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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #281  
Old 02-10-2018, 9:44 PM
Jedediah Munroe Jedediah Munroe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BZB View Post
Once u submit a registration for the new BB AW BS law for a rifle before the deadline, if there are any errors within the application, can one continue to correct the mistakes going by the initial registration submission date, until everything r correct, where DOJ cannot say that it's now past the deadline, too late, too bad?


Regulations specify you have 30 days to address the incomplete application after which it will be cancelled with no refund of fee


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Last edited by Jedediah Munroe; 02-10-2018 at 10:26 PM..
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  #282  
Old 02-10-2018, 10:32 PM
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Originally Posted by BZB View Post
Once u submit a registration for the new BB AW BS law for a rifle before the deadline, if there are any errors within the application, can one continue to correct the mistakes going by the initial registration submission date, until everything r correct, where DOJ cannot say that it's now past the deadline, too late, too bad?


You must register by the deadline and if DOJ requests a change you have 30 days to respond. If you respond within that time period your application is still in process to be approved, unless DOJ requests other changes, that starts the 30 day clock all over again, or rejects your application. DOJ regulations for what you cannot register (and therefore their only reason to reject an application) are very specific. For example, DOJ request you confirm OAL with a tape measure and picture. You send in a pic showing >30Ē, youíll get approved. You send in a pic <30Ē youíll get rejected. As long as you keep answering their questions correctly with in 30 days and they keep asking more, the process appears to have no time limit.


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  #283  
Old 02-10-2018, 10:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Blade Gunner View Post
As long as you keep answering their questions correctly with in 30 days and they keep asking more, the process appears to have no time limit.
Except July 1st 2018, or at least submitted by then.
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Not checkers, not chess, its Jenga.
"The California matrix of gun control laws is among the harshest in the nation and are filled with criminal law traps for people of common intelligence who desire to obey the law." - U.S. District Judge Roger T. Benitez

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  #284  
Old 02-11-2018, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Blade Gunner View Post
You must register by the deadline and if DOJ requests a change you have 30 days to respond. If you respond within that time period your application is still in process to be approved...
Thank you
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  #285  
Old 02-11-2018, 1:09 PM
Howitzer1987 Howitzer1987 is offline
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On average, how long is it taking you guys to hear a response back from the DOJ as to whether the application has been approved or if corrections need to be made?
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  #286  
Old 02-11-2018, 1:38 PM
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Originally Posted by Howitzer1987 View Post
On average, how long is it taking you guys to hear a response back from the DOJ as to whether the application has been approved or if corrections need to be made?
Correction seem to be asked for within a week or two. Total processing time varies wildly and it's always a letter. The CFARS information about current status is solely limited to making corrections, the actual physical letter confirms the "approval" and the website will constantly show "in progress" even after you get the letter. Seems like 8 weeks is the going rate, but some waited up to 6 months.
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Not checkers, not chess, its Jenga.
"The California matrix of gun control laws is among the harshest in the nation and are filled with criminal law traps for people of common intelligence who desire to obey the law." - U.S. District Judge Roger T. Benitez

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  #287  
Old 02-11-2018, 1:47 PM
Jedediah Munroe Jedediah Munroe is offline
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I did some on day one 8/3/17 and Iím still waiting. Of course there was an 80%er in there to slow things down. I received last confirmation email a week or so ago so I have my fingers crossed Iíll finally get my letter sometime soon


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  #288  
Old 02-15-2018, 8:50 AM
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I registered two Rifles on Tuesday the 13th. Yesterday, I received a correction notice on one of the Rifles. I followed the recommendation on the registration guide of using the "Multi caliber" menu choice for AR style rifles. The DOJ agent on the rejection notice for my GAP 10 said I needed to put the caliber as "308mm" since it was listed on the receiver by GAP.

Actually on the receiver, it is marked "Caliber 308". I went into CFARS and corrected the caliber to "308 Win." from the menu. I noted to the DOJ agent in their E mail to me that "308mm" is not marked on the receiver and I put "308 Win" from the menu.

308mm? That's 12" a pretty good sized Artillery piece.

