Calguns.net  

Home My iTrader Join the NRA Donate to CGSSA Sponsors CGN Google Search
CA Semiauto Ban(AW)ID Flowchart CA Handgun Ban ID Flowchart CA Shotgun Ban ID Flowchart
Go Back   Calguns.net > FIREARMS DISCUSSIONS > Centerfire Rifles - Semiautomatic or Gas Operated
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

Centerfire Rifles - Semiautomatic or Gas Operated Centerfire rifles, carbines and other gas operated rifles.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 01-13-2010, 7:03 PM
1988 1988 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: San Jose
Posts: 2,508
iTrader: 201 / 100%
Default Shooting AR-15 pistol ?

With the AR pistol with standard length buffer tube, are we allowed to shoot with the end of the buffer extension resting on the shoulder ?

Would that buffer extension tube be considered a stock if it rests on our shoulder when we shoot ?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 01-13-2010, 7:09 PM
till44's Avatar
till44 till44 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: East Bay
Posts: 2,430
iTrader: 166 / 100%
Default

The buffer tube is not a stock. Put your nose to the charging handle, the tube into your shoulder, and fire away.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 01-13-2010, 7:10 PM
Gio's Avatar
Gio Gio is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: In A Box Under The Freeway
Posts: 10,281
iTrader: 333 / 100%
Default

Nope that is totally illegal to do so Okay just kidding! Yes it is perfectly legal since it is needed in order to function properly.

-Gio
__________________
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 01-13-2010, 8:44 PM
Josh3239's Avatar
Josh3239 Josh3239 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Ventura County
Posts: 8,829
iTrader: 53 / 100%
Default

You can shoot your handgun however you'd like. You can brace the rear of the grip of your handgun to your shoulder and pull the trigger and it still doesn't make it a short barreled rifle.

Be aware that a standard length extention tube can open you up to potentially contructively possessing a short barrled rifle. You'd be much better off with a pistol extention tube, however there is nothing illegal in it of it's self to use a standard length extention tube.
__________________
Proud NRA Life Member As Of 2016


"The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism, but under the name of liberalism they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program until one day America will be a socialist nation without ever knowing how it happened." Norman Thomas, American socialist
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 01-13-2010, 8:54 PM
Acorn556's Avatar
Acorn556 Acorn556 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Off 280
Posts: 2,109
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

I thought with teh standard length extension tube there IS a problem because it can accept a stock. Correct me if I'm wrong but that's the information I've received though calguns and ar15.com

I've wanted to build one and I've just focused on using the pistol buffer.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 01-13-2010, 8:58 PM
1988 1988 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: San Jose
Posts: 2,508
iTrader: 201 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by till44 View Post
The buffer tube is not a stock. Put your nose to the charging handle, the tube into your shoulder, and fire away.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gio View Post
Nope that is totally illegal to do so Okay just kidding! Yes it is perfectly legal since it is needed in order to function properly.

-Gio
Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh3239 View Post
You can shoot your handgun however you'd like. You can brace the rear of the grip of your handgun to your shoulder and pull the trigger and it still doesn't make it a short barreled rifle.

Be aware that a standard length extention tube can open you up to potentially contructively possessing a short barrled rifle. You'd be much better off with a pistol extention tube, however there is nothing illegal in it of it's self to use a standard length extention tube.
My FFL told me that I can shoot the pistol with the buffer tube against my shoulder as long as there is no buttstock. However, I was at the range earlier today, and one of the range master checked my AR pistol during cease fire, and he told me that it's not legal to shoot AR pistol with the buffer tube resting on shoulder.

I'm not sure that he's joking with me or he's just spreading FUD. He also looked at my vz.58 and called it an AK.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 01-13-2010, 9:00 PM
Josh3239's Avatar
Josh3239 Josh3239 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Ventura County
Posts: 8,829
iTrader: 53 / 100%
Default

The issue is constructive possession of a short barreled rifle. Just like having the parts necessary to make a machine gun if you have a lower receiver and a single machine gun parts, if you have a pistol lower that can accept a buttstock then you could be accused of constructive possession of a short barreled rifle. That is the only reason the pistol tube is made, because it cannot accept a stock but the tube itself is vital to the operation of the system. So if you had a spare A2 stock and a pistol with a rifle length extention tube that is constructive possession of a short barreled rifle.

