Calguns.net  

Home My iTrader Join the NRA Donate to CGSSA Sponsors CGN Google Search
CA Semiauto Ban(AW)ID Flowchart CA Handgun Ban ID Flowchart CA Shotgun Ban ID Flowchart
Go Back   Calguns.net > FIREARMS DISCUSSIONS > Centerfire Rifles - Semiautomatic or Gas Operated
Register FAQ Members List Calendar Mark Forums Read

Centerfire Rifles - Semiautomatic or Gas Operated Centerfire rifles, carbines and other gas operated rifles.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 01-01-2012, 8:30 PM
mrjas101 mrjas101 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 9
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default AR15: Carbine vs Precision Rifle

Hi CG forum members, i'm new to guns and I was wondering with the 10 round limit in CA, would it be better to buy a AR15 carbine or precision rifle?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 01-01-2012, 8:31 PM
cabinetguy's Avatar
cabinetguy cabinetguy is offline
CGN/CGSSA Contributor
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Location: Location:
Posts: 11,270
iTrader: 8 / 100%
Default

it all depends on what your intended purpose is
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 01-01-2012, 8:41 PM
Mamluke Mamluke is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Orange County
Posts: 1,161
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

I'd go for a carbine, more versatile imo & likely lighter & easier to carry ... plus if you move out of state, you can switch to high cap mags ....

............... Welcome bud ... ....

........
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 01-01-2012, 8:43 PM
mrjas101 mrjas101 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 9
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Onion rings, mmmmmmm..........
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 01-01-2012, 8:45 PM
Bhobbs's Avatar
Bhobbs Bhobbs is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Chino CA
Posts: 10,597
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

Precision rifle.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 01-01-2012, 8:45 PM
NapaCountyShooter's Avatar
NapaCountyShooter NapaCountyShooter is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Vacaville, Norcal
Posts: 2,151
iTrader: 46 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrjas101 View Post
Onion rings, mmmmmmm..........
You're going to fit in here just fine.

On a serious note, go with a midlength gassed 16" with lots of magpul goodies.
__________________
Jonah
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 01-01-2012, 8:46 PM
mrjas101 mrjas101 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 9
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

is there a large difference in accuracy between 16'' and 18'' barrels?
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 01-01-2012, 8:50 PM
Bhobbs's Avatar
Bhobbs Bhobbs is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Chino CA
Posts: 10,597
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrjas101 View Post
is there a large difference in accuracy between 16'' and 18'' barrels?
If they are equal quality barrels, there should be no difference. The only difference there will be is in muzzle velocity which aids in shooting longer distances.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 01-01-2012, 8:50 PM
NapaCountyShooter's Avatar
NapaCountyShooter NapaCountyShooter is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Vacaville, Norcal
Posts: 2,151
iTrader: 46 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrjas101 View Post
is there a large difference in accuracy between 16'' and 18'' barrels?
In accuracy? No. A 16" barrel can actually be more accurate than an 18" barrel because it has less whip to it. The difference is that longer barrels provide more velocity, which keeps the bullet stabilized over longer distances. If you are just shooting at a couple hundred yards, no big deal. If you're trying to stretch the distance of the AR, go with a longer barrel.
__________________
Jonah
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 01-01-2012, 8:54 PM
mrjas101 mrjas101 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 9
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Thanks for the quick responses guys
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 01-01-2012, 9:02 PM
mrjas101 mrjas101 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 9
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

what do you guys think a beginner like me should get
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 01-01-2012, 9:08 PM
slim_jim989 slim_jim989 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Mountain View
Posts: 5
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

For a beginner I would check and see what the cheapest one is available for you at your local gun store. Get down the basics and then you can upgrade little by little. I built my own AR for 750 bucks before I upgrade but its the way I wanted it. Also you never said what your intended uses where?
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 01-01-2012, 9:08 PM
Droppin Deuces's Avatar
Droppin Deuces Droppin Deuces is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: In your THOTs
Posts: 5,993
iTrader: 10 / 100%
Default

It is possible to have both in one rifle. Look at guns like LaRue's OBR and Stealth, which are basically just super accurate carbines. I have a 16" stealth that drops head shots at 500 yards with the right ammo(Hornady 68 grain match or equivalent). Come to think of it, good ammo will be a bigger factor than an expensive barrel will.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 01-01-2012, 9:13 PM
mrjas101 mrjas101 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 9
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

I plan on taking it into the desert and setting up targets out there and probably take it to some ranges
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 01-01-2012, 9:13 PM
plumbum plumbum is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Tehama County
Posts: 1,320
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

How much money do you have, and how much experience do you have with firearms?

If your answer to both is 'not much', neither would be a great start. If you are limited in experience and/or funds I would grab any decent .22LR rifle, make empty brass as often as possible, and come back after you have obliterated many cans and paper targets.



