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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #481  
Old 03-24-2017, 6:53 AM
BJJ223 BJJ223 is offline
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Jesus Christ was not the timid wimp that modern society makes him out to be. He spoke harshly to stubborn evil people.

John 8:44-45King James Version (KJV)

Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.


This offends the PC meow men that infest our society.

As further proof, Jesus Christ one handedly drove all the money changers out of the Temple. He turned over tables and acted with righteous anger.

One of his last instructions to his followers was to sell their cloak if they had to and buy a weapon

Luke 22:36

Then said he unto them, But now, he that hath a purse, let him take it, and likewise his scrip: and he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one.


I am sure he wrote this verse for people claiming to be Christians like "God Bless America"

Revelation 3:15-17 King James Version (KJV)

I know thy works, that thou art neither cold nor hot: I would thou wert cold or hot. So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.
  #482  
Old 03-24-2017, 9:09 AM
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THE MOST BEAUTIFUL ROSE

The park bench was deserted as I sat down to read
Beneath the long, straggly branches of an old willow tree.
Disillusioned by life with good reason to frown,
For the world was intent on dragging me down.

And if that weren't enough to ruin my day,
A young boy out of breath approached me, all tired from play.
He stood right before me with his head tilted down
And said with great excitement, "Look what I found"

In his hand was a flower, and what a pitiful sight,
With its petals all worn-not enough rain, or to little light
Wanting him to take his dead flower and go off to play,
I faked a small smile and then shifted away.

But instead of retreating he sat next to my side
And placed the flower to his nose and
declared with overacted surprise,
"It sure smells pretty and it's beautiful too.
That's why I picked it; here, it's for you."

The weed before me was dying or dead.
Not vibrant of colors, orange, yellow or red.
But I knew he must take it, or he might never leave.
So I reached for the flower, and replied "Just what I need."

But instead of him placing the flower in my hand,
He held it midair without reason or plan.
It was then that I noticed for the very first time
That weed-toting boy could not see: he was blind.

I heard my voice quiver, tears shone like the sun
As I thanked him for picking the very best one.
"You're welcome," he smiled, and then ran off to play,
Unaware of the impact he had on my day.

I sat there and wondered how he managed to see
A self-pitying woman beneath an old willow tree.
How did he know of my self indulged plight?
Perhaps from his heart, he'd been blessed with true sight.

Through the eyes of a blind child, at last I could see
The problem was not with the world; the problem was me.
And for all of those times I myself had been blind,
I vowed to see the beauty in life, and appreciate every second that's mine.

And then I held that wilted flower up to my nose
And breathed in the fragrance of a beautiful rose
And smiled as I watched that young boy, another weed in his hand
About to change the life of as unsuspecting old man.


Bob.
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  #483  
Old 03-24-2017, 9:18 AM
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How was a blind boy running around?

IT WAS A MIRACLE!!!!!!!!!


Last edited by God Bless America; 03-24-2017 at 9:33 AM..
  #484  
Old 03-24-2017, 10:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by God Bless America View Post
How was a blind boy running around?

IT WAS A MIRACLE!!!!!!!!!

Hahahaha...yes.....
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Fewer people are killed with all rifles each year (323 in 2011) than with shotguns (356), hammers and clubs (496), and hands and feet (728).
  #485  
Old 03-24-2017, 11:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eta34 View Post
Surprised this is still going. Not sure what any of this has to do with the OP's original question.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oceanbob View Post
This^^^^

That answer is Yes.....let's support the NRA regardless.

We need them.

Be well kids

Bob
The main feature film ended long ago. Anyone sticking around here is in for the stuff after the credits.
  #486  
Old 03-24-2017, 1:54 PM
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CRPA and NRA. We all need to unite for a common goal. Look at how Repulicans are fighting with each other while all the leftists are organizing and slowing spreading like a virus from Calif. to Nevada, Oregon, Washington, etc. We all need to come together for our common good. BTW, even though I'm not a bible thumper, I just renewed my NRA for a 5 year membership. It's not that much money in the scope of things.
  #487  
Old 03-24-2017, 7:27 PM
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The NRA is filled with guys like BJJ223. The microsecond guys like that get in charge, it's all over for freedom.

I'd rather have no second amendment , then live in a world controlled by fanatical Christians who can't reason themselves out of a fairy tale.
  #488  
Old 03-24-2017, 9:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dieselpower View Post
The NRA is filled with guys like BJJ223. The microsecond guys like that get in charge, it's all over for freedom.

