[Steyr_223]

I am an optimist in that I think things are getting better for California gun owners. Ideally, I would like to see the end of Roberti Roos, SB 23, the handgun rooster, the 50 Cal ban and shall issue for CCWs..

Assuming we win Mcdonald vs Chicago, how many years will it take to overturn the current restrictions? 2 years, 5 years? Decades?

Or should ?I plan to move to Oregon or North Carolina in the few years instead?

[dantodd]

shall issue within 18 - 24 months I suspect with Sykes already in the pipeline.
roster, same timeframe via Peña.

As for the AW stuff, probably a bit longer. I think we'll see movement on other fronts before movement on things that the general public (incorrectly) sees as evil guns. I am in no way part of the CGF inner-circle so AW may be next on the list but I imagine there is lower hanging fruit.

[6114DAVE]

Originally Posted by Steyr_223

the handgun rooster, for CCWs..

that the 2010 name for a desert eagle? i also hope thiings change for the better.

[wildhawker]

Current cases restart soon after McDonald.

Others...

This is going to be an exciting year. Let's get ready for the launch of a massive CGF outreach and fundraising campaign... Coming very soon to your town through the Calguns Community Chapter (C3) outreach team. Make sure you're signed up for some on the ground activism- it's gonna be fun!

[benelli shooter]

I'm an optimist too about gun rights in California. It feels weird.

I only wish I didn't believe that our country was going to financially implode like the Soviet Union, Zimbabwe, Wiemar Germany, and Argentina all rolled up into one before we ever see our new gun rights. I'm not liking that feeling so much.

[Ford8N]

All I want is a pistol grip with a detachable magazine like Free America.

I am a law abiding citizen and not a criminal scumbag, drug dealing gangbanger or mentally ill.

Yet I am denied something that is legal across some invisible line in the desert.


California sux!

[Serpentine]

In addition to the restrictions mentioined, it sure would be nice to have a NICS and AFS check by phone call like the rest of the country.

No 10 day waiting period would be great too.



.

[Nodda Duma]

Is the assumption that the public thinks black rifles are evil *really* valid? We know liberal politicians do, but what about the general public?

Outside of CA, I'm almost certain that isn't a valid assumption (look at national sales of ARs since Obama was elected). In CA, what to do to change the perception. That is the ultimate root of the problem, and one that should be addressed in parallel with the legal approach. Like the Garand is a symbol of freedom from the Greatest Generation era, the AR-15/M-16/M-4 should be the symbol of freedom for the current generation. Embed this perception in the hearts of the public, and it will go a long way towards establishing the AR as a legitimately legal firearm for generations to come.

-Jason

[mossy]

i have run out of optimism of after ab 962 passed. i would plan on moving.

[wildhawker]

Originally Posted by mossy

i have run out of optimism of after ab 962 passed. i would plan on moving.

Don't worry about AB962.

[yellowfin]

Originally Posted by Nodda Duma

Is the assumption that the public thinks black rifles are evil *really* valid? We know liberal politicians do, but what about the general public?

Outside of CA, I'm almost certain that isn't a valid assumption (look at national sales of ARs since Obama was elected). In CA, what to do to change the perception. That is the ultimate root of the problem, and one that should be addressed in parallel with the legal approach.

A big part of the problem with the CA public it seems is the insular myopic nature of urban populations: they tend to think, particularly in CA, that they're the only place on Earth, that everywhere else is almost fiction and totally irrelevant. I'm guessing that's a byproduct if not a key method of liberal indoctrination. Otherwise they'd see that a lot of their preconceptions are disproven everywhere else and you wouldn't need anything else other than to point that out.

[Untamed1972]

Originally Posted by wildhawker

Current cases restart soon after McDonald.

Others...

This is going to be an exciting year. Let's get ready for the launch of a massive CGF outreach and fundraising campaign... Coming very soon to your town through the Calguns Community Chapter (C3) outreach team. Make sure you're signed up for some on the ground activism- it's gonna be fun!

Sometimes nothing beats a well placed smiley....made me laugh

[BlindRacer]

Originally Posted by Nodda Duma

Is the assumption that the public thinks black rifles are evil *really* valid? We know liberal politicians do, but what about the general public?
-Jason

Being relatively new to guns, I might be able to shed a little light on how the 'general public' sees these black guns. I'm sure a lot of this is already known, but maybe not. About 1 year ago, I really didn't know much of anything in terms of guns, how they worked, what things were for. I liked guns, and didn't have any dislike of our 2nd amendment, but I didn't have too much exposure to them, since I've grown up near the beach in Northern Orange County, CA.

