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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #1  
Old 12-12-2006, 11:37 PM
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roor1200 roor1200 is offline
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Default questions on parts

i have read the post about hi cap mags esp the 30/10 c products magazine. i understand that it clearly states to avoid it but i was wondering if i can get some feed back on this. if i purchased one, i wanted to weld the gaps between the tab and the mag to make a more permanet fix on them. anyone have advice on that? or do i really need to go through that hassle because the mag is made of stainless steal. trying to alter them would in my opinion would warp/ruin the tube. i have no intentions on reversing it. i just think it "looks" more complete with the look of a 30 rnd tube even if i only have 10 shots.

also with all this confusion on the lowers having to have a more permanent fixed mag, does the prince50 or other mag lock type kits cut it legally? and going to local los angeles ranges, would the only safe thing to do is buy a monsterman grip with no flash hider attached? im sorry if im repeating some other threads but i have read almost all of them and have not gotten a clear answer from them. so pretty much all i want to do is fix a cosmetic 10/30 c product mag with a prince 50, have a pistol grip, and flash hider. any LEO's out there have any concerns about seeing a setup like that before i purchase and put one together?
-trying to stay in the clear.
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Last edited by roor1200; 12-12-2006 at 11:42 PM..
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  #2  
Old 12-12-2006, 11:54 PM
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30 round mag bodies suck if you're shooting from the bench. I much prefer my 20 round Colt mags. In the absence of good 10 round mags shaped like 20 rounders, I think the Bushmasters are the best and scream OLL to me.

Personal preference. Anyways, if you're going to have 4 extra inches of obstacle hanging from your rifle, it's your right I guess.
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  #3  
Old 12-13-2006, 7:49 AM
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How do the 10 round (look like 20's) pro-mags hold up? Any one using them?
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  #4  
Old 12-13-2006, 8:34 AM
Jicko Jicko is offline
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PRO-MAG SUCKS..... avoid them.

Bushmaster 10rounders (20rounds look) is a winner...

OR

Stag flush 10rounders work well too!
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  #5  
Old 12-13-2006, 10:16 AM
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My favorite from the bench is the flush 10-rounder.
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  #6  
Old 12-13-2006, 10:28 AM
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I tried like crazy to bend out the tabs on some 10/30 magazines. I was able to get a huge screw driver into the slot from the inside and managed to bend it further inside the magazine making it even more unlikely to be able to get the follower past it. If you really wanted to, you could probably find a way to make a high capacity magazine out of it, but you can do that with the Bushmaster too. The thing is, once you screw with it so far that it becomes a high cap, there isn't a way to switch it back, it will be a high cap forever. It would be no different than you just bringing in a high capacity magazine.

So basically as long as you leave it as it is, the C Products 10/30 magazine is only a 10 round magazine. If you can get an agent to make it take more than ten rounds without destroying the magazine, I would like to see it.

You could try welding it just to make sure, but I think once you get it, you will realize, there is not bending those tabs in order to get the follower to get by and have a high cap.
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  #7  
Old 12-26-2006, 2:29 PM
40calibermikey 40calibermikey is offline
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I actually called C-Products and asked them how they made there magazine CA legal. In the magazine they weld a lance so it cannot load more than 10 rounds. Also if someone decided to manipulate the magazine such as drill out the lance (which is the only way to do it) the rounds would stick out the side of the magazine and it would be destroyed.
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  #8  
Old 12-26-2006, 7:00 PM
Yankee Clipper Yankee Clipper is offline
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And not just shooting from the bench, shooting in the prone position is a pain with a 30 round configuration. To learn to shoot the AR type rifle well you'll want to be able to shoot it off hand, sitting (a 30 may get in your way again) and prone.

Quote:
Originally Posted by xenophobe
30 round mag bodies suck if you're shooting from the bench. I much prefer my 20 round Colt mags. In the absence of good 10 round mags shaped like 20 rounders, I think the Bushmasters are the best and scream OLL to me.

