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  #1  
Old 05-28-2009, 1:32 PM
coder44mag coder44mag is offline
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Default New to 870, how to build a tactical?

I don't own a shotgun, but I would like to build an 870 with an 18" in barrel with either a Knoxx collapsible stock and pistol grip or similar brand (possibly a Command Arms).

Remington has a lot of 870s and by their website, most have an MSRP of over $450. So I think I need to pickup a basic 870 express at Big 5, Walmart or local shop for a good price.

My questions are: do all the inexpensive 870s come in 18"? Do they typically come in black, synthetic, wood, etc?

How come some 870s have a choke tube (?) that is the same length as the barrel, and how do I get that?

Any reading recommendations for newbies is appreciated.

Here is my ideal setup:


or

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  #2  
Old 05-28-2009, 1:50 PM
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no not all the basic 870's are 18". they also come in 20" and 24/26" i think. but as far as ive seen the 20" and 18" ones are always black/ synthetic stocks. The longer barreled 870's have removable chokes so that you can interchange them for hunting purposes. the shorter barrels are not threaded and so are fixed with i believe an improved cylinder(?). The 20" inch version holds one more shot than the 18".
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Old 05-28-2009, 1:52 PM
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btw, chokes control the spread of the shot fired. the tighter (read smaller inside diameter) the choke the less the shot will spread over a given distance. Sounded like you werent sure of what they are. HTH
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  #4  
Old 05-28-2009, 2:00 PM
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You do know that there is a Remington 870 Tactical Pump Shotgun that is already outfitted with a Knoxx Spec-Ops Stock, all you'll need is a light, sling & heatshield to make it look like the pic that you posted. I saw one for $599.
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  #5  
Old 05-28-2009, 2:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ThatFishGuy View Post
no not all the basic 870's are 18". they also come in 20" and 24/26" i think. but as far as ive seen the 20" and 18" ones are always black/ synthetic stocks. The longer barreled 870's have removable chokes so that you can interchange them for hunting purposes. the shorter barrels are not threaded and so are fixed with i believe an improved cylinder(?). The 20" inch version holds one more shot than the 18".
IIRC, the 18" barrels are smooth bore, so no choke.

To the OP: You will not regret the knoxx spec-ops stock with the recoil suppression. If you're going to run buckshot or slugs, it's a must have.
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  #6  
Old 05-28-2009, 2:56 PM
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Big5 will have sales on 870 Express 18" or 20" (usually alternate sale weeks) for $349.99. The 18" holds 6+1 and the 20" will hold 7+1. I'd rather sacrifice 2" and get an extra shot so I got the 20".
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  #7  
Old 05-28-2009, 3:00 PM
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I would skip the ATI heat shield personally.
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  #8  
Old 05-28-2009, 3:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackwater OPS View Post
I would skip the ATI heat shield personally.
I agree.
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Old 05-28-2009, 3:39 PM
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Here is an article explaining almost everything I wanted to know. Remington tries to prevent magazine tube extensions via dimples on the 870 express. Also a few other problems with the 870 Express when trying to a build a tactical home defense gun.

Sounds like their lame attempt at making you buy the Marine Magnum or Police models. This pisses me off.


http://members.tripod.com/~jth8260/870.html
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  #10  
Old 05-28-2009, 3:50 PM
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The guy who wrote that is a mossy lover. Takes all of 5 mins to remove the dimples. One extractor has always worked for me. Getting your finger pinched by the shell lifter, what are you a girl.

He makes a few valid points but I'll still take a remmy over a mossy.
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  #11  
Old 05-28-2009, 4:25 PM
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haha good to know. I always thought they were in the down position!

anyways, got any recommendations on where to buy? I live on the peninsula and it seems like places in Sacramento always have good deals where they don't screw you (River City, Wild Sports, Newtown Firearms).

Here on the peninsula, I never know how much I'm being screwed unless I really shop around. Imbert and Smithers wanted $750 for an XD9 and $560 for an XD 40cal. The 40cal seemed like a fine price, but come on, $200 premium on the 9?
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  #12  
Old 05-28-2009, 5:08 PM
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There is one issue that the article doesn't mention when converting an Express into a "tactical" shotgun.

The magazine cap on the Express is not retained by a detent on the barrel loop the way that Wingmasters and Police models are. The Express magazine spring cap has two grooves that engage the dimples in the magazine tube (the ones you'll grind down if you want an extended magazine). That keeps the spring cap from rotating. The magazine cap has matching detent grooves on its inner face that engage the spring cap, keeping the magazine cap from unscrewing under recoil/vibration. Removing the dimples removes the mag cap detent. Having your barrel loosen can and will create headspace issues, difficult slide operation, and in one case that I personally observed, the magazine cap loosening enough that firing forces sheared the barrel loop off the barrel, launching the barrel downrange. Not a pretty picture.

