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  #1  
Old 04-03-2009, 10:43 AM
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Default shipping ammo

What is the easiest and cheapest way to ship ammo? UPS, Fedex? Or does it not really matter?
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  #2  
Old 04-03-2009, 10:51 AM
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UPS Ground. Write ORM-D on the outside at least twice and that's it.
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  #3  
Old 04-03-2009, 10:52 AM
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UPS does not charge a Hazmat fee but I believe that Fedex does.
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  #4  
Old 04-03-2009, 10:55 AM
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Ammunition is not HazMat. It is ORM-D (Other Restricted Material- Class D, small arms ammunition).
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  #5  
Old 04-03-2009, 10:57 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freakshow10mm View Post
Ammunition is not HazMat. It is ORM-D (Other Restricted Material- Class D, small arms ammunition).
Are there any other local restrictions that you know of or is this all thats required.
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  #6  
Old 04-03-2009, 10:58 AM
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awesome, thanks.
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  #7  
Old 04-03-2009, 11:20 AM
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That's all that's required by CFR and UPS policies.
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  #8  
Old 04-03-2009, 11:41 AM
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I just found out I do have to go to the UPS hub, I can't use any UPS Stores or other authorized retailers. I called Fed-Ex, and they are telling me I have to be licensed and ship to a dealer.. I know that's BS sicne I've received ammo via FedEx in the past.. oh well, I'll go to the UPS center, it's just kinda far...damn!
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  #9  
Old 04-03-2009, 11:43 AM
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How about powder and primers? what is required for that? cost?
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  #10  
Old 04-03-2009, 12:24 PM
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$20 Haz Mat fee.
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  #11  
Old 04-03-2009, 12:47 PM
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Originally Posted by freakshow10mm View Post
$20 Haz Mat fee.
Thanks for the info...
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  #12  
Old 04-03-2009, 8:36 PM
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Well, I made it down to the main UPS Hub to get my ammo shipped. I walked in, told the girl I had to ship some small arms ammo and she started to tell me that I can not ship it, blah blah blah, and if I could ship it, it would have to go Air.. She called her boss, or somebody, and they told her that I can't do it. I had just got off the phone with the UPS Hazardous shipment center and they told me that I COULD ship there, and if they give me any trouble, to give them a call. I called them back, told them what was going on, and let the girl at the UPS center talk to them on my phone. To make a long story short, about an hour later I was able to get my ammo shipped. I wish employees knew the policy. If I have to ship ammo again, I'll just walk in with my box sealed up with the ORM-D stickers on it, and ship it without mentioning the ammo part. This girl wouldn't have had any idea what the ORM-D was all about.
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  #13  
Old 04-03-2009, 9:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cgseanp1 View Post
Well, I made it down to the main UPS Hub to get my ammo shipped. I walked in, told the girl I had to ship some small arms ammo and she started to tell me that I can not ship it, blah blah blah, and if I could ship it, it would have to go Air.. She called her boss, or somebody, and they told her that I can't do it. I had just got off the phone with the UPS Hazardous shipment center and they told me that I COULD ship there, and if they give me any trouble, to give them a call. I called them back, told them what was going on, and let the girl at the UPS center talk to them on my phone. To make a long story short, about an hour later I was able to get my ammo shipped. I wish employees knew the policy. If I have to ship ammo again, I'll just walk in with my box sealed up with the ORM-D stickers on it, and ship it without mentioning the ammo part. This girl wouldn't have had any idea what the ORM-D was all about.
That's how I ship ORM-D, box it up, drop it off.

What license, if any, do you need to sell ammo?
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  #14  
Old 04-03-2009, 9:09 PM
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Get ammo all the time, but all they put on it is ORM-D and never sent it so wouldn't know that way.
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  #15  
Old 04-04-2009, 6:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Capt. Speirs View Post
That's how I ship ORM-D, box it up, drop it off.

What license, if any, do you need to sell ammo?
No license is required to sell ammo, just to manufacture it.
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  #16  
Old 04-04-2009, 7:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freakshow10mm View Post
No license is required to sell ammo, just to manufacture it.
Except for half the people working at UPS and Fedex think you need some sort of license to ship ammo.
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  #17  
Old 04-04-2009, 7:46 AM
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http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.htm...f=133&t=372846

Looks like 90% of the people who ship ammo with UPS get the same run around I got.. Any of you guys here have that problem?
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  #18  
Old 04-04-2009, 7:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cgseanp1 View Post
I just found out I do have to go to the UPS hub, I can't use any UPS Stores or other authorized retailers. I called Fed-Ex, and they are telling me I have to be licensed and ship to a dealer.. I know that's BS sicne I've received ammo via FedEx in the past.. oh well, I'll go to the UPS center, it's just kinda far...damn!
All the online vendors I've every bought ammo from use UPS, and it's always been fine. I didn't know this until I talked to a FedEx guy but FedEx Ground is actually a contractor company (not Express, just Ground) so your service may vary greatly from one area to the next, whereas UPS Ground are normal employees and deliver with their same standard of excellent service.

