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Calguns LEOs LEOs; chat, kibitz and relax. Non-LEOs; have a questions for a cop? Ask it here, in a CIVIL manner.

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  #1  
Old 09-16-2009, 7:40 AM
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Default Article: Do You Have the Right to Flip Off a Cop?

Just wanted to share with the fellow LEO's out there. I also got the finger but I thought to my self, is it really worth it to pull someone over?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/time/2009091...08599192312500
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  #2  
Old 09-16-2009, 9:29 AM
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Is i t really worth it to pull someone over for flipping you off? I hope you're joking... Might as well take away their right to own a gun or choose their own doctor.
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  #3  
Old 09-16-2009, 10:17 AM
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I love it when people flip me off....It makes my day! especially the little gang bangers kid with his fat fingers!

Having a toy gun pulled on you is not fun though....... Mom got an *** chewing for that one!
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Old 09-16-2009, 10:59 AM
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As a LEO, I get it all the time, especially after a traffic cite. No big deal...lets the guy cool off. Smile and a friendly wave

Side question...how many have taken in people in for PC 415(3) to stop fights between people before the 415(1) starts?
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  #5  
Old 09-16-2009, 11:21 AM
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I usually wave back.
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  #6  
Old 09-16-2009, 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by J_B View Post
I usually wave back.
Thats exactly what i do. I wave back with a smile. They get furious.
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  #7  
Old 09-16-2009, 12:39 PM
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absolutely! it is protected under the first amendment as political speech.
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  #8  
Old 09-16-2009, 1:22 PM
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Not a Leo but this is how I see it, A lot of things are not illegal in this country, doesn't mean you should run around and do those things.

I have my fair share of negative experiences with LEO's but there is no reason to disrespect someone like that unprovoked. Besides lets be honest I am sure nearly 90% of people are driving around with at least 1 equipment violation/ ticket able offense why draw attention to your self.

Last edited by Lyte-; 09-16-2009 at 1:27 PM..
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  #9  
Old 09-16-2009, 4:08 PM
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If the driver of a moving vehicle extends his/her arm out the window and bends it upward at the elbow with a closed fist except for the middle digit (arm may or may not be moving vigorously up and down) and either goes straight, turns left or slows down I have PC to stop the vehicle and issue a citation for improper use of hand signals.
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  #10  
Old 09-16-2009, 4:40 PM
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Originally Posted by eltee View Post
If the driver of a moving vehicle extends his/her arm out the window and bends it upward at the elbow with a closed fist except for the middle digit (arm may or may not be moving vigorously up and down) and either goes straight, turns left or slows down I have PC to stop the vehicle and issue a citation for improper use of hand signals.
LOL... nice! (note to self - when flipping off cops, keep arm inside vehicle, or turn right )

I think that trying to provoke (in any way) a PO is just a dumb move. Everytime I've seen it happen, it's always when they're driving away. People tend to get tougher, the further away they get from the opposition be it cops, or anyone else they wouldn't normally confront at point blank range.
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Old 09-16-2009, 10:11 PM
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I remember this issue coming up in the academy. The instructor told us to take out our pencils and carefully write the date, time and his name as the instructor for our notes, which could be discoverable as evidence should the situation arise. This way we could honestly testify that this procedure was included in our formal academy training and how we were taught. It went like this:

"No sane person will ever flip off a Peace Officer. The middle finger salute translates to FU! And as I have just informed you, no sane person would ever do this. Now we have documented proof that this has actually happened.

There are only two reasons we recognize for this.

Number #1: The person is insane. Which means that they are now subject to a 5150 investigation. Consider it your sworn duty to to act upon the probable cause this person has just voluntairly given you. Ignoring it, is ignoring your duty.

Reason #2: If after ruling out a case of 5150, the only other possible thing that this person is communicating to you is "Oh Officer, would you kindly pull me over and conduct an extremly thourough inspection of my vehicle. Please leave no stone unturned, I want you to check my vehicle from bumper to bumper, roof to undercarriage. Time is irrelevent to me. Furthermore, please issue me a citation for any violations that you may find, as safety is my utmost concern."


The instructor concluded by saying, "Well cadets, there you have it. You have now been formally trained on how to properly handle such an occurance, should it ever arise. Keep these notes with you for the duration of your career, because you never know when you might need to refer back to them to justify your official actions."


