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Centerfire Rifles - Manually Operated Lever action, bolt action or other non gas operated centerfire rifles.

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  #41  
Old 02-13-2018, 11:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by digelectric View Post
I think my 22-250 desire was just that it’s cheaper than 308
It's really not though.
204 certainly shoots flatter.
My main squirrel gun for distance shooting is a 204, but I have the same problem with wind past 200yds with the 204 as I do with the 223.
Squirrels are smaller than groundhogs though.
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  #42  
Old 02-14-2018, 12:42 AM
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Originally Posted by LynnJr View Post
You can't compare the 223 to a 22-250 unless you compare a school bus to a Ferrari.
The 22-250 with a 52 grain bullet at 300 yards is a absolute lazor.
If you already have a 308 why not just put a 22-250 barrel on your current gun?
Using an online ballistic calculator, with identical 50 gr bullets and a 100 yard zero, the .223 drops 2 inches more than the .22-250 at 300 yards.
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  #43  
Old 02-14-2018, 12:46 AM
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Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
Do not forget that flatter trajectory means shorter barrel life.
I bet you would be happy with a 223 shooting 45gr hollowpoints for most of your varmint hunting shots and no center fire rifle cartridge beats the price of 223 ammo for target use.
The move from 200-300yds is a big difference and the 22-250 is nicer at 300yds.
The best situation is to have both and use the 223 inside 200 and the 22-250 when they are out past 200.
Having two guns spreads the heat across 2 barrels.
Hey, that's why I said he should buy 2 $269 Savages.

Or 3 if he also wants a .204.
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  #44  
Old 02-14-2018, 1:34 AM
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Originally Posted by sigstroker View Post
Using an online ballistic calculator, with identical 50 gr bullets and a 100 yard zero, the .223 drops 2 inches more than the .22-250 at 300 yards.
That's why I said 52 grain bullets because they are 3.2 inches flatter. And if you use factory Hornady ammo at 4450 FPS with the 35 grain bullets it's even better.
The 204 is 400 FPS slower with a lower BC bullet and isn't flatter shooting.
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Last edited by LynnJr; 02-14-2018 at 5:35 AM..
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  #45  
Old 02-14-2018, 6:15 AM
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Originally Posted by ar15barrels View Post
Do not forget that flatter trajectory means shorter barrel life.
I bet you would be happy with a 223 shooting 45gr hollowpoints for most of your varmint hunting shots and no center fire rifle cartridge beats the price of 223 ammo for target use.
The move from 200-300yds is a big difference and the 22-250 is nicer at 300yds.
The best situation is to have both and use the 223 inside 200 and the 22-250 when they are out past 200.
Having two guns spreads the heat across 2 barrels.
Best advise so far.
I use to shoot regularly on my friends farm. I shot out my Remington 700 22-250 barrel in one sitting because of barrel over heating - I was having way too much fun. I replaced it with a 22-250AI barrel and was exceedingly pleased 250+ FPS improvement dependent upon projectile. If yo don't reload, I suggest 223 / 5.56 x 45. It can get mighty expensive. After that, I took my AR15 20"H-Bar 1/7 twist for up to 300 and my 22-250AI for out to 600+. The vapor trails left from a 22-25-AI were very impressive. I friend sold his farm so those days are gone forever. I sold the rifle shortly after and still regret it to this day. I might assemble another. My 22-250AI went though 3 barrels during that time period - Well spent money.
Most 6mm Variants would serve you well past 500 Yards. The splash from the bullet would take out most little pests even at those distances.

Splash - Short / Close - No hit
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Last edited by Dogbite; 02-14-2018 at 8:21 AM.. Reason: SLash
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  #46  
Old 02-14-2018, 8:17 AM
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One other thing to think about. Do you need to be able to shoot past 200 yards or do you just want to be able to shoot past 200 yards (with no holdover). If the former, just move closer. It sounds like ou'll be shooting on family property but some landowners don't want shooters using anything more powerful than a .223 to avoid having their stock killed or their equipment damaged.

I've got a .243 I'd love to use on varmints but the place where I shot last spring asked me not to use it.
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  #47  
Old 02-14-2018, 9:15 AM
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Originally Posted by digelectric View Post
Sorry thatís an oversight on my part. I saw ďcenterfireĒ and got carried away

No wonder people are pushing for ARís for varminting
Not to worry. We've all done it, I'm sure. Still, a lot of good answers here.
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  #48  
Old 02-14-2018, 9:34 AM
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Was back in Wyoming visiting family a while back; went out prairie dog hunting. Was mostly shooting 223.

Then a family member brought out TC Contender with a 375JDJ barrel. That, was a tack driver and easily took out prairie dogs! That contender would consistently shoot MOA at 200 yards. That ws a lot of fun!

