Calguns.net  

Home My iTrader Join the NRA Donate to CGSSA Sponsors CGN Google Search
CA Semiauto Ban(AW)ID Flowchart CA Handgun Ban ID Flowchart CA Shotgun Ban ID Flowchart
Go Back   Calguns.net > POLITICS, LITIGATION AND ACTIVISM > California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 06-15-2011, 6:47 PM
robnbritt robnbritt is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 176
iTrader: 7 / 100%
Default 80% pistol frames

Are these legal to build in Ca? http://www.ktordnance.com/kto/products.php

I see alot of info on ar 80% lowers and would like to try a pistol next. Just want to make sure it is ok first.
__________________
Quote:
Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they're still not out to get me!!!
“Any inanimate object will just sit there until a person picks it up. What they do with it depends on what kind of respect they’ve been taught for human life”
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 06-15-2011, 6:53 PM
notme92069 notme92069 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: San Marcos, CA
Posts: 863
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Yes, but it has to be a single shot pistol first and then you may convert to semi auto. Do not put a rifle upper on it because it will forever be a rifle afterwards

Search is your friend. This has been covered may times here
__________________
NRA Member
CRPA Member
Don't yank on the trigger. It's not your pecker.
Member #46312
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 06-15-2011, 6:59 PM
wash's Avatar
wash wash is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: sillycon valley
Posts: 9,020
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Blog Entries: 13
Default

Not quite true, adding a "rifle" upper will only make it an other, kind of like a cruiser shotgun. That can be converted back to a pistol without any legal issues.

What you can't do is add a stock and then go back to a pistol configuration later. Once a rifle always a rifle applies to adding a stock and if you go back to a pistol configuration later, that is considered making a short barrel rifle.

It's better to always keep it in pistol configuration and never have any question but adding a long barrel upper does not mean you can't go back to a pistol configuration.
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by oaklander
Dear Kevin,

You suck!!! Your are wrong!!! Stop it!!!
Proud CGF and CGN donor. SAF life member. Former CRPA member. Gpal beta tester (it didn't work). NRA member.

Last edited by wash; 06-15-2011 at 7:03 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 06-15-2011, 7:21 PM
robnbritt robnbritt is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 176
iTrader: 7 / 100%
Default

Ok maybe my question was not clear. Want to build a 80% 1911 not an ar pistol.
__________________
Quote:
Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they're still not out to get me!!!
“Any inanimate object will just sit there until a person picks it up. What they do with it depends on what kind of respect they’ve been taught for human life”
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 06-15-2011, 7:22 PM
G1500 G1500 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Rancho Cucamonga
Posts: 1,775
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Default

Um, are you talking about AR pistol, or 1911 pistol frames?


You posted right before me. You can pill it out and are good to go, basically the same way you do an AR pistol.

Buy the 60% blank, mill it out, build it into a roster exempt single shot pistol, then you can convert it to a semi auto.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 06-15-2011, 7:25 PM
wash's Avatar
wash wash is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: sillycon valley
Posts: 9,020
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Blog Entries: 13
Default

No problem, it still needs to be single shot to start or else you are manufacturing an "unsafe" handgun.

The only catch is that finishing a 1911 is a lot more difficult than finishing an AR lower.
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by oaklander
Dear Kevin,

You suck!!! Your are wrong!!! Stop it!!!
Proud CGF and CGN donor. SAF life member. Former CRPA member. Gpal beta tester (it didn't work). NRA member.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 06-15-2011, 7:35 PM
robnbritt robnbritt is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 176
iTrader: 7 / 100%
Default

Is it required to be registered
__________________
Quote:
Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they're still not out to get me!!!
“Any inanimate object will just sit there until a person picks it up. What they do with it depends on what kind of respect they’ve been taught for human life”
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 06-15-2011, 7:41 PM
wash's Avatar
wash wash is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: sillycon valley
Posts: 9,020
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Blog Entries: 13
Default

No registration is required to own the gun.

