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  #161  
Old 04-21-2012, 1:56 PM
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that Nazi belt buckle gun sold for $18,000.


Last edited by beetle; 04-11-2015 at 1:14 PM..
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  #162  
Old 04-21-2012, 7:43 PM
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some more results from today's auction.

the huge training model (with scale magazine too!) sold for $3250


the FN FNC rifle sold for $4500


the "sight safety" colt 1900 sold for $20,000


the L42A1 british sniper rifle sold for $7500


the presentation pistol from Georg Luger to Borchardt sold for $100,000


the 1907 trials Colt sold for DOUBLE the high estimate. Sold $90,000


next up, what beetle bid on today
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  #163  
Old 04-21-2012, 7:51 PM
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That's not a bad deal on the L42A1. Cased No.4 Mk1T rifles go for 4k-5k, so 7.5k for the much rarer L42A1 isn't bad at all.
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  #164  
Old 04-21-2012, 7:56 PM
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what beetle bought today

I wrote about the Singer pistol story previously. During WWI the army found itself extremely short of sidearms, so much so that it had to bring a revolver back into production to supplement 1911s. After the war, the Army decided to study how American industry could ramp up to produce pistols if needed. It awarded the Singer sewing machine company a contract to study what it would take to produce a 1911. The idea was to give a saavy machine production company a chance to study what it would take to make 1911s without preconceived notions.

Singer came up with plans for new machinery and processes to make the 1911. The government awarded Singer a contract to make 500 pistols as a "educational order". During the production run Singer was not able to ramp up to the goal of pistols per hour, but they did make very high quality pistols. As WW2 broke out Singer decided to apply it's manufacturing prowess towards a more difficult wartime necessity: bomb arming equipment and the famous norden bomb sight.

Having experienced pretty good results with converting typewriter companys to gun manufacturing (for example Underwood making the M1 carbine), the government approached Remington Rand to make the 1911. Remington Rand was a typewriter company best known for introducing the QWERTY layout.

The government turned over the plans and machinery from Singer to Remington Rand. Remington was able to come up to speed pretty quickly and started making pistols that were similar in quality to Singer. Throughout the war they continued to improve the processes and machinery so that by the end of the war Remington Rand pistols were acknolwedged to be the cheapest and best quality 1911s.

All combined Remington Rand manufactured over 800,000 pistols or more than Colt and Ithaca combined. As a result the Remington Rand is the most common WW2 1911A1 encountered today. In the past Remington Rand pistols were often used as a base gun for customization or national matches due to it's high quality and well fitting parts.

Today a collector grade Remington Rand in great shape is worth about $2000. As with all WW2 1911s they are becoming quite rare.

The item I was after (and successfully purchased) was a magnificent example of a Remington Rand pistol. It is in 100% condition and appears "unissued".



There is one special little feature that made this one worth 10X the price of a standard Remington Rand though....



Can you see it?
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  #165  
Old 04-21-2012, 8:13 PM
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Originally Posted by beetle View Post
The item I was after (and successfully purchased) was a magnificent example of a Remington Rand pistol. It is in 100% condition and appears "unissued".

There is one special little feature that made this one worth 10X the price of a standard Remington Rand though....

Can you see it?
"1"
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  #166  
Old 04-22-2012, 1:46 AM
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I'm remiss this is the first time I've seen this thread. My thanks to Beetle for taking the time to share with us this fantastic collection of stories, information, and photographs.



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  #167  
Old 04-22-2012, 9:57 AM
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The Colt 1883 Gatling Gun with Field Carriage



Sold $210,000!
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  #168  
Old 04-22-2012, 10:06 AM
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perhaps the best deal of the auction. 1800s cannon. Estimated to sell between $15,000 and $25,000. Auctioneer states that they are too heavy to be shipped and will need special arrangements for pickup. Auction opens, nobody bids. Finally auctioneer says "any bid? any opening bid?"

a guy bids $1700. The auctioneer takes it. Then the next lot comes up, it's the other half of this cannon pair? Auctioneer asks the guy "want another one for the same price?"

Sold! $1700. So both cannons for $3400 when the auction estimate was $15,000 to $25,000 EACH.

