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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #1  
Old 08-21-2009, 10:16 PM
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Default Nordyke: en banc Oral Arguments 9/24 10AM

All,

Nordyke's oral argument will be the morning of September 24 at 10AM. Sykes oral argument is at 2PM in Sacramento on the 24th.

Charter buses from SF to Sacto will be in the works. If anyone has a plane they can volunteer to move counsel from the SF to Sacto, please email me at hoffmang at hoffmang dot com.

-Gene
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  #2  
Old 08-21-2009, 10:17 PM
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Looking forward to it...got it on the calendar...

--Neill
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Old 08-21-2009, 10:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hoffmang View Post
All,

Nordyke's oral argument will be the morning of September 24 at 10AM. Sykes oral argument is at 2PM in Sacramento on the 24th.

Charter buses from SF to Sacto will be in the works. If anyone has a plane they can volunteer to move counsel from the SF to Sacto, please email me at hoffmang at hoffmang dot com.

-Gene
Are the times and dates a coincidence?
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  #4  
Old 08-21-2009, 10:34 PM
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Nordyke updated on the Wiki
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  #5  
Old 08-21-2009, 10:36 PM
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If no plane avail can we charter?
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  #6  
Old 08-21-2009, 10:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wildhawker View Post
If no plane avail can we charter?
By plane I was meaning charter.

I'm thinking we want to get the legal team to Sacramento with time to spare for the 2PM hearing. Nordyke should only take an hour but there are no guarantees it doesn't run 30 minutes over. That's enough time for the rest of us to get in a charter bus/cars and get to the hearing in Sacramento, but I want to make sure that the legal team can attend both with no risks of being late to Sacramento.

Now, there is a small chance that the 2PM Sacramento hearing could change...

-Gene
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  #7  
Old 08-21-2009, 10:47 PM
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I assume this has been looked into, but I do wonder if a chartered plane will save much time -- from SOMA you've either got to drive south to an airport, or north across a bridge to an airport.

Having a van+driver on standby outside the 9th Circuit might be the fastest way to convey counsel to Sacramento.

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  #8  
Old 08-21-2009, 10:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trashman View Post
I assume this has been looked into, but I do wonder if a chartered plane will save much time -- from SOMA you've either got to drive south to an airport, or north across a bridge to an airport.

Having a van+driver on standby outside the 9th Circuit might be the fastest way to convey counsel to Sacramento.

--Neill
Except if there is a vehicle accident on the way to Sacramento the traffic will be horrible.
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  #9  
Old 08-21-2009, 10:52 PM
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Both Sacramento International (hah!) and Executive airport (Freeport Blvd) to downtown court (501 I Street) is about 20 minutes, according to Google.

Helicopter from downtown to SFO?
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There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.


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Last edited by Librarian; 08-21-2009 at 10:55 PM..
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  #10  
Old 08-21-2009, 10:54 PM
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Wonder if we could get a CHP escort...

-Gene
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  #11  
Old 08-21-2009, 10:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by truthseeker View Post
Except if there is a vehicle accident on the way to Sacramento the traffic will be horrible.
Yep.

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  #12  
Old 08-22-2009, 3:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by truthseeker View Post
Except if there is a vehicle accident on the way to Sacramento the traffic will be horrible.


Do what I do: Motorcycle! When the traffic is bad, there's nothing like "white lining" to get to where you want to be. Its even kind of fun.

The Raisuli
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  #13  
Old 08-22-2009, 3:41 AM
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I wish I could be there.
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  #14  
Old 08-22-2009, 4:16 AM
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If you guys get a big-*** bus to charter and don't want to hire the driver (if that is possible), I can be a driver!

I'm being dead serious too!

Last edited by pullnshoot25; 08-22-2009 at 4:41 AM..
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  #15  
Old 08-22-2009, 4:21 AM
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CGF will have an airforce now?
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Old 08-22-2009, 4:22 AM
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CGF will have an airforce now?
Is that covered in the militia?

Gentlemen, I might be able to make it that day. Hot friggin diggity.
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  #17  
Old 08-22-2009, 6:50 AM
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San Francisco (SFO) seems to be the closest airport to the court no matter what.