If you carry it concealed without a permit, the crime is a felony if the gun is not registered but only a misdemeanor if it is registered.

If you are going to carry it, voluntary registration might be a good idea but it's up to you.
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by oaklander
Dear Kevin,

You suck!!! Your are wrong!!! Stop it!!!
Proud CGF and CGN donor. SAF life member. Former CRPA member. Gpal beta tester (it didn't work). NRA member.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 06-15-2011, 9:18 PM
ETD1010 ETD1010 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Ventura, CA
Posts: 1,300
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

you wouldn't need to build it into a single-shot exemption, as there is no requirement for DROS on it (assuming he mills it himself)
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 06-15-2011, 9:24 PM
G1500 G1500 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Rancho Cucamonga
Posts: 1,775
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by ETD1010 View Post
you wouldn't need to build it into a single-shot exemption, as there is no requirement for DROS on it (assuming he mills it himself)
Wrong. You cannot manufacture an "Unsafe Handgun".
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 06-15-2011, 9:37 PM
choprzrul's Avatar
choprzrul choprzrul is offline
CGN/CGSSA Contributor
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Central Coast, CA
Posts: 5,827
iTrader: 8 / 100%
Default

Not a good idea unless you are rich and have time on your hands:

Build 60% pistol, leave off any kind of serial numbers, UOC, get eChecked, officer can't find serial, arrests you for unregistered gun, you sue the crap outta them for illegally detaining you and illegal search & siezure, take it to USSC and win strict scrutiny for 2A for all of us.

eh, just have fun with your gun.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 06-15-2011, 9:46 PM
G1500 G1500 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Rancho Cucamonga
Posts: 1,775
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by choprzrul View Post
Not a good idea unless you are rich and have time on your hands:

Build 60% pistol, leave off any kind of serial numbers, UOC, get eChecked, officer can't find serial, arrests you for unregistered gun, you sue the crap outta them for illegally detaining you and illegal search & siezure, take it to USSC and win strict scrutiny for 2A for all of us.

eh, just have fun with your gun.
I got the free time part covered. You want to fund the operation

Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 06-15-2011, 10:32 PM
WTSGDYBBR's Avatar
WTSGDYBBR WTSGDYBBR is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: LA/OC
Posts: 1,988
iTrader: 101 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by G1500 View Post
Wrong. You cannot manufacture an "Unsafe Handgun".
Ca Approved list shows the tested handguns that meet the safety drop test.
You can build or manufacture not for commercial resale a pistol with no issue. I have build and know several people who have build Ak47 pistols with no issue. A pistol that is home made may not have any type of mounts for a stock to avoid a SBR from being made.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 06-15-2011, 10:43 PM
WTSGDYBBR's Avatar
WTSGDYBBR WTSGDYBBR is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: LA/OC
Posts: 1,988
iTrader: 101 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by choprzrul View Post
Not a good idea unless you are rich and have time on your hands:

Build 60% pistol, leave off any kind of serial numbers, UOC, get eChecked, officer can't find serial, arrests you for unregistered gun, you sue the crap outta them for illegally detaining you and illegal search & siezure, take it to USSC and win strict scrutiny for 2A for all of us.

eh, just have fun with your gun.
You only need to register a firearm that you bought from a FFL. I believe Pre 89 firearms are not registered. California is not a forced to register state. There for because you owned a firearm that was pre 89 don't mean you have to register it. Same with building a firearm you do not need to add serial numbers to the build there is no such law. ATF say you can add serial numbers to your build to help law enforcement identify the firearm from theft but this is not enforced. Law enforcement is not allow to stop you to request to run your firearms serial number when you open carrying . Law enforcement is allow to only check to see if the firearm is unloaded . You do not even need to show ID if requested.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 06-15-2011, 10:50 PM
bwiese's Avatar
bwiese bwiese is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: San Jose
Posts: 26,727
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WTSGDYBBR View Post
Ca Approved list shows the tested handguns that meet the safety drop test.
Yes, but what does that have to do with below?

