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  #1  
Old 08-13-2019, 8:28 AM
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Default Updating CFARS personal info for ammo check after reject

Is there a single thread or subforum dedicated to problems with the online ammunition purchase system ? Specifically on how to navigate the system screens, the instructions on how to enter, and what operations should be performed with reject or no answer ? Thank you !

Edit: I went through the ammo thread, it is not even close.
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Old 08-13-2019, 2:05 PM
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There is a DOJ memo about this. Its about 14 pages and I would suggest printing it and keeping it handy.
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Old 08-14-2019, 11:43 AM
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Thanks aces. Do you have a link ? This thread was moved to FFL section, but Lord knows why. Nothing to do with FFL> Nothing. Sometimes the mods here are random and capricious. what the **** ??
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Old 08-14-2019, 1:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flouncer View Post
Thanks aces. Do you have a link ? This thread was moved to FFL section, but Lord knows why. Nothing to do with FFL> Nothing. Sometimes the mods here are random and capricious. what the **** ??
I moved it.

Who else but FFLs and 'ammunition vendors' (substantially the same set) has access to those screens?
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I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.


Gregg Easterbrook’s “Law of Doomsaying”: Predict catastrophe no later than ten years hence but no sooner than five years away — soon enough to terrify people but distant enough that they will not remember that you were wrong.


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Old 08-14-2019, 8:04 PM
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I was trying to find out if there is a separate dedicated thread to the ammunition purchase quagmire, specifically what the consumer screens mean. And what to do if rejected. That has nothing to do with being an FFL. I am not sure how to make that clear, or even how to articulate my exact problem. I was at DOJ in Sacramento last week and the guard at entry said I was the 5th person that AM that questions regarding the consumers CFRS system.

A consumer only gets to see the consumer screens, and they have no directions or explanations.

So I ask again, is there a thread dedicated to ammo purchases, the CFRA screens, and how/what to proceed if you are rejected or as in my case put in permanent limbo by being placed in a "pending" status.

I do not see ANY thread on this, I would think it warrants a permanent sticky.

My first ammo purchase was denied at Sportmans Warehouse in Sacramento. They said nothing came up under my name and address and CDL and that I had to create a CFRS account. I did so and selected one of my recent purchases to list. Two weeks later I get a rejection saying that weapon was already listed. Then why did DOJ reject my initial attempt ?

SO I speak with staff at another store and am advised to complete the change of address for that weapon. I do so very carefully. That was three weeks ago. So I am dead in the water and I can't find any help on this site. There should be HUNDREDS of queries on this. Where are they ? Thanks
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Old 08-14-2019, 8:23 PM
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No link since you have to access the DES to read the bulletin.
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Old 08-14-2019, 9:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flouncer View Post
I was trying to find out if there is a separate dedicated thread to the ammunition purchase quagmire, specifically what the consumer screens mean. And what to do if rejected. That has nothing to do with being an FFL. I am not sure how to make that clear, or even how to articulate my exact problem. I was at DOJ in Sacramento last week and the guard at entry said I was the 5th person that AM that questions regarding the consumers CFRS system.

A consumer only gets to see the consumer screens, and they have no directions or explanations.

So I ask again, is there a thread dedicated to ammo purchases, the CFRA screens, and how/what to proceed if you are rejected or as in my case put in permanent limbo by being placed in a "pending" status.

I do not see ANY thread on this, I would think it warrants a permanent sticky.

My first ammo purchase was denied at Sportmans Warehouse in Sacramento. They said nothing came up under my name and address and CDL and that I had to create a CFRS account. I did so and selected one of my recent purchases to list. Two weeks later I get a rejection saying that weapon was already listed. Then why did DOJ reject my initial attempt ?

SO I speak with staff at another store and am advised to complete the change of address for that weapon. I do so very carefully. That was three weeks ago. So I am dead in the water and I can't find any help on this site. There should be HUNDREDS of queries on this. Where are they ? Thanks
Would it be an accurate summary to say you want to know how to use CFARS to change your personal data to get around an ammo purchase denial?

If so, no there is no thread yet - this cluster**** is still pretty new.

As ace has noted, the actual ammo purchase stuff IS a FFL function, but even though you guessed that was the topic, that doesn’t seem to be what you mean.

I’m working from my phone, so hard to do stuff; if you’d put your problem and attempts to solve them in a new thread in How CA Laws Affect Me, that can start the thread you are looking for.
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I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.


