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Optics, Mounts, Rails and Sights If it aims your firearm, post about it here.

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  #1  
Old 06-23-2011, 12:10 PM
TROYSD TROYSD is offline
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Default EOTECH VS ACOG

i have a rem r-15 rifle , 223. right now i have a nikon 3-9 scope, i was thinking of a eotech {which model i dont know ) or a acog ta31. has anyone used both?
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  #2  
Old 06-23-2011, 1:16 PM
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very different in dynamics and purpose.
How do you intend to use the rifle?

If you want super quick snap shots and closer range, the Eotech is king.
The acog at the end of the day is really just a scope, albeit a very tough and versatile one.
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  #3  
Old 06-23-2011, 1:19 PM
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Different strokes for different folks. The EOTech dominates up close with it's 65 MOA ring and 1 MOA dot. That big ring gets you on target quickly and the dot is small enough to engage at 200m. The ring is also good for leading lateral moving targets.

The ACOG is magnified, so it's much slower getting on target up close (unless you train the occluded eye method) but is good for IDing and pinging targets out to 400m.

If you're going for precision - get an ACOG. If you're focusing on 300-400m targets, get an ACOG. If you're mostly shooting inside of 100m and want to run and gun- get an EOTech
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Old 06-23-2011, 1:20 PM
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You need to tell us what you're using it for.
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Old 06-23-2011, 1:54 PM
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These are generalizations, but they come in handy.

Urban enviorment where all the shots are under 50 yards and most are at conversation distances the Red Dot Rules as magnification gets in the way.

Rural or open battle field enviorment where the distances really begin to open up the ACOG really has its place and makes things a little easier.

Long distance precision shooting 10x or more comes in really handy as does a larger round with flatter ballistics like the .308.

Plinking on a range, whatever floats your boat will work.
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Old 06-23-2011, 2:26 PM
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It is more of a long range rifle, so sounds like the acog. im going to build another with a shorter barrel and stock, so that might be more for a eotech
thanks
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  #7  
Old 06-23-2011, 3:28 PM
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ACOG for distance. Aimpoint for CQB
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Old 06-23-2011, 3:38 PM
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Eotech 557 with 3x quick flip out magnifier ftw? Love that setup on my AR. I'd like to say best of both worlds, but I have no hands on ACOG experience so that would be presumptuous.


Last edited by stix213; 06-23-2011 at 3:43 PM..
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  #9  
Old 06-23-2011, 3:56 PM
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ACOG for distance. Aimpoint for CQB
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Old 06-23-2011, 3:58 PM
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Originally Posted by stix213 View Post
Eotech 557 with 3x quick flip out magnifier ftw? Love that setup on my AR. I'd like to say best of both worlds, but I have no hands on ACOG experience so that would be presumptuous.

A) That setup is about $200 more than an ACOG, granted it is nice to be able to switch between the two.
B) If medium-long range is the primary purpose no need to have a CQB optic.
C) Batteryless ACOGs FTW!
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  #11  
Old 06-27-2011, 6:12 PM
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I have both Eotech 511.a65 and an Acog TA31rcoA4

The Eotech is absolutely untouchable in a situation where you need a lightweight carbine, fast target acquisition 100 yards or less and you have a steady supply of batteries - oh and you don't have astigmatism (my friends who have this problem claim the hologram is distractingly fuzzy). if the average human being is 5'5", then that equals the 65 moa circle on the eotech. if the donut of death covers the target they are approximately ~100yds, likewise you can infer if the height of the target only reaches the 1 moa dot, then they are approximately 200yds out.

If you are in a combat environment, where you don't know if you have kick down doors or put bad guys away at up to 600m and you have no clue when you may get batteries, i'd take the Acog (and you are sort of clumsy with your hardware).

once you are trained on the acog reticle and your brain is trained on the BAC, engagements from 0-600m is cake. assuming avg man's shoulder is 19"; line up the crosshair that fits within the target's shoulders and squeeze the trigger

Last edited by krnrspd; 06-27-2011 at 6:15 PM..
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  #12  
Old 06-27-2011, 8:11 PM
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Originally Posted by krnrspd View Post
I have both Eotech 511.a65 and an Acog TA31rcoA4

The Eotech is absolutely untouchable in a situation where you need a lightweight carbine, fast target acquisition 100 yards or less and you have a steady supply of batteries - oh and you don't have astigmatism (my friends who have this problem claim the hologram is distractingly fuzzy). if the average human being is 5'5", then that equals the 65 moa circle on the eotech. if the donut of death covers the target they are approximately ~100yds, likewise you can infer if the height of the target only reaches the 1 moa dot, then they are approximately 200yds out.