So, how I viewed a 'black rifle', was as a fully automatic 'assulting' machine gun. I didn't know what all the things on them were for. IE, the barrel shroud. Had no idea that it was for protecting the shooter from a burn. Had no idea what the rails were or what they were for. Didn't know about the red dot sights, or lasers, or flashlights, or forward grip, or much of anything. All of it added together just made it seem more deadly, cause it didn't look like a normal wood stock rifle.

However, now that I know better, I know that it is basically the same thing as your kids (or your) Ruger 10/22. Just with a more powerful caliber, and the ability to add more accessories for different situations.

Nothing about it makes it different than any .223 (or other caliber) hunting simi-auto with a wood stock.

I only recently started keeping my home defense guns loaded. Only about a few months ago, I was still scared about the workings of a gun. I didn't even want the magazine in, cause you know, those things can just jump up and shoot someone It's not easy overcoming the misconceptions about firearms. I still don't think it's all that safe for someone carrying to walk around with the gun cocked and locked - just to easy of potential energy there. I like the double action first concept. It makes the potential energy of the hammer relaxed, and not able to drop by accident. (maybe that's something that I still need to overcome as well).


I'm sure my previous view of them was from California media indoctrination. I had to do my own research to know what they really were all about. I remember seeing something on youtube, that was, I believe some NRA shoots, where they invited a bunch of media personnel to a range and explained in detail the differences between a standard hunting simi-auto, and an AR (or other 'assault weapon'). They then let them shoot them as well I think. I believe this was during the Clinton AW ban and they were trying to get the correct knowledge out there. Now that the AW ban is lifted, I don't think the NRA really cares much about California.

Maybe if CGF got together with a bunch of media and did a similar thing, then they could go back and write/report about their experiences, and get the word out that an 'assault rifle' isn't really evil after all.


This isn't the video that I remember seeing, but this is similar...
Truth about simi-auto firearms

[SamsDX]

Originally Posted by wildhawker

Don't worry about AB962.

I've noticed that there isn't much talk about the new measure repealing AB962 working its way through the state legislature, and that its passage is regarded as almost a foregone conclusion. I'm not too familiar with what's going on, but why is there so much optimism? and what's going on at the moment? I would have thought that not much would have changed as far as the composition of legislators and their attitudes toward this issue.

[wildhawker]

Originally Posted by SamsDX

I've noticed that there isn't much talk about the new measure repealing AB962 working its way through the state legislature, and that its passage is regarded as almost a foregone conclusion. I'm not too familiar with what's going on, but why is there so much optimism? and what's going on at the moment? I would have thought that not much would have changed as far as the composition of legislators and their attitudes toward this issue.

AB962 will fall to litigation in Federal court as its mail order restrictions are entirely in conflict with and preempted by Federal law (FAAAA). See Rowe v. NH Motor Transport, a recent 9-0 decision at SCOTUS.

[elenius]

Originally Posted by wildhawker

AB962 will fall to litigation in Federal court as its mail order restrictions are entirely in conflict with and preempted by Federal law (FAAAA). See Rowe v. NH Motor Transport, a recent 9-0 decision at SCOTUS.

If that's true, it will be extra sweet to strike down AB962 using a decision from the *left* side of SCOTUS

[dantodd]

Originally Posted by elenius

If that's true, it will be extra sweet to strike down AB962 using a decision from the *left* side of SCOTUS

how do you figure 9-0 is the left side of SCOTUS?

[C.Strong]

Originally Posted by dantodd

how do you figure 9-0 is the left side of SCOTUS?

If you look at the "9" it is on the left side, and the "0" is on the right side. That's how.

[socalblue]

I suspect the liberal scum in Sacramento will ignore the courts & do what they wish anyway. How many times have they told us "Go ahead & sue. It's you $$ paying for both sides. We will ignore the results anyway".

IMO the best solution is a pair of ballot propositions (One to amend the state constitution & one to repeal/change existing laws). Done correctly the CA Legislatures hands would be effectively tied, in much the same way as Prop 13 did with taxes.

This would take a huge grass roots effort & no small amount of $$, though we could potentially get EXACTLY what we want.

[dantodd]

Originally Posted by C.Strong

If you look at the "9" it is on the left side, and the "0" is on the right side. That's how.

It seems the left always wins.

[gregorylucas]

Originally Posted by wildhawker

Don't worry about AB962.

I just love it!

-Greg

[elenius]

Originally Posted by dantodd

how do you figure 9-0 is the left side of SCOTUS?

Good point. I just saw that the decision was written by Breyer.

[Gray Peterson]

Originally Posted by socalblue

I suspect the liberal scum in Sacramento will ignore the courts & do what they wish anyway. How many times have they told us "Go ahead & sue. It's you $$ paying for both sides. We will ignore the results anyway".

You keep forgetting the fact that while the legislature can pass what it generally wants, it is the executive (via the Governor, AG, and police forces) which enforce the laws the Legislature passes. If a federal judge orders the stopping of an enforcement of a law, nothing a state legislature can pass after the fact that could be enforce.