Gregg Easterbrook’s “Law of Doomsaying”: Predict catastrophe no later than ten years hence but no sooner than five years away — soon enough to terrify people but distant enough that they will not remember that you were wrong.


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Old 08-14-2019, 10:11 PM
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Watch this Webinar replay:
https://cc.readytalk.com/cc/playback...k.do?id=2u3524
(You can enter anything for your name, does not have to be real)

Read this:
http://michellawyers.com/wp-content/...-Ammo-Regs.pdf

See this flowchart:
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Last edited by SkyHawk; 08-14-2019 at 10:13 PM..
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Old 08-14-2019, 10:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flouncer View Post
I was trying to find out if there is a separate dedicated thread to the ammunition purchase quagmire, specifically what the consumer screens mean. And what to do if rejected. That has nothing to do with being an FFL. I am not sure how to make that clear, or even how to articulate my exact problem. I was at DOJ in Sacramento last week and the guard at entry said I was the 5th person that AM that questions regarding the consumers CFRS system.

A consumer only gets to see the consumer screens, and they have no directions or explanations.

So I ask again, is there a thread dedicated to ammo purchases, the CFRA screens, and how/what to proceed if you are rejected or as in my case put in permanent limbo by being placed in a "pending" status.

I do not see ANY thread on this, I would think it warrants a permanent sticky.

My first ammo purchase was denied at Sportmans Warehouse in Sacramento. They said nothing came up under my name and address and CDL and that I had to create a CFRS account. I did so and selected one of my recent purchases to list. Two weeks later I get a rejection saying that weapon was already listed. Then why did DOJ reject my initial attempt ?

SO I speak with staff at another store and am advised to complete the change of address for that weapon. I do so very carefully. That was three weeks ago. So I am dead in the water and I can't find any help on this site. There should be HUNDREDS of queries on this. Where are they ? Thanks
I think I know what you're talking about. In case things are unclear, I may repeat things you already know, but in an effort to be thorough, I'll lay them out here.

It sounds like you were rejected at Sportsman's Warehouse for a standard eligibility check (keyword: standard). To be approved for a standard eligibility check, you must have a firearm registered in the Automated Firearms System (AFS) and certain personal information must be current in relation to that AFS entry: full name, date of birth, driver license/ID number, and address. If you were rejected for a standard eligibility check, one of these things did not match up between your AFS gun entry and what was entered into the system for your ammo purchase.

You then created an account on CFARS. I'll bet that you paid $19 and submitted a Firearm Ownership Report. This form serves the purpose of registering a firearm in AFS. but since the firearm you listed is already registered in AFS, your form was rejected.

I'm unclear as to what happened next, however. This is what you should do. Log back onto CFARS. From the main menu, click "Automated Firearm System (AFS) Personal Information Update". Then, click "I want to update my information". On the actual form, in the "Current Information" section, be sure to input your address exactly as shown on your CDL (assuming that's your current address), as it will make ammo purchases go smoothly moving forward. Street vs. st, avenue vs. ave, etc. Match it exactly.

Enter the firearm information. If you have your DROS paperwork, that would be helpful. Sometimes the exact firearm model is tough to pin down, but DROS paperwork will help.

Then enter your information at the time of the purchase. Again, your DROS paperwork will come in handy, so you can duplicate the address where you lived at that time. All this info you enter has to match your existing AFS record exactly.

Do not upload any documents. No document is required for an AFS entry address change. If you upload a document, the process takes longer, as a human being must review and process your document.

After you submit, your transaction will end up in your Shopping Cart in the upper-right corner. Click "View Cart". Click the little box next to your submission, then click "Check Out". There's no fee for this process.

Once you've checked out, you're done. You then want to periodically check your "Notices" section in upper left corner. If approved or rejected, you will be notified there. Supposedly the notification should come within 24 hours.

Last edited by BagelBites; 08-14-2019 at 10:33 PM..
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Old 08-15-2019, 6:10 AM
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Thanks, BagelBites!

Moving the thread, renaming, cleaning up.
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I've been saying that for years ...

There is no value at all complaining or analyzing or reading tea leaves to decide what these bills really mean or actually do; any bill with a chance to pass will be bad for gun owners.

The details only count after the Governor signs the bills.


Gregg Easterbrook’s “Law of Doomsaying”: Predict catastrophe no later than ten years hence but no sooner than five years away — soon enough to terrify people but distant enough that they will not remember that you were wrong.


Not a lawyer, just Some Guy On The Interwebs.


