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  #1  
Old 11-03-2017, 9:11 AM
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Default Fixed! Update: Savage .17 HMR Model 93r17 Light Strike Misfire Fix?

From day one this rifle misfired and over the years it progressively became worse. The first thing I did was to changed ammunition, then warranty firing pin and magazine. Then after several years I recently decided to send it back to Savage under warranty. I sent them a written history with an explanation of the defects. They replaced the outside extractor and firing pin. When I got the firearm back it still had a light strike and failed to fire more often than not.

So after a couple of firing pins, magazines and an extractor I decided to diagnose the malfunction myself. I started by tuning the bolt face and firing pin, then disassembling and cleaning the bolt, neither corrected the problem. Then I added a shim between the bolt and bolt face, fail because that only moved the stricker away from the firing pin causing more of a light syrike on the cartridge.

Then after more function checks I isolated the defect at the bolt locking handle and the slot on the barrel. The worn handle and barrel slot has opened the head-space causing the malfunction. I tested this by using a folded match-book as a shim placing it between the bolt handle and the slot in the barrel, problem solved.

What is the best fix? I can think of several but wanted to hear from the experts, I'm a retired mechanic.

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Last edited by tony270; 02-12-2018 at 7:44 AM.. Reason: Update on fix by modification.
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Old 11-03-2017, 9:15 AM
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Have a welder put a small bead on the bolt handle and machine it back down to fit?
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Old 11-03-2017, 9:23 AM
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Thanks for the response. That's one thought of mine too, should it be a gas brazing, eletric ark or mig?
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Old 11-09-2017, 11:43 PM
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Tig.

-T
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Old 11-10-2017, 12:01 AM
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A very common cause of misfires is excessive headspace and that's what you found when you shimmed the bolt forward.
Those savage actions use the bolt handle root as their locking lug.

Don't try to tighten the headspace by pushing the bolt forward.
The proper fix for excessive headspace is to move the barrel further back into the action.
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Last edited by ar15barrels; 11-10-2017 at 12:03 AM..
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Old 11-12-2017, 5:23 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
A very common cause of misfires is excessive headspace and that's what you found when you shimmed the bolt forward.
Those savage actions use the bolt handle root as their locking lug.

Don't try to tighten the headspace by pushing the bolt forward.
The proper fix for excessive headspace is to move the barrel further back into the action.
Thanks for the reply. What if I can clearly see that the bolt handle and the metal on the rifle are deformed causing the malfunction, at least by .025, the thickness of manila/file folder paper? I have a dial caliper that I can measure the head space with. Thanks
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Old 11-12-2017, 11:17 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony270 View Post
Thanks for the reply. What if I can clearly see that the bolt handle and the metal on the rifle are deformed causing the malfunction, at least by .025, the thickness of manila/file folder paper? I have a dial caliper that I can measure the head space with. Thanks
Remove all the burrs and galling and re-machine the surfaces flat and lap the parts together.
Then set the barrel back to correct the headspace and grease the locking lug so it will not gall again.
If the receiver continues to setback, the receiver is too soft and the action is garbage.
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Old 11-13-2017, 12:11 AM
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Okay, thank you so much. I was thinking of smoothing out the action and applying a brass layer on the bolt handle through acet/oxy gas welding ( brazing) to make up for for the loss due to the soft junk action. Actually I don't think it's due to soft metal, but from the sharp edges on the action that worked against the face of the locking lug ( more of a mass producing issue). Then I would round the edges on the action and lap everything together after finishing the bolt handle, then do what you've suggested except moving the barrel, I don't think that's possible.

I'm not understanding, if the problem is at the bolt handle and action does that require the barrel to be setback to correct the issue at the bolt handle and action?

Last edited by tony270; 11-13-2017 at 12:14 AM..
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  #9  
Old 11-13-2017, 12:29 AM
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This little .17 has no locking lugs on the bolt, here's an image with an aftermaket handle.

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Old 11-13-2017, 12:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony270 View Post
Okay, thank you so much. I was thinking of smoothing out the action and applying a brass layer on the bolt handle through acet/oxy gas welding ( brazing) to make up for for the loss due to the soft junk action. Actually I don't think it's due to soft metal, but from the sharp edges on the action that worked against the face of the locking lug ( more of a mass producing issue). Then I would round the edges on the action and lap everything together after finishing the bolt handle, then do what you've suggested except moving the barrel, I don't think that's possible.

I'm not understanding, if the problem is at the bolt handle and action does that require the barrel to be setback to correct the issue at the bolt handle and action?
Building up with brazing rod will leave you an even softer material in the locking lug.
The locking lug IS the bolt handle root that slides in the slot on the receiver.
That's why there are no other lugs on the bolt.

The area you are working on IS the area that is containing the firing pressure.
I would NOT build it up with brazing rod as the brazing rod is softer than the receiver to start with.
If you MUST build it up, build it up with hardfacing rod and then machine it all back to flat/square.
That will give you a harder surface to handle the firing pressures.

You obviously need to deburr the edges after remachining the locking surfaces after welding so it will not happen again.

The easiest way to move the barrel back is to remove it from the action, thread the front of the action, chop off the old barrel tennon and then thread the barrel and rechamber.
This will not only fix the headspace, but it will also give you a MUCH more solid junction between the receiver and barrel.