Quote:
You can build or manufacture not for commercial resale a pistol with no issue. I have build and know several people who have build Ak47 pistols with no issue.
Um, no.

Lack of detection does not equal legality. (This is a reash of the old, "Is it legal to drive with a dead hooker in the trunk if my taillights work?" question.)

PC12125 basically says you can't build an unsafe, nonexempt handgun.

So you instead must build a Roster-exempt dimensionally compliant single-shot pistol or single-action revolver (described in 12133PC).

If anyone starts asking you how you built your gun, you should clam up. If someone official is doing it, call an attorney.

Stop propagating BS incorrect info.
__________________

Bill Wiese
San Jose, CA

CGF Board Member / NRA Benefactor Life Member / CRPA life member

No postings of mine here, unless otherwise specifically noted, are
to be construed as formal or informal positions of the Calguns.Net
ownership, The Calguns Foundation, Inc. ("CGF"), the NRA, or my
employer. No posts of mine on Calguns are to be construed as
legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 06-15-2011, 10:59 PM
G1500 G1500 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Rancho Cucamonga
Posts: 1,775
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WTSGDYBBR View Post
Ca Approved list shows the tested handguns that meet the safety drop test.
You can build or manufacture not for commercial resale a pistol with no issue. I have build and know several people who have build Ak47 pistols with no issue. A pistol that is home made may not have any type of mounts for a stock to avoid a SBR from being made.
The drop test doesn't matter when referring to an "Unsafe handgun" considering part of the requirement is a LCI and a magazine disconnect.

Here is the relevant PC
PC 12125

(a)Commencing January 1, 2001, any person in this state who manufactures or causes to be manufactured, imports into the state for sale, keeps for sale, offers or exposes for sale, gives, or lends any unsafe handgun shall be punished by imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year.

Last edited by G1500; 06-15-2011 at 11:02 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 06-15-2011, 11:04 PM
G1500 G1500 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Rancho Cucamonga
Posts: 1,775
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Default

AR and AK pistols in and of themselves are almost single shot exempt as they stand. They meet the criteria for OAL and barrel length (most of the time), so with the addition of a mag lock and a zero round magazine, it is built into an exempt form.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 06-15-2011, 11:43 PM
bwiese's Avatar
bwiese bwiese is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: San Jose
Posts: 26,727
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by G1500 View Post
AR and AK pistols in and of themselves are almost single shot exempt as they stand. They meet the criteria for OAL and barrel length (most of the time), so with the addition of a mag lock and a zero round magazine, it is built into an exempt form.
Yup. And people shouldn't go bragging if they skipped that step on a homebrew gun.
__________________

Bill Wiese
San Jose, CA

CGF Board Member / NRA Benefactor Life Member / CRPA life member

No postings of mine here, unless otherwise specifically noted, are
to be construed as formal or informal positions of the Calguns.Net
ownership, The Calguns Foundation, Inc. ("CGF"), the NRA, or my
employer. No posts of mine on Calguns are to be construed as
legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 06-16-2011, 7:31 AM
gun toting monkeyboy's Avatar
gun toting monkeyboy gun toting monkeyboy is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: San Diego (more or less)
Posts: 6,544
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

Wow. those guys are willing to accept American gold and silver coins at full face value. How cool. I can use those $50 gold coins that cost upwards of $1500 to buy, and they will treat them like $50 cash. There is a deal if I have ever seen one...
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by aplinker View Post
It's OK not to post when you have no clue what you're talking about.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 06-16-2011, 7:57 AM
NotEnufGarage's Avatar
NotEnufGarage NotEnufGarage is offline
C3 Coordinator
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Carmichael, CA
Posts: 4,720
iTrader: 51 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by gun toting monkeyboy View Post
Wow. those guys are willing to accept American gold and silver coins at full face value. How cool. I can use those $50 gold coins that cost upwards of $1500 to buy, and they will treat them like $50 cash. There is a deal if I have ever seen one...
I think he has some really good crack that he's smoking...
__________________