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Old 08-15-2019, 7:32 AM
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Thanks all for your help. Bagel diagnosed my situation almost exactly. Back when I purchased my weapons, I never gave a thought to keeping my DROS paperwork. I went to the range and went hunting. Over. I have moved several times and have several recent, in the last ten years firearm purchases. I carefully did the address update to my most recent purchase. That is fail mode that is pending now.

I can try to enter another weapon, a hunting rifle and I have my correct address for that purchase. April 2018. It is not my current address. Should I try that ?

Thanks again.
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Old 08-15-2019, 8:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flouncer View Post
Thanks all for your help. Bagel diagnosed my situation almost exactly. Back when I purchased my weapons, I never gave a thought to keeping my DROS paperwork. I went to the range and went hunting. Over. I have moved several times and have several recent, in the last ten years firearm purchases. I carefully did the address update to my most recent purchase. That is fail mode that is pending now.

I can try to enter another weapon, a hunting rifle and I have my correct address for that purchase. April 2018. It is not my current address. Should I try that ?

Thanks again.
For the AFS update that you've already done, did you upload a document to that? How do you know it's pending? Have you checked "Notices" in the upper left corner? Are you sure you checked this out of your cart, or is it now showing in your "Pending Cart"?

You can do unlimited address updates. If you have time, sure, do the rifle you purchased in 2018. If your AFS update gets rejected, then you know that something you entered (gun information or information at time of purchase, probably address) doesn't match exactly to your AFS entry for that gun. In that case, you may want to go back to that dealer and request a copy of the DROS paperwork and try again.

Aside from all of this, you can also do a basic eligibility check (keyword: basic). It costs $19 and may take a few days, but there's no concern there with any of your AFS record. It's just a regular background check.
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Old 08-15-2019, 6:53 PM
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Originally Posted by BagelBites View Post
For the AFS update that you've already done, did you upload a document to that? No How do you know it's pending? There is a pending box present Have you checked "Notices" in the upper left corner?
Yes, there is anotice but it does not say anything !!!
Are you sure you checked this out of your cart, or is it now showing in your "Pending Cart"? There is nothing in my cart Do I put the pending item in the cart ??

You can do unlimited address updates. If you have time, sure, do the rifle you purchased in 2018. If your AFS update gets rejected, then you know that something you entered (gun information or information at time of purchase, probably address) doesn't match exactly to your AFS entry for that gun. In that case, you may want to go back to that dealer and request a copy of the DROS paperwork and try again.

Aside from all of this, you can also do a basic eligibility check (keyword: basic). It costs $19 and may take a few days, but there's no concern there with any of your AFS record. It's just a regular background check.
Thanks Bagel.. I started this response three times. Deleted in absolute frustration. Unable to find a host for pics so that I can post screen shots here. I carefully looked over my DROS from May 2018. It, the dealer's writing, very carelessly states my Address as living in "W/Sacramento. There is no such place. It's either West Sacramento or W Sacramento. I'll wager the odds against this DROS attempt at 1:5. Easier to just purchase another weapon at my new residence.

When you go to "update" you have to start from scratch. You enter the weapon, the serial number etc. Then you enter the old DROS address and the new current one that matches your Real CDL. Two chances to make an imperfect data entry with several variables. See the one regarding "W/sacramento".
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Old 08-15-2019, 7:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Flouncer View Post
Thanks Bagel.. I started this response three times. Deleted in absolute frustration. Unable to find a host for pics so that I can post screen shots here. I carefully looked over my DROS from May 2018. It, the dealer's writing, very carelessly states my Address as living in "W/Sacramento. There is no such place. It's either West Sacramento or W Sacramento. I'll wager the odds against this DROS attempt at 1:5. Easier to just purchase another weapon at my new residence.

