with the stars forward.

heres an army solider in a nice bed of flowers


and heres a bunch of soliders
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  #22  
Old 12-23-2011, 11:26 PM
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I think your "nice bed of flowers" is afghan opium producing plants.....
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Old 12-23-2011, 11:43 PM
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Looks like fun. Think they would like to play with a semi 1919a4?
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Old 12-23-2011, 11:54 PM
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Why do you have to have BDU's? How about jeans? I guess because it's a militia.
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Old 12-24-2011, 1:02 AM
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Why do you have to have BDU's? How about jeans? I guess because it's a militia.
Jeans are made of 100% cotton. When you wear them on long hikes you can get chaffed in the crotch/legs and they hold water if they get wet. BDU pants are made for tactical wear they are loose in the right areas and snug where they should be. BDU pants also have good pockets for gear, not to mention the camouflage benefit of BDU uniform. Oh yeah BUD type clothes are also made or rip-stop fabric that will hold together better if damaged.
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Old 12-24-2011, 1:11 AM
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Looks like fun. Think they would like to play with a semi 1919a4?
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Old 12-24-2011, 1:23 AM
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In those pics, are those live fire exercises?

Are the trainers former military?

I have been a member of the FA project since inception. Yes, we train with live fire when it fits the location and the exercise.

We also train with blanks for force on force or MOUT exercises. It seems to elevate adrenaline and adds a degree of chaos, which for me heightens the effectiveness of the training.

We do have among our members some folks with prior service, some members with emergency service backgrounds, some folks devoted to the tactical discipline, and some folks that would be considered beginners.

Every skill level is appreciated and welcome --this is an easy group to walk into, yet the group is also serious about the project.


Bill
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Old 12-24-2011, 1:27 AM
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Why do you have to have BDU's? How about jeans? I guess because it's a militia.
There are several answers to that question-- the first of which is that we believe that there is value in the uniformity.

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Old 12-24-2011, 1:28 AM
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Originally Posted by stretch View Post
I think your "nice bed of flowers" is afghan opium producing plants.....
You might be correct, but it is still a nice looking bed of flowers.

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Old 12-24-2011, 1:31 AM
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This was the best part i found on their site. Too bad they're in Norcal. Anything of the sort down here in So-cal?

Good post.
Not at the moment (that we are aware of), but we would like to work on that at some point in time.

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Old 12-24-2011, 1:34 AM
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Are they on private property?
At times we have access to private property. Just as often we are on public land.

Either way, at all times we are hyper-attentive to operating lawfully.

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Old 12-24-2011, 11:22 PM
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Originally Posted by vortec_cruiser View Post
Another interesting thing I noticed is that their arm patch is a backward American flag. I'm not quite sure what to make of that.
The full-color U.S. flag cloth replica is worn so that the star field faces forward, or to the flag’s own right. When worn in this manner, the flag is facing to the observer’s right, and gives the effect of the flag flying in the breeze as the wearer moves forward.

The rule dates back to the Army's early history, when both mounted cavalry and infantry units would designate a standard bearer, who carried the Colors into battle. As he charged, his forward momentum caused the flag to stream back. Since the Stars and Stripes are mounted with the canton closest to the pole, that section stayed to the right, while the stripes flew to the left.


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Old 12-24-2011, 11:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Grinder View Post
The Project will be at Sac Valley shooting center range 10 all day Sunday January 8th. It is a good place to meet new faces. Any wishing to stop by and say hi are welcome to. The Project is not what you would think of a militia, the members are profesional, patriotic, pro-Government, and serious about training. There is no extreme attitudes or crazy talk. The discription on the page of the values is exactly what I saw when I went, I was a little nervous that there would be anti-Government or anti-police type attitude there and because of my job I thought I might not fit in. This was not the case I posted this up on Calguns because I was so impressed with the people there and the way that they carried themselves. At least five of the people that were at the event I went to were veterans of Iraq and Afghanistan and there were others that also seemed to know a ton of info about this type of stuff. They were just above my expectations and I wanted to share it with other folks that might like this type of stuff.
[IMG]http://a8.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/397365_144578262319537_117094135067950_199180_1359 920430_n.jpg[IMG]

[IMG]http://a4.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/377874_144575675653129_117094135067950_199116_1405 780331_n.jpg[IMG]

[IMG]http://a3.sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash4/395797_144578022319561_117094135067950_199173_1447 74859_n.jpg[IMG]
I am very interested in this - Would be nice to be a part of something like this (patriots and pro police/not anarchist rednecks). I will be there the 8th and possibly with a friend.
Honestly I am not sure how much I like the idea of a "uniform" or BDUs - but I guess I can decide on that when I talk to them.
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Old 12-25-2011, 6:56 AM
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Originally Posted by I_Love_My_.38 View Post
Looks like a bunch of whacky nutjobs! Where do I join and where are they???
lol
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Old 12-26-2011, 6:06 PM
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I am very interested in this - Would be nice to be a part of something like this (patriots and pro police/not anarchist rednecks). I will be there the 8th and possibly with a friend.
Honestly I am not sure how much I like the idea of a "uniform" or BDUs - but I guess I can decide on that when I talk to them.
That is great I hope you and your friend can make it on the 8th. It will be lots of fun and any questions you have about us and what we do can best be answered there. I think that you will be as impressed with the people there as I have. Hope to see you there.
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  #36  
Old 12-26-2011, 6:38 PM
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Red Dawn, anyone? Interesting.
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Old 12-26-2011, 6:53 PM
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Ok, so I read thru their website, to which they dont provide much information at all. So maybe one of the folks who here is a member can answer a question or two for me. Please dont bother with the flames in regards to these questions. I personally think they are legitimate questions.

