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Calgunners in Service This forum is a place for our active duty and deployed members to share, request and have a bit of home where ever they are.

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  #1  
Old 07-20-2011, 7:12 PM
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Default Air force+ bachelor in criminal justice= officer?

Hi I'm planning to join the Air Force once I graduate from SF state with my bachelor degree in criminal justice. Im planning to only join the Air Force if they let me in as an officer. If I become an officer, what rank would I be? E3? Would the Air Force help me pay back my student loans? I'm about 37,000 in debt. And within the next year I'm planning to married my girlfriend and start our family. Would this be a problem? Can my girlfriend and child come live with me on base? I'm 23 right now and would be 24 or 25 when I official sign up. Any information would help thanks

Richard.
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  #2  
Old 07-20-2011, 7:25 PM
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Officer grades are preceded by an "O"
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Old 07-20-2011, 7:46 PM
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http://usmilitary.about.com/od/airforce/l/blafrank4.htm
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Old 07-20-2011, 7:55 PM
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If a recruiter is offering you an "E", run.
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Old 07-21-2011, 11:38 AM
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Do not limit your self to the USAF, try other branches, if they need the degree you hold, your in. Needs of the service and all come first. You may have to enter as an E-3 and go thru an officer program. Good luck!
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Old 07-21-2011, 1:48 PM
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Youíll have to take a risk and ďenlistĒ if you want things to go faster.

If you want to ensure you become an officer at entry you need to take the long and competitive process of applying for OCS. There are a lot of hoops to jump through.

Iím 38 and an E4 (Specialist). My mentality is Iíve pretty much given up on ďrankĒ aspirations. I can only hope for a direct commission after I get back from training. If I donít get it, then Iím pretty much resigned to just doing my gig, likely getting to E6 in my first contract and just taking it from there.

If I do get a commission I expect Iíll never get beyond O4 given my age, but once again, Iíll be a 40 year old O1 (so big deal).

The army I think officers something more than all the other services, and that is it is MUCH larger than all the other services and if you walked into a recruiterís office heíd have more opportunities for you to find something you like.

Also, with a 4 year degree you come in the army as an E4 (a specialist with the same pay as a Corporal, but none of the NCO responsibility, but your first promotion will put you at Sgt.).

Hereís an interesting thing Iíve found out now that I have access to all the reserve unit openings. While it might seem like enlisting or there being limited things you are interested in Iíve found that there are over ONE THOUSAND positions open in various reserve units for MAJORS!!!!!!!!

Over ONE THOUSAND. My theory is Ltís and Cptís simply bail when contracts expire and donít fill up the ranks, and the military is particular in filling in sr. positions. So if there isnít anyone within the army to fill it these positions remain open.

There are only a few Lt openings because those are the positions new officers have to come in as, and everyone wanting to be an officer is going after them.

Donít knock the other services. Especially if your motivations are merely experience and education related. If itís your dream to be in the USAF then yes, stick to it. Otherwise they all pay the same money.
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  #7  
Old 07-21-2011, 2:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snoopy47 View Post
Youíll have to take a risk and ďenlistĒ if you want things to go faster.

If you want to ensure you become an officer at entry you need to take the long and competitive process of applying for OCS. There are a lot of hoops to jump through.

Iím 38 and an E4 (Specialist). My mentality is Iíve pretty much given up on ďrankĒ aspirations. I can only hope for a direct commission after I get back from training. .
Better hurry. There is an age cap for new officers, and you are pushing it.
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Old 07-21-2011, 3:58 PM
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Better hurry. There is an age cap for new officers, and you are pushing it.
Not "reservists". I have read this per army reserve polices, and confirmed it. There is no age limit for a DC for "reserves". The policy age limit without a WAIVER is 42, but waivers are permitted. So I have 3 years before I even need a waiver, but waivers can always be an option.

This applies only to the reserves.

If it doesn't work out and I hate it oh well. It's not like I could leave my civilian career anyway. I'll just be 45 when I'm cut loose, I'll have the stories, and use my GI bill money to take private pilot lessons, and continue on in my civilian path.

I am cautious though. A job is still a job. Rank really isnít what is seems. At least thatís my perception. The hierarchy is merely formalized. But essentially, you have folks who boss you around, they evaluate your work and it impacts your success in your future and how much money you make down the road.

How is that any different than a civilian job when it comes down to it?

I would have been an easy commission for a finance MOS. Iíd rather be my MOS as a Specialist than a Finance Captain. Thatís a risk Iím afraid of. If I DC I odds are I will not end up back in my MOS, and if I get assigned to a Finance MOS (given my civilian background) I would have just shot myself in the foot.
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Old 07-21-2011, 5:15 PM
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Do your home work and get back to us.
Not sure of any officer program for loan repayment, only enlisted and not sure they are still in effect.
To be an officer now days 3.5+ in a good college.
Why ask us? talk to a recruiter they don't bite you know?
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  #10  
Old 07-21-2011, 7:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Snoopy47 View Post
Youíll have to take a risk and ďenlistĒ if you want things to go faster.

