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  #1  
Old 12-03-2008, 9:30 PM
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Default can you shoot 40 S&W in a 10mm gun?

can you shoot 40 S&W in a 10mm gun? The dimensions, except length are virtually the same...has anyone tried to do this? Is it safe to do so?
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  #2  
Old 12-03-2008, 9:34 PM
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No, don't do that. The 40 S&W and the 10mm both headspace on the case mouth of the round. A 40 S&W in a 10mm chamber is only held in place by the extractor.
http://www.thegunzone.com/10v40.html
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  #3  
Old 12-03-2008, 9:39 PM
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Auto pistol no, excessive headspace.

Revolver, yes.
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Old 12-03-2008, 9:42 PM
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Oh yeah, a revolver is fine.Thanks Freakshow.
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  #5  
Old 12-03-2008, 9:46 PM
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not in a semi auto for sure
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  #6  
Old 12-04-2008, 1:24 AM
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While I wouldn't do a heavy diet of it yes you can. Just be sure to clean out the chamber real well. I've seen it done quite a bit and have done it myself. You won't get great accuracy.

Yes the round will index off of the extractor when shooting 40. Other semi autos also index off the extractor. Not good for accuracy.

It might be better to sell me your 10mm so you don't have this problem.
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  #7  
Old 12-04-2008, 4:22 AM
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Or buy a 40S&W barrel for it...
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  #8  
Old 12-04-2008, 3:49 PM
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In the spirit of 'I wonder what will happen..." I fired a .40SW round in my 10mm 1006. It chambered, fired, and ejected fine. I loaded a magazine with .40s and fired all no problem. I then went through a box of .40s no problem. Do I recommend anyone else doing it? Nope, but it worked for me ok.
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Old 12-04-2008, 8:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smle-man View Post
In the spirit of 'I wonder what will happen..." I fired a .40SW round in my 10mm 1006. It chambered, fired, and ejected fine. I loaded a magazine with .40s and fired all no problem. I then went through a box of .40s no problem. Do I recommend anyone else doing it? Nope, but it worked for me ok.
Interesting and nice to know. Of course the Smith 1006 is really more a medieval battle implement that can shoot 10mm ammunition than it is a modern handgun (and I say that in the most loving way possible).
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Old 12-04-2008, 10:09 PM
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I concede that it is over-engineered! I do like the piece.
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  #11  
Old 12-04-2008, 11:32 PM
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The only difference in the two cartridges is the length, and the rim is 0.01 larger diameter on the 10mm...thats a very small difference. As to head space...the 38 spl shoots well from a 357 gun, its almost the same scenario between a 40SW and a 10MM.
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Old 12-04-2008, 11:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bubbapug1 View Post
The only difference in the two cartridges is the length, and the rim is 0.01 larger diameter on the 10mm...thats a very small difference. As to head space...the 38 spl shoots well from a 357 gun, its almost the same scenario between a 40SW and a 10MM.
Max pressure on a 40 is 32,633 psi
Max pressure on a 10mm is 37,500 psi

That's a pretty big difference in pressure if you ask me
(esp if your gun doesn't fully support the case as some don't)
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  #13  
Old 12-04-2008, 11:45 PM
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As I recall, I shot a few .40s out of my Glock 20 (10mm) a dozen years ago and they worked flawlessly. I thought it was perfectly fine to do so (like a .38 Special in a .357 Magnum kinda deal). Then I think I read somewhere that you shouldn't, so I haven't.

*shrugs*
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  #14  
Old 12-05-2008, 12:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bubbapug1 View Post
The only difference in the two cartridges is the length, and the rim is 0.01 larger diameter on the 10mm...thats a very small difference. As to head space...the 38 spl shoots well from a 357 gun, its almost the same scenario between a 40SW and a 10MM.
Sir, you spreading FUD. PLEASE, if you don't know what you're talking about then don't post. It could get someone seriously injured.

