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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #1  
Old 04-25-2009, 3:45 PM
LexRex LexRex is offline
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Default My UOC, LCC Unregistered Nonresident FAQ Thread

Ok, so i have been reading on calguns a lot, but i just don't have time to sort through the amount of information on here to get the answers to specific questions that i have. Further, this thread is somewhat more specific in my eyes, because of the CA non-resident nature of my questions.

All questions are with the view of a visitor/non-resident/student/vacation home owner or renter to the state of California, living (but not residing) in Los Angeles County. In other words, the subject in question would possess an out of state license, and handguns/longuns on the approved DOJ list, but not registered with the CA DOJ (purchased out of CA, imported into CA).


So, the questions should be thought of in this manner: Can a non-resident with a pistol with a serial number not registered with the CA DOJ do the following:

Pistol Related Questions

1. Is a non-resident or new resident of CA required to register their out-of-state pistols with the CA DOJ?

2. Can a non-resident with a pistol with a serial number not registered with the CA DOJ Unloaded Open Carry?

3. Can a non-resident with a pistol with a serial number not registered with the CA DOJ carry an unloaded pistol with a full magazine in a locked metal box sitting upon but not attached to the passenger seat of his vehicle?

4. Can the metal box in question #2 be covered by a sweatshirt, or otherwise concealed?

5. Can the metal box in question #2 be a briefcase with a locking combo lock?

6. What is the best type of locked container for vehicle carry?

7. Where do you buy these containers?

8. Would the subject be allowed to carry the locked container into the grocery store/bank/late night ATM run/anywhere other than a school or govt building?

9. When carrying a full magazine, absent a firearm, is a non-resident with an unregistered pistol required to have the magazine in a locked container?

10. Would a non-resident with an unregistered pistol be able to carry an unloaded firearm in a locked IWB holster that is fully concealed under clothing, provided that the holster completely enclosed the firearm and had a combo lock on it?

11. Would full magazines carried upon a non-resident's person need to be in a locked separate compartment?



Long Gun/Shotgun Related Questions

1. Can a non-resident with a non-registered shotgun UOC in his or her vehicle?

2. Can the shotgun be mounted in a car in a similiar fashion as Law cars?

3. Can the shotgun be on the floor of the passenger seat?

4. Can the shotgun be partially concealed by a sweatshirt, papers, trash, etc.?

5. For all reasonable intents and purposes, is UOC of a unregistered shotgun in Los Angeles County feasable, or does the school zone make this a near impossibility?

6. Are there reasonable options for UOC of an unregistered long gun in los angeles county within a vehicle (what areas are off limits?)




please provide concise yes no answers, i'm trying to eliminate having to read through 15 page threads where the answer is concealed somewhere on page 13.

Last edited by LexRex; 04-25-2009 at 4:21 PM..
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  #2  
Old 04-25-2009, 4:43 PM
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Librarian Librarian is offline
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So, we're supposed to do all your work for you?

Little demanding, don't you think? You could take all your questions to a lawyer and PAY for the answers.

One fundamental question for you: do you live here, or are you 'visiting'? If you're visiting without intending to become a California citizen, some of the answers change.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LexRex View Post
Ok, so i have been reading on calguns a lot, but i just don't have time to sort through the amount of information on here to get the answers to specific questions that i have. Further, this thread is somewhat more specific in my eyes, because of the CA non-resident nature of my questions.

All questions are with the view of a visitor/non-resident/student/vacation home owner or renter to the state of California, living (but not residing) in Los Angeles County. In other words, the subject in question would possess an out of state license, and handguns/longuns on the approved DOJ list, but not registered with the CA DOJ (purchased out of CA, imported into CA).


So, the questions should be thought of in this manner: Can a non-resident with a pistol with a serial number not registered with the CA DOJ do the following:

Pistol Related Questions

1. Is a non-resident or new resident of CA required to register their out-of-state pistols with the CA DOJ?

2. Can a non-resident with a pistol with a serial number not registered with the CA DOJ Unloaded Open Carry?

3. Can a non-resident with a pistol with a serial number not registered with the CA DOJ carry an unloaded pistol with a full magazine in a locked metal box sitting upon but not attached to the passenger seat of his vehicle?

4. Can the metal box in question #2 be covered by a sweatshirt, or otherwise concealed?

5. Can the metal box in question #2 be a briefcase with a locking combo lock?

6. What is the best type of locked container for vehicle carry?

7. Where do you buy these containers?

8. Would the subject be allowed to carry the locked container into the grocery store/bank/late night ATM run/anywhere other than a school or govt building?