If you want to ensure you become an officer at entry you need to take the long and competitive process of applying for OCS. There are a lot of hoops to jump through.

Iím 38 and an E4 (Specialist). My mentality is Iíve pretty much given up on ďrankĒ aspirations. I can only hope for a direct commission after I get back from training. If I donít get it, then Iím pretty much resigned to just doing my gig, likely getting to E6 in my first contract and just taking it from there.

If I do get a commission I expect Iíll never get beyond O4 given my age, but once again, Iíll be a 40 year old O1 (so big deal).

The army I think officers something more than all the other services, and that is it is MUCH larger than all the other services and if you walked into a recruiterís office heíd have more opportunities for you to find something you like.

Also, with a 4 year degree you come in the army as an E4 (a specialist with the same pay as a Corporal, but none of the NCO responsibility, but your first promotion will put you at Sgt.).

Hereís an interesting thing Iíve found out now that I have access to all the reserve unit openings. While it might seem like enlisting or there being limited things you are interested in Iíve found that there are over ONE THOUSAND positions open in various reserve units for MAJORS!!!!!!!!

Over ONE THOUSAND. My theory is Ltís and Cptís simply bail when contracts expire and donít fill up the ranks, and the military is particular in filling in sr. positions. So if there isnít anyone within the army to fill it these positions remain open.

There are only a few Lt openings because those are the positions new officers have to come in as, and everyone wanting to be an officer is going after them.

Donít knock the other services. Especially if your motivations are merely experience and education related. If itís your dream to be in the USAF then yes, stick to it. Otherwise they all pay the same money.
Good post. The Military as a whole needs more guys with your outlook.
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  #11  
Old 07-21-2011, 9:14 PM
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You might be able to join the Air Force because of your bachelor's degree, but that does not guarantee you an officer rank. Due to the downsizing and stringent requirements of the military now, I see a lot of people join the military with a college degree and still end up being enlisted. If you really want to be an officer, ask a recruiter about the officer program right from the start, don't tell them you just want to join the Air Force.
As for the student loans you have, I'm not sure about this but, I think the military will not pay you're existing student loans prior to joining the military. Also, you're girl friend can't live on base with you until you marry her and you put her as your dependent on your page two.
My advice is don't get discourage if you don't get a guaranteed officer rank when you sign up. Once you're in the military there's alot of enlisted to officer program out htere for you. Good luck!
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Old 07-22-2011, 6:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by richie3888 View Post
Hi I'm planning to join the Air Force once I graduate from SF state with my bachelor degree in criminal justice. Im planning to only join the Air Force if they let me in as an officer. If I become an officer, what rank would I be? E3? Would the Air Force help me pay back my student loans? I'm about 37,000 in debt. And within the next year I'm planning to married my girlfriend and start our family. Would this be a problem? Can my girlfriend and child come live with me on base? I'm 23 right now and would be 24 or 25 when I official sign up. Any information would help thanks

Richard.
Are you too good to be an enlisted to whom you will be leading into battle where their lives are on the line?
You should join because you want to serve, not to use it to pay off personal debt.

Your priorities are all f'd up.
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Old 07-22-2011, 7:15 AM
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Originally Posted by E__WOK View Post
Are you too good to be an enlisted to whom you will be leading into battle where their lives are on the line?
You should join because you want to serve, not to use it to pay off personal debt.

Your priorities are all f'd up.
If the military is offering, why not take them up on it. Your perspective is all f'd up.
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Old 07-22-2011, 8:29 AM
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If the military is offering, why not take them up on it. Your perspective is all f'd up.
I don't understand. What exactly is the military offering, offering to absorb his debt?
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  #15  
Old 07-22-2011, 8:46 AM
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I think the military does credit checks too, they don't have to take someone with huge amounts of debt or liability.
That being said, if they need your skills maybe you could swing a signing bonus to help out.
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Old 07-22-2011, 6:25 PM
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Are you too good to be an enlisted to whom you will be leading into battle where their lives are on the line?
You should join because you want to serve, not to use it to pay off personal debt.

Your priorities are all f'd up.
Im not asking them to pay my credit cards or my house payments. I'm simply asking if they help payback students loans. And I'm not to good for anything but why not try to get in a higher rank if I can because of my degree. And don't say my priorities are messed up. I wanted to serve ever since I was a kid. I grew up in a military family and I would love to follow in my dad, uncle, and cousins foot steps.

Because I wrote one thing about money, don't assume I'm going in for the wrong reason.
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Old 07-22-2011, 7:14 PM
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Originally Posted by E__WOK View Post
Are you too good to be an enlisted to whom you will be leading into battle where their lives are on the line?
You should join because you want to serve, not to use it to pay off personal debt.