If you are in a combat environment, where you don't know if you have kick down doors or put bad guys away at up to 600m and you have no clue when you may get batteries, i'd take the Acog (and you are sort of clumsy with your hardware).

once you are trained on the acog reticle and your brain is trained on the BAC, engagements from 0-600m is cake. assuming avg man's shoulder is 19"; line up the crosshair that fits within the target's shoulders and squeeze the trigger
Once you start knocking down doors the ACOG is a liability, however.
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  #13  
Old 07-03-2011, 10:36 PM
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A nice compromise might be a 1-4x variable power scope. It will weigh as much as a an Eotech/magnifier combo but will have a sharper reticle with magnification.
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Old 07-03-2011, 10:46 PM
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I would recommend the Aimpoint T-1 or H-1 (own both) or the new Aimpoint Pro over any model Eotech. We have the Eotechs on our patrol rifles (552's) and have had nothing but problems with the battery compartments. I have never, ever seen such a high incidence of Alkaline battery ruptures as I have inside the Eotech battery compartments of our duty rifles. Why are we having this problem? I'm not sure. Is it the high pressure put on the batteries by the Eotech battery compartment design, is it the longitudinal shock of full auto fire on the batteries? All I know is that we have had lots of problems with Eotechs, none of which I have had with my own Aimpoints.
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Old 07-08-2011, 10:18 AM
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Originally Posted by kmrtnsn View Post
I would recommend the Aimpoint T-1 or H-1 (own both) or the new Aimpoint Pro over any model Eotech. We have the Eotechs on our patrol rifles (552's) and have had nothing but problems with the battery compartments. I have never, ever seen such a high incidence of Alkaline battery ruptures as I have inside the Eotech battery compartments of our duty rifles. Why are we having this problem? I'm not sure. Is it the high pressure put on the batteries by the Eotech battery compartment design, is it the longitudinal shock of full auto fire on the batteries? All I know is that we have had lots of problems with Eotechs, none of which I have had with my own Aimpoints.
what kind of batteries are you putting in your eotech and how long have they been sitting on the shelf. i've had instances of Duracell Procells leak on me (not in my eotech) because they had just been sitting around way too long

i have a 511 a65 which uses the n cells, I prefer that form factor as it is a bit smaller and takes up less real estate on the rail and haven't had a single issue
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Old 07-08-2011, 10:52 AM
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I've got both. Eotech with magnifier and TA01. If I had to pick one I'd take the Acog. I like not having to rely on a battery. For CQB with the Acog, practice, practice and more practice.
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Old 07-08-2011, 11:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TROYSD View Post
i have a rem r-15 rifle , 223. right now i have a nikon 3-9 scope, i was thinking of a eotech {which model i dont know ) or a acog ta31. has anyone used both?
I have and I sold the EOtech. I now have an Aimpoint PRO on one rifle and an ACOG on another. If I had to pick just one, it'd be the ACOG, hands down. Much better reticle with a bit of magnification. It works fine in close quarters, with ample training.
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Last edited by HK35; 07-08-2011 at 2:37 PM..
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Old 07-11-2011, 6:24 PM
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I have both. Now as stated in all the replies they both work perfect in ther range. What else can be said that hasn't . Don't be shy buy them both .
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  #19  
Old 07-12-2011, 9:37 PM
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I have a Eotech 2.0. Works great for hoodrats.
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Old 07-12-2011, 11:02 PM
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I was in a similar dilemma not too long ago. I tried a few AOCGs including the TA31, and the thing that got me is up close it was really useless, but I loved the 4x magnification for the 100M+ shots at the local ranges. I had Lasik like five years back, but when it comes down to distance I figured I needed all the help I can get.

I looked at few Eotech's as well, and although the whole red dot thing is pretty cool, I could not get over that it didn't do much for distance. To be honest, I thought it was only marginally better than an RMR.