I'll quote from Gene Hoffman here:

Originally Posted by hoffmang

Let me clarify further. First 7x57 is right.

Assume post Sykes/Palmer win. So you go to your local sheriff and apply. If he denies you, you call CGF. We look at the reason for denial (he'll have to write it down.) If it's cause you're a child molestor - best of luck, hire a lawyer. Anything that is just political BS, game on.

We'll call the local lawyer. He'll write county counsel a letter that says Sykes controls. County counsel will realize he's going to lose if we're forced to file. Let's imagine County Counsel is a moron or San Francisco. We file for a TRO and Permanent Injunction, cite Sykes and get on the calendar in Federal court in the next 3-7 days. The TRO will be granted and off the PI will often be granted as well. Both command the Sheriff to issue you your permit or US Marshalls will come and arrest the Sheriff and take him to a Federal jail on contempt (or in the alternative, fine him personally - Federal judges are not to be messed with.) At that point, the County pays for all legal fees expended by CGF (or you.) Once you have on point controlling case law, these things get done fast and on the County's dime.

County Counsel understands these things, hence they never go there. Today, there is no on point binding Federal Court precedent... Give us a few more months.

-Gene

See what I mean? Federal judges are not to be messed with. They will have them dragged into a jailcell until they comply and issue the licenses, or to stop their behavior against self defensive carry.

IMO the best solution is a pair of ballot propositions (One to amend the state constitution & one to repeal/change existing laws). Done correctly the CA Legislatures hands would be effectively tied, in much the same way as Prop 13 did with taxes.

This would take a huge grass roots effort & no small amount of $$, though we could potentially get EXACTLY what we want.

And it will fail when the local news outlets refuse to run our advertisements. There have been FOUR attempts to get a California RKBA proposition on the ballot. ALL of them have failed. Besides, what good is a very strong RKBA provision in the state constitution if the state courts are so corrupted by anti-gun thugs influenced by LCAV that they will do anything to uphold gun control laws passed by the state and localities? Even if you put "strict scrutiny" into the RKBA provision, they will destroy that standard and still uphold the gun control law.

Like the racist state courts and sheriffs down in the south who refused to follow the constitution in the 1950's, only the Federal courts can fix the issues with California, and if members of the executive apparatus in California refuse to follow the federal judges orders, they will be hailed into a federal jail cell to comply. If they refuse to go along with the marshals, they'll get tased, or shot.

[ErikTheRed]

Originally Posted by Steyr_223

Ideally, I would like to see the end of the handgun rooster.......

Yeah, me too..... this guy is a serious threat and needs to GO!

[artherd]

Donate to CGF - we have some big and expensive lawsuits coming down the pipe.

Allison may lock herself in her office for the next 3 years

[Steyr_223]

Originally Posted by ErikTheRed

Yeah, me too..... this guy is a serious threat and needs to GO!

Good one! My spelling sucks..

[BadIndianSwamp]

Originally Posted by artherd

Donate to CGF - we have some big and expensive lawsuits coming down the pipe.

Allison may lock herself in her office for the next 3 years

I just proudly donated today.

[CharAznable]

I hope CGF smacks down AB962 like it was Finland in that semi-final game.

[ErikTheRed]

Originally Posted by Steyr_223

Good one! My spelling sucks..

Dude, no sweat..... it was just a typo. One that I caught and capitalized on.

[loather]

Originally Posted by artherd

Allison may lock herself in her office for the next 3 years

I'd prefer she crawl back under whatever rock from whence she came and never, ever again see the light of day But I'll settle for 3 years!

[Steyr_223]

Thanks! This would be an interesting year! Here's for a win on McDonald!

[Milsurp Collector]

Originally Posted by Steyr_223

Or should ?I plan to move to Oregon or North Carolina in the few years instead?

Any green state. Green is good, the farther up the red scale, not so good.



Hypothetically, if people living behind the Iron Curtain in the 1950s-1980s had been free to travel to the West -- the way people are free to move about our country -- would it have made more sense for them to move and enjoy freedom immediately, or to hope patiently for things to get better, until the Berlin Wall finally came down in 1989? I wonder how many people living in East Germany after World War II didn't live long enough to see the wall come down.

[BlindRacer]

When you put it that way, it makes me want to move. But I'm still young, and things look promising right now, so I think I'll stick it out for a while.

[SwissFluCase]

Originally Posted by ErikTheRed

Yeah, me too..... this guy is a serious threat and needs to GO!

Uhhh... What is that 'thing' hanging from his throat?

Seriously, our fight should stay in the courts. There is no need to risk a ballot proposition. Too many of them have gone very badly in the last few years.

I want a piece of the anti's. Standing by for instructions...

Regards,


SwissFluCase