I mean absolutely no disrespect, but for most people who are new to guns, neither of the rifles you mention are an ideal starting point. Again, I would say get a .22LR or an inexpensive used hunting rifle and get used to firing a gun - then move up to the money pit guns
__________________
Ready for Bears and Zombies... since 1999!
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 01-01-2012, 9:16 PM
mrjas101 mrjas101 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 9
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Unhappy

Quote:
Originally Posted by plumbum View Post
How much money do you have, and how much experience do you have with firearms?

If your answer to both is 'not much', neither would be a great start. If you are limited in experience and/or funds I would grab any decent .22LR rifle, make empty brass as often as possible, and come back after you have obliterated many cans and paper targets.



I mean absolutely no disrespect, but for most people who are new to guns, neither of the rifles you mention are an ideal starting point. Again, I would say get a .22LR or an inexpensive used hunting rifle and get used to firing a gun - then move up to the money pit guns
I only plan on buying one rifle, don't have enough money to buy a .22 also. I have zero experience with firearms.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 01-01-2012, 9:19 PM
Bhobbs's Avatar
Bhobbs Bhobbs is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Chino CA
Posts: 10,597
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrjas101 View Post
I only plan on buying one rifle, don't have enough money to buy a .22 also. I have zero experience with firearms.
Then get the .22 first.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 01-01-2012, 9:21 PM
vinny_land's Avatar
vinny_land vinny_land is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Nomad - Bakersfield & Palm Desert
Posts: 2,704
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Default

Do both! Eventually you will.
__________________
"1911 mag, twinkie, twinkie, cupcake, primary weapon mag"

AR's gone through it's final evolution...for now: Precision rig & close encounters
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...&postcount=460

shuttlecock
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 01-01-2012, 9:24 PM
mrjas101 mrjas101 is offline
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 9
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vinny_land View Post
Do both! Eventually you will.
I guess I'll try to get a .22 first. Are those 30 round mags in the pic and if they are how do you get to use them?
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 01-01-2012, 9:25 PM
frigginchi's Avatar
frigginchi frigginchi is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 1,168
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Default

A carbine can be a precision rifle. Get some quality components and you'll be happy.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 01-01-2012, 9:26 PM
plumbum plumbum is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Tehama County
Posts: 1,320
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrjas101 View Post
I only plan on buying one rifle, don't have enough money to buy a .22 also. I have zero experience with firearms.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bhobbs View Post
Then get the .22 first.
What he said ^

Honestly, don't waste your money on something just because it looked cool on the internetz.

If you desire to learn to shoot, then head to your local gun shop and plunk down the money for a Ruger 10/22, Marlin 60, or whatever they happen to have on the shelf. Learn how to handle them safely, see what a gun is capable of, and establish the fundamentals of firearms ownership.
__________________
Ready for Bears and Zombies... since 1999!
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 01-01-2012, 9:45 PM
plumbum plumbum is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Tehama County
Posts: 1,320
iTrader: 0 / 0%
Default

The first gun I bought myself was a Marlin model 60, and that was the best $125 I ever spent. Here I am 15 years later and just now getting my first AR put together. If you still like the idea of a tactical rifle, grab one of the newer AR clones in .22LR, Big 5 generally has a few different styles and brands on sale.
__________________
Ready for Bears and Zombies... since 1999!
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 01-01-2012, 9:49 PM
Droppin Deuces's Avatar
Droppin Deuces Droppin Deuces is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: In your THOTs
Posts: 5,993
iTrader: 10 / 100%
Default

Don't forget the dedicated .22 upper option.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 01-01-2012, 10:21 PM
jimster716's Avatar
jimster716 jimster716 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: LA - Where only criminals can get ammo
Posts: 432
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Default

If you have zero experience and not enough money for two rifles then you can't afford to have an AR and the ammo to get experience imo. A 1000 rd case of XM193 will cost more than a lot of .22 rifles! If you want the AR look, consider the S&W M&P 15-22 which isn't that cheap...the Mossberg Tactical .22 is another option but many people have reported feeding problems with the 25rd mag (lucky for us in CA, we don't have to worry about that ).

I'm the opposite, with rifles started with an AR then added a Remy 700 (I had previous experience with handguns). It's super expensive to shoot as often as I'd like so I ordered a handloading set up but I'm still considering getting a .22 rifle to practice for cheap.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 01-01-2012, 10:57 PM
vinny_land's Avatar
vinny_land vinny_land is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Nomad - Bakersfield & Palm Desert
Posts: 2,704
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrjas101 View Post
I guess I'll try to get a .22 first. Are those 30 round mags in the pic and if they are how do you get to use them?
They are Magpul 10/30 and 10/20 round magazines. Perfectly legal in CA.