The GAP 10 has a PRS stock and I didn't mark the feature of a collapsable stock. I only marked the pistol grip as a feature on this rifle. There was no rejection notice on the PRS stock at this time.

The response from DOJ was prompt, only one day after submitting.

I'm curious to see if they will mess with me over the PRS stock as has been reported in other posts. The PRS stock does not telescope nor does it fold.

My other rifle was accepted, it is a Spikes AR and is marked "multi cal" on the receiver.



I'll update this when I hear back from DOJ.

*UPDATE* DOJ rejected my GAP 10 for the PRS Stock several days after I posted this. I had to go back and check the Telescoping or folding stock feature. Pure nonsense. I didn't argue, I corrected it and it was accepted.

Last edited by FLIGHT762; 03-10-2018 at 12:16 PM..
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  #289  
Old 02-15-2018, 2:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLIGHT762 View Post
I registered two Rifles on Tuesday the 13th. Yesterday, I received a correction notice on one of the Rifles. I followed the recommendation on the registration guide of using the "Multi caliber" menu choice for AR style rifles. The DOJ agent on the rejection notice for my GAP 10 said I needed to put the caliber as "308mm" since it was listed on the receiver by GAP.

Actually on the receiver, it is marked "Caliber 308". I went into CFARS and corrected the caliber to "308 Win." from the menu. I noted to the DOJ agent in their E mail to me that "308mm" is not marked on the receiver and I put "308 Win" from the menu.

308mm? That's 12" a pretty good sized Artillery piece.

The GAP 10 has a PRS stock and I didn't mark the feature of a collapsable stock. I only marked the pistol grip as a feature on this rifle. There was no rejection notice on the PRS stock at this time.

The response from DOJ was prompt, only one day after submitting.

I'm curious to see if they will mess with me over the PRS stock as has been reported in other posts. The PRS stock does not telescope nor does it fold.

My other rifle was accepted, it is a Spikes AR and is marked "multi cal" on the receiver.



I'll update this when I hear back from DOJ.
Did you have to submit a shot of the barrel caliber marking on the Spikes AR where the receiver lists multi cal?
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  #290  
Old 02-15-2018, 2:32 PM
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Originally Posted by FilmGuy View Post
Did you have to submit a shot of the barrel caliber marking on the Spikes AR where the receiver lists multi cal?
No.
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  #291  
Old 02-22-2018, 1:03 AM
b18bturboek9 b18bturboek9 is offline
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Ok I got a funny one for you guys. I have a cmmg dedicated 9mm lower but the lower has no caliber marking nor does my barrel. They asked me today to send caliber markings on either barrel or receiver but my cmmg lower has no caliber markings.. Kinda got me like wtf do I do now. Even on the dros paper it says 0000 for caliber.
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  #292  
Old 03-03-2018, 10:09 PM
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Default PRA is submitted

I submitted a CPRA request today for all DOJ documents pertaining to the employee training and process for the SB880 aw registration. I will let you know what I end up with - unless it is a raid and lockup. There is a price to be paid for freedom, so I will take it.

I quote:

"In enacting the CPRA, the Legislature stated that access to information concerning the conduct of the publicís business is a fundamental and necessary right for every person in the State. Cases interpreting the CPRA also have emphasized that its primary purpose is to give the public an opportunity to monitor the functioning of their government. The greater and more unfettered the public officialís power, the greater the publicís interest in monitoring the
governmental action.
"(emphasis added)
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  #293  
Old 03-04-2018, 4:46 AM
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Originally Posted by @miller View Post
I submitted a CPRA request today for all DOJ documents pertaining to the employee training and process for the SB880 aw registration. I will let you know what I end up with - unless it is a raid and lockup. There is a price to be paid for freedom, so I will take it.