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  #169  
Old 04-22-2012, 10:16 AM
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It's amzing what ego's and money will do at an auction,, the 2 folks bidding on the PPK and running it up to 55 grand is just unbelievable. I guess when pockets are deep the common sense factor seems to go out the window. Hope the buyer is as happy as the seller is,, lol
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  #170  
Old 04-22-2012, 10:23 AM
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"1"

Looks more like a "7" (seven) to me...
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  #171  
Old 04-22-2012, 10:26 AM
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Looks more like a "7" (seven) to me...
The ONE I bought is quite unique
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  #172  
Old 04-22-2012, 10:49 AM
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The ONE I bought is quite unique
It's also pretty clear that it's a pre-'68 pistol, since the frame has NONE of the federally-required markings for firearms. Love it!
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  #173  
Old 04-22-2012, 11:03 AM
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Quote:
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The ONE I bought is quite unique
Did you get a deal? or within the “estimate range?”

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  #174  
Old 04-22-2012, 11:23 AM
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Beetle,
Is this the Colt that was broadcast in the pilot of the RIA tv show?

Also, did you notice them filming future episodes? :P
Yes, that was the one featured in their Discovery channel pilot. Pat mentioned that there is a very high likelyhood that more episodes are coming.

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Did you get a deal? or within the “estimate range?”

Alas no I did not get a "deal". As you can imagine interest was high on this one. In fact it sold for quite a sum over the high estimate. Oh well, how often do you across #1 of something?
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  #175  
Old 04-22-2012, 12:40 PM
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these nazi paratrooper helmets always seem to go high. This is the third helmet that I've seen go for way over the auction estimate. either the auction house is routinely estimating them low, or demand is higher than they expect.

Auction estimate is 2500-4500. Sold for $11,000

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  #176  
Old 04-22-2012, 1:09 PM
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LOL, it happens at least once every auction. up was this beautiful engraved shotgun:



bidding is enthusastic between a couple of guys in the room. auctioneer opens the bid at $14,000 then anounces 15, 16, 17, 18, 19 thousand. then twenty, last call, sold! twenty thousand to bidder number XYZ.

XYZ says 20 thousand?!? oh i though we were bidding in hundreds

embarassing!
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  #177  
Old 04-22-2012, 4:01 PM
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auction is done. I only bought two items this time around

1) Remington Rand #1 Pistol


2) Colt Double Diamond Commemorative Set (Officers 1911 and Python in Stainless)


let me review today's results and I'll do a final posting of interesting results.
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  #178  
Old 04-22-2012, 4:08 PM
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Does RIA post the catalog with results??
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  #179  
Old 04-22-2012, 4:40 PM
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Excellent beetle. Love the 1911. We'll have to go on a trip to RIA for a big auction. Bummed I had to sit this one out, but it helped the wallet recover somewhat.
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  #180  
Old 04-23-2012, 1:08 PM
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What an incredible thread. Thanks for sharing!
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  #181  
Old 04-24-2012, 7:25 PM
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In summary prices for guns (collector or otherwise) remain strong. Almost every lot went for or above the high estimate -- especially the prestige lots. The Colt 1907 trials pistol went for double the high estimate. And you read about the story of two enthusiastic bidders pushing that PPK up to 55K. And yes I'll be honest and say that I paid well over the high estimate for my Remington Rand #1.

I'm not sure if it's because of the TV show, but there were definatley more bidders in this auction then previous ones. And some of the prices just did not make sense. I can understand rare collectibles going over their current market value, but current production guns? Two auctions ago I was lucky enough to pick up a Colt Gold Cup Trophy for $750. This time the same Colt Gold Cup Trophy sold for $1500! with buyer's premium that is $1725. you can find these all day long on gunbroker for $1200 or less. My out-of-state FFL buddy (who deals in Class 3) was shocked at the prices of the MAC10s for sale. He said the normal market price is in the $3K range. At this auction they were selling in the $7-$8K range. I don't know -- perhaps there is another buying spree underway.

I "only" got two lots in this auction, but I'm happy with the ones I got.

The next auction is in the June timeframe, however it is their "regional" auction. This is where RIA typically sells the less expensive items. Usuallly guns will be sold in bigger lots (for example a lot of 3-5 guns), so there may be some deals to be had. I usually don't follow the regional auction too closely but may end up making a small update to this thread.