Since you're new to firearms, you cant go wrong with a .22 rifle. If you really like the AR platform and not want to plunge straight into Black Rifle Disease (BRD can be expensive) depending where you live, check out your local Big5 or Turners sporting goods store for an AR-22 (Mossberg, Colt/Umarex, or S&W).

Or (the more preferred method imo) you can just buy a standard OLL receiver and get a dedicated 22 upper. Once you're ready to move on, you can just buy any 5.56 upper you want and go from there. If you do go this route, you will need to be specific on what you want to do with your rifle and how much money you are willing to spend on a setup. The beauty of the AR is that you can upgrade as you go. Do some research on what is out there and how you want to apply it for your needs. A carbine setup can be precise btw.

Enjoy the second amendment and have fun doing it!!!
__________________
"1911 mag, twinkie, twinkie, cupcake, primary weapon mag"

AR's gone through it's final evolution...for now: Precision rig & close encounters
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...&postcount=460

shuttlecock
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 01-01-2012, 11:13 PM
nitroxdiver's Avatar
nitroxdiver nitroxdiver is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Not in California
Posts: 3,439
iTrader: 3 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrjas101 View Post
I have zero experience with firearms.
Hi welcome. Thank you for wnting to become an American rifleman. I too would suggest a ruger 10/22, a couple mags, a sling, and several thousand rounds of cci minimag .22 There are after market sights available for the 10/22 called tech sights that will be an improvement over stock. After you get your .22, I highly recommend signing up for an Appleseed shoot. You will be miles ahead when you start shooting center fire rifles.
Good luck and have fun.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 01-01-2012, 11:14 PM
emy's Avatar
emy emy is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: SFV
Posts: 929
iTrader: 9 / 100%
Default

Build one . buy a TACTICAL SOLUTION 22 upper and build an AR lower. Later you can buy another upper 223 or 7.62x39 or 50 Beowolf
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 01-01-2012, 11:19 PM
roushstage2's Avatar
roushstage2 roushstage2 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Amador County
Posts: 2,842
iTrader: 13 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimster716 View Post
If you have zero experience and not enough money for two rifles then you can't afford to have an AR and the ammo to get experience imo. A 1000 rd case of XM193 will cost more than a lot of .22 rifles! If you want the AR look, consider the S&W M&P 15-22 which isn't that cheap...the Mossberg Tactical .22 is another option but many people have reported feeding problems with the 25rd mag (lucky for us in CA, we don't have to worry about that ).
.
The 15-22 is still plenty cheaper to buy and shoot than a 5.56 AR. The Mossberg .22AR is...bleh.

IMO, if you want an AR-style, go with the M& 15-22. "Regular" rifle, go with a Marlin, Savage or Ruger.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 01-01-2012, 11:34 PM
jimster716's Avatar
jimster716 jimster716 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: LA - Where only criminals can get ammo
Posts: 432
iTrader: 4 / 100%
Default

Are the tacticool AR .22's 2-stage triggers? I'm wondering if it's better to go with the 10/22 or Savage MKII to better get the fundamentals down.

I, myself, may get a 10/22 or MKII.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 01-01-2012, 11:55 PM
HK Dave's Avatar
HK Dave HK Dave is offline
Calguns Addict
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Rowland Heights, CA
Posts: 5,301
iTrader: 73 / 100%
Default

This question is pointless... as once you get infected with BRD, you'll get both anyhow. :P
__________________
...Slow, deep breath in followed by two quick, shallow exhales, then one long breath out. It should sound like "HEE HEE HOOOOOOOOooooooo...HEE HEE HOOOOOOOOooooooo". Once your comfortable with that breathing pattern, try to sync the tempo up with your heart rate. "Lub-dub...HEE HEE HOOOOOOOOooooooo... etc". ~ CBruce
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 01-02-2012, 12:03 AM
Dreaded Claymore Dreaded Claymore is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 3,240
iTrader: 5 / 100%
Default

Definitely get a .22 LR rifle first. If you must have an AR-15 type rifle (like me), get a .22 LR upper first. Any rifle will be useless if you don't know how to handle it, and learning takes practice. A .22 LR firearm will allow you to get lots of practice.
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 01-02-2012, 1:13 AM
roushstage2's Avatar
roushstage2 roushstage2 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Amador County
Posts: 2,842
iTrader: 13 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jimster716 View Post
Are the tacticool AR .22's 2-stage triggers? I'm wondering if it's better to go with the 10/22 or Savage MKII to better get the fundamentals down.