I quote:

"In enacting the CPRA, the Legislature stated that access to information concerning the conduct of the publicís business is a fundamental and necessary right for every person in the State. Cases interpreting the CPRA also have emphasized that its primary purpose is to give the public an opportunity to monitor the functioning of their government. The greater and more unfettered the public officialís power, the greater the publicís interest in monitoring the
governmental action.
"(emphasis added)
Good luck

I hope you are an attorney otherwise little people in this state are ignored.
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  #294  
Old 03-04-2018, 7:22 AM
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Originally Posted by b18bturboek9 View Post
Ok I got a funny one for you guys. I have a cmmg dedicated 9mm lower but the lower has no caliber marking nor does my barrel. They asked me today to send caliber markings on either barrel or receiver but my cmmg lower has no caliber markings.. Kinda got me like wtf do I do now. Even on the dros paper it says 0000 for caliber.
If you have the CMMG 9mm upper, the caliber is marked "9x19 NATO" below the flash hider, (at least it is on mine).
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  #295  
Old 03-04-2018, 12:39 PM
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Applications submitted in late December 2017; I am still waiting for them to add a manufacturer on their website so I could finish my registration. This sucks
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  #296  
Old 03-04-2018, 2:49 PM
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Originally Posted by veeklog View Post
Applications submitted in late December 2017; I am still waiting for them to add a manufacturer on their website so I could finish my registration. This sucks
Don't bother, just use "America" in the list AND make this note: "Manufacturer not listed, real manufacturer is -insert name-."
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  #297  
Old 03-04-2018, 10:42 PM
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Thumbs up Apparently the DOJ thinks the ARMagLock makes an AR a fixed magazine rifle

I have ARMagLock on 2 of my ARs that I tried to register. First time I tried to apply, I selected 5.56 as the caliber and they emailed me saying:

"The California Department of Justice has received your electronic AB 1135/SB 880 Assault Weapon Registration; however, it cannot be processed for the following reason(s):
Thank you for submitting your application. Based on the information provided, the caliber for this firearm is stamped as MULTI. Please change the caliber listed on your application to "Firearm with interchangeable barrels," which is the option for MULTI caliber firearms on the application. Refer to California Code of Regulations, title 11, section 5474(b) for more information: https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/agweb/pdfs/firearms/regs/text-adopted-regulations-bullet-button.pdf"

After I changed it to multi and re-submitted my application, they rejected it with an email saying:

"Thank you for submitting your application. Based on the information you provided, your firearm is not considered an assault weapon. Pursuant to California Code of Regulations, title 11, section 5472, DOJ will not register firearms as assault weapons if they do not meet certain criteria. Please refer to the regulations for more information: https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/a...let-button.pdf
If you have any questions, please use the Report an Issue feature in the CFARS application https://cfars.doj.ca.gov."

I used the Report an Issue feature in the CFARS app and here is what they responded with:

"Mr. xxx, based on the photos provided your firearms do not have bullet buttons, but instead have fixed magazines. This characteristic is why your firearms are not considered assault weapons. Please refer to California Code of Regulations, title 11, section 5472(d), "The Department will not register a firearm as an assault weapon if the firearm has a fixed magazine that hold 10 rounds or less."

Now I need to figure out if I want to swap them back to BB configuration just to register.
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  #298  
Old 03-04-2018, 11:19 PM
lordmorgul lordmorgul is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Doctawho View Post
I have ARMagLock on 2 of my ARs that I tried to register. First time I tried to apply, I selected 5.56 as the caliber and they emailed me saying:

"The California Department of Justice has received your electronic AB 1135/SB 880 Assault Weapon Registration; however, it cannot be processed for the following reason(s):
Thank you for submitting your application. Based on the information provided, the caliber for this firearm is stamped as MULTI. Please change the caliber listed on your application to "Firearm with interchangeable barrels," which is the option for MULTI caliber firearms on the application. Refer to California Code of Regulations, title 11, section 5474(b) for more information: https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/agweb/pdfs/firearms/regs/text-adopted-regulations-bullet-button.pdf"

After I changed it to multi and re-submitted my application, they rejected it with an email saying:

"Thank you for submitting your application. Based on the information you provided, your firearm is not considered an assault weapon. Pursuant to California Code of Regulations, title 11, section 5472, DOJ will not register firearms as assault weapons if they do not meet certain criteria. Please refer to the regulations for more information: https://oag.ca.gov/sites/all/files/a...let-button.pdf
If you have any questions, please use the Report an Issue feature in the CFARS application https://cfars.doj.ca.gov."

