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Calgunners in Service This forum is a place for our active duty and deployed members to share, request and have a bit of home where ever they are.

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  #1  
Old 01-24-2017, 8:31 PM
Kali_M14 Kali_M14 is offline
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Default off roster handguns for military

I know this has been posted before, but based on this what gives a police officer more rights to purchase one than military members? they do not buy all of their off roster guns for discharge of their duties and read the paragraph after and the definition in 3200 subd b4:

https://oag.ca.gov/firearms/exemptpo

State Exemptions for Authorized Peace Officers
Non-Roster Handguns (Unsafe Handguns)

The following agencies may purchase non-roster firearms for use in the discharge of their official duties:

Department of Justice
A police department
A sheriff’s official
A marshal’s office
The Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation
The California Highway Patrol
Any district attorney’s office
Any federal law enforcement agency
The military or naval forces of this state or of the United States (Pen. Code, § 32000, subd. (b)(4).)

Penal Code section 32000 does not prohibit the sale to, or purchase by, sworn members of the above agencies of a handgun.


(Pen. Code, § 32000, subd. (b)(4):
(4) The sale or purchase of any pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person, if the pistol, revolver, or other firearm is sold to, or purchased by, the Department of Justice, any police department, any sheriff's official, any marshal's office, the Youth and Adult Correctional Agency, the California Highway Patrol, any district attorney's office, or the military or naval forces of this state or of the United States for use in the discharge of their official duties.  Nor shall anything in this section prohibit the sale to, or purchase by, sworn members of these agencies of any pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed upon the person. - See more at: http://codes.findlaw.com/ca/penal-co....i7I6FZcP.dpuf

It seems members of the CSMR, Guard and federal forces can purchase off roster guns.

Thoughts?
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Old 01-24-2017, 11:46 PM
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interesting!
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Old 01-25-2017, 1:25 AM
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FAQ.

You would need a lawsuit, probably brought by the particular service or DOD, to challenge that.

CA legislators tend to believe 'sworn' means PC 830 'peace officers'.

I'm in favor of the Roster just going away. Absent that, the more exemptions the better.
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Old 01-25-2017, 7:18 AM
Kali_M14 Kali_M14 is offline
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As military members we are sworn in and sign paperwork to that affect. Also remember that PC 832 is for California only and they do differentiate between military and federal. Also they specifically list the military and naval forces of the the state which is really the CSMR and Guard. Furthermore,the national guard doesn't have a naval component but the CSMR does. The next paragraph also specifically states the individual member of the agencies can purchase.
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Old 01-25-2017, 9:48 AM
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This post looks familiar. Swearing into the military and be sworn into LE are two entirely different things. I am retired Military and retired LE and one never implied the other. There is also a big difference between PC 830 that Librarian is talking about and PC 832 that you have posted above. 830 is for regular officers while 832 is for reserve officers.
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Old 01-25-2017, 9:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Librarian View Post
FAQ.

You would need a lawsuit, probably brought by the particular service or DOD, to challenge that.

CA legislators tend to believe 'sworn' means PC 830 'peace officers'.

I'm in favor of the Roster just going away. Absent that, the more exemptions the better.
Will the DROS system or CA DOJ kick back an off roster transaction? What would happen if every FFL started selling off roster guns at the same time? Mass civil disobedience ect. Does DOJ have the man power to process and go after everyone?
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Old 01-25-2017, 1:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MotoFahren View Post
Will the DROS system or CA DOJ kick back an off roster transaction? What would happen if every FFL started selling off roster guns at the same time? Mass civil disobedience ect. Does DOJ have the man power to process and go after everyone?
If the FFL cannot put in an exemption into DROS, yes, that DROS would be rejected.
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Old 01-25-2017, 1:57 PM
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only in CA...Ask for reassignment to a different base in Free America and buy whatever you want.
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Old 01-25-2017, 11:44 PM
Kali_M14 Kali_M14 is offline
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Check this out from the CRPA dated 06 APR 2016:

http://crpa.org/sworn-members-peace-...-roster-alert/

The law also “does not prohibit the sale to, or purchase by, sworn members of these agencies of a handgun.” So what constitutes a “sworn member”?

The term “sworn member” is not defined in the law. But any individual who can show proof that they are a “sworn member” of any of the above listed agencies should be exempt from the Roster requirement. This should be true even though they may not qualify as “peace officers,” as that term is defined under California Penal Code section 830. Typically, “peace officers” are “sworn members.” But, “sworn members” may not always be “peace officers.”

Problematically, DOJ has cited several licensed firearm retailers with violations of the law for selling an off-Roster handgun to individuals who are not “peace officers,” even though they are “sworn members” of the exempted agencies. That is wrong. DOJ is conflating the term “sworn member” in the “unsafe handgun” law with specific exceptions for “peace officers” created in other laws that apply when purchasing firearms, such as the “peace officer” exceptions to the 10-day waiting period and Firearm Safety Certificate (FSC).

In light of DOJ’s confusion, “sworn members” of the above referenced agencies who want to purchase firearms that are not on the Roster should bring written proof of their “sworn member” status to their local firearm dealer at the time of purchase (even though there is no requirement under California law that a “sworn member” of an agency provide written proof of the member’s status.) This should protect the firearm dealer and the sworn member. Any dealer processing these transactions should keep a copy of the sworn member’s letter along with the other transferee’s paperwork.
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Old 01-26-2017, 3:43 PM
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:sigh: You missed the important part:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kali_M14 View Post
The following agencies may purchase non-roster firearms for use in the discharge of their official duties:
Members of the armed forces are not allowed to use personal firearms in their official duties. The military buys whatever weapons regardless of what CA says and those are what are used.
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Old 01-26-2017, 5:18 PM
Kali_M14 Kali_M14 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcourson View Post
:sigh: You missed the important part:



Members of the armed forces are not allowed to use personal firearms in their official duties. The military buys whatever weapons regardless of what CA says and those are what are used.
Your confusing what an agency can purchase vs the second part which deals with the individuals owning and purchasing for their own use...your statement is also further proof that military members can purchase off roster...there is nothing in the below verbiage that says official duties...an example is a police department buys gen 4 glocks for duty but an individual officer may buy a Wilson which is also off list but can only use his Glock for duty.

Penal Code section 32000 does not prohibit the sale to, or purchase by, sworn members of the above agencies of a handgun.
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Last edited by Kali_M14; 01-27-2017 at 6:30 PM..
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Old 01-27-2017, 6:37 PM
Kali_M14 Kali_M14 is offline
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Guys think about this....if people think that the key term is for use in the discharge of their duties is inclusive of sworn members within the agencies, then how is it that LEO can buy non-roster gun for personal use...PD are also listed? If so, why separate the section for sworn members...again sworn members not peace officers.
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Old 02-04-2017, 7:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kali_M14 View Post
Guys think about this ...
Kali must be a Lance Corporal ...

... or a sea lawyer.

Semper Fi
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