In Sacramento, to those familiar, I'd ask which one poses the least amount of traffic risk: Sacramento International, or Executive. Rio Linda says more like 20, so...which one poses the least amount of risk or traffic?

I can fly people from SFO to Sacramento - in my Turbo Mooney it's around 27 minutes flight time. If someone thinks more than 2-3 people need to be flown, I can probably talk to someone who owns a charter company and is 2A friendly.

Gene, contact me anytime...
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  #18  
Old 08-22-2009, 7:07 AM
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Quote:
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I can fly people from SFO to Sacramento - in my Turbo Mooney it's around 27 minutes flight time.
Yeah!! Mooney FTW. Love those planes...

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  #19  
Old 08-22-2009, 7:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by truthseeker View Post
Except if there is a vehicle accident on the way to Sacramento the traffic will be horrible.
If? Hah!
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  #20  
Old 08-22-2009, 7:55 AM
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Sac airport to downtown is the best. It's about 8-10 miles out on I-5.

I might be able to pick up counsel team from the airport in our mini-van. How many will need a ride from airport to courthouse?
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  #21  
Old 08-22-2009, 8:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by glbtrottr View Post
San Francisco (SFO) seems to be the closest airport to the court no matter what.

In Sacramento, to those familiar, I'd ask which one poses the least amount of traffic risk: Sacramento International, or Executive. Rio Linda says more like 20, so...which one poses the least amount of risk or traffic?

I can fly people from SFO to Sacramento - in my Turbo Mooney it's around 27 minutes flight time. If someone thinks more than 2-3 people need to be flown, I can probably talk to someone who owns a charter company and is 2A friendly.

Gene, contact me anytime...
So RAD! I love surgical strike stuff like this
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  #22  
Old 08-22-2009, 8:10 AM
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Do we know who's sitting on the en banc panel yet?
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Old 08-22-2009, 8:17 AM
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Do we know who's sitting on the en banc panel yet?
I don't know if anyone has any other source of info, but it appears the court website doesn't list the panel members till after arguments are heard, even though the panel is already selected.
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  #24  
Old 08-22-2009, 8:40 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bulgron View Post
Do we know who's sitting on the en banc panel yet?
The Panel has not yet been announced. You can track it here: http://www.ca9.uscourts.gov/enbanc/v..._id=0000000037

-Gene
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Old 08-22-2009, 8:42 AM
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Heads up to anyone coming to this (legal team included) who's not familiar with this area: parking can be somewhat...competitive. Leave some time to walk a ways if needed, because you may end up parking blocks away.
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Old 08-22-2009, 8:51 AM
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All, I am on vacation at this time and available to meet the Legal team at any airport in Sac and transport them to the front door of the courthouse for drop-off service. I will park and come in after dropping them off. I have a Toyota Sienna 7 seater. Please let me know if I can help.

Also, for the pilot: Have you considered Smith Ranch or Gnoss in Marin? They aren't too far up the road and there is no class B or SFO air traffic to worry about.


PM me if I can be of service!
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Old 08-22-2009, 9:02 AM
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^^^ Between you and me, we have it covered between Sac airport and downtown. I can carry six additional to me. First priority goes to legal team. Others will be in second van etc.
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Old 08-22-2009, 9:09 AM
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If Sykes went beautifully and the district court found that personal protection was sufficient justification for issue of a CCW in the two counties involved, what would be the impact in other California jurisdictions?

Could I then apply to the City of Riverside, which likewise has written policy stating the self protection is insufficient cause, citing Sykes and would they be legally bound to grant me a license?

If not, what would be the legal path from a good outcome in Sykes to California essentially becoming a shall issue state?
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Old 08-22-2009, 9:15 AM
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CA9
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Old 08-22-2009, 9:16 AM
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Quote:
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^^^ Between you and me, we have it covered between Sac airport and downtown. I can carry six additional to me. First priority goes to legal team. Others will be in second van etc.
Sounds Awesome! Just glad I can help out. Let me know when and where and I'll be there. Already let the Wife know to save the date. So how do we orchestrate this? Who do I PM with my contact info? My van has 6 seats available also, 7 with driver.
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Old 08-22-2009, 9:26 AM
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It does look like we're leaning ground transport for all but I will be checking in with the pilots.