I used the Report an Issue feature in the CFARS app and here is what they responded with:

"Mr. xxx, based on the photos provided your firearms do not have bullet buttons, but instead have fixed magazines. This characteristic is why your firearms are not considered assault weapons. Please refer to California Code of Regulations, title 11, section 5472(d), "The Department will not register a firearm as an assault weapon if the firearm has a fixed magazine that hold 10 rounds or less."

Now I need to figure out if I want to swap them back to BB configuration just to register.


Well that result may prove useful for litigation if/when someone gets to be the test case for ARMagLock.


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  #299  
Old 03-05-2018, 12:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Tree Cutter View Post
If you have the CMMG 9mm upper, the caliber is marked "9x19 NATO" below the flash hider, (at least it is on mine).
Built the upper awhile back but the barrel didn't come marked but knew it was a decent barrel. I ended up sending them a link to the mk9 cmmg line up to show it's a dedicated 9mm lower and sent pictures showing no markings on either and they accepted and processed my submission.

Though they did tell me take a full picture of my Underfolder AK with a tape measure above the rifle to prove its overall length.

Last edited by b18bturboek9; 03-05-2018 at 1:00 AM..
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  #300  
Old 03-08-2018, 4:22 PM
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I got a second round of rejections today for my AUG. They are claiming that the model for my AUG/A3 is Steyer. I responded by informing them that that was infact not the model but the make and that by filling out my form in the manner they requested, I would knowingly be lying on a government form which of course is highly illegal. I cant believe the ineptitude of these people...
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  #301  
Old 03-09-2018, 2:02 AM
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For my first submission-
Submitted 1/26, 8/9 rejected
later that day- 5 accepted w corrections, 3 rejected.
1/29 last 3 accepted
Around Feb 7th or 8th. my new AW letter came. They lumped all the new stuff right along (mixed in) with my 1999 AWs. You cannot tell one from another.

Some of the fun rejections:
Asked me what that 'thing' was on my M92 pistol (rear sling mount- I took it off and resubmitted photos).
Made me say the PS90 has a thumbhole stock AND a pistol grip. Not a second or vertical foregrip.
Called an arisaka defense hand stop on my FMBUS AR pistol a VFG.
Uh, my 3 year old couldn't use it as a VFG> It's literally the diameter of a pen and less than 1/2" long. Called a hooked hand stop a VFG.

They also asked for a caliber mark on my M1a- which it does not have. After saying that it does not have one in the comments, they accepted it.

The form also asks who you acquired them from- when I put the out of state selling dealer, and the receiving dealer in the notes, they were not happy- I had to rewrite it so I 'acquired' it from my transfer dealer.
They also weren't picky about stuff from ~10 years ago where I vaguely remember who and when I transferred it with, jus tht enewer stuff which has a DROS record, I suppose. I made a note on that one "to the best of my recollection"..

Second round:
2/14: accepted 3 of 4 right off the bat. No word since. Wondering if the 4th is approved but the email didn't go out? They didn't send me any correction or the submitted 'approval' email.
I called it in and all they could say is it's still processing. Maybe I got really lucky with the first batch in terms of processing time.

You have to work it like a building inspection- do what they ask unless it's impossible. Be picky, and be perfect. You're still going to get rejections.

Attached is a generic pic of their 'VFG' hand stop. All mine does is keep you from shooting off your fingers :|
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  #302  
Old 03-09-2018, 7:46 AM
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Originally Posted by Crazed_SS View Post
Since we're collecting kickback reasons here, Ill post this again.. this was the only issue I had and was easily rectified.