9. When carrying a full magazine, absent a firearm, is a non-resident with an unregistered pistol required to have the magazine in a locked container?

10. Would a non-resident with an unregistered pistol be able to carry an unloaded firearm in a locked IWB holster that is fully concealed under clothing, provided that the holster completely enclosed the firearm and had a combo lock on it?

11. Would full magazines carried upon a non-resident's person need to be in a locked separate compartment?



Long Gun/Shotgun Related Questions

1. Can a non-resident with a non-registered shotgun UOC in his or her vehicle?

2. Can the shotgun be mounted in a car in a similiar fashion as Law cars?

3. Can the shotgun be on the floor of the passenger seat?

4. Can the shotgun be partially concealed by a sweatshirt, papers, trash, etc.?

5. For all reasonable intents and purposes, is UOC of a unregistered shotgun in Los Angeles County feasable, or does the school zone make this a near impossibility?

6. Are there reasonable options for UOC of an unregistered long gun in los angeles county within a vehicle (what areas are off limits?)




please provide concise yes no answers, i'm trying to eliminate having to read through 15 page threads where the answer is concealed somewhere on page 13.
If concealed, pistols/handguns must be transported in a locked case. It does not matter where you keep the case, and the case itself may be concealed or obscured. Magazines with live rounds may be in that case or out of it. The kind of case is unspecified - look on line, for example, at MidwayUSA.

Other than school zones, long guns may be transported however you wish - no regs except for 'assault weapons'.

Unloaded Open Carry is a risk wherever you try.
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  #3  
Old 04-25-2009, 4:48 PM
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For starters, get this book:



http://www.gunlawpress.com/

Use the search feature here too...
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  #4  
Old 04-25-2009, 5:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LexRex View Post
Pistol Related Questions

1. Is a non-resident or new resident of CA required to register their out-of-state pistols with the CA DOJ?

If the pistols remain out of state, no. You may not be able to bring them in later though, if you don't do it in the fist 60 days, or they may need to go through an FFL. If you do bring them in during that period they need to be registered.

2. Can a non-resident with a pistol with a serial number not registered with the CA DOJ Unloaded Open Carry?

I can't of any reason why not, but it seems like a really bad idea. Ask a lawyer before proceeding.

3. Can a non-resident with a pistol with a serial number not registered with the CA DOJ carry an unloaded pistol with a full magazine in a locked metal box sitting upon but not attached to the passenger seat of his vehicle?

See #2.

4. Can the metal box in question #2 be covered by a sweatshirt, or otherwise concealed?

I'll assume you meant #3. A locked container with a handgun in it may be concealed.


5. Can the metal box in question #2 be a briefcase with a locking combo lock?

Yes, assuming it is "secure".

6. What is the best type of locked container for vehicle carry?

Probably the type described in #5.

7. Where do you buy these containers?

Try ebay...

8. Would the subject be allowed to carry the locked container into the grocery store/bank/late night ATM run/anywhere other than a school or govt building?

If you had some lawful reason to take it there. In the eyes of a jury, it seems unlikely that you would.


9. When carrying a full magazine, absent a firearm, is a non-resident with an unregistered pistol required to have the magazine in a locked container?

Probably not, but your question makes no sense so I might be misreading it.

10. Would a non-resident with an unregistered pistol be able to carry an unloaded firearm in a locked IWB holster that is fully concealed under clothing, provided that the holster completely enclosed the firearm and had a combo lock on it?

Yes, if the holster was a "secure container".

11. Would full magazines carried upon a non-resident's person need to be in a locked separate compartment?

No, but again this is a bad idea. If one of the magazines finds it's way into the gun somehow, you are looking at a felony. There is also a weak argument to me made that the magazine is part of the gun. You would probably win on appeal though...


Long Gun/Shotgun Related Questions

1. Can a non-resident with a non-registered shotgun UOC in his or her vehicle?

Yes, and there is no registration of non-AW long guns, so residency and registration don't apply here.

2. Can the shotgun be mounted in a car in a similiar fashion as Law cars?

Yes.

3. Can the shotgun be on the floor of the passenger seat?


Yes.

4. Can the shotgun be partially concealed by a sweatshirt, papers, trash, etc.?

Yes, or fully concealed.

5. For all reasonable intents and purposes, is UOC of a unregistered shotgun in Los Angeles County feasable, or does the school zone make this a near impossibility?