Your priorities are all f'd up.
Except for mostly the Air Force sends all it's officers into battle while leaving the enlisted behind for support work.
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Old 07-24-2011, 8:26 AM
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The Air Force typically only provides student loan payoff's on nursing and doctorial degrees. A CJ major would only be useful to an individual working in OSI or Security Forces. However, if you were selected to attend OCS, they could put you in a myriad of other career fields and train you even though that AFSC may have nothing to do with your major. Happens all the time. You need to speak to a recruiter.
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Old 07-24-2011, 8:28 AM
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Except for mostly the Air Force sends all it's officers into battle while leaving the enlisted behind for support work.
At one point, this was semi-true. Nowdays, completely untrue. The Air Force has more boots-on-the-ground activites then in it's entire history.
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Old 07-24-2011, 10:04 AM
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Debt is not a rejection only lack of payment of that debt. You must be in good standing on all debt. Airforce runs credit checks on everyone before enlisting them.
And the comment that you are too good to be enlisted is highly offensive. You should get the best option you can.
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Old 07-26-2011, 1:43 PM
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If the military is offering, why not take them up on it. Your perspective is all f'd up.
Children, children.........

When I enlisted I was given two choices on my contract.
1) $10,000 student loan repayment program. This could have been used toward any preexisting or future loan so long as it was a QUALIFIED student loan. Donít go and get a loan to use toward college and expect the army to honor it per your contract if it isnít a QUALIFIED STUDENT LOAN.
2) Instead of the $10K incentive for a loan I took the 3 year mobilization stabilization promise. Meaning, I will not be sent anywhere for 3 years after I get back from BCT and AIT (so they say). I of course would likely waive it, but it's nice to have if I end up having a kid or something in the near future, or change jobs early on in my enlistment.

I was also presented with a Military Police MOS choice that had a $30K loan repayment incentive (it was for jail custody type work).

The larger the incentive the crappier the job.

I donít think the officer gigs get any incentives, and I expect if I direct commission I know for a fact my contract will start over for another 6 years, I will lose my stabilization incentive, and Iíll likely end up in another MOS.
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Old 07-26-2011, 1:48 PM
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Originally Posted by epilepticninja View Post
At one point, this was semi-true. Nowdays, completely untrue. The Air Force has more boots-on-the-ground activites then in it's entire history.
Keep in mind the USAF doesn't have Warrants Officers. So I suspect their officer ranks are inflated relative to other services.
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Old 07-26-2011, 1:54 PM
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but why not try to get in a higher rank if I can because of my degree.
Don't underestimate the education of those around you. I am finding Iím surrounded by degreed enlisted like myself. What I am not finding is the very young (right out of high school) because they are getting pushed out by those in their early 20ís who need to get out from under their education debts.

I thought being an E4 would have been golden at least in terms of entry, but where the hell did all the PFC's and lower go? I'm the low one on the totem poll.
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Old 07-26-2011, 2:08 PM
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I can't speak for USAF but in the Army, if you want your student loans paid then you have to come in as enlisted. Your choices are DC with all the perks, pay and quality of life that it brings. Or you enter the enlisted ranks as a SPC (E4) and have x amount of your loans payed off.
From my understanding, the air force requires specific degrees for specific commissions eg engineers have engineering degrees.
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Old 07-26-2011, 2:12 PM
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I can't speak for USAF but in the Army, if you want your student loans paid then you have to come in as enlisted. Your choices are DC with all the perks, pay and quality of life that it brings. Or you enter the enlisted ranks as a SPC (E4) and have x amount of your loans payed off.
From my understanding, the air force requires specific degrees for specific commissions eg engineers have engineering degrees.
Also, had I tried to come in a few years sooner, I could have come in as an O3 finance officer. They army from time to time does open up areas they are really short on.
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Old 07-26-2011, 2:47 PM
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I remember hearing back in 05-06ish that coming in as an officer did not include load repayment compared to enlisting which did. Enter the recession where retention/recruitment is not a problem for any service and the deals they offer will be much more limited. Regardless of service if you enlist with the intention to go officer ensure OCS is in your contract! If it isn't in your contract you are at their HR's mercy.
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Old 07-26-2011, 4:13 PM
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When I recruited (Navy) the loan repayment program was 10k annually for 4 years of loan repayment.
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Old 07-27-2011, 9:33 AM
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Regardless of service if you enlist with the intention to go officer ensure OCS is in your contract! If it isn't in your contract you are at their HR's mercy.
Yep, and that was the risk I simply had to take.

However, I will say, if you are young there will be plenty of time to become an officer if you desire it and the military desires you.

Here's what I missed. See when I graduated High School:
1) The USSR ceased to exist.
2) Sadam had been defeated the fiirst time.
3) Terrosim didn't exist in it's new context.
4) The military was shirnking.

You have NO IDEA what's going to happen in the next 20 years.

When 9/11 happend I was 27, and the officer cut off was 28. So again I was too old to make that happen realistically.

What happened between now and then was the ages were raised (and I didn't figure that out until it was too late).

So had I enlsited at 27, I am sure I would have been sucked up as an officer by now, and would have been in my 10th year and a maybe even a Major.

So ask yourself, what has happened in the last 20 years, and the 20 years before that? What's going to happen in the next 20 years? North Africa is a mess, and North Korea gets froggy from time to time.

If you are in the military when it is small and it hits the fan promotional success seems to be quick. But you have to be IN it at the time that happens.
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