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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #1  
Old 01-27-2011, 10:11 AM
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Default Legal? For S&W Model 41 Clarks Barrel with Threaded End

Hello, thought I would seek some advice from those in the know. I see that the Smith and Wesson Model 41 is on the CA Doj list for the 5.5" and 7" barrel lengths.

Can I purchase out of state and have it sent to my FFL?
Is there a year made that qualifies for this or just the barrel length? I ask because Smith has been making these for years and I have my eye on a older one from the 60's or 70's.

Next, my buddy will sell me his and he is out of state. He has a couple extra barrels, one is a Clark's barrel with a threaded end for a suppressor or compensator and he will throw it in on the deal but I'm not sure this is legal? I know we can't have suppressors. A little help here is appreciated for what I can and can't do. Is it okay if I put a compensator on it? Should he just keep it? Help here is needed.

Thanks In Advance
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  #2  
Old 01-27-2011, 2:38 PM
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It's legal to own the threaded barrel.

But, it's illegal for you to install it on a semi-auto pistol that accepts detachable magazines.

It is legal to install it on a semi-auto pistol with a fixed 10 round magazine.


Summary:
Threaded barrel + semi-auto pistol + detachable magazine = illegal assault weapon [PC 12276.1(a)(4)(A)].


Penal Code 12276.1
(a) Notwithstanding Section 12276, "assault weapon" shall also mean any of the following:
(4) A semiautomatic pistol that has the capacity to accept a detachable magazine and any one of the following:
(A) A threaded barrel, capable of accepting a flash suppressor, forward handgrip, or silencer.
(B) A second handgrip.
(C) A shroud that is attached to, or partially or completely encircles, the barrel that allows the bearer to fire the weapon without burning his or her hand, except a slide that encloses the barrel.
(D) The capacity to accept a detachable magazine at some location outside of the pistol grip.
(5) A semiautomatic pistol with a fixed magazine that has the capacity to accept more than 10 rounds.
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  #3  
Old 01-27-2011, 7:19 PM
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Would it then be legal (because of a fixed magazine? If it used moon clips would it count as a magazine and thus be illegal?)to have a threaded revolver barrel?

I know it's ineffective, but I'd still like to know....
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Old 01-28-2011, 5:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye View Post
Would it then be legal (because of a fixed magazine? If it used moon clips would it count as a magazine and thus be illegal?)to have a threaded revolver barrel?

I know it's ineffective, but I'd still like to know....
Revolvers are not semi-auto pistols, so it is legal to have a threaded barrel on a revolver.


Summary:
Semi-auto pistol + detachable magazines + threaded barrel = illegal
Semi-auto pistol + fixed magazine + threaded barrel = legal
Single-shot pistol + threaded barrel = legal
Revolver + threaded barrel = legal
Pump-action pistol + threaded barrel = legal
Lever-action pistol + threaded barrel = legal
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Old 01-28-2011, 7:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye View Post
Would it then be legal (because of a fixed magazine? If it used moon clips would it count as a magazine and thus be illegal?)to have a threaded revolver barrel?

I know it's ineffective, but I'd still like to know....
The OP was asking about a S&W Model 41, which is a semi-auto handgun with a detachable magazine.
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Old 01-28-2011, 7:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkeye View Post
I know it's ineffective, but I'd still like to know....
It's not as effective as "silencing" an autoloader but it not ineffective. Tunnel rats in 'Nam used suppressed 38 revolvers for a while until they determined the extra length made them too unwieldy in such small spaces.
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Old 01-28-2011, 8:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quiet View Post
It's legal to own the threaded barrel.

But, it's illegal for you to install it on a semi-auto pistol that accepts detachable magazines.

.
I learned yesterday that the S&W M41 is exempt from the AW regs as an olympic pistol, http://www.ag.ca.gov/firearms/forms/pdf/op.pdf . I see nothing that says that only those pistols in the original configuration are exempt. If that is the case, it should be able to have a a threaded barrel.
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Old 01-28-2011, 4:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EOD Guy View Post
The OP was asking about a S&W Model 41, which is a semi-auto handgun with a detachable magazine.
I know. I was asking a separate question. That's why I had "bolded" revolver...

Btw Thanks quiet and scarville!
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Old 01-28-2011, 6:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ke6guj View Post
I learned yesterday that the S&W M41 is exempt from the AW regs as an olympic pistol, http://www.ag.ca.gov/firearms/forms/pdf/op.pdf . I see nothing that says that only those pistols in the original configuration are exempt. If that is the case, it should be able to have a a threaded barrel.
It's exempt from the list, not the assault weapon regulations.
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Old 01-28-2011, 6:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EOD Guy View Post
It's exempt from the list, not the assault weapon regulations.
how do you determine which models are exempt from the Roster, but not the AW regs?

sure looks like to me any pistol on the "exempted olympic competition pistol" Roster is exempt from both.
Quote:
Penal Code (PC) sections 12132(h)(3) and 12276.1(c)(3) exempt certain qualifying competitive Olympic pistols from the Aunsafe handgun@ provisions of Penal Code section 12125, et seq., and the assault weapon provisions of Penal Code section 12275, et seq. In addition to pistols specified in the statutes, the Department of Justice (DOJ) is authorized to exempt pistols based on recommendations from AUSA Shooting@ the national governing body for international shooting competition in the United States. The Roster of Exempted Olympic Competition Pistols established by the Department of Justice pursuant to Section 5455 of Division 5 of Title 11of the California Code of Regulations identifies all of the Olympic pistols that are exempt from the Aunsafe handgun@ and assault weapon provisions.
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  #11  
Old 01-29-2011, 5:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ke6guj View Post
how do you determine which models are exempt from the Roster, but not the AW regs?

sure looks like to me any pistol on the "exempted olympic competition pistol" Roster is exempt from both.
But, the S&W Model 41 does not come with a threaded barrel.
Would it still be legal, if you install an aftermarket threaded barrel to it?
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  #12  
Old 01-29-2011, 7:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ke6guj View Post
how do you determine which models are exempt from the Roster, but not the AW regs?

sure looks like to me any pistol on the "exempted olympic competition pistol" Roster is exempt from both.
You are right and I was wrong (not the first time)

I didn't think the Model 41 was on the list. I was looking at the original list which apparently has been updated several times.
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  #13  
Old 01-29-2011, 8:53 AM
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You would have to have the threads removed or a thread protector/muzzle device pinned in place.
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  #14  
Old 01-29-2011, 11:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Quiet View Post
But, the S&W Model 41 does not come with a threaded barrel.
Would it still be legal, if you install an aftermarket threaded barrel to it?
I dunno. I was looking for the olympic pistol regs but couldnt find them yesterday (I think AJAX22 has them) to see if threaded barrels are legal in olympic pistol competition. But I still don't see where it must be in original configuration to be exempt. I could see someone buying a used threaded-barrel M41 from someone and not realizing that the threaded barrel might nto be original. They knew enough that it met the defintion of an AW but then saw the olympic list that told them that the M41 was exempt from the AW regs. I would think the logic behind the Harrott decision would work for us there.
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