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  #1  
Old 08-21-2009, 6:48 AM
kanga123 kanga123 is offline
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Default Difficulty in FFL transfer

I am attempting to have a M1A w/muzzle brake and 10 rnd clip transferred to me from a seller (private party) in AL (through gunbroker.com). The FFL has indicated that the seller needs to provide a color copy of his DL in order for him to receive. The seller advises it is not necessary for the transfer. The local FFL refuses. What is the private parties responsibility in a sale of this nature?
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Old 08-21-2009, 6:56 AM
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halifax halifax is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kanga123 View Post
I am attempting to have a M1A w/muzzle brake and 10 rnd clip transferred to me from a seller (private party) in AL (through gunbroker.com). The FFL has indicated that the seller needs to provide a color copy of his DL in order for him to receive. The seller advises it is not necessary for the transfer. The local FFL refuses. What is the private parties responsibility in a sale of this nature?
Although not necessary for the transfer, the CA FFL has the last word. I will only accept from private parties who provide a legible copy of their DL. Makes it much easier to document for the A/D book.
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Old 08-21-2009, 7:05 AM
kanga123 kanga123 is offline
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Brings me pause as to why the seller is not complying.
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Old 08-21-2009, 7:44 AM
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tenpercentfirearms tenpercentfirearms is offline
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The FFL can require whatever the FFL wants or the FFL can simply refuse the transfer.

Now that I think about it, I never require a DL on guns shipped to me. I just write down their address. I guess if it is stolen that won't upset me too much as you paid for it and I didn't. I suppose on guns I am buying I would want to have a copy of that DL, but when it is your dime on the line, I don't care so much.

So you might want to reconsider the deal not knowing if you are buying stolen goods nor not. If it seems like too good of a deal to be true, it probably is.
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Old 08-21-2009, 9:27 AM
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kemasa kemasa is offline
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Getting a copy of the drivers license makes it easier to show who it actually came from. The FFL has a choice in whether to accept firearms from non-FFLs, so if the seller does not want to provide a copy, then they can ship it through a FFL. It is easier to keep a copy of the drivers license than part of the shipping label (it is nice to have something to show where it came from). There are some FFLs who refused to accept firearms from non-FFLs at all.

It is the responsibility of the seller to provide documentation as to where the firearm is coming from. To be honest, if the seller refuses, I would question what is actually going on. If the person is law enforcement or the like, they might not want to provide a copy of their drivers license, which is understandable.
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Old 08-21-2009, 6:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kemasa View Post
It is the responsibility of the seller to provide documentation as to where the firearm is coming from. To be honest, if the seller refuses, I would question what is actually going on. If the person is law enforcement or the like, they might not want to provide a copy of their drivers license, which is understandable.
In my state, the photo is digitized. If you verify the photo is the guy holding it then the state has a copy. If the license is forged you are out of luck unless you have a copy. Color is better.

If it is law enforcement, you should be able to get a copy of their badge or ID, unless they are not uniformed in which case they do not care to have their photo floating around. If you are going to accept any form of ID you need to know what a real one looks like. In the cases where I have interfaced with the FBI and the Secret Service I have been handed the document to heft, sniff, peer at. The SS is two pages opened up in a thick velvet book cover trimmed in like thin gold rope or something. It was pretty awesome. They are the politest people you have ever met. Unless you get on their bad side I guess.

I am going to add that any agent should be willing to be photographed right there in your shop. Why not? The photo will be secured in an ATF approved storage facility for guns. If the guy is the local FBI agent, he does not want his picture in the paper but he should be willing to put one under your custody, where it would be a crime for you to furnish it to the public.

Last edited by billslugg; 08-21-2009 at 6:06 PM.. Reason: Added last paragraph
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Old 08-21-2009, 6:51 PM
kanga123 kanga123 is offline
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The seller has agreed to send copy of DL w/firearm shipment. Obviously once I have paid for it. Is this acceptable. Bear in mind, I have never had to transfer a rifle or handgun accross state line via FFL before. Excuse my ignorance.
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Old 08-21-2009, 7:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kanga123 View Post
The seller has agreed to send copy of DL w/firearm shipment. Obviously once I have paid for it. Is this acceptable. Bear in mind, I have never had to transfer a rifle or handgun accross state line via FFL before. Excuse my ignorance.
It honestly is up to your receiving FFL. Whatever they want. I do not know if there is any requirement for identificaton for a shipment or not.
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  #9  
Old 08-22-2009, 11:04 AM
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kemasa kemasa is offline
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FYI:

http://ag.ca.gov/firearms/hscfaqs.php#c4

4. It is illegal to photocopy federal credentials. How do I retain a copy of the proof of exemption documentation for individuals with federal credentials?

For individuals with federal credentials record the person's name, federal agency, and credential number rather than photocopying the credentials.

See also:

http://www4.law.cornell.edu/uscode/18/701.html
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