Really a carbine or rifle length tube modified to where a stock cannot be put on it would be no different than a pistol tube. I actually thought about doing this and tried it by removing the stock itself from my AR rifle and found it very awkward. The pistol length tube with foam or saddle on it is much more comfortable IMO.

EDIT: There are some letters from the ATF floating around somewhere on ARF where the ATF states that there is no restrictions on tubes on AR pistols no matter what they are called, how they are used, or their length.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Acorn556 View Post
I thought with teh standard length extension tube there IS a problem because it can accept a stock. Correct me if I'm wrong but that's the information I've received though calguns and ar15.com

I've wanted to build one and I've just focused on using the pistol buffer.
__________________
Proud NRA Life Member As Of 2016


"The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism, but under the name of liberalism they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program until one day America will be a socialist nation without ever knowing how it happened." Norman Thomas, American socialist

Last edited by Josh3239; 01-13-2010 at 9:06 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 01-13-2010, 9:04 PM
Josh3239's Avatar
Josh3239 Josh3239 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Ventura County
Posts: 8,829
iTrader: 53 / 100%
Default

Like I said, you can rest your Glock against your shoulder and shoot it that way and it doesn't make it a SBR. The ATF has made it clear the extention tube is not a buttstock.

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1988 View Post
My FFL told me that I can shoot the pistol with the buffer tube against my shoulder as long as there is no buttstock. However, I was at the range earlier today, and one of the range master checked my AR pistol during cease fire, and he told me that it's not legal to shoot AR pistol with the buffer tube resting on shoulder.

I'm not sure that he's joking with me or he's just spreading FUD. He also looked at my vz.58 and called it an AK.
__________________
Proud NRA Life Member As Of 2016


"The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism, but under the name of liberalism they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program until one day America will be a socialist nation without ever knowing how it happened." Norman Thomas, American socialist
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 01-13-2010, 9:06 PM
1988 1988 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: San Jose
Posts: 2,508
iTrader: 201 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh3239 View Post
The issue is constructive possession of a short barreled rifle. Just like having the parts necessary to make a machine gun if you have a lower receiver and a single machine gun parts, if you have a pistol lower that can accept a buttstock then you could be accused of constructive possession of a short barreled rifle. That is the only reason the pistol tube is made, because it cannot accept a stock but the tube itself is vital to the operation of the system. So if you had a spare A2 stock and a pistol with a rifle length extention tube that is constructive possession of a short barreled rifle.

Really a carbine or rifle length tube modified to where a stock cannot be put on it would be no different than a pistol tube. I actually thought about doing this and tried it by removing the stock itself from my AR rifle and found it very awkward. The pistol length tube with foam or saddle on it is much more comfortable IMO.
To be more concise, the buffer tube on my pistol is Pistol buffer tube from RRA with Standard Carbine length, and it does not accept a standard buttstock.

Would that still be at risk of being accused of constructive ?
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 01-13-2010, 9:10 PM
Josh3239's Avatar
Josh3239 Josh3239 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Ventura County
Posts: 8,829
iTrader: 53 / 100%
Default

Nope, your fine.
__________________
Proud NRA Life Member As Of 2016


"The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism, but under the name of liberalism they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program until one day America will be a socialist nation without ever knowing how it happened." Norman Thomas, American socialist
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 01-13-2010, 9:14 PM
1988 1988 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: San Jose
Posts: 2,508
iTrader: 201 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh3239 View Post
EDIT: There are some letters from the ATF floating around somewhere on ARF where the ATF states that there is no restrictions on tubes on AR pistols no matter what they are called, how they are used, or their length.
Does anyone still have the link to that letter ?