I still have four full binders of classroom notes from my academy days.
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  #12  
Old 09-17-2009, 7:07 AM
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I like to tell this story ...

Years ago my Mom would give my younger sister rides from SF to Cal-Berkeley after a home weekend visit. Mom tended to need somebody to be in the car with her for the return trip and for some reason I tended to be stuck riding shotgun. So one late afternoon after Mom dropped off sister, we're traveling down University Ave. towards I-80 when a siren sounds. Sure enough a police cruiser comes up fast and furious behind Mom's car. She's from the old country and tended to get easily discombobulated. And at the time she'd been driving at least 30-something years in the U.S.

"What do I do? What do I do?" she said, frantically.

"Well ... lol ... Pull over," I said.

By the time she managed to drive the car from the left-hand lane to the right-hand lane, maybe 30 seconds had elapsed. And as the Berkeley PD cruiser passed us, we watched as the fat cop inside raised his middle finger to Mom.

lol lol lol

We should have reported that jerk, but we didn't know we could.
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Old 09-17-2009, 11:07 AM
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Did you actually say "lol"?
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  #14  
Old 09-17-2009, 12:27 PM
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lol = "I laughed at loud"

Just for you, next time I'll use brackets.
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  #15  
Old 09-18-2009, 6:57 PM
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They wanted my attention, now they have it.
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  #16  
Old 09-18-2009, 7:36 PM
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So you get the finger? At least you know your still "number one" in their book!!!
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Old 09-18-2009, 11:17 PM
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Default A long time ago I reversed it & really shouldn't have...

I was driving my unit back home after a memorial for a K9 (SBSO I think) that was killed tracking a rape suspect out in the high desert. My partner was in the back seat sleeping soundly & I was dwelling on how I would feel if I'd lost him in the line of duty.

Anyway I was cruising about 65mph. This was the days of the silly 55 only speed limit. Anyway any one who has ever driven a black & white on the freeway and stuck to the speed limit knows what it does to traffic. It backs up because everyone is afraid to go past you...( well most everyone)

Anyway I'm cruising along in the #1 lane and all of a sudden this VW van comes blowing up on my passengers side. Looking over I see this uh..."citizen" has his window down and is screaming something at me. I roll down my window thinking maybe theres an accident behind me, he needs help or maybe he needed directions to a barber for that ponytail he needed to have cut off... Nope, Mr. Tie-dyed is screaming at me "55 Officer! The speed limit is 55!!!" then showing me all five fingers...

After the days events I was less than tolerant. Before I really thought about it I raised my right hand, smiled at him and flipped him off with the most professional bird I could. I must admit his expression was priceless.

I drove back to my Dept and notified my Sgt. what I had done, a preemptive "mea culpa" as it were. He just shook his head...
Mr. tie-dyed never did call in to complain. He's probably still traumatized to this day. I was lucky but I was wrong and it was once again a perfect example of: "If it feels good saying it, I probably shouldn't have."
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  #18  
Old 09-23-2009, 8:52 AM
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Were always the bad guys.
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Old 09-23-2009, 9:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 696k View Post
I was driving my unit back home after a memorial for a K9 (SBSO I think) that was killed tracking a rape suspect out in the high desert. My partner was in the back seat sleeping soundly & I was dwelling on how I would feel if I'd lost him in the line of duty.

Anyway I was cruising about 65mph. This was the days of the silly 55 only speed limit. Anyway any one who has ever driven a black & white on the freeway and stuck to the speed limit knows what it does to traffic. It backs up because everyone is afraid to go past you...( well most everyone)

Anyway I'm cruising along in the #1 lane and all of a sudden this VW van comes blowing up on my passengers side. Looking over I see this uh..."citizen" has his window down and is screaming something at me. I roll down my window thinking maybe theres an accident behind me, he needs help or maybe he needed directions to a barber for that ponytail he needed to have cut off... Nope, Mr. Tie-dyed is screaming at me "55 Officer! The speed limit is 55!!!" then showing me all five fingers...

After the days events I was less than tolerant. Before I really thought about it I raised my right hand, smiled at him and flipped him off with the most professional bird I could. I must admit his expression was priceless.