I'd rather have no second amendment , then live in a world controlled by fanatical Christians who can't reason themselves out of a fairy tale.
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  #489  
Old 03-24-2017, 11:10 PM
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Originally Posted by dieselpower View Post
The NRA is filled with guys like BJJ223. The microsecond guys like that get in charge, it's all over for freedom.
He might want to convert you, but he doesn't want to legislate against you. Given a chance, you'd legislate against him in a heartbeat because you believe you have that right as a matter of "protection."

BJJ223 thinks you're wrong, you believe he is evil. The difference is that only one would *actually* try to take the rights of the other away. Which one is it, hmmmm?
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  #490  
Old 03-25-2017, 12:14 AM
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I'm an atheist. Also a lifetime member of the NRA. We all have our choices to make. I do think that the NRA should keep their noses out of places where they don't belong and stick to gun rights advocacy. A while back there was a mass shooting that they blamed on video games, kind of pissed me off as I am a gamer as well. Never the less they remain the #1 lobbying organization on behalf of our 2A rights, and as such they will always have my support. I agree with OP in that, while my political beliefs are greatly divergent from that of the stereotypical conservative right winger, I have never been made to feel unwelcome here because of it. The only people who really get flamed on these forums are the ones who don't support our rights, which is as it should be IMO.
  #491  
Old 03-25-2017, 8:58 AM
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Typical lie from IVC. My position of absolute no religious laws or rules of law means religion is targeted, while religious law against gay, other religion and freedom of speech is ok...

What a load of BS.

This is why I no longer give money to the NRA or any organization with a religious membership. Members like IVC infect it with help for BJJ223 and promote tyranny while lying through their teeth about others.
  #492  
Old 04-03-2017, 7:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by God Bless America View Post
We don't want to watch your atheist sermons any more than you care to watch our religious sermons.
I have watched many and long ago went to church every week. try spending as much time watching science programs as you do studying religion.

Italian scientist and scholar Galileo made pioneering observations that laid the foundation for modern physics and astronomy. and the church jailed him for it.
  #493  
Old 04-04-2017, 6:05 AM
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Originally Posted by ben-wah View Post
I have watched many and long ago went to church every week. try spending as much time watching science programs as you do studying religion.

Italian scientist and scholar Galileo made pioneering observations that laid the foundation for modern physics and astronomy. and the church jailed him for it.
Its why religion is poison to society. At least when something is found wrong in science, scientist work toward understanding why and either validate the new information or prove it false. Religion just ignores, silences and destroys anything that is in conflict with its teachings. This yet another reason I do not give money to an organization that panders to religion.
  #494  
Old 04-04-2017, 10:47 AM
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Originally Posted by AnarchoPunk View Post
I'm an atheist. Also a lifetime member of the NRA. We all have our choices to make.
This is what it comes down to. What does one hold in higher regard and if it's gun rights, do they back up their words with deeds.

I've no objection if a person chooses otherwise, although equating the risk to the 2nd Amendment posed by the government with the risk to the 1st by NRA seems to me a vast overreach. But such folks ought to have the intellectual integrity to acknowldge they do little or no good on the gun rights front, that they take a free ride and let others do the work.

Can't fault a person for reaching a conclusion with which we disagree. Being a hypocrite is a different matter.
  #495  
Old 04-04-2017, 2:00 PM
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Originally Posted by dieselpower View Post
Its why religion is poison to society. At least when something is found wrong in science, scientist work toward understanding why and either validate the new information or prove it false. Religion just ignores, silences and destroys anything that is in conflict with its teachings. This yet another reason I do not give money to an organization that panders to religion.
To begin with I'm not a RC, so I'm not here to defend everything RC. Secondly, the Roman church did correct it's view of the solar system. Thirdly, the RC didn't ultimately ignore, ultimately silence, or destroy Galileo. At least get your history correct.

Maybe the electro-chemical reaction going on in your head is having an off day.

And amazingly, we Christians find that atheism is truly a poisonous position. I guess it all depends on your bias. But, I will agree, up to a point, that almost all religion beside orthodox Christianity is poisonous at some level, just like atheism.

Guys like you come and go, but Christ will continue building His church long after you're moldering in the grave and long after you're forgotten.

Where there is still breath, there is still hope of belief.

Last edited by TomMcC; 04-04-2017 at 3:04 PM..
  #496  
Old 04-04-2017, 4:06 PM
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Originally Posted by ben-wah View Post
I have watched many and long ago went to church every week. try spending as much time watching science programs as you do studying religion.
I spend much, much more time in scientific study than I do religious study. Furthermore, I have a science degree, but not a religious degree.

