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Rimfire Firearms .22, .17 and other Rimfire Handguns and Rifles

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  #1  
Old 05-10-2009, 3:16 PM
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Default Inquiry: Spikes Tactical ST-22 complete rifle

I stumbled across several threads showing complete ST-22 rifles and started drooling. Doing some searching around in the forums and elsewhere trying to find more information I got more and more confused.

Some mentioned using these as conversions for their current AR-style rifles while others reference building dedicated models. So I took a quick trip over to Spikes to see what they had and while I consider myself a non-newbie I could not find any particular kit that would allow for a dedicated rifle except for the upper kit and just the lower body with no parts in it.

So, I'm hoping that many of you who have gone over this ground before can help. Here's what I'm trying to find out:

1. Exactly what parts, besides the obvious upper and lower, would be needed in building up a ST-22?

2. Based upon previous builds what is a rough estimate of the cost involved? I managed to find some archived auctions on Gunbroker that put the cost in the $1100 range but not sure if that was a markup due to demand or something else.

3. How difficult would this be for someone to do who has little or no experience with AR-style rifles?

4. Or am I just plain crazy wishing for one of these and would be better off sticking with a .22lr pistol? ^_^


As always all input on these questions is appreciated.
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  #2  
Old 05-10-2009, 3:33 PM
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The only thing different between a regular AR upper and a dedicated upper is the .22lr barrel and the .22lr conversion kit.

If you already have an AR, it would be cheaper to just buy the conversion kit that is offered from various manufacturers like Spikes, Cmmg, & Ciener. The going rate for these kits average at about 200 or less including 1 10 round mag while dedicated uppers go for 600+. Each has its own benefits.

Difficulty..there is none. If you buy a dedicated upper, all you need is a complete lower receiver and you are good to go. If you get the conversion kit, all you have to do is remove your standard BCG and slide in the new conversion kit with a .22lr magazine and you are done.

Hope this helps!.

Edit:

Here is spikes dedicated upper
http://www.spikestactical.com/z/inde...roducts_id=116

conversion kit
http://www.spikestactical.com/z/inde...roducts_id=176

Last edited by Arteel; 05-10-2009 at 3:37 PM..
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  #3  
Old 05-10-2009, 4:14 PM
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Some folks claim that the differences in bore size and twist in .223 barrels vs. a dedicated .22LR barrel give an edge to a .22LR barrel. I don't know this to be true or not, but many have said the AR15 twist and bore size (223 vs 222 dia.) do not maximize accuracy for a .22LR bullet. Again, I'm echoing things I heard...I cannot confirm this.

I bought a complete Spike's .22, even though I have AR's here, because it was more convenient to have a dedicated .22 rather than swapping uppers or dropping in a Ceiner kit every time I wanted to shoot rimfire. Plus, I liked the idea of having a lower marked ".22LR."

Give Spike's a call. Their staff is knowledgeable and helpful. I, too, was confused a little by their website when I was thinking about having them build me a complete rifle. A couple of calls and I knew what I wanted and placed my order. I opted for the Lothar Walther barrel.

If you opt for a Spike's .22LR upper, you can send your lower to them and they will tune the setup for a fee (I think $50.00) so that they can guarantee function and reliability. Sometimes AR15 recoil springs need a little tweak to work with a .22 BCG and sometimes the mag catches need clearancing to work with various .22 mags based on the Ceiner design.

When my Spike's .22 was delivered and I checked it out, I knew I made the right choice.

Last edited by eltee; 05-10-2009 at 4:22 PM..
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Old 05-10-2009, 4:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eltee View Post
I bought a complete Spike's .22, even though I have AR's here, because it was more convenient to have a dedicated .22 rather than swapping uppers or dropping in a Ceiner kit every time I wanted to shoot rimfire. Plus, I liked the idea of having a lower marked ".22LR."

Give Spike's a call. Their staff is knowledgeable and helpful. I, too, was confused a little by their website when I was thinking about having them build me a complete rifle. A couple of calls and I knew what I wanted and placed my order. I opted for the Lothar Walther barrel.
Where exactly did you purchase the complete rifle from? I've tried digging around and all I find are links for people who use the upper's for their current AR-style rifles or expired auctions from Gunbroker.