The revolver cartridge headspaces on the rim whereas the pistol cartridge headspaces on the mouth of the case.

By comparing 38/357 to 10mm/40 is pure bull. The difference is the former are RIMMED cases and the latter are RIMLESS.
Some 10's autos will function with 40's but that is not necessarily the norm. The revolvers should be no problem if you are using either 1/2 or full moon clips.

If you are using a revolver that was chambered to headspace on the case mouth then a 40 will not fire as it seats too deep in the chamber. If it was chambered to use "clips" then there is no problem.

When you get to the point in this game where you want to be innovative please do your homework thoroughly as a mistake could cost you dearly.
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  #15  
Old 12-29-2009, 4:46 PM
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hahahaha!

i know this is a old thread, but i just HAD to chime in.
i own several 10MM firearms. glock 20, 20C, delta elite, springfield omega,ect. i have fired 40 S&W out of every single one of them with absolutely NO ISSUES whatsoever, and accuracy was fine.. its a common thing with the glock 10mms. you can fire 40 S&W out of any 10mm that has an extractor thats tuned stiff, so it ( the 40) will headspace off of the extractor.i was a gunsmith for years with my own shop, and never saw one single 10mm come thru with damage from shooting 40 thru it, and ive probably tuned a couple hundred to shoot the 40 for my customers

i have fired 2 full 1 gallon paint cans of 40 out of my 10s ( apprx 1500 rounds). if you own a glock 10mm, go for it, right out of the box. if you have a 1911 pattern gun, tune the extractor tight, and youll not have an issue either.

i have to agree about doing your homework. contact your local (hopefully competent) gunsmit and see what he says. when you ask questions like this on the internet, you get more opinions ( crap that people have read somewere else, and then attempt to comment authoritatively o). than true straight answers to technical questions.

Last edited by LongRangeShootin; 12-29-2009 at 4:50 PM..
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  #16  
Old 12-29-2009, 4:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smle-man View Post
In the spirit of 'I wonder what will happen..." I fired a .40SW round in my 10mm 1006. It chambered, fired, and ejected fine. I loaded a magazine with .40s and fired all no problem. I then went through a box of .40s no problem. Do I recommend anyone else doing it? Nope, but it worked for me ok.
I tested it becasue of the case I was working on. It worked fine. I do not recommend it, though.
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  #17  
Old 12-29-2009, 6:32 PM
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I have done it, would do it again if it was necessary.

I do not own any .40 SW pistols so therefore no .40 SW ammo on hand.

I do have a Colt DE and a 1006 along with about 3K rounds of 10mm on hand.

My experience was that the pistol cycled just fine with the shorter cartridge,

but IIRC I did have one that the extractor failed to grab that had to be

removed from the bore with a rod. Shooting .40 SW out of a 10mm is

possible but does invite problems to come up, you really should just go ahead

and shoot the correct ammo in your gun or get the correct gun for your

ammo.

I have also seen 9mm fired through a .40 sucessfully, cycled the

action and everything worked fine except for the D shaped holes in the

target. Didn't do much good for the empties though.
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  #18  
Old 12-29-2009, 6:36 PM
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You will erode the chamber area by firing 40's in the 10mm, Get a 40 barrel fitted up to your gun and don't worry about anything.
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  #19  
Old 12-29-2009, 7:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bubbapug1 View Post
can you shoot 40 S&W in a 10mm gun? The dimensions, except length are virtually the same...has anyone tried to do this? Is it safe to do so?
I fired 2 .40S&W in my P220st .45ACP not to long ago.

When I fired the first one the recoil didn't feel right. I cleared and checked the gun thinking is was squib fire/squib load. The round had cleared the barrel and had enough power to cycle loading a .45 behind it.

The second one that happened in another magazine did the same but this time didn't cycle another round but did eject the first round.

I found the spent cases which where deformed and blown out and badly cracked. I was thinking "What the heck could cause this? then I saw the head stamps and realized I had accidentally loaded .40S&W into my magazines.