Quote:
Italian scientist and scholar Galileo made pioneering observations that laid the foundation for modern physics and astronomy. and the church jailed him for it.
His legacy was also reformed by the church. Galileo was right and the church later said so.
  #497  
Old 04-05-2017, 11:37 AM
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You guys are carefully leaving out several key facts that are not in question.
1- there was no historical person named Moses, who lead the Jews out of slavery. It's a made up fairy tale that has been debunked. All religions with this at their core are flawed.
2- There was no global flood. All religions with this at their core are flawed.
3- Christians claim Jews don't know their history, while the Jews say Christians are making stuff up that isn't and was never true. Muslims claim both of them are making stuff up... and all three have the same God. And all three refuse to examine their flaws to find which of these religions has the more truth.

4- Evolution is 100% fact. There is so much evidence proving this it's easier to claim gravity and germs don't exist and are fake then Evolution, yet 50% of Americans don't agree with that.
  #498  
Old 04-05-2017, 1:33 PM
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Originally Posted by dieselpower View Post
You guys are carefully leaving out several key facts that are not in question.
1- there was no historical person named Moses, who lead the Jews out of slavery. It's a made up fairy tale that has been debunked. All religions with this at their core are flawed.
2- There was no global flood. All religions with this at their core are flawed.
3- Christians claim Jews don't know their history, while the Jews say Christians are making stuff up that isn't and was never true. Muslims claim both of them are making stuff up... and all three have the same God. And all three refuse to examine their flaws to find which of these religions has the more truth.

4- Evolution is 100% fact. There is so much evidence proving this it's easier to claim gravity and germs don't exist and are fake then Evolution, yet 50% of Americans don't agree with that.
How do you know Moses was not real, were you living at the time?

Explain how dirt, water, and gases, you know dead stuff, evolved into the first living cell
  #499  
Old 04-05-2017, 2:01 PM
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Historically, the barbarism and cruelty of the of the Roman empire was gradually and thankfully subdued by the propagation of Christian thought and practice. Europe was more and more civilized by this propagation. Was this perfectly done, no, there were still men who lusted after power and tyrannies did come and go. The church was set upon by the hierarchy, leading to the protestant reformation. Was this halting progress made because of atheistic thinking, well NO.

The United States of America, arguably, the greatest, but still flawed, country to ever grace the planet, came into existence because, again, Christian influence. Though, not all the founders were orthodox Christians by any stretch, they were all, with the possible except of Paine, theists. Theists most definitely influenced by Christian thought. Was atheistic thought very much of an influence....NO. Rights came from a Creator.

Chattel slavery was done away with in the British sphere, without bloodshed, by again, those of a Christian persuasion. Slavery in the USA was done away with by again those of Christian and theistic persuasion. Sadly the southern church and many southern Christians sinned by ultimately fighting for the preservation of slavery. Was atheistic thought fundamental to the abolition slavery in those days?.......NO again.

And today the Democratic party, the party least influenced by orthodox Christianity, the party that explicitly kicked the idea of God out of their convention, the party that most probably has the most atheists in it's ranks, the party that is at the very root of pretty much every evil in this country since the time of Andrew Jackson is trying to disarm us. A party more and more denying that there is a creator God who blesses us with inalienable rights.

Maybe the NRA knows something that the atheists on this thread don't know.
  #500  
Old 04-05-2017, 2:18 PM
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Yes, yes, yes, yes. We've heard it all before. The Christians invented everything, including democracy, hospitals, and cream cheese bagels.

As a person NOT of an Abrahamic, monotheistic religion, I find this laughable at best. Google "Christianization of Europe" and a delightful Christian (actually two of them!) named Theodosius. Plenty to get started with right there, even without bringing up niceties such as the Inquisition (of which office STILL exists to this day) or what happened to Hypatia of Alexandria.
  #501  
Old 04-05-2017, 2:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Zorba View Post
Yes, yes, yes, yes. We've heard it all before. The Christians invented everything, including democracy, hospitals, and cream cheese bagels.

As a person NOT of an Abrahamic, monotheistic religion, I find this laughable at best. Google "Christianization of Europe" and a delightful Christian (actually two of them!) named Theodosius. Plenty to get started with right there, even without bringing up niceties such as the Inquisition (of which office STILL exists to this day) or what happened to Hypatia of Alexandria.
Since you've heard it all, which really isn't an argument, maybe you can move on. You seem to have not engaged at all with what I said. Oh well.

And like all broad brushers, you don't make allowances for the vast majority of professed Christians who didn't do awful things and you don't seem to be able to distinguish between the Papacy and Presbyterians or Baptists, or the Waldensians. The Roman church did do many bad things.....but what's that have to do with Jesus Christ and His Apostles?

Last edited by TomMcC; 04-05-2017 at 2:59 PM..
  #502  
Old 04-05-2017, 3:41 PM
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How do you know Moses was not real, were you living at the time?
Well, believing something without facts, such as there was no Moses, would be a matter of faith, wouldn't it?