I'd like to have it printed and bring it along with my AR pistol.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 01-14-2010, 7:09 AM
mcholak mcholak is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Fresno
Posts: 191
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Controlling the manner by which you shoot the gun seems unrealistic. Wouldn't it would be like saying shooting a rifle from your hip is illegal? I'm obviously speaking from a logic standpoint, not a legal standpoint....and we all know logic has no place in CA laws.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 01-14-2010, 7:28 AM
glock_this's Avatar
glock_this glock_this is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Under your skin
Posts: 8,227
iTrader: 48 / 98%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh3239 View Post
EDIT: There are some letters from the ATF floating around somewhere on ARF where the ATF states that there is no restrictions on tubes on AR pistols no matter what they are called, how they are used, or their length.
another mention of one of those supposed elusive letters.. boy, sure would be nice to have that and have it in a Calguns Documents section
__________________
10 +1 in the chamber

WTS: Gun stuff & things
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 01-14-2010, 7:48 AM
CHS's Avatar
CHS CHS is offline
Moderator Emeritus
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Santa Ana, CA
Posts: 11,329
iTrader: 14 / 100%
Default

Rifles are defined by federal and state law as a firearm that is designed or redesigned to be fired from the shoulder.

Firing an AR pistol from the shoulder is a surefire way to get nabbed for an SBR. There is no mention of buttstock in the laws defining rifles.
__________________
Please read the Calguns Wiki
Quote:
Laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes...Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man.
--Cesare, Marquis of Beccaria, "On Crimes and Punishment"
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 01-14-2010, 8:18 AM
spdrcr's Avatar
spdrcr spdrcr is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,653
iTrader: 272 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1988 View Post
Does anyone still have the link to that letter ?

I'd like to have it printed and bring it along with my AR pistol.
Not sure if this is what the previous poster was referring to or not, but here's one letter:

http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/400...arpistols1.jpg
http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/210...arpistols2.jpg
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 01-14-2010, 8:29 AM
glock_this's Avatar
glock_this glock_this is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Under your skin
Posts: 8,227
iTrader: 48 / 98%
Default

another one of those topics where we get totally contradictory opinions from page 1 to page 2

in +90% of the photos you see of people shooting AR pistols, they are on ones cheek. Not on the shoulder. Now, that does not mean I think it is illegal to shoot it from the shoulder as logically, a pistol alone can be shot from 1 hand, 2 hands, hip, turned sideways, etc.. so hard to imagine that just placing the AR pistol on you shoulder, since it does not have a butt stock, is illegal or could be construed as an SBR. Just an opinion though. But more interesting, given the short nature of an AR pistol, how easy is it to even shoot it from a shoulder?

well, I will find out tonight as I go shoot my new one I just built

BTW, good find on the letters spdrcr, I downloaded them to keep just to have.
__________________
10 +1 in the chamber

WTS: Gun stuff & things
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 01-14-2010, 10:23 AM
1988 1988 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: San Jose
Posts: 2,508
iTrader: 201 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by spdrcr View Post
Not sure if this is what the previous poster was referring to or not, but here's one letter:

http://img32.imageshack.us/img32/400...arpistols1.jpg
http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/210...arpistols2.jpg
Thanks for the links.

However, I think we need something to clear the grey area in which if we won't get into trouble shooting the AR pistol with the buffer extension resting on our shoulder.

Would any expert please chime-in to help out on the grey area ?
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 01-14-2010, 12:21 PM
RMTactical's Avatar
RMTactical RMTactical is offline
Member
 
Join Date: May 2009
Posts: 287
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

All that matters is that the weapon is configured in compliance with law. Shoot it how you see fit.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 01-14-2010, 12:40 PM
Josh3239's Avatar
Josh3239 Josh3239 is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Ventura County
Posts: 8,829
iTrader: 53 / 100%
Default

I am trying to find the letters. You should go on ARF and post a request. In the meantime, so far the only letter I could find is with regard to whether or not it is a violation of NFA to put rubber cane tips on the end of a pistol buffer tube. The ATF ruled it is not, not even potentially constructive possession, what do you guys think the rubber cane tips on the end of a pistol buffer tube is for?

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.htm...f=122&t=465457

Quote:
Originally Posted by bdsmchs View Post
Rifles are defined by federal and state law as a firearm that is designed or redesigned to be fired from the shoulder.

Firing an AR pistol from the shoulder is a surefire way to get nabbed for an SBR. There is no mention of buttstock in the laws defining rifles.
1) Keyword designed. It doesn't matter how you shoot it, it matters what it is designed for. AR pistols aren't designed to be fired from the shoulder anymore than my Glock is. I could still do it.