On older Express models, Remington shaved a few cents by simply not installing the detent and spring on the barrel loop. Newer Express barrels, I've been told, eliminated the detent hole entirely. If the Express you're thinking about buying has a barrel with the detent hole drilled, Brownell's sells the detent, spring, and correct punch to install it. I just bought those items to do an Express barrel and the cost was $27.18 and about two minutes to install the parts. If it doesn't have the detent hole, you install an extension at your own risk. You could shop around for a barrel, but by the time you're done, you'll have spent enough that you could probably find a Police model for the same or less money.

I just got done converting an Express into a "tactical" shotgun by installing an 18" rifle sighted barrel and +2 magazine extension. The only reason that it was worth my while to do so is that I already had the barrel in my safe, and I bought the Express at an estate sale a couple of years ago for $200. Otherwise, I'd have sold it and bought a Police model.

If there's anything you want to ask about the process or want pics, PM me and I'll be happy to oblige.
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  #13  
Old 05-28-2009, 5:57 PM
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You should go shoot go rent a gun and shoot skeet to get familiar with a shotgun. Then you'll have a better understanding of what you want. All you really need is a bead, you don't need to spend money on rifle sites or ghost rings.

Grumpy makes a good point on the express, but nothing with 10 minutes with a dremel won't fix. I've seen the problem of mag caps having the tendancy to loosen, but if you get high quality mag extension like a scattergun tech or remington OEM, you shouldn't have a problem, but I have observed the problem with lower end like tacstar parts.

I recommend a traditional stock, I personally have a hogue stock (shortest length of pull available) and it adds real estate for me to add a buttcuff with an extra seven rounds.
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  #14  
Old 05-28-2009, 6:05 PM
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I picked up my 870 at big 5 for $369+fees.
see "zombie stoper" on youtube for a step by step mod vid.
sorry i would attach the link but i am at work and cannot access youtube.
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  #15  
Old 05-28-2009, 8:07 PM
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Thanks for the info. I've shot a Benelli Nova and SuperNova, as well as a Remington and Ithaca.

I ultimately decided on a tactical/shorter gun rather than a longer bird gun since I don't plan on hunting.
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  #16  
Old 05-29-2009, 12:56 AM
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dont get one with a collapsable stock...

gets flimsy.

i have a 2 year old remmie 870 tacticool. i wished i woulda gotten the solid stock tacticool version instead.
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  #17  
Old 05-29-2009, 7:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coder44mag View Post
Thanks for the info. I've shot a Benelli Nova and SuperNova, as well as a Remington and Ithaca.

I ultimately decided on a tactical/shorter gun rather than a longer bird gun since I don't plan on hunting.
See thats where your wrong. The remington 870 combo package, 20 inch adn 28 inch barrels might be good for you. How do you plan on practicing with your shotgun? Contrary to popular belief you have to aim with a shotgun. And what better way to train than to shoot some skeet! If you can hit a moving speeding clay pigeon 20 yards away (and by the way, all you need is a bead site, if fact its harder to shoot clay with ghost rings!) out of the air thats all the shotgun skills you need, you don't need to look tacticool. Shooting a washing machine downrange is not shotgun training
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  #18  
Old 05-29-2009, 10:12 AM
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Originally Posted by sd1023x View Post
See thats where your wrong. The remington 870 combo package, 20 inch adn 28 inch barrels might be good for you. How do you plan on practicing with your shotgun? Contrary to popular belief you have to aim with a shotgun. And what better way to train than to shoot some skeet! If you can hit a moving speeding clay pigeon 20 yards away (and by the way, all you need is a bead site, if fact its harder to shoot clay with ghost rings!) out of the air thats all the shotgun skills you need, you don't need to look tacticool. Shooting a washing machine downrange is not shotgun training
The combo package sounds like a good idea. I've shot clay casually since I was 14 so I don't really care about fancy sights. Is the 18" barrel that bad for shooting clay though?

I like the 18" for looks and size though. Ultimately, I would like to have both a tacticool 18" and a very nice traditional looking gun such as a double barrel or something with some class.
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  #19  
Old 05-29-2009, 11:07 AM
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Originally Posted by coder44mag View Post
The combo package sounds like a good idea. I've shot clay casually since I was 14 so I don't really care about fancy sights. Is the 18" barrel that bad for shooting clay though?