NRA Life Member (Benefactor level)

"Those who give up some of their liberty in order to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty, nor safety." B. Franklin
Calguns Community Chapters (C3) in Your Community
Calguns Community Chapters (C3) and Appleseed Event Calendar

The 2nd Amendment is not about hunting or competition shooting. It's all about your inalienable rights to life and liberty.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 06-16-2011, 8:03 AM
Bhobbs's Avatar
Bhobbs Bhobbs is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Chino CA
Posts: 10,511
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by wash View Post
Not quite true, adding a "rifle" upper will only make it an other, kind of like a cruiser shotgun. That can be converted back to a pistol without any legal issues.

What you can't do is add a stock and then go back to a pistol configuration later. Once a rifle always a rifle applies to adding a stock and if you go back to a pistol configuration later, that is considered making a short barrel rifle.

It's better to always keep it in pistol configuration and never have any question but adding a long barrel upper does not mean you can't go back to a pistol configuration.
This is idiotic. Hopefully this regulation will be taken down in the future.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 06-16-2011, 9:06 AM
wash's Avatar
wash wash is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: sillycon valley
Posts: 9,020
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Blog Entries: 13
Default

I agree, but it has been that way since 1934 I think...
__________________

Quote:
Originally Posted by oaklander
Dear Kevin,

You suck!!! Your are wrong!!! Stop it!!!
Proud CGF and CGN donor. SAF life member. Former CRPA member. Gpal beta tester (it didn't work). NRA member.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 06-16-2011, 3:53 PM
WTSGDYBBR's Avatar
WTSGDYBBR WTSGDYBBR is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: LA/OC
Posts: 1,988
iTrader: 101 / 100%
Default

Commencing January 1, 2001, any person in this state who manufactures or causes to be manufactured, imports into the state ("for sale"), ("keeps for sale"), ("offers or exposes for sale"), gives, or lends any unsafe handgun shall be punished by imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year.

First line says it all For Sale. There are no listed Ar type or Ak Type pistols on the cal approved list. Matter of fact because there is no rear Trunnions that can attach a stock your in the clear. So having a 0 shot sled or a 10 round mag you do not need to register a home made hand gun. Law enforcement cannot arrest you if you have a firearm that you built with no serial numbers. The California approved list don't mean crap.You can own almost any hand gun here.Dros as a single shot pistol.



Quote:
Originally Posted by bwiese View Post
Yes, but what does that have to do with below?



Um, no.

Lack of detection does not equal legality. (This is a reash of the old, "Is it legal to drive with a dead hooker in the trunk if my taillights work?" question.)

PC12125 basically says you can't build an unsafe, nonexempt handgun.

So you instead must build a Roster-exempt dimensionally compliant single-shot pistol or single-action revolver (described in 12133PC).

If anyone starts asking you how you built your gun, you should clam up. If someone official is doing it, call an attorney.

Stop propagating BS incorrect info.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 06-16-2011, 4:08 PM
bwiese's Avatar
bwiese bwiese is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: San Jose
Posts: 26,727
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by WTSGDYBBR View Post
Commencing January 1, 2001, any person in this state who manufactures or causes to be manufactured, imports into the state ("for sale"), ("keeps for sale"), ("offers or exposes for sale"), gives, or lends any unsafe handgun shall be punished by imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year.

First line says it all For Sale. There are no listed Ar type or Ak Type pistols on the cal approved list. Matter of fact because there is no rear Trunnions that can attach a stock your in the clear. So having a 0 shot sled or a 10 round mag you do not need to register a home made hand gun. Law enforcement cannot arrest you if you have a firearm that you built with no serial numbers. The California approved list don't mean crap.You can own almost any hand gun here.Dros as a single shot pistol.
Um, I know all the above .... because I was the guy that created the single-shot conversion Roster exemption game plan some time ago for AR, AK and other pistols. I

Again, what I am saying is that IF YOU BUILD A HANDGUN, you NEED TO BUILD IT IN EXEMPT FORM FIRST (dimensionally compliant single shot, for example). 12125 says if you manufacture an unsafe handgun, it's a problem.