Note that Sykes Oral Argument may be very brief and it's a virtual certainty that no merits decision will be made that day.

-Gene
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  #32  
Old 08-22-2009, 9:33 AM
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Gene, there are repaving projects happening all over highway 80. Just something to consider when time may be short and caltrans stands between where you are and where you need to go.

Also, If you need ground between SF and SAC, I can do that too. Just let me know.
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Old 08-22-2009, 9:39 AM
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Check the Caltans sched closure list, should be avail. online. If not I'll get it from their TMC.
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Old 08-22-2009, 9:48 AM
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Looks like most of the upcoming work that is expected to impact traffic is going to be east of SAC on 80. However, I drive between SF and Fairfield at least 4 times a week and there is major roadwork happening between Fairfield and Vacaville. It hasn't seemed to impact my commute though. Just be advised it's there.
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Old 08-22-2009, 10:58 AM
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Have access to aircraft and, ahem "Expedited" ground transport at both locations. glbtrottr your mooney is probably faster than even the twin I was planning on - let's talk.

Working on a police escort to both airports and/or along the ground. If you are in LE in either CHP or either locality please contact me on that front.
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Old 08-22-2009, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sfpcservice View Post
Gene, there are repaving projects happening all over highway 80. Just something to consider when time may be short and caltrans stands between where you are and where you need to go. ...
On that note, not only are there highway construction projects going on through I-80, but off ramps at highway interchanges may be closed off. If checking on construction, you may want to also ask about ramp closures. Hopefully such closures only happens at night.

For those going through Livermore and Lodi, I-680 through Pleasanton & I-580 through Livermore and up the Altamont is a mess with construction, and it could be very slow. I-205 through Tracy has just been widened, but it's not completely done yet.

Division of Traffic Operations - Road Information - California Highway Information

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  #37  
Old 08-22-2009, 1:11 PM
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You can get an actual list of planned closures by hwy, postmile and lane no.
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Old 08-22-2009, 1:22 PM
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Just remember that if you can't use SFO with that Turbo Mooney, there's San Carlos Airport (SQL)...
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Old 08-22-2009, 2:17 PM
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Default Water route?

Would it be legal to parachute down to the courthouse in Sacramento?

Have you considered a water route? I think you can get all the way to Sacramento by water. But I also think there is a speed limit which might be much too low. If there is a no wake speed limit, a hovercraft may be able to travel at high speed with no wake.

A water route might also be good for the first or last segments of the trip. Maybe to get from downtown to SFO Airport, or just across the bay. Surely there are plenty of CalGuns members with speedboats to get you across the bay.

You might also be able to get use of a yacht or barge to land a helicopter on near downtown. Larry Ellison has a yacht with TWO hellipads on it. I just cited that as trivia, I have no Idea if he supports the Second Amendment or if his yacht is anywhere nearby.

An amphibious seaplane is another possible option. Alaska is in the Ninth Circuit isn't it? There are lots of amphibs in Alaska. Maybe you can get some Alaskan to volunteer to fly down to visit his family and give the legal team a ride while he's down here. It might be legal to land in one of the canals in Sacramento, closer to the courthouse than an airport.

If you choose to drive, do they still have a ferry in San Francisco? That might be an alternate or more reliable route than the bridges. I thought I heard a story a while back about how the ferry became real popular while they were doing some work on a bridge. It's probably slow though.

Is BART reliable? Being able to bypass traffic gives it that potential. Though the execution of such things tends to fall far short of the potential.

It's a fun intellectual exercise, but all the elaborate plans above are probably overkill because it's probably sufficient to just have some guys on motorcycles follow the caravan in case you hit a traffic jam.

Last edited by MindBuilder; 08-22-2009 at 2:22 PM.. Reason: Added hovercraft possibility
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  #40  
Old 08-22-2009, 2:18 PM
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Running the Delta really isn't a useful option.

We'll most likely just have ground transportation set up with an advance departure in case the en banc runs over for some of the attorneys.

-Gene
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