Personal preference. Anyways, if you're going to have 4 extra inches of obstacle hanging from your rifle, it's your right I guess.
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  #9  
Old 12-26-2006, 7:22 PM
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Default pro mags???

I have some pro mags. My question is what makes them so bad? Rather than take a chance in competition, I purchased some additional mags from Ten Percent Firearms and I can see what makes them so reliable. With the pro mags, can you up grade them to make them more reliable? Possibly changing the springs? Hate to waste the money! Any thoughts??
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  #10  
Old 12-26-2006, 8:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roor1200
i have read the post about hi cap mags esp the 30/10 c products magazine. i understand that it clearly states to avoid it but i was wondering if i can get some feed back on this.
The C products 10/30 magazine is permanant enough.

Quote:
if i purchased one, i wanted to weld the gaps between the tab and the mag to make a more permanet fix on them. anyone have advice on that? or do i really need to go through that hassle because the mag is made of stainless steal. trying to alter them would in my opinion would warp/ruin the tube.
No need to do that.

Quote:
i have no intentions on reversing it. i just think it "looks" more complete with the look of a 30 rnd tube even if i only have 10 shots.
Like the others have said, if you plan to shoot from the bench the 30 round tube is an inconvenience.

Quote:
also with all this confusion on the lowers having to have a more permanent fixed mag, does the prince50 or other mag lock type kits cut it legally?
Yes, the prince50 is legal by the letter of the law.

Quote:
and going to local los angeles ranges, would the only safe thing to do is buy a monsterman grip with no flash hider attached?
Some feel that that is safer, but I have no problem going to the range with my fixed magazine. If you don't feel you know the laws well enough to talk to a LEO about them then maybe you should avoid the fixed magazine and go with the MonsterMan grip.

Quote:
im sorry if im repeating some other threads but i have read almost all of them and have not gotten a clear answer from them. so pretty much all i want to do is fix a cosmetic 10/30 c product mag with a prince 50, have a pistol grip, and flash hider. any LEO's out there have any concerns about seeing a setup like that before i purchase and put one together?
-trying to stay in the clear.
There a hundreds of people out there with a setup like you are describing .
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  #11  
Old 12-26-2006, 8:23 PM
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+1 on the advantages of the 20 rounders. I use Bushmaster 30 rounders for duty back-ups and bushmaster 20 roudners for "patrol load" so my elbo doesn't bang against the 30 round tube while sitting in the car.

One of the advantages I found in training (I'm the only guy with 20's for patrol load at my PD) I found that short officers with 30 rounders can really have a hard time shooting from a baricaded position behind a patrol car hood. Never thought of it before that beause I'm that 6'4 monster that weighs 250LBS trying to hide behind that little dinky front tire

30's are good for standing work or plinking. I can understand why the military stopped issuing hte 20's due to the full auto and 3 rnd burst of class III guns. We field 30's ONLY with our true M4's.

As a LEO in CA, I would say that if I looked at your unloaded 10/30 mag and pushed my metal bodied pen down inside your mag body, it shouldn't go down more than half the length of my pen. Crude way of measuring? I don't know of a better way on a traffic stop if the mag is already unloaded and you don't have any rounds in your car. I know I'm not gonna unload mine, I have to trust my life to those rounds later in my shift and I don't want to risks that they might get buggered up in an unknown mag body. That's just me though.
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  #12  
Old 12-26-2006, 8:29 PM
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And that post goes to show you that quite a few LEOs in California do understand that not all AR/AK looking guns are banned. That should only get better over the next year.

-Gene
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Last edited by hoffmang; 12-26-2006 at 9:07 PM..
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  #13  
Old 12-26-2006, 8:36 PM
gunrun45 gunrun45 is offline
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I just wished they would stop changing the stupid law!!
I have given 3 updates about the law changes at my office in teh past year alone!! I was the one who had to do the foot work on the learning curve there, DOJ firearms didn't send us any info regarding ANY of this . I had to learn about this over a conversation with my local FFL while I watched a guy buy the first OLL I had ever seen
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  #14  
Old 12-26-2006, 8:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gunrun45
I just wished they would stop changing the stupid law!!
They havn't changed any laws. Everything that they have said means nothing, these OLLs are just as legal now (and for the same reasons) as they were when this started.
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  #15  
Old 12-26-2006, 9:04 PM
gunrun45 gunrun45 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blkA4alb
They havn't changed any laws. Everything that they has said means nothing, these OLLs are just as legal now (and for the same reasons) as they were when this started.
Sorry, I mis-spoke myself. I meant DOJ written interpretations that directly effect prosecutors enforcement of the present laws and thus our implied duties as Officers to uphold them. More accurate, or just more confusing? I think "new laws" was easier to say

By the way, DOJ has not issued any notice to LEO's regarding ANY OLL issues. As far as any officers who aren't "gun guys" or haven't heard about this issue "through the grape vine", they have NO OFFICIAL NOTICE THAT THESE RIFLES ARE PERFECTLY LEGAL. Personally, I catch a lot of crap for investing about 20 minutes a week at work online here and on other places investigating this evolving issue in an effort to keep up on what's going on. I feel that my ability to accurately enforece the law requires multiple sources of accurate information to do the job effectively.

Since I found out about this issue, I have bought 3 OLL AR's myself and have 2 AK builds in the works.
I am actually greatful to everyone here who has given me the information that I need to accurately do my job.
Where else can I get links to almost every law related to firearms

Last edited by gunrun45; 12-26-2006 at 9:14 PM..
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  #16  
Old 12-26-2006, 9:34 PM
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thanks for all ur help everyone. and im glad i got some more insite comming from a L.E.O.
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  #17  
Old 12-27-2006, 7:23 AM
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I'd like a Beta C-Mag limited to 10 rounds please. Or maybe the 90 round snail mag limited to 10 rounds. It would be so rad!
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  #18  
Old 12-27-2006, 10:32 AM
Yankee Clipper Yankee Clipper is offline
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I don't know why you’re getting dumped on. You’re the go-to-guy in your department, or at minimum on your shift, that has the latest knowledge re AR/AK type firearms. That should, at least in my mind, enhance your career. If our state gun laws continue to get more and more convoluted, every department will need people like you.
Quote:
gunrun45: Personally, I catch a lot of crap for investing about 20 minutes a week at work online here and on other places investigating this evolving issue in an effort to keep up on what's going on.
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  #19  
Old 12-27-2006, 1:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by royta
I'd like a Beta C-Mag limited to 10 rounds please. Or maybe the 90 round snail mag limited to 10 rounds. It would be so rad!
Both could be done. It would be easier and more permanent to modify the 120rd chicom drum instead (Steel body)






I actually DO own one of these...legally... but I won't even take it out of storage to take pics. Everyone wants to use it to bumpfire a gripless build, lol... *SURE* Its basically irreplaceable, good luck finding "mag rebuild" parts for one of those... I wanna use it but the risk of breaking or confiscation are not worth it

IIRC I paid $89.00 for it brand new in 1999.


JP
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Old 12-27-2006, 2:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JPglee1
IIRC I paid $89.00 for it brand new in 1999.


JP
That's pretty cheap considering the '94 Crime Bill in effect at the time. If I recall correctly, those Beta mags were in the $300's at in 2001. Crazy!!!

I'm not into show, so I was only kidding about limiting anything to only 10 rounds. Just give me a regular 10 round mag and I'll be just fine.
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  #21  
Old 12-27-2006, 3:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by royta
That's pretty cheap considering the '94 Crime Bill in effect at the time. .
Yah, the seller didn't know it was for an AR-15


J
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  #22  
Old 12-27-2006, 4:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JPglee1
Yah, the seller didn't know it was for an AR-15


J
And to think I was doing back hand springs I was so excited when I picked up six 20 rd'ers and one 30 rd'er for $60.
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