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  #1  
Old 02-18-2010, 9:30 AM
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Default Best hunting round for .223

I've always been curious about this because I own an AR and am working on setting up a hunters safety class date. Any who, I plan on using my .223 as my pig hunting gun until I can finish up my .308. So my questions are;

-Do all copper bullets really matter unless I'm in condor country or will the lead also ruin the meat?

-Hollow points vs. Ballistic tips, soft point vs. FMJ ..... basically which tip would do the most damage? I'm thinking hollow points..

-How much does grain really matter? Is it better to have a higher or lower grain?

Thanks for looking and answering my potentially noobish questions! haha
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Old 02-18-2010, 9:45 AM
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Originally Posted by SexPistol View Post
I've always been curious about this because I own an AR and am working on setting up a hunters safety class date. Any who, I plan on using my .223 as my pig hunting gun until I can finish up my .308. So my questions are;

-Do all copper bullets really matter unless I'm in condor country or will the lead also ruin the meat?

-Hollow points vs. Ballistic tips, soft point vs. FMJ ..... basically which tip would do the most damage? I'm thinking hollow points..

-How much does grain really matter? Is it better to have a higher or lower grain?

Thanks for looking and answering my potentially noobish questions! haha
.223 is way less then optimal for pigs. You can't legally hunt with FMJ, and lead bullets do not poison meat. Get the heaviest hunting bullet you can since you are using such a small caliber. The ballistic tips in .223 are most likely not going to work on something hard like a pig. the twist rate of your barrel will determine the size of the bullet you should be looking at.
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Old 02-18-2010, 9:54 AM
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.308 will work on almost anything pigs being no exception!
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Old 02-18-2010, 9:57 AM
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Originally Posted by SexPistol View Post
I've always been curious about this because I own an AR and am working on setting up a hunters safety class date. Any who, I plan on using my .223 as my pig hunting gun until I can finish up my .308. So my questions are;

-Do all copper bullets really matter unless I'm in condor country or will the lead also ruin the meat?

You dont have to use unleaded bullets if your not in the zone. It will not ruin your meat. Somehow it does with the condors, but theres no report of people die'n because of game meat that was filled with lead.

-Hollow points vs. Ballistic tips, soft point vs. FMJ ..... basically which tip would do the most damage? I'm thinking hollow points..

It depends on what your after. Bullet construction is key. You want penetration so the deeper the bullet goes, the better. If your out of unleaded zone, Wolf's 55-62gr HP works excellent. Thru my testing in gellatin, it really tumbles and slices its way thru as the jacket is shaped like a knife as it tumbles. It was the deepest penetration I tested vs ballistic tips which was the shallowest penetration.

-How much does grain really matter? Is it better to have a higher or lower grain?

The higher the grain the better the penetration, sort of. But it goes back to bullet construction. A wolf 55gr HP (made of bi-metal steel) will penetrate deeper then a 60gr Hornady HP. If you reload, Hornady 75gr HPBT works with penetration, but dont expect it to expand like a HP. Its made to shoot long distances not expansion.

Well, hope that helps.


Thanks for looking and answering my potentially noobish questions! haha
hope that helps.. replies in the quote.
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Old 02-18-2010, 11:19 AM
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Your AR would work good for pig eradication not so much for hunting and ethically harvesting imo.


Milf slam nailed it.

Think of bullets as this way
FMJ = war
Balistic Tips = explodes on contact (very low penetration) Great for small varmints and causing bits to fly
Hollow point = controlled expansion (for all big game)
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I've gone to cabelas outfitter pattern for the central coast. Works so good the animals and I never see each other.

224 rounds of high quality Winchester .223 FS/FT

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s....php?t=1226164

Last edited by lewdogg21; 02-18-2010 at 11:21 AM..
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Old 02-18-2010, 11:55 AM
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I didn't know it was legal to hunt pigs with .223 ammo!
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Old 02-18-2010, 12:11 PM
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I didn't know it was legal to hunt pigs with .223 ammo!
Any center rifle cartridge. .223 falls in the category. heck you can use a 9mm! but strongly, STRONGLY not advised! haha.. jk
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Old 02-18-2010, 12:19 PM
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I would advise against hunting pig with a .223. It's just not worth the risk of wounding an animal. If you have to, borrow a gun.

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Originally Posted by lewdogg21 View Post
Your AR would work good for pig eradication not so much for hunting and ethically harvesting imo.


Milf slam nailed it.