When you go to "update" you have to start from scratch. You enter the weapon, the serial number etc. Then you enter the old DROS address and the new current one that matches your Real CDL. Two chances to make an imperfect data entry with several variables. See the one regarding "W/sacramento".
If it's in your "Pending Cart", it hasn't been submitted. Open Pending Cart, add transaction to cart, check out of cart. If this isn't what you're talking about, then I'm not sure. Yes, screenshots would be helpful.
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Old 08-15-2019, 7:48 PM
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Done. We'll see. Thanks for your persistence. I owe you a beer in any event
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Old 08-15-2019, 8:11 PM
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Done. We'll see. Thanks for your persistence. I owe you a beer in any event
My pleasure. Keep us posted please.
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Old 08-16-2019, 5:21 AM
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Received a DOJ CFAR email over night. The email stated that I had important information in CFARS account. You were correct, I had a notice in the CFAR account which stated I had to select another link and approve of the DOJ .pdf letter stating I had updated my information. So this entire time my action was stagnant because I didn't add an update to the "cart", apparently. Since I paid the $19 three weeks ago, I didn't think I needed to do anything with the "cart". I'll attempt a purchase when the store opens a 9 AM.
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Old 08-16-2019, 5:59 AM
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What great example of the total fluster cluck of a government we have in this state.
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Old 08-16-2019, 11:43 AM
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Default DING !! Fries are Done !!

I was able to purchase ammo this AM at my local store. The DOJ e-mail with the .pdf from Xavier acknowledging that I was updated in the system was stamped 1:01 AM today. I input yesterday at approximately 4:30 PM. Collective sigh of relief. My simple lack of knowledge and how to input info stopped his purchase process. Rather than try to justify my ignorance or rant further I am motivated to work with some of the contributors to this thread and the mods to create a screen shot step by step that follows the flow chart shown herein earlier.

I did not see any instructions linked or connected to the CFARS page. I know "memos" etc have been mentioned but I do not see them where they are needed, at the online document itself. If this is an oversight, it would be the first thing I would emphasize in any instructional advice.

One of the reasons my transaction floundered, besides my ineptness, was that the FFl at the store was unable to see my PC screen as events unfolded, as was I of his. There fore there is no collective procedural sharing of information.
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Old 09-06-2019, 6:13 AM
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Following this thread due to very recent similar experience.

I had NOT tried to buy ammunition anywhere since the reg change(s), but I have moved since my most recent firearm purchase. So like a Good Boy® I attempted to follow what I thought would be the spirit of the law and update my address in CFARS. My license (DL) does NOT show my updated/new address.

It did not work. I was rejected. Based on the information above I **think** I need to have purchased a firearm whilst living at my current address. OR it was rejected because the gun I chose from the pulldown menu is one I bought several addresses ago. OR I need to go to DMV and acquire a new actual license with my current address.

I don't frigging know.

But I suppose the good news is that the State of California most certainly does not have a (even modestly functional) firearm registry.
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Old 09-06-2019, 1:43 PM
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Originally Posted by slobmonster View Post
Following this thread due to very recent similar experience.

I had NOT tried to buy ammunition anywhere since the reg change(s), but I have moved since my most recent firearm purchase. So like a Good Boy® I attempted to follow what I thought would be the spirit of the law and update my address in CFARS. My license (DL) does NOT show my updated/new address.

It did not work. I was rejected. Based on the information above I **think** I need to have purchased a firearm whilst living at my current address. OR it was rejected because the gun I chose from the pulldown menu is one I bought several addresses ago. OR I need to go to DMV and acquire a new actual license with my current address.

I don't frigging know.

But I suppose the good news is that the State of California most certainly does not have a (even modestly functional) firearm registry.
Is your dmv record updated to reflect your current address?
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Old 09-06-2019, 2:44 PM
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Is your dmv record updated to reflect your current address?
To the best of my knowledge, yes it does. FWIW the first rejection came very quickly (within hours) and the second attempt seems to be taking longer.

If I get stymied again I'll check with DMV.

Cheers and thank you
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Old 09-11-2019, 6:49 AM
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Glad I found this thread. I tried to buy ammo and was rejected- due to addresses as I had moved.
Created a CFARS account and entered in my information this went ok.
I pulled out some dros forms and did the update information selection. I entered a handgun, shotgun, Ruger 19/22, two AR receivers. System approved the handguns rejected all the others. I'm not finding any lucid information on the doj website and still waiting to hear. Last time I contacted them the response was close to 3 weeks later..
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Old 09-11-2019, 9:03 PM
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Glad I found this thread. I tried to buy ammo and was rejected- due to addresses as I had moved.
Created a CFARS account and entered in my information this went ok.
I pulled out some dros forms and did the update information selection. I entered a handgun, shotgun, Ruger 19/22, two AR receivers. System approved the handguns rejected all the others. I'm not finding any lucid information on the doj website and still waiting to hear. Last time I contacted them the response was close to 3 weeks later..
You only need to update one record.
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Old 09-13-2019, 5:54 AM
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Yeah, found that out later..... not the sharpest tool in the shed...
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