Fortunately I did not do any damage to my firearm. I was firing both my sig p229 .40 and my sig p220st .45 at the range that day, and I learned a valuable lesson ... be carefull when dealing with different calibers/gauges even with handguns and rifles.

To be honest I would not fire a .40S&W out of a 10mm due to the inside (webbing) of the case being thicker on the .40S&W and the .40 uses a small pistol primer as the 10mm uses a large Pistol primer. while you may get several rounds to fire you may eventually damage your firing pin. Even though both are almost ballisticly identical until you get to the heavier bullets the .40 does produce more pressure if I'm not mistaken.
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Old 12-29-2009, 7:30 PM
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I didnt think a 220 mag would hold a 40 casing. I learned something new.
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Old 12-29-2009, 8:02 PM
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I will not disagree with anyone's posting on this issue. But, when you are shooting those 40 S&W's in your 10MM semi-auto, will you please let me know first if I'm in the lane next to you. I want to watch. Thanks.
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Old 12-29-2009, 8:41 PM
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IIRC there was one 10mm/40 gun which was specifically designed to shoot both.... it had dual extractors to make sure it headspaced properly off the rim.

can't for the life of me remember what it was though...
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  #23  
Old 12-29-2009, 9:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AJAX22 View Post
IIRC there was one 10mm/40 gun which was specifically designed to shoot both.... it had dual extractors to make sure it headspaced properly off the rim.

can't for the life of me remember what it was though...
I think the Peters-Stahl design was like this, better known in the US as the Springfield Armory Omega. The design allowed for a variety of cartridge conversions without changing the slide, just the barrel, magazine, and recoil assembly.

I will add to what I posted above that just because something like shooting a .40 in a 10 is possible it is not a wise thing to practice shooting improper ammunition in any firearm. A revolver works in an entirely different fashion so a .38 Special in a .357 is perfectly OK as is a .40 S&W in a 10mm REVOLVER.

You might hear some offering advise as to what will happen if you shoot a short cartridge in a semi auto such as is the topic. My favorite was one guy that claimed that the shorter case would allow the bullet to turn sideways in the chamber before hitting the rifling and creating a stuck bullet. Anything is possible under extreme circumstances but I doubt this would ever happen unless there was a failure to ignite the powder and the primer lodged the bullet into the throat, but sideways?
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  #24  
Old 12-30-2009, 8:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cope113 View Post
I didnt think a 220 mag would hold a 40 casing. I learned something new.
Neither did I but it did and it loaded flawlessly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by wilshire1412 View Post
I think the Peters-Stahl design was like this, better known in the US as the Springfield Armory Omega. The design allowed for a variety of cartridge conversions without changing the slide, just the barrel, magazine, and recoil assembly.

I will add to what I posted above that just because something like shooting a .40 in a 10 is possible it is not a wise thing to practice shooting improper ammunition in any firearm. A revolver works in an entirely different fashion so a .38 Special in a .357 is perfectly OK as is a .40 S&W in a 10mm REVOLVER.

You might hear some offering advise as to what will happen if you shoot a short cartridge in a semi auto such as is the topic. My favorite was one guy that claimed that the shorter case would allow the bullet to turn sideways in the chamber before hitting the rifling and creating a stuck bullet. Anything is possible under extreme circumstances but I doubt this would ever happen unless there was a failure to ignite the powder and the primer lodged the bullet into the throat, but sideways?
I threw two .40s out of a .45 and by the way the bullets hit the paper at 15 feet I would say it could tumble after exiting the barrel (one bullet went threw the paper sideways) but even in the .45 it didn't stick as both bullets made it out and hit the paper about 5" outside my normal group. I doubt the bullets ever touched the rifling.
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Old 12-30-2009, 8:50 AM
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I don't say this often, mayhem, but you're just plain old dumb for shooting a 40 out of a 45. I hope to god I'm never at a range you're at. As for shooting 40 out of a 10, I personally wouldn't do this, but then again, there's a lot of things I wouldn't do that other's have no common sense not to do. The issue is, I don't want to be near anyone that's shooting a gun with a bullet not in spec for that gun. Unfortunately that's the world we live in. Idiots can ruin it for everyone around them. And it is NOT COMMON to shoot 40 out of a Glock. Go over to GlockTalk and you'll see the same arguments. Some saying "Eh, it's alright," and others who disagree. If you're really that hard up for cash to shoot your guns, maybe you should trade your 10mm for a .22?
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Old 12-30-2009, 9:24 AM
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Thats OK cineski, the feeling is mutual. I wouldn't want to be on a range with you or anyone like you without a proctologist that specializes in stick removal cause you all need your sticks pulled out.