Think of bullets as this way
FMJ = war
Balistic Tips = explodes on contact (very low penetration) Great for small varmints and causing bits to fly
Hollow point/soft-point = controlled expansion (for all big game)
In red. I'd say more people use soft-points than do hollow-points. Plus, hollow-point .223's are general match bullets and are meant to punch holes in paper not flesh.
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Old 02-18-2010, 3:09 PM
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Thread jack, sorry.

So a 91/30 should be ok?
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Old 02-18-2010, 3:12 PM
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Thread jack, sorry.

So a 91/30 should be ok?
Sure, if you can find hunting ammo for it.
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Old 02-18-2010, 3:56 PM
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For hunting pigs you need a bullet with enough mass to ensure good penetration through the hide and enough remaining energy to get into the vitals. IMHO the 223 does not have enough mass, but there are hunting bullets that offer good penetration. My first choice would be the 62gr Barnes TSX and my second choice would be the 60gr Barnes partition. Both bullets are available in factory loaded ammo.
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Old 02-18-2010, 5:33 PM
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Why does every have to clown on the 5.56 round? I think if the 5.56 round is good enough for the military to fight angainst the talibans it shoot be good to enough to hunt a pig. COME ON! A 22lr will kill a 450lb pig!
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Old 02-18-2010, 5:34 PM
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Originally Posted by tmncali View Post
Thread jack, sorry.

So a 91/30 should be ok?
I've hunted with my Mosin. Called in a coyote but couldn't get a shot off. Winchester makes a soft-tip round for hunting as does Brown or Silver Bear. All are well performing rounds too. Winchester will be around $20 and the others you can find for around $10.
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Old 02-19-2010, 5:30 AM
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Originally Posted by lewdogg21 View Post
Your AR would work good for pig eradication not so much for hunting and ethically harvesting imo.


Milf slam nailed it.

Think of bullets as this way
FMJ = war
Balistic Tips = explodes on contact (very low penetration) Great for small varmints and causing bits to fly
Hollow point = controlled expansion (for all big game)
Well said Lewdogg....but as far as it being ethical...it all depends on the shooter's ability to place a shot, the shooter's confidence level in that ability, and their willingness to pass on a shot that's not ideal. A .223 will do the job with VERY good shot placement. But if the shooter is willing to have a pig in their sights and not shoot it because the shot is not ideal...I would say that is pretty ethical. But anyways...all I know is I'm not that guy, if a pig is in my sights - it's going down! So I wouldn't be hunting with anything less then a .30 cal.
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Old 02-19-2010, 5:49 AM
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Originally Posted by para38super View Post
Why does every have to clown on the 5.56 round? I think if the 5.56 round is good enough for the military to fight angainst the talibans it shoot be good to enough to hunt a pig. COME ON! A 22lr will kill a 450lb pig!
The military actually attempts to down an enemy not kill them. A wounded enemy is likely out for the whole war or at least a decent while. Meanwhile, there are now others that must attend to him taking more enemies off the battlefield. That's why they use 5.56 and FMJ. Sure it can be lethal but that's not always what they're going for. Same is true with the pigs. Sure it can be lethal right away but if your placement is off you've wounded him which is a usually a slow death sentence for a pig. In that case everyone loses out: pig dies painfully and slowly and you either have to track it down or lose the pig. There aren't any laws against it so to each his own but out of respect for the pig I'd use something that is more likely to end it more quickly and humanely if I flinch, which I am probably most likely to do. Stupid buck fever.
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Old 02-19-2010, 7:01 AM
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Originally Posted by para38super View Post
Why does every have to clown on the 5.56 round? I think if the 5.56 round is good enough for the military to fight angainst the talibans it shoot be good to enough to hunt a pig. COME ON! A 22lr will kill a 450lb pig!
The short and dirty is the military likes the 556 b/c its lighter than the 308/7.62 so you can carry more or the same rounds with less weight plus people die a lot easier than animals (when not hopped up on drugs).

Case in point. 110 yard broadside shot on a Spike bull elk with a .300 win mag smack dab into the front shoulder and the elk limps off and is seen hours later back with the herd. People wouldn't be doing that.

Mule Deer doe at 150ish yards shot with a .257 ackley improved 117 grain bullet high on her shoulder. Followed her for 1 or so miles in the snow and couldn't catch up to her. (She hit a road and got nailed by some road hunters it seemed from the tracks and what we found).

Look it's the internet and everybody has their opinion. I choose to express mine b/c I don't want people who are new to the sport or not capable marksmen from making poor choices when it comes to caliber, shot placement and the ability of them and their rifle.