I'll drop them an email tonight and hopefully they can shed some light on things for me since this would satisfy my AR craving without breaking the bank. ^_^
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Old 05-10-2009, 4:55 PM
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Actually you will be spending about the same amount vs a standard AR. The lower assembly is the same and the upper costs 600+. Overall you will have about a grand invested or more.
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Old 05-10-2009, 5:23 PM
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It's really not to hard to build a rifle yourself. You can put the lower together with a few simple hand tools. And buy a .22 dedicated upper. the upper needs a few specialized tools to put together, that's why I personally bought a complete upper.

a few companies now make .22lr dedicated uppers.
Spikes
CMMG
Tacsol

If you give Spikes or CMMG a call I'm sure they can build you a complete rifle.

I built mine for a little over $1000, but I bought a limited edition lower from spikes which cost a little more. if you're on a budget look around for good deals and build yourself a rifle to your own specs. A dedicated AR22 could be built under 1000 pretty easily

Lanworld is selling complete spikes 22s
http://www.lanworldinc.com/ar15.html

Last edited by Alecks; 05-10-2009 at 6:23 PM..
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Old 05-10-2009, 9:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arteeel View Post
Actually you will be spending about the same amount vs a standard AR. The lower assembly is the same and the upper costs 600+. Overall you will have about a grand invested or more.
I kind of figured as much. At least I'll have an AR-style rifle that will be cheap to feed and fun to shoot which is all I'm really looking for.

I mean, anyone can take a 10/22 and turn it into a Tommy Gun but not everyone has a wicked-looking .22LR AR-22. ^_^
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Old 05-10-2009, 9:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alecks View Post
It's really not to hard to build a rifle yourself. You can put the lower together with a few simple hand tools. And buy a .22 dedicated upper. the upper needs a few specialized tools to put together, that's why I personally bought a complete upper.

a few companies now make .22lr dedicated uppers.
Spikes
CMMG
Tacsol

If you give Spikes or CMMG a call I'm sure they can build you a complete rifle.

I built mine for a little over $1000, but I bought a limited edition lower from spikes which cost a little more. if you're on a budget look around for good deals and build yourself a rifle to your own specs. A dedicated AR22 could be built under 1000 pretty easily

Lanworld is selling complete spikes 22s
http://www.lanworldinc.com/ar15.html
Thanks for the info! I'll be looking at contacting Lanworld as well to see what they can do.

Really, while I know I could probably go a bit cheaper by rolling my own I'd rather this one done right and I'll save the build-up for the future.
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Old 05-10-2009, 9:14 PM
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Why not buy directly from Spikes and not go through a middle man?
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Old 05-10-2009, 9:22 PM
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yep you can order direct too.

just add the following into your cart:
.22 dedicated upper
-specify if you want a front sight post or block
lower receiver
-.22lr dedicated if you want that marking, other wise you can add one that is marked multi
Lower parts kit
Stock kit

total came out to $964.95, before shipping for a basic m4 style .22lr
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Old 05-10-2009, 10:03 PM
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Originally Posted by offrdmania View Post
Why not buy directly from Spikes and not go through a middle man?
I did not know that you could until someone had mentioned it earlier in this thread. Heck, if you go to their website there is no mention, or at least not one I could find, that they even offered such a service which is why I reached out to all of you for help.

Honestly, it really would have been helpful if they had mentioned that they did somewhere or even what parts but I guess they assumed that people would know how to roll their own or were just looking for conversion parts. *shrug*
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Old 05-10-2009, 10:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alecks View Post
yep you can order direct too.

just add the following into your cart:
.22 dedicated upper
-specify if you want a front sight post or block
lower receiver
-.22lr dedicated if you want that marking, other wise you can add one that is marked multi
Lower parts kit
Stock kit

total came out to $964.95, before shipping for a basic m4 style .22lr
Nice!

Well, as I mentioned earlier I've got an email in with them already so sooner or later I'll be talking with someone over there. The more I think about this the more excited I get.
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Old 05-10-2009, 10:12 PM
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Just give them a call, Angela is a big help over there. Let her know what you want and what FFL you will be having it shipped to and she will get everything taken care of. Now they are a small company and dont always answer the phone so keep trying until you get someone. Dont get mad because thats just they way they roll.
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Old 05-11-2009, 7:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by offrdmania View Post
Why not buy directly from Spikes and not go through a middle man?
Thats a big +1 right there. Spikes will sell directly to you.
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Old 05-12-2009, 5:08 AM
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they have on there site a list of ffl's for ca that they use, its a long list.
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Old 05-12-2009, 7:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chunky_lover View Post
they have on there site a list of ffl's for ca that they use, its a long list.
If they are not on the list get your local FFL to fax them over their info.
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