Commas are important.
__________________

Bill Wiese
San Jose, CA

CGF Board Member / NRA Benefactor Life Member / CRPA life member

No postings of mine here, unless otherwise specifically noted, are
to be construed as formal or informal positions of the Calguns.Net
ownership, The Calguns Foundation, Inc. ("CGF"), the NRA, or my
employer. No posts of mine on Calguns are to be construed as
legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 06-16-2011, 4:26 PM
WTSGDYBBR's Avatar
WTSGDYBBR WTSGDYBBR is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: LA/OC
Posts: 1,988
iTrader: 101 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bwiese View Post
Um, I know all the above .... because I was the guy that created the single-shot conversion Roster exemption game plan some time ago for AR, AK and other pistols. I

Again, what I am saying is that IF YOU BUILD A HANDGUN, you NEED TO BUILD IT IN EXEMPT FORM FIRST (dimensionally compliant single shot, for example). 12125 says if you manufacture an unsafe handgun, it's a problem.

Commas are important.
I don't disagree with what yours saying. I also understand by not building a firearm in a EXEMPT FORM FIRST could led it as being a unsafe handgun. I'm sorry that I did not take the time write the rules and regulations on how to build a firearm in my post. But that not right for you to say I'm "propagating BS incorrect info". We are all here to help each other out not to give people incorrect info.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 06-16-2011, 6:48 PM
robnbritt robnbritt is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 176
iTrader: 7 / 100%
Default

So what I am getting from this is -
1- I can build the 1911 if I build it as a single shot
2- After single shot build is completed then I can convert it to a semi-auto.
3- I do not need to dros or register it.

I have no intentions to carry (concelaed or UOC) this build just want to try to build one for personal satisfaction.

I just don't want to end up on the news
__________________
Quote:
Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they're still not out to get me!!!
“Any inanimate object will just sit there until a person picks it up. What they do with it depends on what kind of respect they’ve been taught for human life”
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 06-16-2011, 6:50 PM
Bhobbs's Avatar
Bhobbs Bhobbs is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Chino CA
Posts: 10,511
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

Is there a time period you should keep the gun in a single shot form for? 10 minutes, 1 hour, 1 day etc?
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 06-16-2011, 7:36 PM
CHS's Avatar
CHS CHS is offline
Moderator Emeritus
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Santa Ana, CA
Posts: 11,329
iTrader: 14 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by robnbritt View Post
So what I am getting from this is -
1- I can build the 1911 if I build it as a single shot
2- After single shot build is completed then I can convert it to a semi-auto.
3- I do not need to dros or register it.
Correct on all points. However, the "exempt" form is NOT simply "single-shot". There are other requirements which are a 6" minimum barrel length and minimum 10.5" overall length. Once you've met all three of those requirements, it's exempt from the roster.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bhobbs View Post
Is there a time period you should keep the gun in a single shot form for? 10 minutes, 1 hour, 1 day etc?
Only for as long as it takes you to convert from exempt back to normal.
__________________
Please read the Calguns Wiki
Quote:
Laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes...Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man.
--Cesare, Marquis of Beccaria, "On Crimes and Punishment"
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 06-16-2011, 7:50 PM
G1500 G1500 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Rancho Cucamonga
Posts: 1,775
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bhobbs View Post
Is there a time period you should keep the gun in a single shot form for? 10 minutes, 1 hour, 1 day etc?
Pretty much once you complete the build (in single shot form of course) by putting the last part in its place you have manufactured an exempt firearm. There is really no time period. I say put it together, set it down, pick it back up and convert it to semi.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 06-16-2011, 8:11 PM
goober's Avatar
goober goober is online now
Veteran Member
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: da sloo
Posts: 4,939
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Default