2) An AR pistol is a pistol, it is in the same classification as my Glock. So your telling me that if I brace my Glock against my shoulder and pull the trigger my Glock has become an SBR?
__________________
Proud NRA Life Member As Of 2016


"The American people will never knowingly adopt socialism, but under the name of liberalism they will adopt every fragment of the socialist program until one day America will be a socialist nation without ever knowing how it happened." Norman Thomas, American socialist
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 01-14-2010, 12:51 PM
dpharley's Avatar
dpharley dpharley is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Lafayette, CA
Posts: 327
iTrader: 19 / 100%
Default

I shoot mine Sideways.....
__________________

I HAVE AMMO available
WTS 1,000 Rounds of .223 Ammo by PMC - 55gr FMJBT

://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/showthread.php?t=726840
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 01-14-2010, 1:10 PM
Gio's Avatar
Gio Gio is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: In A Box Under The Freeway
Posts: 10,281
iTrader: 333 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by dpharley View Post
I shoot mine Sideways.....
I shoot mine off my forehead...........
__________________
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 01-14-2010, 1:35 PM
CHS's Avatar
CHS CHS is offline
Moderator Emeritus
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Santa Ana, CA
Posts: 11,329
iTrader: 14 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh3239 View Post
I am trying to find the letters. You should go on ARF and post a request. In the meantime, so far the only letter I could find is with regard to whether or not it is a violation of NFA to put rubber cane tips on the end of a pistol buffer tube. The ATF ruled it is not, not even potentially constructive possession, what do you guys think the rubber cane tips on the end of a pistol buffer tube is for?

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.htm...f=122&t=465457
Read his letter again as it's VERY misleading:

"In addition, is it legal for me to add a rubber walking cane tip (such as those found in drug stores to provide a non-slip grip for canes) to the end of the buffer tube to provide a non-slip way to stand the AR15 pistol up in my gun safe?"

Of course the ATF approved the cane tips for that purpose.

Quote:
1) Keyword designed. It doesn't matter how you shoot it, it matters what it is designed for. AR pistols aren't designed to be fired from the shoulder anymore than my Glock is. I could still do it.
The keyword is not just 'designed'. it's "designed, redesigned, made or remade, and INTENDED to be fired from the shoulder".

Using an AR pistol in a manner where you are directly firing from the shoulder by putting the A2 receiver extension into your shoulder socket, is "making or remaking" and "intending" to fire from the shoulder.

That's an SBR and the ATF can prosecute you for it.

A foam-covered tube where you are getting a cheek weld, but keeping the gun specifically OUT of the shoulder socket is a much safer way to go.
__________________
Please read the Calguns Wiki
Quote:
Laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes...Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man.
--Cesare, Marquis of Beccaria, "On Crimes and Punishment"
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 01-14-2010, 4:21 PM
glock_this's Avatar
glock_this glock_this is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Under your skin
Posts: 8,227
iTrader: 48 / 98%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gio View Post
I shoot mine off my forehead...........
well hell, that explains a lot
__________________
10 +1 in the chamber

WTS: Gun stuff & things
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 01-14-2010, 7:07 PM
1988 1988 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: San Jose
Posts: 2,508
iTrader: 201 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gio View Post
I shoot mine off my forehead...........
Be careful... they might accuse you for other things not firearms related.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 01-14-2010, 8:22 PM
Fate's Avatar
Fate Fate is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Proud Member of the Quitter Club. Moscow, ID
Posts: 9,114
iTrader: 38 / 100%
Default

I like looking at the actual code, so here's what I found for CA and Federal definitions.

Quote:
CA Penal Code

12001. (a) (1) As used in this title, the terms "pistol,"
"revolver," and "firearm capable of being concealed upon the person"
shall apply to and include any device designed to be used as a
weapon, from which is expelled a projectile by the force of any
explosion, or other form of combustion, and that has a barrel less
than 16 inches in length. These terms also include any device that
has a barrel 16 inches or more in length which is designed to be
interchanged with a barrel less than 16 inches in length.
(2) As used in this title, the term "handgun" means any "pistol,"
"revolver," or "firearm capable of being concealed upon the person."


(f) Nothing shall prevent a device defined as a "handgun,"
"pistol," "revolver," or "firearm capable of being concealed upon the
person" from also being found to be a short-barreled shotgun or a
short-barreled rifle, as defined in Section 12020.