Self-built is for 80%, NOT rifles built from stripped lowers.
I selected self-built for my rifles built from stripped lowers and then changed it before submission figuring that I was being too literal and the DOJ too vague in their intent. Looks like I guessed right!
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  #303  
Old 03-09-2018, 8:18 AM
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That is funny on the hand stop as vfg, I submitted two guns, one with a Magpul MVG and both of them with the same Arisaka hand stop barrier support on them with no mention of that as a grip and there was no kickback on it. They are very inconsistent and apparently not getting enough second opinion and sharing of issues inside the reviewers team.


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  #304  
Old 03-09-2018, 1:28 PM
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Got another rejection letter for my M1A in a EBR stock. They are insisting on a caliber stamp which doesn’t exist. Don’t know what else I can do to prove to these folks that it doesn’t exist.
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  #305  
Old 03-09-2018, 1:37 PM
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Got another rejection letter for my M1A in a EBR stock. They are insisting on a caliber stamp which doesnít exist. Donít know what else I can do to prove to these folks that it doesnít exist.
So they asked for a picture of the caliber on the barrel, you said it didn't exist, and they rejected the submission? And this happened more than once?

How about stamping a caliber on the barrel and then submitting that picture?
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Not checkers, not chess, its Jenga.
"The California matrix of gun control laws is among the harshest in the nation and are filled with criminal law traps for people of common intelligence who desire to obey the law." - U.S. District Judge Roger T. Benitez

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  #306  
Old 03-09-2018, 1:49 PM
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If I have to resort to that I guess I’ll have to. It just drives me crazy that we have to jump through all these damn hoops just show something that’s not even required on the forms
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  #307  
Old 03-09-2018, 1:53 PM
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If it's not on the barrel, just tell them in the "comments section" that there is no caliber markings and resubmit it.

They purposely go out of their way to kick these back for stupid reasons.

I just treat it as a game.
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  #308  
Old 03-09-2018, 3:47 PM
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If I have to resort to that I guess Iíll have to. It just drives me crazy that we have to jump through all these damn hoops just show something thatís not even required on the forms
Had the same issue with my 9mm ar and sent optional pic to show no markings on barrel because they saw by reciever pics and it didn't have caliber markings and they processed it after.
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  #309  
Old 03-09-2018, 4:24 PM
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Howitzer- submit a barrel pic and tell them there is no caliber marking on the barrel OR receiver.

I also looked up a forum discussion regarding the caliber stamp on springfield receivers disappearing on later guns, and posted that in the comments as well- submitted, approved, paper in the hand grip.
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  #310  
Old 03-09-2018, 4:38 PM
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The initial rejection was also because of the lack of caliber stamp which I explained in the comments section. I also explained that during this period, Springfield was not putting caliber stamps. I figured that would be enough but I guess not I have to dismount my optic to remove the Sage stock and photograph the bare receiver and barrel to appease these people. Then they kicked back my AUG telling me to put Steyer as the manufacturer after I explained to them that was not the model. I already have Steyr Mann as the manufacturer of my AUG... Unreal
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  #311  
Old 03-09-2018, 6:12 PM
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Originally Posted by saki302 View Post

Some of the fun rejections:
Asked me what that 'thing' was on my M92 pistol (rear sling mount- I took it off and resubmitted photos).
Made me say the PS90 has a thumbhole stock AND a pistol grip. Not a second or vertical foregrip.
Did you mention and add comment regarding the barrel extension?
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  #312  
Old 03-10-2018, 7:08 AM
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Tagged
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  #313  
Old 03-10-2018, 7:20 AM
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Do you guys take clear pictures of the receiver markings? All the directions say is left and right side of receiver. Doesn't say anything about stampings.
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  #314  
Old 03-10-2018, 7:34 AM
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Ford8N Ford8N is offline
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Originally Posted by BamBam View Post
Do you guys take clear pictures of the receiver markings? All the directions say is left and right side of receiver. Doesn't say anything about stampings.
You have to use the optional picture on NODAK AK receivers because the serial number is always on the bottom in front of the mag well.
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  #315  
Old 03-10-2018, 10:16 AM
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saki302 saki302 is offline
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Originally Posted by akspetsnaz View Post
Did you mention and add comment regarding the barrel extension?
No- mine has the buttstock extension to 30"+
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  #316  
Old 03-10-2018, 3:30 PM
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jmatt511 jmatt511 is offline
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I just registered multiple rifles. DOJ did have issues with 2 and notified me the next day. The issues were all resolved the following day and the applications are in process. One was requiring a Magpul PRS stock to be designated as a "folding or telescoping stock." Fingers crossed.
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  #317  
Old 03-11-2018, 5:34 PM
slainla slainla is offline
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I submitted registration for a few rifles a couple weeks ago and I got a kick-back a week later for my cz scorpion carbine with faux suppressor. They wanted a picture with a measuring tape and a barrel caliber stamp.
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  #318  
Old 03-12-2018, 12:52 PM
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FLIGHT762 FLIGHT762 is offline
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Originally Posted by FLIGHT762 View Post
I registered two Rifles on Tuesday the 13th. Yesterday, I received a correction notice on one of the Rifles. I followed the recommendation on the registration guide of using the "Multi caliber" menu choice for AR style rifles. The DOJ agent on the rejection notice for my GAP 10 said I needed to put the caliber as "308mm" since it was listed on the receiver by GAP.