Anyway, I ended up going with an ACOG TA01NSN. It is a standard cross-hair and BDC during the day, the center of the cross-hair lights up yellow at night, it also has an attached iron peep sight on top for closer targets, and it will never need batteries. I figured it was the best of both worlds. I have been very happy with my decision.
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  #21  
Old 07-16-2011, 9:23 PM
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I've got an eotech 557 with 3x magnifier and a trijicon ta31frmr, I first got the eotech kit, I thought at the time it was the best bang for the buck 900 bucks shipped, however I noticed its rather heavy and the optic is not super clear compared to my acog trijicon, its also 4X magnification. yeah I spent another 700 bucks more on the trijicon, but its like HD tv compared to the eotech. I like the flip to side magnifier, but if you're going for light weight I would go with the trijicon. If I ranked them in order it would be Trijicon 1st, Aimpoint 2nd, Eotech 3rd. just my 2 cents hopefully it will help. worse case buy it like I did and experiment. Plus get a good deal on stuff and it doesn't matter, you can always sell it. the other thing is battery life, trijicon has none except the RMR...
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  #22  
Old 07-16-2011, 11:34 PM
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ACOG + off set Larue mount w/ Aimpoint T1. Best of both worlds and super fast to switch over
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Old 07-17-2011, 12:40 PM
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Aimpoint or ACOG. There is no way an EoTech can do this:

https://danieldefense.com/TortureTest
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Old 07-17-2011, 1:53 PM
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I think an eotech could.

Quote:
Originally Posted by scobun View Post
Aimpoint or ACOG. There is no way an EoTech can do this:

https://danieldefense.com/TortureTest
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Old 07-17-2011, 5:29 PM
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I think an eotech could.
There is no comparison between the two. An Eotech wouldn't survive the first few drop tests.
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Old 07-17-2011, 10:57 PM
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one way to find out....email daniel defense and ask them to run another test with an Eotech.
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Old 07-18-2011, 2:07 PM
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one way to find out....email daniel defense and ask them to run another test with an Eotech.
Not DD but a member over on M4Carbine has been doing his own test of an EXPS 2. He admits in the first post that he dislikes EOTechs due to failures, check out what he does to the sight on page 3.

http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=83558
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  #28  
Old 07-19-2011, 1:52 PM
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Acog FTW, I have an eotech with 4x DM Premium magnifier with Larue FTS mount.

If I could do it again I would have simply slapped on an acog.

The Magnifier adds more weight and it's annoying when Flipped to the side, so you may as well remove it. I'm not in the military or running special ops missions so I pretty much know when a magnifier will be needed.

The clarity of an acog is amazing.

As far as batteries I don't really care, I run CR123's which are not as prone to leaking as crappy AA batteries. I have had the same batteries in my eotech since I started shooting with it a few years ago.

Last edited by Justintoxicated; 07-19-2011 at 1:55 PM..
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  #29  
Old 07-19-2011, 2:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimA77 View Post
Not DD but a member over on M4Carbine has been doing his own test of an EXPS 2. He admits in the first post that he dislikes EOTechs due to failures, check out what he does to the sight on page 3.

http://www.m4carbine.net/showthread.php?t=83558
Aimpoints will fail just as easily and as often EoTechs. I know that one from personal experience. Had an Aimpoint T-1 fail the day of a carbine course. Ran the course with irons. I did fine, but it would have been a lot more enjoyable with a red dot.
That same class a guy with an EoTech 511 had the darn thing fall apart. The circut board came loose. His sight was considerably older and more beat up than mine. My issue was just a short.

Personally I prefer Eotechs. The reticle is much easier to pick up the large square window gives you a nicer field of view. Yes the battery life is shorter, but it is still way out there. I feel the shorter battery life is worth it in order to get the better reticle.

Current EoTech XPS 2.0 on primary rifle and a Primary Arms Micro on my backup rifle.


Aimpoint T-1 I used to own.

Last edited by tacticalcity; 07-19-2011 at 2:14 PM..
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Old 07-19-2011, 2:20 PM
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Also depends how much money you want to spend.Eotech is about 400 bucks and Trijicon is about 800 bucks. They both have differant uses. Eotech for under 200 yards,Trijicon four greater than 200 yards.
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Old 07-19-2011, 6:02 PM
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I have an EoTech 517 on my AR with a Vortex 3x magnifier and I love the setup. My point about the guy on M4CArbine is that he tried to kill the EXPS 2 and didn't really succeed. I'm not an operator and don't plan on trying to emulate one. The 517 fits my needs just fine. The ACOG looks interesting but I can't justify the cost to myself.
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Old 07-19-2011, 6:04 PM
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Eotech's realistically probably in the 500 range. Trijicon t-31's 850 on the cheap (got to search really hard). Eotech faster sight acquisition uses batteries good for 100-200 yards. Trijicon beyond 200 (barely depending on your eyes) no batteries sight magnification. Eotech unlimited eye relief. Trijcon looking at 1.5-2 inches.
CLOSE RANGE...EOTECH... REACHING OUT A LITTLE FURTHER... ACOG...
Yes I have both and have used both.
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Old 07-19-2011, 9:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Justintoxicated View Post
Acog FTW, I have an eotech with 4x DM Premium magnifier with Larue FTS mount.