Now why don't you go read my earlier post. Because I did not intentional load or shoot a 40 out of a 45.

We had allot of bulk .40 and .45 ammo that day several firearms and more then 1 Sig p220 and more then 1 shooter reloading magazines. I myself had 2 firearms my p220st 45 and my p229 40. Personally I'm glad no one brought a 9mm 10mm or other semi auto (Specially a glock). I'm not even sure I'm the one that loaded the 2 magazines in question. It was an interesting mistake I got an education from.
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Old 12-30-2009, 9:30 AM
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Mayhem, I'm not going to get into an arguing match with you. I'm just saying that what you did was incredibly dangerous. Your attitude came off as cavalier and I hope you realize that what you do can effect people next to you if your gun goes kaboom. The scenario you described was preventable. If you call being safe as having a stick up my rear, well, you need to get your priorities straight.
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Old 12-30-2009, 10:04 AM
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cineski I'm sorry about the stick comment but your comment makes it sound like your assuming I'm some noob that deliberately fired a .40 out of my .45. The "you're just plain old dumb" statement didn't help. You probably should have read my first post before jumping on me.

I'm well aware of what could have happened. As I said I learned a lesson from this.

The problem was created by having allot of Ammunition of different calibers in so close a proximity at the loading station. Multiple people loading Magazines/speed loaders for them selfs and other people. I myself had 2 guns of different calibers and I wasn't the only one. we even had 2 p220's. The only calibers we were firing that day where .38/.357 .40 and .45. Most ammo was in unmarked trays or loose in the boxes but not mixed in the boxes (I hope as we didn't use it all and most of us took a few boxes home with us).

I felt that I made it clear this was not deliberate in my first post.

What did I learn from this .... clearly segregate your sorted ammo, Control who loads what and when, check the ammo as your loading it into your magazine/speed loaders, stick to one caliber at a time when loading up, and don't think this can't happen to you because it can.

When I realized what had happened we unloaded all the magazines checked our ammo and took the steps above.

I wasn't trying to come off as cavalier I was simply sharing a unique and interesting story. I thought I made it clear in the original post that there was a valuable lesson learned from it.
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  #29  
Old 12-30-2009, 5:36 PM
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I have a S&W 610 which does exactly that - it is a 10mm but you can also shoot .40S&W from it too. Great all around gun and probably my favorite revolver

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Old 01-07-2010, 6:14 AM
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I'll add to this post. But first, I have to tell you that I do not recomment doing it.

I have shot almost 1800 rounds of 40 cal out of my 10 mm semi auto. As we all know, the primer shortage has gotten to most of us at the beginning of the year. Most of my guns are 10mm with the exception of 1 40 cal, 45 acp and 1 9mm. I didn't have anymore large pistol primers so I started doing research on 40 SW.

My favorite 10 mm is a custom STI 6 inch. I use it to hunt and target. It has thousands and thousands of rounds out of it. Anyway, in my research, I found that some pro shooters are using 40 SW in a custom pistol throated for a 10mm. It made sense. I didn't have any large primers and I wanted to shoot.

