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  #1  
Old 07-15-2005, 11:24 AM
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I would LOVE to see your proof that cops around the country are disabling the disconnects on their pistols wholesale in this obviously thinly disquished attempt to impose them on civilians.

Tin foil hat anyone?
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Old 07-15-2005, 8:31 PM
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All the LAPD officers I've seen with 4506's and 5906's for starters.

Look, the basic initial question came up what is a magazine safety and how does it work.

I listed a series of pistols that are now or were in production WELL BEFORE the California law was ever conceived.

Suddenly, the conversation goes from being a basic statement of fact to political BS being thrown around.

The fact that you don't like and them and don't trust them is irrelevent. If you want to make this a debate as to the use, go ahead. I don't like them either and you can argue with yourself. None of my pistols have them and my HP's have had them removed.

S&W added their disconnect to their pistol line as a solution to the LEO issue of weapons retention and officer safety. Does it really save lives? I don't know if they have numbers to show that, but it's a safety concern and S&W attempted to address it. Other solutions include many of the retention holsters on the market today. The reality is that it's most likely never going to be an issue for a CCW or HD handgun owner.

Any officer running around with a 5906, 4506, or any other S&W 2nd and 3rd generation semi-auto or Ruger is running around with a pistol with a magazine safety. There are more then a few doing so.
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  #3  
Old 07-14-2005, 9:31 PM
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If the magazine is removed from the handgun it will not fire.
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Old 07-15-2005, 3:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by San Francisco, 1911:
When you are rolling around in the dirt with a BG, you hit the <STRIKE>mag release</STRIKE><span class="ev_code_RED">trigger</span>, and the BG <STRIKE>can not pull the trigger</STRIKE> <span class="ev_code_RED">dies</span>. This is how the thinking goes.
I made a minor correction

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Old 07-15-2005, 3:38 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by GunsnRovers:
I would LOVE to see your proof that cops around the country are disabling the disconnects on their pistols wholesale in this obviously thinly disquished attempt to impose them on civilians.

Tin foil hat anyone?
CA's own SB 489 (the one that required mag disconnects on new guns after 2006) exempts LEOs from the requirement of the mag disconnect. New Jersey has a law requiring the implementation of "smart gun technology" into all handguns sold in the state within the next 5 years. It also exempts LEOs, for both service weapons and personal weapons.

Police opposition in CA to SB489 was not for the interest of officer safety, but that as a result of the "unsafe handgun" definition being expanded to their service weapons, they were afraid of more legal liability in officer involved shootings.

While it is against department policy to modify the internals of one's service weapon (including disabling a magazine disconnect), there are no checks for this, and the majority of departments stay away from all models which include disconnects, despite touting their "safety" when legislation like SB489 come up.
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Old 07-17-2005, 8:43 PM
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I have a little Pheonix 22 semi-auto. It has a mag disconect as well as a firing pin disconect and a safety. You also cannot clean the gun without first inserting a magazine to get it open. Scary. I am with Ramon let the public decide what it wants. If you dont want to shoot the gun you should be the one to decide not the gun.
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Old 07-15-2005, 5:42 AM
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All current production Hi-Powers have a disconnect. As do S&W' semi-auto's that came after the Model 39 and 41. Don't forget Ruger semi-auto's and the Bersa .380. There are a few others out there. More then a few older out of production pistols.
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Old 07-16-2005, 3:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by FortyFiveCal:
So this is final? All new handguns made after 2006 will have to have a mag disconnect if it's sold in California? Was it already voted on and passed? Sorry, but I haven't been paying attention lately.
Yes it's final. It passed already. More problems for legal gun owners no thanks to the leftist legislature in California. We can't get a break.

This law will only effect NEW as in newly submitted pistols after 2007. 2006 for chamber load indicators. All of those pistols that are already on the safety list do not need to comply as long as the manufacturer pays the yearly ransom.
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Old 07-15-2005, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by GunsnRovers:
While I'm not a fan of mag disconnects, they have a decent sized following in law enforcement as wat to keep a bad guy from killing you with your own pistol. That was the primary reason S&W added it to their line.

Open carry does have the risk of having your pistol for everyone to see, including those who want to take it from you.
How does having a mag disconnect stop the bad guy from stealing the cops gun and shooting him/her with it? At a local Walmart less than a year ago a shop lifter got caught by a cop who patrols the store and took her gun from her holster and shot her in the head with it. I fail to see how a mag disconnect would prevent this as at no time did the mag leave the weapon.