12020. (c) (2) As used in this section, a "short-barreled rifle" means any of
the following:
(A) A rifle having a barrel or barrels of less than 16 inches in
length.
(B) A rifle with an overall length of less than 26 inches.
(C) Any weapon made from a rifle (whether by alteration,
modification, or otherwise) if that weapon, as modified, has an
overall length of less than 26 inches or a barrel or barrels of less
than 16 inches in length.
(D) Any device which may be readily restored to fire a fixed
cartridge which, when so restored, is a device defined in
subparagraphs (A) to (C), inclusive.
(E) Any part, or combination of parts, designed and intended to
convert a device into a device defined in subparagraphs (A) to (C),
inclusive, or any combination of parts from which a device defined in
subparagraphs (A) to (C), inclusive, may be readily assembled if
those parts are in the possession or under the control of the same
person.


(20) As used in this section, a "rifle" means a weapon designed or
redesigned, made or remade, and intended to be fired from the
shoulder and designed or redesigned and made or remade to use the
energy of the explosive in a fixed cartridge to fire only a single
projectile through a rifled bore for each single pull of the trigger.
Quote:
US Code

TITLE 18 > PART I > CHAPTER 44 > 921
Prev | Next
921. Definitions

(7) The term “rifle” means a weapon designed or redesigned, made or remade, and intended to be fired from the shoulder and designed or redesigned and made or remade to use the energy of an explosive to fire only a single projectile through a rifled bore for each single pull of the trigger.

(8) The term “short-barreled rifle” means a rifle having one or more barrels less than sixteen inches in length and any weapon made from a rifle (whether by alteration, modification, or otherwise) if such weapon, as modified, has an overall length of less than twenty-six inches.

(29) The term “handgun” means—
(A) a firearm which has a short stock and is designed to be held and fired by the use of a single hand; and
(B) any combination of parts from which a firearm described in subparagraph (A) can be assembled.
Not sure I totally agree with BDSMChris' argument that a standard, BATFE-defined pistol (in AR form) somehow is redesigned or remade by how you hold it. I will agree that the cane tip might push a pistol over the line, but using a pistol buffer that can't accommodate a buttstock shouldn't. It's still designed to be a non-shoulder-fired pistol. I couldn't find anything in either document mentioning anything about how you held a pistol changing the definition.

I don't have an AR/AK pistol, so no real dog in this fight, just curious as I have been thinking about building one.
__________________
"On bended knee is no way to be free." - Eddie Vedder, "Guaranteed"

"Let your gun therefore be the constant companion of your walks." -Thomas Jefferson
, in a letter to his nephew Peter Carr dated August 19, 1785

Last edited by Fate; 01-14-2010 at 8:31 PM..
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 01-14-2010, 9:14 PM
glock_this's Avatar
glock_this glock_this is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Under your skin
Posts: 8,227
iTrader: 48 / 98%
Default

having shot mine for the first time tonight.. which was awesome BTW, I fond it very hard and to close to my face if I actually tried to shoulder it. Face on the buffer tube - or in my case the CAA stock saddle cheek weld - was really the only reasonable way.. unless I wanted to lose teeth
__________________
10 +1 in the chamber

WTS: Gun stuff & things
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 01-14-2010, 9:56 PM
CHS's Avatar
CHS CHS is offline
Moderator Emeritus
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Santa Ana, CA
Posts: 11,329
iTrader: 14 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fate View Post
but using a pistol buffer that can't accommodate a buttstock shouldn't. It's still designed to be a non-shoulder-fired pistol. I couldn't find anything in either document mentioning anything about how you held a pistol changing the definition.
Keep in mind that the OP was talking about a standard A1/A2 receiver extension, and not a compact carbine receiver extension, or dedicated pistol receiver extension.
__________________
Please read the Calguns Wiki
Quote:
Laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes...Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man.
--Cesare, Marquis of Beccaria, "On Crimes and Punishment"
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 01-14-2010, 10:32 PM
Fate's Avatar
Fate Fate is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Proud Member of the Quitter Club. Moscow, ID
Posts: 9,114
iTrader: 38 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bdsmchs View Post
Keep in mind that the OP was talking about a standard A1/A2 receiver extension, and not a compact carbine receiver extension, or dedicated pistol receiver extension.
Ah yes. That could indeed be a sticking point.