Anyways, I enjoyed sharing the guns, stories, and results with calguns -- I hope you enjoyed it as well. This concludes beetle's report of the April 2012 Rock Island Auction.
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  #182  
Old 04-24-2012, 7:26 PM
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oops duplicate posting removed.
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  #183  
Old 04-24-2012, 7:46 PM
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I had absolutely no interest in gun auctions.... until this thread

Truly epic thread, awesome pics and stories KEEP POSTING!!!
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  #184  
Old 04-24-2012, 8:52 PM
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I pick up my first 1911 on Saturday. Thanks, this thread has me looking on gunbroker for additional 1911's.
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  #185  
Old 04-24-2012, 9:38 PM
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Beetle, thanks again for a great recap and insight into the RIAC auctions. As much as I grumble about the "buyer's premium" I am glad there is a groundswell of buyers with money -- the fact that many are overpaying only suggests to me that we have a lot of "newbies" with money joining the pro-gunnie crowd.

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  #186  
Old 04-26-2012, 9:02 PM
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any word on who won that colt #1? is it going to a museum or private collection?

way too rich for my blood, that is for sure!
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  #187  
Old 04-30-2012, 11:00 AM
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Quote:
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Does RIA post the catalog with results??
Yes, the online catalog has been updated with results. www.rockislandauction.com

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marty27 View Post
any word on who won that colt #1? is it going to a museum or private collection?

way too rich for my blood, that is for sure!
Hmm, I'm not sure which gun you are referring to as I never wrote about Colt #1. From what I have read online Colt #1 is in a private collection somewhere, but it has long been out of the public.

My original post was about trying to get Colt #33. It is now in the hands of a private collector.

In the latest installment of this series, I wrote about Remington Rand #1. This is now in a private collection as well -- mine!!!!
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  #188  
Old 04-30-2012, 11:36 AM
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it is evident from this thread, your knowledge of some very historic events, and you recent acquisitions, that you must have a very interesting "private collection" any chance we can see some highlights of that? this thread and information is just too good to let sit until the next auction...

If not, that is understandable as well considering its a private collection.

Thanks for all the reading material and history lessons.
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  #189  
Old 05-01-2012, 7:16 AM
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Thanks for the catalog info beatle,, enjoy the new toys. JT
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  #190  
Old 05-01-2012, 9:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by beetle View Post
Hmm, I'm not sure which gun you are referring to as I never wrote about Colt #1. From what I have read online Colt #1 is in a private collection somewhere, but it has long been out of the public.

My original post was about trying to get Colt #33. It is now in the hands of a private collector.

In the latest installment of this series, I wrote about Remington Rand #1. This is now in a private collection as well -- mine!!!!
sorry, i meant that colt navy cartridge serial #1. the one with no estimate before the auction.
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  #191  
Old 05-02-2012, 9:45 AM
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pretty cool experience you had!!
Thanks for sharing
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  #192  
Old 05-02-2012, 10:13 AM
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Thank you for this thread. I have enjoyed it tremendously.
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  #193  
Old 05-03-2012, 11:05 AM
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Some very interesting firearms, thanks for sharing.

What does the Nazi belt buckle do? I can not tell from the pictures.
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  #194  
Old 05-13-2012, 3:35 PM
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Not sure what this is, it's labled "my friend". some kind of ring gun? Sold for $950
James Reid "my friend" knuckle duster. Knuckle duster is also a term for brass knuckles, which this gun can act as. I think these "my friend" ones are super cool, and I also have a weird thing for old Pepperbox style guns. $950 was probably a good deal (http://www.icollector.com/Very-scarc...-cov_i10487874)

That Alcatraz model 12 is awesome. Maybe it's just living in SF or my mom's insane fascination with Alcatraz, but I would have gladly paid $1,500 for that.



Great thread! Great read! Can't wait to see more.
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  #195  
Old 05-16-2012, 3:42 PM
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so no word / ideas on where that 1st cartridge colt ended up?
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  #196  
Old 05-16-2012, 7:32 PM
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Awesome thread!. The good thing about missing these the first few times is you get lots of content at once.