I like the 18" for looks and size though. Ultimately, I would like to have both a tacticool 18" and a very nice traditional looking gun such as a double barrel or something with some class.
Ive tried, but found the 18 incher's lacks ummph to hit a clay at a standard skeet range unless you hit the sucker win a second of being flung.

You know, the combo package is hard to find, but you should just get a standard express with a 28 inch barrel. something like this, http://gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewIte...Item=130248867. The 18.5 inch barrel for the remington can be had brand new from www.midwayusa.com for 100-130 bucks. Also from midway you can get the scattergun tech +2 mag extension w/hi vis follower and extra duty spring. Do it the other way, get the 18 inch first, and u find you want an 28 inch barrel later, the 28 inch barrel is closer to $200.
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  #20  
Old 05-29-2009, 11:09 AM
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forget that gunbroker link... check this one

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/p...ducts_id/95589

buds gun shop does business in CA, so you can get it sent to your local FFL
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  #21  
Old 08-04-2009, 9:57 AM
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Have you considered the #81198 870 package...?

Around $450... gives you a nice head start for the money...

Tactical barrel with XS front blade sight and Rem Choke Tactical extended ported choke tube. XS Ghost Ring sight rail mounts to the receiver. Sight is fully adjustable for windage and elevation. Factory installed two shot extension. Receiver is milled from a solid block of billet steel. Cycling is regulated by non-binding twin action bars. Black synthetic stock w/SuperCell pad and tactical style forend with sling swivel studs installed.



Action Pump
Gauge 12 GA
Barrel Length 18 1/2"
Capacity 6 + 1
Chamber 3"
Length 39"
Weight 7 1/2 lbs
Drop 1 1/2" @ Comb & 2 1/2" @ Heel
Stock Synthetic
Finish Black
Ghost Ring Sights

Hogue #556440 OverMolded Tamer Pistol Grip and Forend Remington 870 12 Gauge Rubber Black


Hogue Shotgun Stocks are molded from a fiberglass-reinforced polymer assuring stability and accuracy. Non-slip stocks are durable, weatherproof and extremely comfortable with a standard length of pull of 14-1/4" or with a shorter 12" length of pull for small shooters or for use with body armor. The Tamer grip provides hours of comfort and recoil protection with it's Sorbothane insert, palm swells and finger grooves.

Here it is:







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Old 08-04-2009, 10:12 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sd1023x View Post
forget that gunbroker link... check this one

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/p...ducts_id/95589

buds gun shop does business in CA, so you can get it sent to your local FFL

Yeah, +1 on Buds for sure.
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Old 08-04-2009, 11:18 AM
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Thats nice but Too fancy/complicated. I bought a 28" Express when it was on sale since I needed it for my once a year hunt Quail. Later I Picked up a 18" riot barrel on Ebay for $25.00. Kept it stock since I prefer wood. I would like to put one of those skinny slim police forearm stocks on it but I can only find plastic ones, no wood..
I'd rather just spend the money on ammo and Zombie targets anyway :O)
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Old 08-04-2009, 4:41 PM
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There are no problems building a tactical shotgun on any 870 including the Express model. There is only one 870 and they differ only by finish, furniture and a couple small parts. The detents on the Express 4+1 model drill out easily and there are no detents on the Express 6+1 model. So it is the same as any other 870 except for those few small parts I mentioned. Any 870 you buy will make a perfect platform to build the weapon you want. Also, you got some bad information above about Remington barrels. They no longer make an 18" they are all 18.5" even though the parts list states 18" and if you call there the cubical clown will tell you they are 18" but when it arrives it will have grown 1/2". Also, the 18.5 comes in Cly Bore, I/C, Modified or you can get one that is threaded for Rem Choke tubes.
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Old 08-04-2009, 6:17 PM
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Yes, dimples are BS, but 10 minutes with a dremel will smooth them out.

From a basic 870 express with 26/28 inch barrel, www.midwayusa.com has alot of the stuff your gonna need:

1. 18.5 inch barrel
2. Wilson Combat\Remington OEM +2 extension (dunno about remington, but wilson comes with new spring and hi vis follower)
3. If you must have pistol grip, a speedfeed stock set (length of buttstock would be your comfort choice)
4. There are some crazy capacity side saddles (thanks to the three gun guys), and size and capacity would be your choice
something like this....

And I think you'll have a pretty slick shotty
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Old 08-04-2009, 7:50 PM
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This is what an 870 should look like...