Given the choice I'll choose UPS over FedEx any day, FedEx guys almost always give you attitude when delivering stuff but the UPS guys are always friendly, always cool.
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  #19  
Old 04-04-2009, 4:02 PM
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Does anyone know of any rules against using the UPS home pickup service to ship ammo?
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  #20  
Old 04-04-2009, 4:23 PM
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Daily pick up account is OK, but scheduled pick up isn't AFAIK. Not recommended but I've yet to meet a UPS driver that cares otherwise.
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  #21  
Old 04-05-2009, 5:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by freakshow10mm
Ammunition is not HazMat. It is ORM-D (Other Restricted Material- Class D, small arms ammunition).
Yes, it is hazmat, although hazmat fees are not usually charged for ORM-D materials. ORM-D is a DOT hazard class.

Also, ORM-D stands for Other Regulated Material-D. The D doesn't stand for anything. The shipping name is Cartridges Small Arms, not small arms ammunition.

Although formal training might not be required, you are still responsible for following all the applicable DOT regulations pertaining to packaging and marking. Here are the ones for shipping small arms ammunition:

Quote:
Code of Federal Regulations, Title 49, Part 173

173.63 Packaging exceptions

(b) Cartridges, small arms, and cartridges power devices. (1) Cartridges, small arms and cartridges power devices (which are used to project fastening devices) which have been classed as a Division 1.4S explosive may be reclassed, offered for transportation, and transported as ORM-D material when packaged in accordance with paragraph (b)(2) of this section; such transportation is excepted from the requirements of subparts E (Labeling) and F (Placarding) of part 172 of this subchapter. Cartridges, small arms, and cartridges power devices that may be shipped as ORM-D material is limited to:

(i) Ammunition for rifle, pistol, or shotgun;
(ii) Ammunition with inert projectiles or blank ammunition;
(iii) Ammunition having no tear gas, incendiary, or detonating explosive projectiles;
(iv) Ammunition not exceeding 12.7 mm (50 caliber or 0.5 inch) for rifle or pistol, cartridges or 8 gauge for shotshells; and
(v) Cartridges power devices which are use to project fastening devices.

(2) Packaging for cartridges, small arms, and cartridges power devices as ORM-D material must be as follows:
(i) Ammunition must be packed in inside boxes, or in partitions which fit snugly in the outside packaging, or in metal clips;
(ii) Primers must be protected from accidental initiation;
(iii) Inside boxes, partitions or metal clips must be packed in securely-closed strong outside packagings;
(iv) Maximum gross weight is limited to 30 Kg (66 pounds) per package; and
(v) Cartridges, power devices which are used to project fastening devices and 22 caliber rim-fire cartridges may be packaged loose in strong outside packagings.

Part 172 (Marking)

172.316 Packagings containing material classed as ORM-D

(a) Each non-bulk packaging containing a material classed as ORM-D must be marked on at least one side or end with the ORM-D designation immediately following or below the proper shipping name of the material (Cartridges, Small Arms). The ORM designation must be placed within a rectangle that is approximately 6.3 mm (0.25 inches) larger on each side than the designation.

(b) The marking ORM-D is the certification by the person offering the packaging for transportation that the material is properly described, classed, packaged, marked and labeled (when appropriate) and in proper condition for transportation according to the applicable regulations of this subchapter.

Last edited by EOD Guy; 04-05-2009 at 5:53 PM..
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  #22  
Old 04-05-2009, 6:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EOD Guy View Post
Yes, it is hazmat, although hazmat fees are not usually charged for ORM-D materials. ORM-D is a DOT hazard class.

Also, ORM-D stands for Other Regulated Material-D. The D doesn't stand for anything. The shipping name is Cartridges Small Arms, not small arms ammunition.

Although formal training might not be required, you are still responsible for following all the applicable DOT regulations pertaining to packaging and marking. Here are the ones for shipping small arms ammunition:
How does this look? Obviously, the package is missing shipping label, but I made my own ORM-D label. And I put another one on the side, to be safe.

