back from Oregon: flew with 2 ARs, pistol, 450+ rnds ammo

[bwiese]

Hiya all...

Back from a 6 day stint in Eastern Oregon - vacation + family visit before starting a new gig. Flew San Jose to Boise, ID roundtrip via Southwest. Travelled with a Pelican stuffed w/2 ARs (one ACOG4X, one w/EOtech), a 10mm pistol, some hicaps for the ARs, and 450+ rounds of M193 (some 10mm in the mix too).

Pleasantly surprised at ease coming and going with firearms with Southwest. Apparently 5 other guys had flown out on Southwest earlier in the day so the gate agent girls were quite unperturbed.

Southwest has you put one "Firearms Declared" tag per gun in your gun case, which is different than Alaska/Horizon - whatever.

Even though they're not supposed to do it this way, I had to give them the combos for the padlocks on the Pelican case so TSA could inspect it in the bowels of the airport. I suppose they coulda summoned me to a private area where I could open it. If the TSA wants to violate FAA law, fine with me.

On return flight from Boise, I just carried my tagged case to the 'oversized luggage' area and the TSA guy inspected it right in front of me after I unlocked it. (He was a gun guy, his father works at Cabela's, and enjoyed seeing the nice toys - though Idaho is a free state and there's prob plenty of unneutered ARs up there.)

Neither the outgoing or return trip's gun matters took more than 3 minutes total to deal with, and it was not regarded as anything exceptional.

I did include statement sheet in my Pelican about their being "legal, registered assault weapons", and that I was indeed allowed to exit and reeenter CA with them and their hicap magazines. I also stapled a copy of my AW reg form to it for a "just in case" if some wiseacre SJ cop didn't know what was what (as seemed to happen to another member here yesterday after he was burglarized).

I was fairly nicely dressed/presentable when I flew ("biz casual" with well-shined western boots), and was wearing one of my customary Smith & Wesson caps. Both ways I was asked (without evil intent) if I worked for Smith - the latter incident by another TSA guy. (Answer: "Unfortunately, no - but I do own lots of their fine products.")

Hmm, wonder if I get another free cap if I buy a new M&P-15 (hey, it's OLL!)



BTW: it was rather refreshing driving around in E. Oregon with 2 ARs, uncased, often thrown in the back seat. The motel folks recognized the gun case and asked, "Goin' huntin'?"

[50 Freak]

I flew out of SJ on SW this weekend too. Noticed the one page instructions on carrying firearms taped in front of their booths.

Thought it was a little weird at the time. Guess SW does have a lot of gun nuts traveling with them.

I may have to bring some of my toys to Las Vegas next month. Guess it's going to be on SouthWest.

[bwiese]

Originally Posted by 50 Freak

I flew out of SJ on SW this weekend too. Noticed the one page instructions on carrying firearms taped in front of their booths.

Thought it was a little weird at the time. Guess SW does have a lot of gun nuts traveling with them.

I may have to bring some of my toys to Las Vegas next month. Guess it's going to be on SouthWest.

Alaska/Horizon is gun-friendly too.

Man, I had a great trip. BBQs, guns, family, relaxed small town atmosphere. The Flying J truck stop we often went to for lunch or dinner (my aunt & uncle are seniors and don't do much home cooking) actually has good food. Wish there were one near my home for regular dining purposes - or maybe not, I'd get too fat.

[WokMaster1]

Plenty of Birkenstock wearing hippies totting "evil" rifles up there?

[Hunter]

Originally Posted by 50 Freak

I flew out of SJ on SW this weekend too. Noticed the one page instructions on carrying firearms taped in front of their booths.

Thought it was a little weird at the time. Guess SW does have a lot of gun nuts traveling with them. .......

You got to remember that this last weekend was the dove opener. Flights out of SJ to Phoenix on Thurs./Friday had lots of hunters. I counted 10 on the thursday evening flight alone ( and those are only the ones I saw).

[bwiese]

Originally Posted by WokMaster1

Plenty of Birkenstock wearing hippies totting "evil" rifles up there?

This is *EASTERN* Oregon. The Cascades divide it politically.

Since this is a college town you do see some noserings, Birkenstocks, etc. But those are the younger folks. There are some older semi-hippy folks but these are more 'mountain man' types, and these are likely libertarian pro-gun types.

.gov employees aren't too welcome in the hilly/backwoods areas up there.

Most residents, though, are very casual - jeans/shorts/tennies/boots.

Haven't seen any open carry but *tons* of folks have CCW.

[faterikcartman]

I too read the TSA gun rules on their website when I flew in and out of Indianapolis a few years ago.

I for one was not happy about, nor willing, to give my keys and combo to the TSA guys in white short sleve shirts and black ties.