I have converted a couple of these savage rimfires to thread-in breech setups.
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Old 11-13-2017, 5:55 AM
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Thanks for the schooling ar15barrel. I'm going to have a weld bead laid on the bolt handle, then I'll clean it up and finish by burnish the action and bolt handle surfaces. I'll post the finished product, thanks again.
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Old 11-13-2017, 5:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony270 View Post
I'm going to have a weld bead laid on the bolt handle, then I'll clean it up and finish by burnish the action and bolt handle surfaces.
Lay on hardfacing filler.
It's harder than standard filler wire.
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Old 02-10-2018, 8:22 PM
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Okay I'm back with an update. The fix was tapping the locking handle for a set screw, then trimming the set screw, and then red loctiting the screw and installing it to the correct depth.







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File Type: jpg CAM06547.jpg (93.9 KB, 80 views)
File Type: jpg CAM06548.jpg (88.6 KB, 79 views)
File Type: jpg CAM06551.jpg (93.5 KB, 79 views)

Last edited by tony270; 06-15-2018 at 7:11 PM..
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  #14  
Old 02-11-2018, 9:49 AM
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So now you have an even smaller contact patch rubbing on the soft reciever? How hard do you think that screw is? Is there a reason you insist on NOT doing everything a professional gun smith with experience with this exact problem recommended? Your fix will work for now, but it will wear out faster thanit did originally.
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Old 02-11-2018, 10:57 AM
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I'll still be able to make adjustments, and by the way the idea, drilling and tapping was preformed by a professional, at a Gun Shop, $40.00, lol. I identified the defect and cut and set the set screw. I'm not a novice when it comes to mechanics.
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Old 02-11-2018, 11:03 AM
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And to answer another question, the *contact patch* (ride contact) is larger with the modification, the backstop contact is smaller.
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Old 02-11-2018, 11:21 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G-forceJunkie View Post
So now you have an even smaller contact patch rubbing on the soft reciever? How hard do you think that screw is? Is there a reason you insist on NOT doing everything a professional gun smith with experience with this exact problem recommended? Your fix will work for now, but it will wear out faster thanit did originally.
Once it all laps in it should do just fine, I'll keep a dab of silicone grease on it. Here's another look:



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File Type: jpg IMG_20180211_110802.jpg (91.2 KB, 68 views)
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Old 02-11-2018, 11:42 AM
tuna quesadilla tuna quesadilla is offline
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Out of curiosity, how many rounds do you have through the rifle?
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Old 02-11-2018, 11:53 AM
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The rifle has been to the factory twice. I've fired about a 1000 rounds through it, I've done a lot of hiking with it, without a sling, it's a tack driver.

The barrel receiver are one piece, the barrel is not threaded or adjustable, the bolt doesn't have locking lugs. In my case the head space is easiest to adjust by thickening the bolt handle locking lug.

There are more than a couple threads on the net about this same defect for the same rifle, no one has solved it.
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Old 02-12-2018, 7:51 AM
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I tested it, fired 25 rounds without a misfire,
Instead of silicone grease I used silver anti seize, the modification looks great, works better than new.
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Old 02-12-2018, 9:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony270 View Post
The barrel receiver are one piece,
No it's not.
I have taken several of these apart and put them back together.

The barrel is slip-fit into the receiver and then retained by pin(s) and a screw.
The screw holds it in place while they cross-pin the barrel to the receiver.

Great pictures on Roy's page:
http://rvbprecision.com/shooting/sav...r-bedding.html
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Old 02-13-2018, 5:08 AM
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Oh it's pressed and pinned, not simple to remove the berrel, and how would the head space be adjusted. Thanks for the correction,
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Old 02-13-2018, 10:22 AM
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Quote:
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Oh it's pressed and pinned, not simple to remove the berrel, and how would the head space be adjusted. Thanks for the correction,
The ones I took apart have never needed to be pressed.
After removing the pins and the screw, they slide out by hand.

To tighten the headspace, you turn the shoulder of the barrel back so that the barrel moves further back into the receiver.
Then you have to drill new holes and install pins in a different location.

Threads make a stronger/better junction than a slip-fit and pins.
That's why I thread the receiver and barrel together like a real rifle.
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Old 02-13-2018, 11:28 AM
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IMO for my case the bolt face moved away from the head because the bolt locking handle wore, see where I've pointed it out with a yellow arrow. So fooling with the barrel would be too much of a waste of time and money, in my case only. Do you agree?

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Old 02-13-2018, 11:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tony270 View Post
IMO for my case the bolt face moved away from the head because the bolt locking handle wore, see where I've pointed it out with a yellow arrow.
So fooling with the barrel would be too much of a waste of time and money, in my case only.
Do you agree?

I fully understand your problem.
These guns were only made to last about 500 rounds as that's all that most people will ever fire through them.
It is probably not worth PAYING someone to fix the problem.
If you could do it yourself, moving the barrel back is one option.
Another option is to build up the receiver and bolt handle root with hardfacing rod and then machine them back to flat/square and lap them together.
Such a treatment would make them last FAR longer than the original manufacturing methods, but would likely cost more than simply buying a new rifle.
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Old 02-13-2018, 11:50 AM
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The ammo comes in boxes of 50, 500 rounds is silly, anyway I fixxed it.
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