if you're building a (dimensionally compliant) AR pistol, can you build it in a single-shot configuration by leaving the gas tube off, instead of using a sled?
__________________
Live between Santa Cruz and SLO? Want to get involved?
Check out the Central Coast Calguns Community Chapter
And join the Central Coast Region Social Group!
NRA Life Member - CRPA Life & Board Member - SAF Life Member - Monterey County Carry Initiative Sponsor
Statements posted here are the sole opinions of the author and not those
of CGN, CGF, CRPA, or any other institution or agency unless otherwise noted.
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 06-16-2011, 8:21 PM
wildhawker's Avatar
wildhawker wildhawker is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: California
Posts: 14,407
iTrader: 84 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by goober View Post
if you're building a (dimensionally compliant) AR pistol, can you build it in a single-shot configuration by leaving the gas tube off, instead of using a sled?
A DI AR without the tube will not cycle the action, so it effectively becomes a single-shot action in that state. The statute (PC 12133(b)) offers no qualification that the exempt pistol contain or hold only one round of ammunition at a time.

Note that (a) requires the exempt single-action revolver to have at least a 5-cartridge capacity.

-Brandon
__________________
Brandon Combs

I do not read private messages, and my inbox is usually full. If you need to reach me, please email me instead.

My comments are not the official position or a statement of any organization unless stated otherwise. My comments are not legal advice; if you want or need legal advice, hire a lawyer.
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 06-16-2011, 8:21 PM
Bhobbs's Avatar
Bhobbs Bhobbs is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Chino CA
Posts: 10,511
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by G1500 View Post
Pretty much once you complete the build (in single shot form of course) by putting the last part in its place you have manufactured an exempt firearm. There is really no time period. I say put it together, set it down, pick it back up and convert it to semi.
Makes sense.
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 06-16-2011, 8:35 PM
goober's Avatar
goober goober is online now
Veteran Member
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: da sloo
Posts: 4,939
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by goober View Post
if you're building a (dimensionally compliant) AR pistol, can you build it in a single-shot configuration by leaving the gas tube off, instead of using a sled?
Quote:
Originally Posted by wildhawker View Post
A DI AR without the tube will not cycle the action, so it effectively becomes a single-shot action in that state. The statute (PC 12133(b)) offers no qualification that the exempt pistol contain or hold only one round of ammunition at a time.

Note that (a) requires the exempt single-action revolver to have at least a 5-cartridge capacity.

-Brandon
thot so.... thanks
__________________
Live between Santa Cruz and SLO? Want to get involved?
Check out the Central Coast Calguns Community Chapter
And join the Central Coast Region Social Group!
NRA Life Member - CRPA Life & Board Member - SAF Life Member - Monterey County Carry Initiative Sponsor
Statements posted here are the sole opinions of the author and not those
of CGN, CGF, CRPA, or any other institution or agency unless otherwise noted.
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 06-16-2011, 8:56 PM
robnbritt robnbritt is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Sacramento
Posts: 176
iTrader: 7 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CHS View Post
Correct on all points. However, the "exempt" form is NOT simply "single-shot". There are other requirements which are a 6" minimum barrel length and minimum 10.5" overall length. Once you've met all three of those requirements, it's exempt from the roster.
So I would need to put a 6" barrel on a 1911 frame and be 10.5" oal to be roster exempt? How is that even possible? My delta gold cup is 8.8" oal with a 5" barrel.
__________________
Quote:
Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they're still not out to get me!!!
“Any inanimate object will just sit there until a person picks it up. What they do with it depends on what kind of respect they’ve been taught for human life”
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 06-16-2011, 9:04 PM
Tripper's Avatar
Tripper Tripper is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Central Coast-Salinas
Posts: 6,845
iTrader: 92 / 100%
Default

I think
complete it
Set it down
TAKE A PICTURE OF IT
then pick it up and do the rest
that way you have a picture of it being in its 'exempt' configuration.
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 06-16-2011, 9:11 PM
G1500 G1500 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Rancho Cucamonga
Posts: 1,775
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by robnbritt View Post
So I would need to put a 6" barrel on a 1911 frame and be 10.5" oal to be roster exempt? How is that even possible? My delta gold cup is 8.8" oal with a 5" barrel.
It is possible.