I, myself, may get a 10/22 or MKII.
I don't believe they come with a 2-stage trigger, no. Most guns don't, unless you perhaps special order it. IMO, you don't need one to learn the fundamentals either. I don't have a 2-stage trigger on any of my rifles and I can still hit the center of the target just fine (once the sights are dialed in of course).
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 01-02-2012, 1:20 AM
sigma6's Avatar
sigma6 sigma6 is offline
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 289
iTrader: 2 / 100%
Default

The M&P 15-22 performance edition comes with a 2 stage trigger, but I don't know how good it is or if its worth the $700 price.
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 01-02-2012, 2:02 AM
roushstage2's Avatar
roushstage2 roushstage2 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Amador County
Posts: 2,842
iTrader: 13 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sigma6 View Post
The M&P 15-22 performance edition comes with a 2 stage trigger, but I don't know how good it is or if its worth the $700 price.
The performance edition has a Laney Match Chamber/Match Grade Precision Barrel, two-stage trigger, Hogue Overmolded grip and Vltor stock. Seems it is supposed to be an out-of-the-box precision .22 AR.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 01-02-2012, 7:23 AM
Richard Erichsen's Avatar
Richard Erichsen Richard Erichsen is offline
Senior Member
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,912
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrjas101 View Post
Hi CG forum members, i'm new to guns and I was wondering with the 10 round limit in CA, would it be better to buy a AR15 carbine or precision rifle?
Fit the tool to the purpose and to the shooter. A weapon that is guaranteed to shoot sub MOA in the hands of someone who might struggle for some time to be consistent enough to surpass 4-5MOA is a waste of range budget IMHO. You need to be a very good shot before your rifle is holding you back. The same rule applies to scopes, where the high dollar 8x+ can cost as much or more than the rifle.

Save your money and invest in appropriate classes, get a trainer that can work out some of the kinks in your posture and stop bad habits before they form. Ammo prices are up and it will probably take thousands of rounds before you are competent with your first rifle.

I suggest starting with the most basic carbine. You can always add on and change things later. About the only advise I've heard and like is start with a good lower, the rest will evolve as your needs change and you can start making consistent hits at longer and longer distances, at a faster rate.

Good luck,

R
__________________
Mangler of loose parts into modernized boom sticks

"Your breathing should be slow and steady. It should sound like HEE HEE HOOOOOOOOooooooo!!!" - CBruce
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 01-02-2012, 1:04 PM
glock7's Avatar
glock7 glock7 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: V.C.
Posts: 3,327
iTrader: 26 / 100%
Default

Start with your basIc ar-15 carbine. Jump into it with both feet. Get a .22 adapter if need be. If you're like me money was an issue and I wanted to get right into it. I got a .22 adapter and quickly got rid of it because I'm a recoil junkie. Love shooting .223/5.56 ymmv. Good luck whatever you do.
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 01-02-2012, 1:05 PM
glock7's Avatar
glock7 glock7 is offline
Veteran Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: V.C.
Posts: 3,327
iTrader: 26 / 100%
Default

Get a 16" iron sights and put a nice scope on it to shoot a little further. You'll be glad you did.
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 01-02-2012, 3:00 PM
Squidward's Avatar
Squidward Squidward is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Central Coast
Posts: 1,514
iTrader: 5 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by mrjas101 View Post
Hi CG forum members, i'm new to guns and I was wondering with the 10 round limit in CA, would it be better to buy a AR15 carbine or precision rifle?

New to guns? Get a .22.

Lots of good 'carbine' and 'precision' info here;
http://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/index.php
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 01-03-2012, 1:12 AM
vliberatore's Avatar
vliberatore vliberatore is offline
I need a LIFE!!
 
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Kansas
Posts: 10,740
iTrader: 12 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bhobbs View Post
If they are equal quality barrels, there should be no difference. The only difference there will be is in muzzle velocity which aids in shooting longer distances.
Between a 16" and 20" barrel, what kind of ranges would the be similar at as opposed to the 20" being noticeably more accurate?
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 01-03-2012, 9:37 AM
Richard Erichsen's Avatar
Richard Erichsen Richard Erichsen is offline
Senior Member
CGN Contributor
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,912
iTrader: 1 / 100%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by vliberatore View Post
Between a 16" and 20" barrel, what kind of ranges would the be similar at as opposed to the 20" being noticeably more accurate?
All things being equal, the shorter barrel is the stiffer and therefore more accurate. A higher quality/more precise 16" barrel will outshoot the 20" barrel. The loss of some 130 FPS is too little to bother with for a target gun with appropriate projectiles.

R
__________________
Mangler of loose parts into modernized boom sticks

"Your breathing should be slow and steady. It should sound like HEE HEE HOOOOOOOOooooooo!!!" - CBruce
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump



All times are GMT -8. The time now is 11:54 AM.




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Proudly hosted by GeoVario the Premier 2A host.
Calguns.net, the 'Calguns' name and all associated variants and logos are ® Trademark and © Copyright 2002-2018, Calguns.net an Incorporated Company All Rights Reserved.