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Back in Wyoming I have shot prairie dogs with a 24Ē colt Hbar in .223, .243 and .308. They all zap the dogs but the .243 was the most impressive. To be fair I was shooting ball in .223 and gold metal match in 308. The .243 were jacked soft points.
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  #49  
Old 02-14-2018, 9:37 AM
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Savage 99 fan here. Have seen 99's in 22-250 in the past. I would like to add a 250-300 to the collection first, but a 22-250 would on the short list to add too...
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  #50  
Old 02-15-2018, 6:24 AM
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I can tell you I use a wicked fast 243AI and a 223 for varmint hunting. The 223 works well for shorter range targets and gives time for the +4200fps primary to cool off.

I dont care about barrel life since the sight of a squirrel launching 20ft in the air is priceless. Keep those horses safe.
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  #51  
Old 02-15-2018, 10:11 AM
Horrendo Revolver Horrendo Revolver is offline
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When someone starts making a factory 22-250 with a 1:7 twist I’ll be getting one.
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  #52  
Old 02-15-2018, 10:36 AM
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Originally Posted by Horrendo Revolver View Post
When someone starts making a factory 22-250 with a 1:7 twist Iíll be getting one.
They will when they start making factory 77 - 90 grain ammunition.
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  #53  
Old 02-16-2018, 10:09 AM
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I also have a Savage Heavy barreled .223 and a .22-250. I load the .223 with 40 gr bullets and load the .22-250 with 50 gr bullets. I alternate while prairie dog shooting so neither gets too hot. The loads I make run pretty close the to the same trajectory, at least for the first couple hundred yards. After that, the .22-250 or my .243 with 70 gr Blitzkings or 75 gr V-Maxs gets the nod.
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  #54  
Old 02-16-2018, 10:18 AM
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If they jump to those bullet weights, would there be any advantage compared to 90ish grain loads in the original 2500-3000?

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They will when they start making factory 77 - 90 grain ammunition.
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  #55  
Old 02-16-2018, 10:46 AM
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Originally Posted by RNE228 View Post
If they jump to those bullet weights, would there be any advantage compared to 90ish grain loads in the original 2500-3000?
The 22 caliber bullet of the same style/design and same weight will have a better ballistic coefficient than the 25 caliber bullet of the same style/design and same weight.

The Sierra .257 caliber 100 grain MatchKing has a G1 BC of .386 and G7 BC of .184.
The Sierra .224 caliber 90 grain Matchking has a G1 BC of .563 and G7 BC of .257.

Assuming both loads achieve 3000 fps muzzle velocity and are zeroed at 100 yards:

The Sierra .257 caliber 100 grain MatchKing at 600 yards will drop about 86 inches and drift 38 inches in a 10 mph crosswind. The bullet would stay supersonic to about 800 yards. (calculated from http://www.jbmballistics.com).
The Sierra .224 caliber 90 grain MatchKing at 600 yards will drop about 73 inches and drift 25 inches in a 10 mph crosswind. The bullet would stay supersonic to about 1100 yards. (calculated from http://www.jbmballistics.com).

Expect about 1300 rounds of accurate barrel life from the 22-250 (.224 bullet diameter, 38 grains of H4350, 55000 PSI).
Expect about 2200 rounds of accurate barrel life from the 250-3000 (.257 bullet diameter, 41 grains of H4350, 45000 PSI).
(Calculated from the Accurate Shooter barrel life spreadsheet http://www.accurateshooter.com/techn...l-barrel-life/ using Hodgdon load data)
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  #56  
Old 02-16-2018, 9:32 PM
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OP
In car terminology if that will help. The 22-250 is a Corvette and the 223 is a Volkswagen.
They will both get you to the store but that is where the similarities end.
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  #57  
Old 02-17-2018, 3:45 AM
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Originally Posted by LynnJr View Post
OP

In car terminology if that will help. The 22-250 is a Corvette and the 223 is a Volkswagen.

They will both get you to the store but that is where the similarities end.

Yeah I want the 22-250 even after researching the ballistics vs 223 after being prompted again by other calgunners. I appreciate all the feedback . No issues with 223, itís just not what I want. The 22-250 is a higher velocity, flatter trajectory, better for longer range (even if I donít often need it) and will be better in windy conditions. I could do what Iím wanting with several other rounds but I can do more of what I want with the 22-250. I wonít be shooting enough rounds to care about the cost difference.

Thanks for the feedback. I think itís Savage 12 or one of the other great recommendations and Iíll be happy when I pull the trigger.
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  #58  
Old 02-17-2018, 6:27 AM
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I'm a varmint hunters and what I tend to see is the varmints are getting smarter and smarter the more they get shot at.
You step into a field fire the first shot and everything under 250 yards runs off or goes underground.
For varmints velocity is what equates to those spectacular hits. Slower rounds don't give you those flipping in the air impacts the faster rounds do.
The 22-250 is every bit as accurate as the 223 it's just not as anemic.
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  #59  
Old 02-17-2018, 9:39 AM
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Originally Posted by LynnJr View Post
I'm a varmint hunters and what I tend to see is the varmints are getting smarter and smarter the more they get shot at.