So I kept reading and reading. They were actually loading 40 cal 180 grain and 200 grainers long, 10mm length, chambered in 10mm. It made some sense, so the bullet would help headspace the cartriage. They were being shot at around 1150 to 1250 fps, 10mm velocities. Well, I loaded up 100 rounds the first time out and shot all without failure to feed or any type of problems. I did have to reduce the pring rate 2 lbs to make sure it functioned. I went through a full box of primers and a lot of blue dot. I still shoot the 40 cal out of my 10mm while waiting to get more large primers.

The only thing I can see with this is that the step on the barrel, where the case headspaces with erode prematurely. But heck, I can always re-barrel it.

Anyway, I don't recommend it, but it worked for my custom gun.

Last edited by cocorador; 01-07-2010 at 6:19 AM..
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Old 01-07-2010, 8:29 AM
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Headspacing a rimless round on the extractor will work, but not reliably because there is way too much room between the breechface and the extractor hook. The case slides forward as the firing pin strikes the primer and the force of the firing pin is cushioned by that friction.

No, it won't blow the gun, but why do it?

I often see people at the range mindlessly blasting away at a target with a gazillion holes in it for the sake of making noise. Shooting .40 in a 10mm is for them.
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Old 01-07-2010, 5:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LongRangeShootin View Post
hahahaha!

i know this is a old thread, but i just HAD to chime in.
i own several 10MM firearms. glock 20, 20C, delta elite, springfield omega,ect. i have fired 40 S&W out of every single one of them with absolutely NO ISSUES whatsoever, and accuracy was fine.. its a common thing with the glock 10mms. you can fire 40 S&W out of any 10mm that has an extractor thats tuned stiff, so it ( the 40) will headspace off of the extractor.i was a gunsmith for years with my own shop, and never saw one single 10mm come thru with damage from shooting 40 thru it, and ive probably tuned a couple hundred to shoot the 40 for my customers

i have fired 2 full 1 gallon paint cans of 40 out of my 10s ( apprx 1500 rounds). if you own a glock 10mm, go for it, right out of the box. if you have a 1911 pattern gun, tune the extractor tight, and youll not have an issue either.

i have to agree about doing your homework. contact your local (hopefully competent) gunsmit and see what he says. when you ask questions like this on the internet, you get more opinions ( crap that people have read somewere else, and then attempt to comment authoritatively o). than true straight answers to technical questions.
Pretty neat stuff. I'm not going to make a habit if it, but I will have try it in my G29.
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Old 01-07-2010, 5:42 PM
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Ehhh, Sure... Why not!
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Old 01-08-2010, 1:48 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sorensen440 View Post
Max pressure on a 40 is 32,633 psi
Max pressure on a 10mm is 37,500 psi

That's a pretty big difference in pressure if you ask me
(esp if your gun doesn't fully support the case as some don't)

Yes a big difference which makes it pretty safe to shoot a 40 in a 10.
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Old 01-08-2010, 1:53 AM
randy randy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cineski View Post
I don't say this often, mayhem, but you're just plain old dumb for shooting a 40 out of a 45. I hope to god I'm never at a range you're at. As for shooting 40 out of a 10, I personally wouldn't do this, but then again, there's a lot of things I wouldn't do that other's have no common sense not to do. The issue is, I don't want to be near anyone that's shooting a gun with a bullet not in spec for that gun. Unfortunately that's the world we live in. Idiots can ruin it for everyone around them. And it is NOT COMMON to shoot 40 out of a Glock. Go over to GlockTalk and you'll see the same arguments. Some saying "Eh, it's alright," and others who disagree. If you're really that hard up for cash to shoot your guns, maybe you should trade your 10mm for a .22?
If you want to split hairs the 10 and 40 bullets are identical. The cartridge is different.

There's not going to be any damage by shooting a 40 out of a 45. NONE nothing nada. Or 9 out of a 40. If you think there will be then you need to do some reading or have somebody explain to you how firearms/cartridges work.
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