I drove back to my Dept and notified my Sgt. what I had done, a preemptive "mea culpa" as it were. He just shook his head...
Mr. tie-dyed never did call in to complain. He's probably still traumatized to this day. I was lucky but I was wrong and it was once again a perfect example of: "If it feels good saying it, I probably shouldn't have."

Hahaha you go boy!
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Old 09-23-2009, 9:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mr.elite View Post
Were always the bad guys.
In order to do your job you were given powers, privileges, and immunities other citizens don't have. It's only natural that you're expected to conform to higher standards than other citizens, for if you don't, you can do more harm and get away with more than other citizens. Thanks to the fact that most of your do conform to those standards I can teach my nieces, and when the time comes, my kids, to respect, support, and help the policemen.

I can see how dealing with the scum of society daily might give you the "we're always the bad guys" idea. To them you are the bad guys, for you're preventing them from doing what they want to do - committing crimes, and punish them for doing it. However, most people in this country aren't criminals, and don't consider you bad guys. Quite the opposite, actually.

Moreover, many people, myself included, don't believe in our legal system anymore (myself, I've dealt with corruption in it too much to hold it in much esteem), and the ONLY part of it that such people still have respect for is, well, you.

So when you deal with the dregs of society, don't forget that there's still the rest of society that trusts, supports, and respects you, and to them you're the good guys. Let's not lose focus here

Unless one of you violates that trust, of course, and that's where the outrage comes from. An often misdirected outrage, unfortunately.
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  #21  
Old 09-23-2009, 9:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 696k View Post
I was driving my unit back home after a memorial for a K9 (SBSO I think) that was killed tracking a rape suspect out in the high desert. My partner was in the back seat sleeping soundly & I was dwelling on how I would feel if I'd lost him in the line of duty.

Anyway I was cruising about 65mph. This was the days of the silly 55 only speed limit. Anyway any one who has ever driven a black & white on the freeway and stuck to the speed limit knows what it does to traffic. It backs up because everyone is afraid to go past you...( well most everyone)

Anyway I'm cruising along in the #1 lane and all of a sudden this VW van comes blowing up on my passengers side. Looking over I see this uh..."citizen" has his window down and is screaming something at me. I roll down my window thinking maybe theres an accident behind me, he needs help or maybe he needed directions to a barber for that ponytail he needed to have cut off... Nope, Mr. Tie-dyed is screaming at me "55 Officer! The speed limit is 55!!!" then showing me all five fingers...

After the days events I was less than tolerant. Before I really thought about it I raised my right hand, smiled at him and flipped him off with the most professional bird I could. I must admit his expression was priceless.

I drove back to my Dept and notified my Sgt. what I had done, a preemptive "mea culpa" as it were. He just shook his head...
Mr. tie-dyed never did call in to complain. He's probably still traumatized to this day. I was lucky but I was wrong and it was once again a perfect example of: "If it feels good saying it, I probably shouldn't have."
You understood what you did was wrong, and that shows great strength of character.
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  #22  
Old 09-26-2009, 10:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by haodoken View Post
how many have taken in people in for PC 415(3) to stop fights between people before the 415(1) starts?
415 (2) usually gets me after eating some types of ethnic food and getting gas
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  #23  
Old 10-09-2009, 6:12 PM
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I don't condone anyone flipping off anyone. It's a rude gesture, one that I feel really has no place in our society. My opinion only.

Turby
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  #24  
Old 10-09-2009, 8:59 PM
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Showing the infamous finger to the police is generally a bad idea, even if it is protected speech.

I remember a real case when I was in law school and clerking. It was the New Year's celebration in Santa Rosa and just after midnight police had broken up a fight and were sorting out the participants, then seated on the curb. Genious runs up, yells "F U" at the officer and waves a middle finger salute. He immediately runs away at full gallop. (I wonder just what did he think was going to happen next?) The officer follows, also at full gallop, and quickly tackles and apprehends our genious who had been making with the hand gestures. In his pocket is a Buck lock-blade knife with the blade extended in the locked position.

Result: Genious is charged with a felony for possession of a dirk or dagger. He admitted he was carrying the knife for "protection" and legally that is all it takes to make the charge stick. Oh yes, that was before I saw the light, the motion to suppress evidence I filed was denied. Genious was on the hook for a felony: he was felony stupid.
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