Oh and another thing the mag disonnect does is prevent firing the gun during a tac reload, where you may find yourself surprised by a bad guy during a lull in the action and want to fire the one chambered round you have even with no mag in the gun.
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  #10  
Old 07-14-2005, 10:14 PM
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Older Browning Hi Powers had this feature but currently no one does this.
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  #11  
Old 07-15-2005, 5:55 PM
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How many police do you know that carry a duty pistol that has a magazine disconnect?
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Old 07-17-2005, 6:41 AM
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Brainwashed? No. Woefully ignorant? Yes.

I can't believe how many shooters I run into that have NO idea about the anti-gun legislation being passed. They get pissed when they hear about it, but it's usually after the fact.

We get the government we deserve. When the mayor of LA is voted in with a 30% turnout, apathy rules the land.
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Old 07-16-2005, 2:15 PM
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So this is final? All new handguns made after 2006 will have to have a mag disconnect if it's sold in California? Was it already voted on and passed? Sorry, but I haven't been paying attention lately.
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  #14  
Old 07-15-2005, 2:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by San Francisco, 1911:
When you are rolling around in the dirt with a BG, you hit the mag release, and the BG can not pull the trigger. This is how the thinking goes.

Without the mag disconnect, you hit the mag release, and the BG only gets one round off. Hopefully that one doesn't hit you anywhere you can't cope with a hole. That is, unless you can take the slide out of battery, in which case you get the same result as a disconnect - no fire.

It's a tool to help when firearms retention is an issue. For the average target shooter or home defense, it's probably not ever going to help you.
Interesting. I never thought you would intentionally want to disable your gun. Still, I can't imagine it's taught too much since the average cop most likely carries a SIG or Glock, neither of which have the mag disconnect feature.
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Old 07-15-2005, 8:48 AM
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A mag safety disconnect prevents the gun from firing if the mag is removed - even if there's a chambered round, any safety is off, and the trigger's pulls. This is dangerous because it means if you have a mag failure you can't even fire single rounds.

And to those who think one needs a mag disco. to keep you safe, you need to be removed by Mr. Darwin cuz you're missing the key safety device between your ears.

Speaking of which, I've still gotta remove my Browning HiPower's mag safety disconnect.

I can really feel its disengagement after the midst of a trigger pull: it is very irritating and impinges on shooting accuracy.

Fortunately mag disconnects are easy to remove - I just need to get off my arse...

Bill Wiese
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Old 07-14-2005, 8:35 PM
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I was reading about AB 352 and it mentioned something about a "safety disconnect". WHat is it and what does it do?
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Old 07-16-2005, 9:39 PM
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I think we should all start seriously considering relocating to Nevada. The leftist legislature can't make guns illegal, but they can try to squeeze our balls so tight( forgive my french) that we'll give up owning firearms alltogether. Their goal is to make fireamrs ownership a pain in the arse, and if this bullet seriel # fiasco passes, that would seriously hurt us. I swear, californians are totally brain washed w/ this anti-gun non sense. Sorry, rant mode off.
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  #18  
Old 07-15-2005, 1:19 PM
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When you are rolling around in the dirt with a BG, you hit the mag release, and the BG can not pull the trigger. This is how the thinking goes.

Without the mag disconnect, you hit the mag release, and the BG only gets one round off. Hopefully that one doesn't hit you anywhere you can't cope with a hole. That is, unless you can take the slide out of battery, in which case you get the same result as a disconnect - no fire.

It's a tool to help when firearms retention is an issue. For the average target shooter or home defense, it's probably not ever going to help you.
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  #19  
Old 07-15-2005, 11:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by GunsnRovers:
While I'm not a fan of mag disconnects, they have a decent sized following in law enforcement as wat to keep a bad guy from killing you with your own pistol. That was the primary reason S&W added it to their line.
They have a decent sized following in law enforcement as something to impose on the law-abiding populace, while they themselves disable the mag disconnects on any issued service weapons, and are exempt from legislation requiring the inclusion of such features.
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  #20  
Old 07-15-2005, 10:22 AM
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While I'm not a fan of mag disconnects, they have a decent sized following in law enforcement as wat to keep a bad guy from killing you with your own pistol. That was the primary reason S&W added it to their line.

Open carry does have the risk of having your pistol for everyone to see, including those who want to take it from you.
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  #21  
Old 07-15-2005, 10:20 PM
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If you want to buy a handgun that has a magazine disconnect that's great. Let the market decide.

As for making it law that is something altogether different. I do not beleive the intention of the grabbers is a positive one.
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