Actually on the receiver, it is marked "Caliber 308". I went into CFARS and corrected the caliber to "308 Win." from the menu. I noted to the DOJ agent in their E mail to me that "308mm" is not marked on the receiver and I put "308 Win" from the menu.

308mm? That's 12" a pretty good sized Artillery piece.

The GAP 10 has a PRS stock and I didn't mark the feature of a collapsable stock. I only marked the pistol grip as a feature on this rifle. There was no rejection notice on the PRS stock at this time.

The response from DOJ was prompt, only one day after submitting.

I'm curious to see if they will mess with me over the PRS stock as has been reported in other posts. The PRS stock does not telescope nor does it fold.

My other rifle was accepted, it is a Spikes AR and is marked "multi cal" on the receiver.



I'll update this when I hear back from DOJ.

*UPDATE* DOJ rejected my GAP 10 for the PRS Stock several days after I posted this. I had to go back and check the Telescoping or folding stock feature. Pure nonsense. I didn't argue, I corrected it and it was accepted.
Received updated RAW list today with the two bullet buttoned Rifles I registered about 4 weeks ago. New RAWs are listed along with my others from 1989 and 2000. There is nothing in the list that denotes the two newly registered RAWs from the standard magazine release originals.

Curious as to how L/E is supposed to know the difference of the legal, non bullet buttoned originals from the two new bullet buttoned equipped RAWs?

This is so much a bunch of BS.

Does someone have the actual law on preventing these bullet buttoned RAWs from changing them over to a standard magazine release after being a RAW or putting a Mag Magnet on them ?

Thanks.
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  #319  
Old 03-12-2018, 12:56 PM
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onelonehorseman onelonehorseman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FLIGHT762 View Post
Received updated RAW list today with the two bullet buttoned Rifles I registered about 4 weeks ago. New RAWs are listed along with my others from 1989 and 2000. There is nothing in the list that denotes the two newly registered RAWs from the standard magazine release originals.

Curious as to how L/E is supposed to know the difference of the legal, non bullet buttoned originals from the two new bullet buttoned equipped RAWs?

This is so much a bunch of BS.

Does someone have the actual law on preventing these bullet buttoned RAWs from changing them over to a standard magazine release after being a RAW or putting a Mag Magnet on them ?

Thanks.
More than likely, LE won't know the difference. For that reason, I would always carry a copy of my ORIGINAL registration paperwork for those pre-BB RAWS whenever you take them out.
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  #320  
Old 03-12-2018, 12:59 PM
Howitzer1987 Howitzer1987 is offline
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Well it’s definitely a mismanaged system that depends on the person looking at the form and photos to determine if it’s adaquate or needs revision. My MPX for example got denied the first time because they said the markings on the receiver were not clear enough on the photos provided. Sent the revised photos and now it got denied because of the stock, and forward grip even though the forward grip box checked and the stock being fixed was explained in the comments section. The Scorpion other hand went through without a problem even though it was basically presented the same way as the MPX
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