If I could do it again I would have simply slapped on an acog.

The Magnifier adds more weight and it's annoying when Flipped to the side, so you may as well remove it. I'm not in the military or running special ops missions so I pretty much know when a magnifier will be needed.

The clarity of an acog is amazing.

As far as batteries I don't really care, I run CR123's which are not as prone to leaking as crappy AA batteries. I have had the same batteries in my eotech since I started shooting with it a few years ago.
Exactly, get the ACOG! I've got em' all the Trijicon rocks!
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Old 07-19-2011, 10:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HK35 View Post
If I had to pick just one, it'd be the ACOG, hands down. Much better reticle with a bit of magnification. It works fine in close quarters, with ample training.
Training has nothing to do with it. The EOtech or Aimpoint will always be "faster" on target over the ACOG which is why you see Dr. Optics above the ACOGs.
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Old 07-21-2011, 8:58 AM
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Acog gets the job done out to 700 yards.

https://calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=419373
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Old 07-27-2011, 11:06 AM
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It was said once before, how about a 1-4 variable scope which gives you the best of both worlds. I like the features of the Trijicon Accupoint models. It gives you the versatility of a variable scope with Trijicon quality. The sight is fiber optic, same as the ACOG uses and it also has a tritium night sight built in so no batteries to worry about. Just my two cents. But I am no expert. I have used an Eotech and I really like it a lot. I have used an ACOG but it just isn't versatile enough for me for close range. Good luck in your search.
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Old 07-30-2011, 3:56 AM
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Originally Posted by V8toytruck View Post
ACOG + off set Larue mount w/ Aimpoint T1. Best of both worlds and super fast to switch over
also the heaviest and bulkiest
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Old 07-30-2011, 4:17 AM
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It was said once before, how about a 1-4 variable scope which gives you the best of both worlds. I like the features of the Trijicon Accupoint models. It gives you the versatility of a variable scope with Trijicon quality. The sight is fiber optic, same as the ACOG uses and it also has a tritium night sight built in so no batteries to worry about. Just my two cents. But I am no expert. I have used an Eotech and I really like it a lot. I have used an ACOG but it just isn't versatile enough for me for close range. Good luck in your search.
If most of my shooting were range shooting, hunting, or open battlefield stuff (basically over 50 yards) then I am guessing variable power like the Trijicon Accupoint 1-4x? would be the ideal way to go. I'll probably end up with something like that on my Recon/Backup rifle eventually. Not anxious to spend that $500-800 when I already have my M4 tricked out.

My average shot when training is 15-25 yards out. Because that is where most training courses have you shooting from. A 200 yard shot during an carbine course is unheard of. You are training for self defense, not open battle field combat. So for the kind of shooting I do both a fixed power scope like an ACOG or a variable power scope like the ACCUPOINT are a bit of liability. The tube affect from the variable power does slow you down a bit when on 1x. And the magnification of the ACOG definately slows you down. Both give you a bit of a head ache over time. For that kind of shooting, a red dot or holographic sight without magnification of an elongated tube is king.

The problem with Doctor sights on the ACOG is that they dramatically increase the height over bore effect. The distance between the sight and the bore of the rifle changes point of aim point of impact. The closer you get, the more dramatic the effect. Suddenly you are aiming way over the guys head just to get a head shot. Or aiming at his head just to get a chest shot. It is one of those things that sounds great in theory but sort of lets you down in real life.

I am not saying both the ACOG and ACCUPOINTS are not really nice. I am just saying they are less than ideal for how I like to train with my rifle.

Last edited by tacticalcity; 07-30-2011 at 4:24 AM..
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  #39  
Old 07-30-2011, 9:17 AM
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HK Dave HK Dave is offline
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Tacticalcity, have your tried an swfa 1-4 with donut reticle or vortex with donut?
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  #40  
Old 07-30-2011, 9:25 AM
RenoActiveShooter RenoActiveShooter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 45R View Post
ACOG for distance. Aimpoint for CQB
+2

EoTech will have dead batteries when you need it most. Or it will have automatically turned off when you need it. The Aimpoints can stay on for years- so change the battery once a year and never worry.
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