I also do not like to see animals wounded and suffer needlessly. I've had a few instances when you walk up on something and it can't get up and it starts whining/crying. It about broke my heart and I thought about quitting hunting.
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I've gone to cabelas outfitter pattern for the central coast. Works so good the animals and I never see each other.

224 rounds of high quality Winchester .223 FS/FT

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s....php?t=1226164
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Old 02-19-2010, 7:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Bearclaw View Post
Well said Lewdogg....but as far as it being ethical...it all depends on the shooter's ability to place a shot, the shooter's confidence level in that ability, and their willingness to pass on a shot that's not ideal. A .223 will do the job with VERY good shot placement. But if the shooter is willing to have a pig in their sights and not shoot it because the shot is not ideal...I would say that is pretty ethical. But anyways...all I know is I'm not that guy, if a pig is in my sights - it's going down! So I wouldn't be hunting with anything less then a .30 cal.
Wait wait, so you'll hunt with a 380acp?!?! :P I kidd I kidd..
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Old 02-19-2010, 7:30 AM
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Wait wait, so you'll hunt with a 380acp?!?! :P I kidd I kidd..
I do for black bear....



all the time....



naked.....



with honey and bacon grease smeared on me....




top that....
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I've gone to cabelas outfitter pattern for the central coast. Works so good the animals and I never see each other.

224 rounds of high quality Winchester .223 FS/FT

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s....php?t=1226164
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Old 02-19-2010, 7:32 AM
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Oh yeah, here's a picture of bullet construction and how they react to wetpacks:


Quote:
Originally Posted by lewdogg21 View Post
I do for black bear....



all the time....



naked.....



with honey and bacon grease smeared on me....




top that....
LOL.
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Old 02-19-2010, 4:22 PM
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So from what it seems like shot placement is key on bigger pigs with a .223 round. And Hollow points are best?
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Old 02-19-2010, 4:27 PM
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It's going to have to be one really nice shot. I've seen videos of headshots on pigs and some still end up running.
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Old 02-19-2010, 5:46 PM
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Originally Posted by SexPistol View Post
So from what it seems like shot placement is key on bigger pigs with a .223 round. And Hollow points are best?
Shot placement is key for any type of round, except for 40mm, not 40Cal., MM.

I wouldnt say HP is best, you have to check out what their made for. Each bullet maker tells you what the bullet is designed to do.

Here is a sample of what Im talking about:

http://www.hornady.com/bullets
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Old 02-20-2010, 2:48 PM
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Well a lot say deep penetration.. Do you want that with a hunting round or something that will go straight through? I'm still not clean on whats a good round.
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Old 02-20-2010, 2:59 PM
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Originally Posted by theseacow View Post
.223 is way less then optimal for pigs.
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Originally Posted by mif_slim View Post
STRONGLY not advised!
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Originally Posted by hybridatsun350 View Post
I would advise against hunting pig with a .223.
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Originally Posted by Trapper View Post
IMHO the 223 does not have enough mass.
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Originally Posted by Bearclaw View Post
So I wouldn't be hunting with anything less then a .30 cal.
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Originally Posted by SexPistol View Post
Well a lot say deep penetration.. Do you want that with a hunting round or something that will go straight through? I'm still not clean on whats a good round.
Just because you havent got the answer that you want doesnt mean you havent gotten the right answer.

The .223 is less than optimal for pigs, regardless of the bullet you are using.

CAN you kill a pig with .223, yes. Should you try? probably not.

I recall you questioning the ethics of some of the hunters on this forum in regards to coyotes, yet you come asking for advice and disregarding that which doesnt fit you.

Look around and see what serious hog hunters are using, its not .223, maybe you should heed the advice of guys with experience in the field. Either that or go leave some wounded hogs in the field... your call.
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Old 02-20-2010, 4:48 PM
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Ohhh boy here we go..

First of all I'm new to hunting so sorry if these answers that were given to me weren't clear enough for me to understand. But I do recall seeing some people posting that .223 will work on pigs. And if you read the first post I'm building a bigger rifle but for the time being this is what I have to use... And if you want to talk about "serious hog hunters" then you obviously haven't seen videos on youtube of people shooting pigs with .223 I suggest you look up "dnahoghunter" or watch this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eq8RZbyyb1g

and on top of that I know people who have shot and killed big pigs with .223 and I want to look deeper into what kind of ammo I should be using to drop the animal and not have to "go leave some wounded hogs in the field..."
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Old 02-20-2010, 4:55 PM
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I prefer the 55gr softpoint black hills (blue box).
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Old 02-20-2010, 5:12 PM
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Ohhh boy here we go..