1- just what exactly is the purpose of this group? A group of people waiting for SHTF so they can tool around and survive together? California already has the CaARNG as a state militia. Is this another group wanting to to step in at that level? Even using the "militia" title, do they actually think they will get called upon by the governor of the state to help out in a emergency? Honestly? While its great to have all the knowledge about patrolling, and executing ambush left/right. . what exactly does this pertain to in anything in Calif?

2- California has the california state military reserve ( http://www.calguard.ca.gov/casmr/Pages/default.aspx ) which is actually a subsection of the NG in california. this seems to be the legitimate aspect of a militia in california, whereas now you have the california state militia ( http://cal-militia.com/home ) and the Fortress America project now stepping in. If is is actually Fortress America. . . then why is it only in northern california? They do say they are also in nevada and washington or oregon as well, but I didnt see anything other than that on their website. is this where they wanted a catchy namesake to make themselves seem legitimate?

3- The mini-14 is the standardized weapon for them? seriously? And as I read it, you cant get your expert certification unless you use this or a M1a??

Quote:
Overall, it strikes me that the Ruger Mini-14 is just about the best thing going in California. Fortress America Project has decided to standardize this carbine for our California FTXs, so stop complaining and get yours as soon as possible. Either the Mini-14 or M1a will be required to get your expert certification.

and probably the most disconcerting part about this part, is what follows afterwards, a picture of Liam Neilson as Hannibal from the A-team with the caption., . . . .

Good enough for the A-Team, good enough for Fortress America.
Seriously? The mini-14? Everybody whos ever been around a mini-14 knows just exactly how unreliable they are as far as accuracy. They always have been, and they always will be. How do I know this? Well, I own 3 of them, from the early 80's all the way to a recent production, and they are all still junk. Sure, I can understand the aspect of the mini-14 not seeming all EBR as some of the m4gery thats out there nowadays. But is this all about being PC as a militia now? Is this something where they creating members all had mini-14s and decided this would be the unit standard? Dont they know they can build an AR-15 for the same amount of money, or even less than a brand new mini-14, and have more accuracy than a mini-14? And you can have magazines that are more common, and more reliable than a mini-14 factory or aftermarket mag?

so anyways, whats the real deal here? be honest, you can even do it in a PM, im just wondering, as Im sure alot of other people here are as well. It takes more than great photography on a website to make a militia. And if they dont have anything to hide, then why are they so vague on their website about everything? while these may seem like pretty tough and blunt questions, somebody has to ask them right?
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  #38  
Old 12-26-2011, 8:46 PM
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FatalKitty FatalKitty is offline
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I just got off the phone with one of their guys as I had contacted them on their website's form.

I am THOROUGHLY impressed with this group

from what I was told, there are 3 main goals of the group - 1: safety, 2: fun, 3: productivity - they basically do this to have some friends to shoot with and have fun training in a tactical environment regularly (Anyone who has ever had friends bail on a day of shooting with you knows why they do this)

as for your #2 - I was told they also do stuff in Nevada - and with the name... who knows, but Fortress America does sound a lot better than Fortress California (which would probably have to be written in pink sparkle letters)

future member right here pending meeting everyone on the 8th!

Last edited by FatalKitty; 12-26-2011 at 8:57 PM..
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  #39  
Old 12-26-2011, 9:07 PM
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CBlacksheep CBlacksheep is offline
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Originally Posted by Stormfeather View Post
California has the california state military reserve ( http://www.calguard.ca.gov/casmr/Pages/default.aspx ) which is actually a subsection of the NG in california. this seems to be the legitimate aspect of a militia in california, whereas now you have the california state militia ( http://cal-militia.com/home ) and the Fortress America project now stepping in. If is is actually Fortress America. . . then why is it only in northern california? They do say they are also in nevada and washington or oregon as well, but I didnt see anything other than that on their website. is this where they wanted a catchy namesake to make themselves seem legitimate?
Do yourself a favor and read 10 USC 311. I did not think anyone would make this argument.

Being sponsored by a government does not make it any more 'legitimate' than the country bumpkins in jeans and mossy oak anoraks organizing for marksmanship practice. Clearly, your definition of the militia does not quite sync up with that which the Militia Act of 1903 provide. The CASMR is a mostly unarmed volunteer branch of the California Military Department and acts chiefly as an augmenting force to the California National Guard. They are considered a part of the organized militia, along with Active, Reserve, and National Guard components. They, however, cannot be federalized.

You go to the range with your friends and hone your marksmanship. You often look for opinions from friends and experts on how to improve the performance of your firearms. You buy and store ammunition. You take educate yourself with emergency medical courses and supply your home with the means to feed and protect those you hold dear. Whether or not you take care to recognize or even believe it, you do all of these as a member of the militia.
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Old 12-26-2011, 9:25 PM
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If you can qualify with the Mini, surely you'll do just as well, if not better, with the AR. Reading their rationale behind the Mini and M1A shows it was thought out and made to be open to as many people as possible. The Mini is a fairly basic carbine, almost all are the same internally (most have stock barrels/actions though aftermarket is available) with only external aftermarket parts, and even the most basic novice shooters can figure out the controls; not saying the AR is some Black Magic/Runs on JuJu rifle, but the Mini/M1A seem to be the bare bones of what you would need. After quals, you can use AR, Mini, M1A it seems.

As for my Mini 3" at 100 yds isnt too bad, especially for my novice self.
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