You don't need $400 worth of mall ninja crap on a $300 gun. Federal H132-00 doesn't recoil that much. Buy some ammo and shoot the thing. Take the $400 and shoot 60 rounds of skeet or take a defensive shotgun class.
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Old 08-04-2009, 8:04 PM
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Originally Posted by 8200rpm View Post
This is what an 870 should look like...



You don't need $400 worth of mall ninja crap on a $300 gun. Federal H132-00 doesn't recoil that much. Buy some ammo and shoot the thing. Take the $400 and shoot 60 rounds of skeet or take a defensive shotgun class.
Rockin Stock...Love it. Thats all you need really.
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Old 08-04-2009, 8:08 PM
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I got a Knoxx collapsible stock it works great but i would like to have an ar style kit instead so i can put an ar grip on it
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Old 08-06-2009, 3:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackwater OPS View Post
I would skip the ATI heat shield personally.

I agree, If you want Ghost rings sights get a set that mounts to the reciever and barrel
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Old 08-06-2009, 4:15 PM
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Originally Posted by 8200rpm View Post

You don't need $400 worth of mall ninja crap on a $300 gun. Federal H132-00 doesn't recoil that much. Buy some ammo and shoot the thing. Take the $400 and shoot 60 rounds of skeet or take a defensive shotgun class.
I also agree with this as it is very good advice. If you take this approach it may not look as good to show off, but you'll still have as "tactical" as you need to have shotgun for defensive purposes.
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Old 08-06-2009, 5:13 PM
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Marking this for future reference.
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Old 08-06-2009, 8:39 PM
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Originally Posted by 1BigPea View Post
I agree.
Me three. But you have to get it out of your system. I had just a limbsaver on mine for the longest time. I've recently gotten a 6 shot side saddle and surefire forend, but the forend is too bulky and makes the gun heavy. So I have a hogue overmolded youth stock (shorter LOP) and forend on the way and I think that's about it.
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Old 08-07-2009, 4:50 AM
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Me three. But you have to get it out of your system. I had just a limbsaver on mine for the longest time. I've recently gotten a 6 shot side saddle and surefire forend, but the forend is too bulky and makes the gun heavy. So I have a hogue overmolded youth stock (shorter LOP) and forend on the way and I think that's about it.
You'll like that 12" LOP.
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Old 08-07-2009, 5:58 AM
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The one on the left is a 1977 Wingmaster from the Sacramento PD. $200. Had it refinished, forcing cone lengthened, and new springs installed. Tritium front bead, side saddle, Surefire rale, LaRue light. Basic speed feed short stock and a Wilsons +1 extension. Into it for about $600 including the light.

The one on the right is a 1955 Wingmaster that came with a 30" barrel. $150.
Picked up a 20" rifle sighted smooth bore for $75, had the forcing cone lengthened, and tossed in new springs. Hogue forearm, side saddle, Wilsons +1, and the same speed feed stock. Into it for under $400.

I'll take an old Wingmaster over a new Express any day of the week.
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  #35  
Old 08-07-2009, 7:17 AM
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I like to keep anything forward of the receiver as it came from the factory ( Just less weight...less to grab...less to catch on obstacles...etc ) .

I just added a couple of things.....the Knoxx stock with the powerpak cheek piece.....a small red dot sight ....and a very small light.

The light sticks no further out to the left then the ammo carrier on the Knoxx sticks out to the right...very nice close fit.

The receiver mount threads were tapped into the soft aluminum , so I drilled the holes and used stainless steel inserts and new stainless shoulder bolts as well ( Of course I had to swap out the Daniel Defense bolt to stainless as well )










Last edited by shadowofnight; 02-07-2010 at 10:21 PM..
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  #36  
Old 08-07-2009, 7:58 AM
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lunde lunde is offline
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This is my idea of the ideal Remington 870 configuration for those times when one hears a bump in the night...

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  #37  
Old 08-08-2009, 8:42 PM
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Originally Posted by lunde View Post
This is my idea of the ideal Remington 870 configuration for those times when one hears a bump in the night...

Whoa, does it reach minimum length?

I think I need one of those.
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  #38  
Old 08-08-2009, 11:40 PM
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Originally Posted by prc77 View Post
You'll like that 12" LOP.
I do...not a fan of the recoil pad though...I could immediately tell the difference between the hogue pad and the limbsaver...suggestions?
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  #39  
Old 08-09-2009, 10:22 PM
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Originally Posted by TheOriginalFlavor View Post
Remington SuperCell
Does it fit the hogue youth stock? I tried putting my limbsaver on it and it was slightly too big.
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