It's certainly possible in some areas, keep in mind there is a private property exemption, and the laws only applies if you know or reasonable should have known the school was there. Certainly risky though.

6. Are there reasonable options for UOC of an unregistered long gun in los angeles county within a vehicle (what areas are off limits?)

School zones are probably your biggest worry, you will want to stay off any government owned property as well.


please provide concise yes no answers, i'm trying to eliminate having to read through 15 page threads where the answer is concealed somewhere on page 13.
That is the best you are going to get from me on here, if you want code and case law references and solid specific answers backed by somebodies malpractice insurance and reviewed by an attorney it will have to go through under the umbrella of a local 2a law firm and it won't be free.

FYI the questions you are asking if you are planing do to this stuff are not even the really important ones. I guarantee you miss something that can land you in jail. Especially playing around with unregistered handguns.
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Last edited by Matt C; 04-25-2009 at 5:16 PM..
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Old 04-25-2009, 5:19 PM
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What brand is your flame suit and what lvl?
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Old 04-25-2009, 5:33 PM
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As far as I'm concerned, UOC is a political statement and doing it with a pistol that isn't registered is dumb. You are just asking for additional scrutiny. If you aren't a resident it's double dumb.

Plan B (locked container carry) is for personal security if you feel your life is at risk. A locked day planner in your hand seems a lot more safe than stuffing a pistol in a locked bag down your pants. If you get stopped by the police and they find that in your pants I wouldn't be surprised if they found some excuse to arrest you.

There are laws about transporting firearms so I don't do it unless I can honestly say I am going to or from the range. That includes long arms. If you carry a shotgun in a rifle rack through any urban areas, you are going to get stopped by the police.

If you fear for your life, don't come here. If you have to, plan B is what I would do and it wouldn't be stuck down my pants.

Don't do anything stupid.
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Old 04-25-2009, 7:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wash View Post
As far as I'm concerned, UOC is a political statement and doing it with a pistol that isn't registered is dumb. You are just asking for additional scrutiny. If you aren't a resident it's double dumb.

Plan B (locked container carry) is for personal security if you feel your life is at risk. A locked day planner in your hand seems a lot more safe than stuffing a pistol in a locked bag down your pants. If you get stopped by the police and they find that in your pants I wouldn't be surprised if they found some excuse to arrest you.

There are laws about transporting firearms so I don't do it unless I can honestly say I am going to or from the range. That includes long arms. If you carry a shotgun in a rifle rack through any urban areas, you are going to get stopped by the police.

If you fear for your life, don't come here. If you have to, plan B is what I would do and it wouldn't be stuck down my pants.

Don't do anything stupid.
What he said.
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Old 04-25-2009, 7:15 PM
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Walking around with a shotgun in LA is a pretty stupid idea. It might get you dead. In Wyoming, no problem
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Old 04-25-2009, 8:12 PM
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Answers to many of your questions are here: http://www.californiaopencarry.org/C...aOpenCarry.pdf

By no means all, but many regarding open carry and concealed transport.
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Old 04-25-2009, 9:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LexRex View Post
please provide concise yes no answers, i'm trying to eliminate having to read through 15 page threads where the answer is concealed somewhere on page 13.
Yeah, sure. There, I just eliminated having to answer 17 questions that are all answered in the CA PC, available on the DOJ website, or in the book Doheny suggested (Yes, I have a copy of my own too! - that's a free answer BTW.)
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Old 04-25-2009, 9:30 PM
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If you don't have the time, why not pay an attorney to review your questions with you? Librarian and BWO both went far beyond the level of response your inquiry deserved, and for their patience and willingness to respond you should be thankful. BWO has an excellent point- without spending some of your precious time determining what is truly important (and, further, your desired outcome), you will eventually overlook some critical information and nuance which may get you into a situation where a lawyer isn't an option.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LexRex View Post
Ok, so i have been reading on calguns a lot, but i just don't have time to sort through the amount of information on here to get the answers to specific questions that i have. Further, this thread is somewhat more specific in my eyes, because of the CA non-resident nature of my questions.
You haven't searched through the voluminous information already posted here, but somehow you are assured that your circumstances are unique?

Quote:
Please provide concise yes no answers, i'm trying to eliminate having to read through 15 page threads where the answer is concealed somewhere on page 13.
I didn't realize that responses could not only be demanded, but the form of the response dictated as well. Kudos to you for breaking new ground.
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