You would also need to put a magazine lock with a zero round magazine or block off the mag well.

Although if you bought it before 1/1/2001 then you did not need to do this, you also do not need to do this if you are buying it PPT or having it gifted to you through intrafamiliar transfer.
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 06-16-2011, 9:13 PM
goober's Avatar
goober goober is online now
Veteran Member
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: da sloo
Posts: 4,939
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by robnbritt View Post
So I would need to put a 6" barrel on a 1911 frame and be 10.5" oal to be roster exempt? How is that even possible? My delta gold cup is 8.8" oal with a 5" barrel.
sounds like you need a 7"+ barrel...
__________________
Live between Santa Cruz and SLO? Want to get involved?
Check out the Central Coast Calguns Community Chapter
And join the Central Coast Region Social Group!
NRA Life Member - CRPA Life & Board Member - SAF Life Member - Monterey County Carry Initiative Sponsor
Statements posted here are the sole opinions of the author and not those
of CGN, CGF, CRPA, or any other institution or agency unless otherwise noted.
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 06-16-2011, 9:16 PM
goober's Avatar
goober goober is online now
Veteran Member
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: da sloo
Posts: 4,939
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by G1500 View Post
It is possible.

You would also need to put a magazine lock with a zero round magazine or block off the mag well.

Although if you bought it before 1/1/2001 then you did not need to do this, you also do not need to do this if you are buying it PPT or having it gifted to you through intrafamiliar transfer.
OP is talking about building a 1911-style pistol from an 80% paperweight....
your statement about maglock/sled is relevant, but the latter ones are not.
__________________
Live between Santa Cruz and SLO? Want to get involved?
Check out the Central Coast Calguns Community Chapter
And join the Central Coast Region Social Group!
NRA Life Member - CRPA Life & Board Member - SAF Life Member - Monterey County Carry Initiative Sponsor
Statements posted here are the sole opinions of the author and not those
of CGN, CGF, CRPA, or any other institution or agency unless otherwise noted.
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 06-16-2011, 9:24 PM
G1500 G1500 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Rancho Cucamonga
Posts: 1,775
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by goober View Post
OP is talking about building a 1911-style pistol from an 80% paperweight....
your statement about maglock/sled is relevant, but the latter ones are not.
He made that post seem like he already had a Gold Cup, and asked if he needed to put one on.

If he is building it he does, if he already has one he doesn't.
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 06-16-2011, 9:32 PM
goober's Avatar
goober goober is online now
Veteran Member
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: da sloo
Posts: 4,939
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by G1500 View Post
He made that post seem like he already had a Gold Cup, and asked if he needed to put one on.

If he is building it he does, if he already has one he doesn't.
i interpreted the Gold Cup reference as an example of typical OAL for a 1911 style pistol, using something he already owns.
OP was wondering how he would build a dimensionally compliant 1911 from an 80% paperweight given that his Gold Cup is only 8.8" OAL.

i may have misinterpreted, but anyway no big. it's all info.
__________________
Live between Santa Cruz and SLO? Want to get involved?
Check out the Central Coast Calguns Community Chapter
And join the Central Coast Region Social Group!
NRA Life Member - CRPA Life & Board Member - SAF Life Member - Monterey County Carry Initiative Sponsor
Statements posted here are the sole opinions of the author and not those
of CGN, CGF, CRPA, or any other institution or agency unless otherwise noted.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 7:03 AM.




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Proudly hosted by GeoVario the Premier 2A host.
Calguns.net, the 'Calguns' name and all associated variants and logos are ® Trademark and © Copyright 2002-2016, Calguns.net an Incorporated Company All Rights Reserved.