It also makes me wonder where my life went horribly wrong.

Thanks again for sharing, wonderful read.
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Old 05-19-2012, 9:28 AM
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Quote:
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Some very interesting firearms, thanks for sharing.

What does the Nazi belt buckle do? I can not tell from the pictures.
Here's another picture of the Nazi belt buckle gun. It has a 4 shot capacity.


Quote:
Originally Posted by JeremyS View Post
James Reid "my friend" knuckle duster. Knuckle duster is also a term for brass knuckles, which this gun can act as. I think these "my friend" ones are super cool, and I also have a weird thing for old Pepperbox style guns. $950 was probably a good deal (http://www.icollector.com/Very-scarc...-cov_i10487874)

That Alcatraz model 12 is awesome. Maybe it's just living in SF or my mom's insane fascination with Alcatraz, but I would have gladly paid $1,500 for that.

Great thread! Great read! Can't wait to see more.
Very cool -- thanks for the info! I had no idea how this worked, but now that you describe it as brass knuckles I see it now. Thanks!

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so no word / ideas on where that 1st cartridge colt ended up?
Unfortunately I don't have any more info on that Colt first cartridge model. It was sold to a private individual on the floor that I don't recognize. So could have been a proxy for someone else, or just somebody acquiring a unique piece for a private collection.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeR View Post
Awesome thread!. The good thing about missing these the first few times is you get lots of content at once.

It also makes me wonder where my life went horribly wrong.

Thanks again for sharing, wonderful read.
You're welcome. I enjoy making these threads as well -- helps to pass the time between lots that I'm waiting to come up

On that note, the catalog is up for the June 29-July 1 "regional" auction. This is Rock Island's auction where they sell off the items that don't make it into the "premiere" auction. the catalog is in black and white instead of color, and most of the lots sell under $3K. They also sometimes bundle a bunch of guns together (lot of 5 mauser handguns, etc). There could be deals here.

I won't be going through the catalog in detail this time, but if you are interested in trying out an auction perhaps this is something you can look into.

I can get a lot of PMs about WW2 1911s. Here's one coming up that might be had at a reasonable price:


Auction estimate is $1000-$1500 which is about right for a authentical, non-rearsenaled ww2 1911. Since it's C&R it's also exempt from the roster.

The next "Premiere" auction is in september, so I'll update this thread when that catalog is released.
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  #198  
Old 07-26-2012, 8:34 PM
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Guess what time it is boys and girls? It's almost time for the September Premiere auction!

Welcome to yet another installment of Beetle's auction commentary.

Here is a teaser:

This Colt 1910 model was developed to compete against Fabrique Nationale in European markets. Colt worked with Winchester to develop a new catridge, the 9.8mm. Several thousand rounds of 9.8mm was manufactured for this experimental pistol.

Colt took the model of 1910 .45ACP pistol (predecessor to the 1911) and scaled it down. It has the same finish as all Colts of that era -- high polish blue with nitre blue small parts.

The frame itself is stamped "RAD 40" or Research and Development. The lot comes with two Winchester 9.8mm catridges.

This pistol won the 1st place award from the 2007 Colt Collector's Association show.

Only five examples of this pistol were manufactured. Four of them are in public museums which makes this the only one available for private collections.

Auction estimate is $160,000-$250,000.



More auction call outs, history, and stories to come.....

Last edited by beetle; 07-29-2012 at 6:37 PM..
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  #199  
Old 07-27-2012, 5:26 PM
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I just checked the latest "toy" catalog,,, some nice Walthers,, the "Party Leader" PPK should be interesting to follow.
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Old 07-29-2012, 6:39 PM
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Join Date: May 2009
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some more interesting guns coming up for auction....

The Gyrojet Mark I.

Produced from 1962 to 1970, the Gyrojet used a 13mm spin stablized solid fuel rocket for ammunition. Because the ammo was a small rocket, there is very little recoil (unlike normal ammunition where all of the kinetic energy is released at once).

Like a rocket, velocity when leaving the barrel was low, but increased as the micro rocket continued it's flight. At peak it reaches 1,250 feet per second.

Long out of production, ammo is very expensive now -- over $100/round.

Auction estimate is $2500-$3500
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