You step into a field fire the first shot and everything under 250 yards runs off or goes underground.

For varmints velocity is what equates to those spectacular hits. Slower rounds don't give you those flipping in the air impacts the faster rounds do.

The 22-250 is every bit as accurate as the 223 it's just not as anemic.

Flips. I want flips!!
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  #60  
Old 02-18-2018, 9:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LynnJr View Post
I'm a varmint hunters and what I tend to see is the varmints are getting smarter and smarter the more they get shot at.
You step into a field fire the first shot and everything under 250 yards runs off or goes underground.
For varmints velocity is what equates to those spectacular hits. Slower rounds don't give you those flipping in the air impacts the faster rounds do.
The 22-250 is every bit as accurate as the 223 it's just not as anemic.
That's because you singed the hair off them.

Try the 22 Hornet for under 250 yards.
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  #61  
Old 02-18-2018, 12:20 PM
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Im with LynnJr these days anything under 200 yards is what we call a close shot. Ive found that wearing dull fde type clothes has helped a lot but we dont get anymore 30 yard 22lr opportunities anymore.

223/22-250 for close shots less than 300 yards.

243/7STW for the longer shots.
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  #62  
Old 02-18-2018, 10:58 PM
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Originally Posted by LynnJr View Post
OP
In car terminology if that will help. The 22-250 is a Corvette and the 223 is a Volkswagen.
They will both get you to the store but that is where the similarities end.
The truth is 300 yards is only the end of the driveway. Sure the Corvette will get there quicker, but the difference isn't worth worrying about.
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  #63  
Old 02-18-2018, 11:01 PM
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Originally Posted by digelectric View Post
Yeah I want the 22-250 even after researching the ballistics vs 223 after being prompted again by other calgunners. I appreciate all the feedback . No issues with 223, itís just not what I want. The 22-250 is a higher velocity, flatter trajectory, better for longer range (even if I donít often need it) and will be better in windy conditions. I could do what Iím wanting with several other rounds but I can do more of what I want with the 22-250. I wonít be shooting enough rounds to care about the cost difference.

Thanks for the feedback. I think itís Savage 12 or one of the other great recommendations and Iíll be happy when I pull the trigger.
If you end up getting 2 of them, make the other one the .204 and really see some big speed. Post video of flying varmints.
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  #64  
Old 02-18-2018, 11:21 PM
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Originally Posted by sigstroker View Post
If you end up getting 2 of them, make the other one the .204 and really see some big speed. Post video of flying varmints.

Did most of the ballistic comparison to 223 but after your suggestion looked at 204 a little more. Seems like for smaller stuff the 204 is better but if there is something a bit larger (like coyote size, even tho I have no interest in those) the 22-250 is better due to greater energy at distance. I can see both the 22-250 and 204 being great for different (but really similar) purposes.

I suppose if I wanted to shoot a prairie dog with a 22-250 Iíd expect to recover a lot less of it vs with a 204. Donít know whatís better, but appreciate the suggestion.
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  #65  
Old 02-19-2018, 7:19 AM
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Originally Posted by LynnJr View Post
I'm a varmint hunters and what I tend to see is the varmints are getting smarter and smarter the more they get shot at.
You step into a field fire the first shot and everything under 250 yards runs off or goes underground.
For varmints velocity is what equates to those spectacular hits. Slower rounds don't give you those flipping in the air impacts the faster rounds do.
The 22-250 is every bit as accurate as the 223 it's just not as anemic.
So true - The little critters get educated. I hope everyone on this forum is smart enough to not drive their vehicle or walk out to check what's left of the critters. The surviving critters see the vehicle or person and get educated. Their gone when you come back the next time to have fun. I would walk and then crawl to my vantage point before engaging. Sometimes several hundred yards. Try that with 2 rifles, ammo, water ECT. The little critters never knew where the danger was coming from and lengthened my engagement time considerably.
It's been years since I exploded pests - Just typing this is getting me interested again. I just might be assembling that 6mm I always wanted but could never justify. My 22-250AI was amazing but a 6mm at similar velocities would be the cat's meeeyoww.
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  #66  
Old 02-19-2018, 7:47 AM
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Originally Posted by sigstroker View Post
The truth is 300 yards is only the end of the driveway. Sure the Corvette will get there quicker, but the difference isn't worth worrying about.

Actually the small 22 caliber bullets have very low BC numbers so the velocity is what gives you the flat trajectory. