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Ammo and Reloading Factory Ammunition, Reloading, Components, Load Data and more.

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  #1  
Old 05-26-2011, 8:38 PM
ap1040 ap1040 is offline
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Default Question about powder loads for 9MM

I'm new to reloading (I only cleaned and de-primed my brass so far) but was getting ready to start and now would like some help from folks who know.

Question: How do you decide which data set to use and believe when selecting reloading data?

Example:
Lyman Reloading Handbook 49th edition page 341:
9MM 115 Gr Jacketed HP using Titegroup powder, the min load is 4.0 grains (Pressure CUP 27,100) and the max is 4.5 (Pressure CUP 31,400).

According to the label on Hodgdon Titegroup for 9MM, starting load is 4.32 and the max load is 4.8

According to Hodgdon.com reloading center, the starting load is 3.9 (Pressure CUP 25,800) and the max is 4.3 (Pressure CUP 30,500)

I'll start using the Lyman load but the charge on the label looks significantly higher then either the website or the book. How do you select which data set you will follow? thanks.
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Old 05-26-2011, 8:47 PM
Triple R Munitions Triple R Munitions is offline
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i trust the loading books. the internet is a good second, and i never use the label for reloading.

i run 4.3gr with my 9mm. 1.150 COAL and chronos around 1085/1100.

but thats my way of choosing a load. i also own 4 manuals....so i compare too...

.02
R
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Old 05-26-2011, 8:53 PM
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Low-Pressure Low-Pressure is offline
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If you are just reloading plinking ammo, stick to the minimum first. Load a few and try it out at the range. If you are not getting any malfunctions and your grouping is decent, stick with it. If not you can fine tune it by going up slowly.
Remember, just because there is a maximum load doesn't mean it's more accurate.
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Old 05-26-2011, 10:03 PM
Bill Steele Bill Steele is offline
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I agree that starting conservative is a good idea. If you start down at 3.9gr, I would not recommend loading a great deal as it may not cycle your gun.

The label data will be fine to use as well, but always start at or a tenth or two below the "start" load and work up slowly.

I also agree with the previous post that a max load is rarely the most accurate load. Likely your best overall load will be something between 4.3 and 4.5grs.
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Old 05-27-2011, 6:47 AM
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I consult at least two sources and use the lowest starting load. You will find that due to test conditions, that one manual's starting load will be higher than another's max load. Then, there is the fact that your equipment (barrel dimensions in particular) differ from either manual's. In your case, start at 3.9gn.
Also, if in doubt, drop the charge 5%..
COL is established by your gun. You should aim for the longest COL that fits your magazine and feeds and chambers in your gun. From there, after you find a load that is accurate, you can ply with shorter COL, but I have never seen any advantage.
Most of the time, the manual's COL is either the minimum recommended COL by the manual's publishers or the maximum COL that SAAMI recommends the industry test at (which is not the maximum they would recommend the reloader use). In both cases, you are to use a COL no shorter than listed and should use a longer COL.
Here is my compilation of data from manuals I own. I really think a newbie should start off loading some other cartridge (.45 Auto is about the most forgiving) and, for 9x19, a slower powder. The best use for TiteGroup is for accurate light target loads. From my data, one can see that TightGroup must have some pressure problems as the total range of charge weights is from 4.3-4.8gn in one manuals and 4.5-4.8gn in another. This is too small a range for me to even think about loading.
Check the label. I could see the starting load being 4.2 or 4.3, but I really don't think Hodgdon listed it as 4.32
9x19
Bullet Weight Powder Weight Velocity Start/Max Power Factor COL
FMJ 115 TiteGroup 4.2 Accurate 0 1.135
GDHP 115 TiteGroup 4.3 Start 0
J-all 115 TiteGroup 4.5 1135 Start 131
J-all 115 TiteGroup 4.8 1158 Max 133
GDHP 115 TiteGroup 4.8 1158 Max 133 1.125
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Old 05-27-2011, 8:15 AM
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From my reloading logbook:

115gr JHP OAL = 1.100"

4.1gr Titegroup = 1107 FPS (10 shot average)
4.4gr Titegroup = 1151 FPS (10 shot average)
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Old 05-27-2011, 8:43 AM
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What I have found is many variations in loading data over the years.
Improved pressure testing, more consistent powders, misprints and liabilty lawyers all result in changing info.
I usually compare load data in three or more references to determine a loading.
Should large discrepancies be found, I keep looking until I am sure I have figured out the mis-prints or whatever is off.
For most auto pistol calibers, my experience is that the most reliable and accurate loads are at least a few tenths below maximum.
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Old 05-27-2011, 8:45 AM
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Compare several data sources, then average the starting loads and you will then have a safe and sane starting point. You can also average the starting and max listed loads from several sources then split the difference between the averages and you will have a reasonable mid-range load.
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Old 05-27-2011, 8:57 AM
LGB Loader LGB Loader is offline
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Quote:
i trust the loading books. the internet is a good second, and i never use the label for reloading.

thats my way of choosing a load. i also own 4 manuals....so i compare too...

.02
R
That's how I develop a load as well. you have to have manuals on the bench.

LGB
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Old 05-27-2011, 9:54 AM
ap1040 ap1040 is offline
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Thanks everyone for your responses, you have confirmed what I was thinking, start with the lowest charge from Lyman's and SLOWLY work up from that. I have a second book on order which should arrive on Tuesday (May 31) for comparison purposes.
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Old 05-27-2011, 1:44 PM
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Re: averaging of starting loads or averaging of start/max
Exactly what part of "Starting Load" is unclear? If you start off anywhere but at the starting load, you are on your own and flying blind.
Safety first: start with the lowest starting load and work up.
There is no safer technique that I know of.
Walk before you run. Your buddy's load may be over max in your gun.
If just starting to reload, choose a slower powder that has at least a 1 grain range from start to max.
There are KBs in action shooting for a reason. Keep your loads safe and sane.
Never use a fast powder for Major loads--wait until you have a fully-supported chamber and a tight match barrel and have several years of experience.
Nobody ever KBd a 9x19 with Blue Dot. There have been several KBs with TiteGroup, N310, Solo 1000, AA N100, Clays, and, for some reason, AA5.
The "game" isn't worth blowing up your gun or yourself.
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