First of all I'm new to hunting so sorry if these answers that were given to me weren't clear enough for me to understand. But I do recall seeing some people posting that .223 will work on pigs. And if you read the first post I'm building a bigger rifle but for the time being this is what I have to use... And if you want to talk about "serious hog hunters" then you obviously haven't seen videos on youtube of people shooting pigs with .223 I suggest you look up "dnahoghunter" or watch this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eq8RZbyyb1g

and on top of that I know people who have shot and killed big pigs with .223 and I want to look deeper into what kind of ammo I should be using to drop the animal and not have to "go leave some wounded hogs in the field..."
It's not a matter of ethics of "leaving wounded hogs in the field" for ME. I'm afraid I'm not gonna kill the dang thing and instead, I'LL get hurt

But that's just me. I want a pig to drop, not charge.
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Old 02-20-2010, 5:42 PM
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But pig's don't always drop even with big rounds I hear. Idk I'm just going to have to go out there and experience it myself and try and get my .308 done quickly.
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Old 02-21-2010, 12:03 AM
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Sure, if you can find hunting ammo for it.

Yup...its around...but it"ll cost you twice the price of a 91/30 just to sight it in with the 7.62x54r Green ammo.
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Old 02-21-2010, 7:17 AM
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A hollow point is more of a varmint round. A soft point with a lead core is better for controlled expansion. Unless you plan on shooting it in the head it is too small on hogs.I would only use it on a 100 pound hog and make sure you neck shoot them.
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Old 02-21-2010, 10:11 AM
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I just finish looking at a hunting channel, they used 22mag to hunt pigs. Drop em in it's tracks. Shot in the forehead by a kid at 45 yards.
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Old 02-21-2010, 12:07 PM
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butcher use the 22 mag 2 kill cattle and hogs but most of the time hunting shots will not be the same as an animal in a pen.
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Old 02-21-2010, 1:49 PM
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I was having this conversation with a buddy of mine about the penetration of the .223 and hunting pigs, he was saying the same thing as most here. I understand about it not having the knock down power but I think a clean head shot would drop them if placed properly. My AR is more then sufficient for head shot accuracy at 100 yards, and as far as penetration, ive blown through 3/8" steel plate, hardly moving it and the bullet kept on going. Now if I was to use my AR, I dont think I would pull the trigger unless I had an absolute perfect shot.
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Old 02-21-2010, 1:58 PM
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Originally Posted by SKSer View Post
I was having this conversation with a buddy of mine about the penetration of the .223 and hunting pigs, he was saying the same thing as most here. I understand about it not having the knock down power but I think a clean head shot would drop them if placed properly. My AR is more then sufficient for head shot accuracy at 100 yards, and as far as penetration, ive blown through 3/8" steel plate, hardly moving it and the bullet kept on going. Now if I was to use my AR, I dont think I would pull the trigger unless I had an absolute perfect shot.
refer to my prior post
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Old 02-21-2010, 1:58 PM
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Originally Posted by mif_slim View Post
Wait wait, so you'll hunt with a 380acp?!?! :P I kidd I kidd..
hahaha...
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Old 02-21-2010, 2:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Bearclaw View Post
refer to my prior post
Yea I think I could definately refrain unless I had a well placed head shot, im more after the meat then a trophy. I load my own ammo as well so I would go for a bullet like this: http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct...tNumber=837001
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Old 02-21-2010, 6:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Shoot-it View Post
butcher use the 22 mag 2 kill cattle and hogs but most of the time hunting shots will not be the same as an animal in a pen.
They use 22lr's. I go to them alot and the 6 area in our place here all uses 22lr for cows and pigs. A 10/22 to be exact for all of them.
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Old 02-21-2010, 7:33 PM
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There are no well placed shots in pig hunting. The animals are almost always moving and most of the time the hunters are short of breath from hiking etc.
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Old 02-22-2010, 6:01 AM
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Yea I think I could definately refrain unless I had a well placed head shot, im more after the meat then a trophy. I load my own ammo as well so I would go for a bullet like this: http://www.midwayusa.com/viewProduct...tNumber=837001
it is a good bullet....I use the same thing in my 30-06, except i use the Tipped TSX.
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Old 02-22-2010, 6:02 AM
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There are no well placed shots in pig hunting. The animals are almost always moving and most of the time the hunters are short of breath from hiking etc.
^+1
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