I had $15,000 worth of shotguns in my Americase and if you don't know which way is up parts can fall out if you open the case upside down. I'm not going to have an ape scratch my Perazzi (or steal it for that matter).

What a NIGHTMARE!

When I decided I would rather take a rental car home to San Diego I couldn't even get my guns back.

My saving grace was never raising my voice or getting angry (at least visibly).

I was told by one white shirt TSA knucklehead in particular that:

(1) he was the head honcho as far as the airport in Indianapolis was concerned;

(2) he had a right to cover up his nameplate (which was previously uncovered) so that I could NOT read his name because of national security reasons;

(3) the TSA at Indy did NOT have to follow the TSA rules and regs I read at the TSA website;

(4) he did NOT have to show me a copy of the rules for Indy that say, in contradiction to the TSA's web posted rules, I have to give up my key and combo because of national security reasons; and

(5) I could not watch him inspect my guns as they did at the airport in San Diego, due to, you guessed it, national security reasons.

After hearing this I just asked for my gun case back and I would find another way home.

An hour later I still didn't have my guns and no one could tell me when or if I would get them back.

I started asking for a way to contact the TSA but was told there was no way to contact them and the person with the most authority at the airport was the white shirt black tie kid who told me the BS above.

So I just stood in line for about 35 minutes asking over and over again politely, quietly, and with a smile, for a number to the TSA headquarters. After the line behind me grew to about 50 people, and I wasn't acting in any way they could call beligerent and arrest me, the number that didn't exist suddenly came into existence!

It was a "real deal" phone number not likely meant for the public but for airport personnel. Now keep in mind that I'm an attorney so your mileage may vary on pulling this off yourself. I got through to a TSA Special Agent investigator in Washington D.C.

I told him what was true from my perspective: two TSA employees who refused to give me their names and covered up their nametags stole two shotguns worth $15,000.

Within minutes I was paged and met up with two of Indianapolis' finest, two different dudes in white shirts and black ties, the original two, and a new guy wearing a very nice suit and looking and sounding clearly like he was the real head honcho far above the pay scale of the kid in the white shirt and black tie.

Here's what I got:

Everyone's real name and the business card and direct line to the head honcho, I didn't have to give my keys or combo to anyone, I got to open the case myself and stand right there while they inspected them, the jerk who told me the BS originally was told to "step away from the case Tom" and "not quite a terrorist's assault weapon is it Tom?", and I was told to just call ahead next time I came through Indianapolis and they would be glad to inspect the guns my way not theirs.

I also got tremendous satisfaction.

However, I also had an important lesson reinforced: give government power and it will go to the heads of those who get it. They see you as little people and they only get worse the more power you give them.

Believe me (and I'm not speaking to you here Bill, just in general), when it comes time for you to be issued your "Learn Chinese the Easy Way" book, or your official prayer rug, you are never going to get the chance to use your guns to defend yourself or your country.

Long before the so-called "invasion", your own governemnt will have disarmed you to prevent you from fighting back. They will come one at a time the way Stalin had people grabbed for the gulag. You won't help yourself because you'll tell yourself it must be a misunderstanding and you'll clear everything up at the station. And your neighbours won't help you because they'll tell themselves you must have a dark secret and it won't, after all, happen to them right?

I will never feel good about the Patriot Act or clamping down on law abiding citizens until we've at least tried clamping down on foreign muslim fanatics first to see if that will work.

End of rant.

[bwiese]

From a practical standpoint, I really didn't care to worry if the TSA were following their own rules & regs. They're gonna have a hard time stealing guns, these are 'shooter' guns about $1+K apiece w/ optics, along with a $500 handgun) - not delicate Perazzi artwork. Plus, I have a whole pile more of ARs though it'd be a shame to lose a reg'd AW.

I think some of the paperwork in my case - very detailed, etc. - may put the fear of gawd in typical TSA luggage drone anyway. They are busy enough anyway it doesn't appear they even remove the rifles, etc. they just poke around. Of course, chambers are empty and locked open. They look under the foam side pads sometimes. [I think the X-ray does most of the work for things like gun cases- a couple of years ago (post-9/11 a year or two) I took a few frames of unexposed 35mm film off a roll in a dark room and put it in an opaque plastic sheath. The film frames were all pretty fogged after development, in contrast to unused film that didn't go on the trip and that was developed as a control.]

Didn't wanna deal with delays & grief, I was on a short vacation before starting a new job.

I've done this for the last 6 years without problems. Of course, it's always SJ or SF to Oregon or Idaho or Nevada, I lead a boring life

[WokMaster1]

So what is the "real deal" phone number? Feel like sharing? I think it is good thing to have for situations like this.

[hoffmang]

On the risk of firearms thefts while flying - which local TSA rep wants the fact that airport personnel are stealing firearms to get public on their watch...

-Gene