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  #23  
Old 04-05-2009, 6:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cgseanp1 View Post
How does this look? Obviously, the package is missing shipping label, but I made my own ORM-D label. And I put another one on the side, to be safe.
I prefer to only put the ORM-D label on the side of the package. It is less likely to be noticed by an uninformed busy-body customer counter person that way.
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  #24  
Old 04-05-2009, 6:31 PM
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Quote:
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I prefer to only put the ORM-D label on the side of the package. It is less likely to be noticed by an uniformed busy-body customer counter person that way.
Good point. I just thought it had to be on top. After the hassle I had last time I shipped ammo, I hope I can just go in, drop it off, pay and leave. Maybe i'll just stick it on the side for now on
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Old 04-06-2009, 10:03 AM
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I talked with UPS hazmat, they said I can shedule a pick up for ammo, and don't need a daily pick up account good news.
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  #26  
Old 04-07-2009, 6:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cgseanp1 View Post
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.htm...f=133&t=372846

Looks like 90% of the people who ship ammo with UPS get the same run around I got.. Any of you guys here have that problem?
The local UPS folks are all fine with shipping ammo. In fact I got into a conversation with the UPS guy behind the counter about reloading 35 Whelen last time I shipped some ammo out. The local FedEx center is the same way. The girl doesn't even blink. I wish you guys lived in a gun-friendly part of the state.


BTW the ORM-D labels have changed reently. Here is the current incarnation:



Notice it says nothing about small arms cartridges. They have generalized the label.

-Jason
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Old 04-07-2009, 9:04 AM
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Great thread! Thanks for the info.

OK so there is not hazmat fee for ammunition but there is for powder and primers. What about primed brass cases? Classified as ammo or as powder and primers?
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  #28  
Old 04-07-2009, 11:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nodda Duma View Post
BTW the ORM-D labels have changed reently. Here is the current incarnation:



Notice it says nothing about small arms cartridges. They have generalized the label.

-Jason
This is wrong.

The Federal regulations still require the ORM-D label to say "CARTRIDGES, SMALL ARMS" if you are shipping ammo. The "CONSUMER COMMODITY" labels are not some new design. They have always been around, but are used for other types of ORM-D shipments, like perfume and cans of hairspray.
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  #29  
Old 04-07-2009, 12:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by GrayWolf09 View Post
...What about primed brass cases? Classified as ammo or as powder and primers?
Primed brass cases are not regulated by the DOT for some reason. You can ship them without any paperwork or special labeling requirements at all.

I am of the opinion that US Postal regulations forbid mailing primed brass, so I recommend you ship them via UPS or FedEx. But others feel that using the Post Office for primed brass is fine. The disagreement is just over different interpretations of the wording of the Postal regs. Very knowledgable people disagree with me on this.
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  #30  
Old 04-07-2009, 12:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mssr. ElegantÚ View Post
This is wrong.

The Federal regulations still require the ORM-D label to say "CARTRIDGES, SMALL ARMS" if you are shipping ammo. The "CONSUMER COMMODITY" labels are not some new design. They have always been around, but are used for other types of ORM-D shipments, like perfume and cans of hairspray.
Oops. Guess I misread my reference. Here's a link to the sticker you need. Thanks for calling me on that.



-Jason
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  #31  
Old 04-07-2009, 2:01 PM
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Why settle for just blue stickers? Save paper by printing whole sheets of ORM-D labels. Now in "tactical" black and "stealth" white...

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...ad.php?t=54456

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  #32  
Old 04-07-2009, 3:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mssr. ElegantÚ View Post
Why settle for just blue stickers? Save paper by printing whole sheets of ORM-D labels. Now in "tactical" black and "stealth" white...

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...ad.php?t=54456

darn, thats cool. I made my own though. I wish I saw this earlier.
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  #33  
Old 04-07-2009, 5:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mssr. ElegantÚ View Post
Why settle for just blue stickers? Save paper by printing whole sheets of ORM-D labels. Now in "tactical" black and "stealth" white...

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...ad.php?t=54456

Who said buy the stickers? Nice that someone's already done the work

-Jason
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  #34  
Old 04-07-2009, 6:34 PM
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I ship ammo for the .Gov I use the regular ORM-D labels for ammo shipments all day by ground but I do have to mark the box with the proper shipping name.

Quote:
(a) Each non-bulk packaging containing a material classed as ORM-D must be marked on at least one side or end with the ORM-D designation immediately following or below the proper shipping name of the material (Cartridges, Small Arms).
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  #35  
Old 04-08-2009, 6:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nodda Duma View Post
The local UPS folks are all fine with shipping ammo. In fact I got into a conversation with the UPS guy behind the counter about reloading 35 Whelen last time I shipped some ammo out. The local FedEx center is the same way. The girl doesn't even blink. I wish you guys lived in a gun-friendly part of the state.


BTW the ORM-D labels have changed reently. Here is the current incarnation:



Notice it says nothing about small arms cartridges. They have generalized the label.

-Jason

That is the wrong label. The Proper Shipping Name for small arms ammunition is Cartridges Small Arms, not Consumer Commodity. Comsumer commodity is a Proper Shipping Name for hazardous materials packed for consumer use.
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