I am not Mormon but I most certainly believe there was a Joseph Smith.

I am not Muslim, but I cannot say there was no Muhammed at the time. In fact, there probably was. I just don't believe he was divine.

An atheist should feel the same way about Moses. Given all of the historic references, there is no basis to conclude there was no famous person at the time. Those references are evidence. Cold, hard, facts. Divinity, on the other hand, is a matter of faith.

Anti-theists, however, often believe without proof that there was no Moses. As a matter of unwitting faith. Which is ironic, given the proclivity for anti-theists to tout rationality as the only thing worth believing in.

What in the name of Science has this world come to?

  #503  
Old 04-05-2017, 4:15 PM
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If you can only work with people that agree with every opinion you have, you will be very lonely...
  #504  
Old 04-05-2017, 4:25 PM
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...what's that have to do with Jesus Christ and His Apostles?
Exactly. What does "the church" or that darn BOOK have to do with the Christ? Yet most Christians seem to think "the church" is the most important thing, and worship the BOOK rather than the God.
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Old 04-05-2017, 6:59 PM
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Originally Posted by TomMcC View Post
How do you know Moses was not real, were you living at the time?

Explain how dirt, water, and gases, you know dead stuff, evolved into the first living cell
1- We know Moses was not real because we can trace the story to the first guy who said, "hey look, I found this book written by a guy named Moses, and he says we are the favorite Tribe of a God called Yahweh." The book just happens to be written in my native language, even though my language was not even invented yet in the time frame when this guy Moses wrote all this down."

Let me give you an analogy...

Its 2017. Some guy goes up to President Trump and gives him a book. The Book says it was written by a guy name Cooper. Cooper was the best friend of Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ told Cooper that when Trump became President of the United States, he was there because Jesus Christ wanted that and also wants Trump to invade the world and take it over...because the USA is Gods tribe of people and Americans are better than everyone else.

The book is written in modern English. Has words and phrases only in use by modern Americans.

2- We know the entire history of the Jewish people because we found the Libraries Ugarit, the capitol city of Canaan.

3- We also know the history of Egypt, which never enslaved the Jews and we know who were the builders of Egypt's mega structures, and they were not (for the most part) slaves. The vast majority of the builders were professional guilds. They were middle to upper class educated. These guilds lasted THOUSANDS of years.

4- First off abiogenisis is not evolution. And you are wrong, abiogenis is possible and has been shown to work in at least a dozen different ways.

5- Evolution is the progression of life, not the beginning of life.

here's a 9th grade level video on abiogenisis...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bdozVq81gog



Quote:
Originally Posted by God Bless America View Post
Well, believing something without facts, such as there was no Moses, would be a matter of faith, wouldn't it?

I am not Mormon but I most certainly believe there was a Joseph Smith.

I am not Muslim, but I cannot say there was no Muhammed at the time. In fact, there probably was. I just don't believe he was divine.

An atheist should feel the same way about Moses. Given all of the historic references, there is no basis to conclude there was no famous person at the time. Those references are evidence. Cold, hard, facts. Divinity, on the other hand, is a matter of faith.

Anti-theists, however, often believe without proof that there was no Moses. As a matter of unwitting faith. Which is ironic, given the proclivity for anti-theists to tout rationality as the only thing worth believing in.

What in the name of Science has this world come to?

Its not faith when you uncover hard evidence of a lie.
None of what is written in the Book of Moses is true, so what does that tell you?

Not only is the information in the book false, its written and phrased in a language that was not around in the time it was said to be written.

Not only is it written in a false language, has false information but doesnt match the actual written history of the area it is said to be from.

analogy...
Trump's Secretary of State, gives him a Book said to be written by the best friend of Jesus Christ telling Trump America and Americans are Gods chosen people and everything that Jesus Christ is doing 2000 years ago was to get America to invade the world. Jesus Christ's best friend freed Americans from enslavement in Germany with the help from Jesus who magically guided the American people across the Atlantic Ocean and it only took 11 million Americans 200 years to make the trip in canoes. It was a fight the whole way.. along the way, the Americans lead by Jesus's best friend, invaded Greenland killing everyone there, then heading down into North America and took over New York.

If you cant spot all the errors in that, and understand why that would be viewed as fake...I can't help you with the Book of Moses, because that book is basically the same.
  #506  
Old 04-05-2017, 7:23 PM
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*sigh* Not surprisingly this has gone off topic and become pointless.

To answer the OP it's short and simple, if you want to donate to the 2A effort in the manner that will actually get stuff done and go towards the effort here are the three places.

National and California 2A: NRA-ILA

California 2A: CRPA Foundation

California Shooting Sports and Education: CGSSA

It's that simple and no need to go off the rails like this thread did.
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