Are there pistol receiver extentions (sans threaded screw hole, etc) that are as long as an A1/A2 rifle version?
__________________
"On bended knee is no way to be free." - Eddie Vedder, "Guaranteed"

"Let your gun therefore be the constant companion of your walks." -Thomas Jefferson
, in a letter to his nephew Peter Carr dated August 19, 1785
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 01-16-2010, 3:08 AM
1988 1988 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: San Jose
Posts: 2,508
iTrader: 201 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fate View Post
Ah yes. That could indeed be a sticking point.

Are there pistol receiver extentions (sans threaded screw hole, etc) that are as long as an A1/A2 rifle version?
The lower is RRA pistol. It has the RRA pistol buffer tube which is the same length as the carbine buffer extension.

It's clear that the pistol extension is not an issue, just it's position when we shoot the pistol. The question is:

Would the pistol be consider a SBR if we shoot it with the buffer extension tube resting on our shoulder ?
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 01-16-2010, 12:17 PM
titus7 titus7 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: ridgecrest
Posts: 541
iTrader: 9 / 100%
Default

Dont know if this helps any but here it is...


Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 01-18-2010, 11:49 AM
gvazquez's Avatar
gvazquez gvazquez is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: The OC
Posts: 476
iTrader: 22 / 100%
Default

Ok, so I have an AR Pistol with the carbine tube and foam cover with a CAA cheek saddle, but I also have another idea for a more solid and stronger cheek rest.

This is my current pistol setup:


and this is an idea for a stronger, more solid setup for a cheek rest (Using part of a magpul stock) In this setup it still is not a shoulder stock, it is a buffer tube with a cheek rest built in and bottom rails for attaching rail covers :
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 01-18-2010, 6:13 PM
glock_this's Avatar
glock_this glock_this is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Under your skin
Posts: 8,227
iTrader: 48 / 98%
Default

honestly, like the first setup - same as mine - the second one, ahhh not so much
__________________
10 +1 in the chamber

WTS: Gun stuff & things
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 01-18-2010, 7:07 PM
CHS's Avatar
CHS CHS is offline
Moderator Emeritus
CGN Contributor - Lifetime
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Santa Ana, CA
Posts: 11,329
iTrader: 14 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by gvazquez View Post
and this is an idea for a stronger, more solid setup for a cheek rest (Using part of a magpul stock) In this setup it still is not a shoulder stock, it is a buffer tube with a cheek rest built in and bottom rails for attaching rail covers :
That looks like an SBR felony just waiting to happen.
__________________
Please read the Calguns Wiki
Quote:
Laws that forbid the carrying of arms...disarm only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes...Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, for an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed man.
--Cesare, Marquis of Beccaria, "On Crimes and Punishment"
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 01-19-2010, 1:37 AM
titus7 titus7 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: ridgecrest
Posts: 541
iTrader: 9 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bdsmchs View Post
That looks like an SBR felony just waiting to happen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by gvazquez View Post
Ok, so I have an AR Pistol with the carbine tube and foam cover with a CAA cheek saddle, but I also have another idea for a more solid and stronger cheek rest.

This is my current pistol setup:


and this is an idea for a stronger, more solid setup for a cheek rest (Using part of a magpul stock) In this setup it still is not a shoulder stock, it is a buffer tube with a cheek rest built in and bottom rails for attaching rail covers :
I was thinking of doing the same thing but with a UBR stock and just shaving the rail off of the cheek rest, so that there is no way possible to attach the buttstock to it.
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 01-19-2010, 8:46 AM
coop44's Avatar
coop44 coop44 is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: ex-sacramentan-now in Lacey WA & lovin' it
Posts: 1,483
iTrader: 28 / 100%
Default

I remember some years ago a stock available for a s/a pistol that was not "attached" and perfectly legal, held in place with pressure against the shoulder and shooting hand.

Similarly couldn't an a2 stock be slid onto a properly sized buffer tube and held in place with pressure, since it is not "attached" what would it be considered?
__________________
"There's no way to rule innocent men. The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws" From Atlas Shrugged by Ayn Rand
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 5:50 PM.




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Proudly hosted by GeoVario the Premier 2A host.
Calguns.net, the 'Calguns' name and all associated variants and logos are ® Trademark and © Copyright 2002-2016, Calguns.net an Incorporated Company All Rights Reserved.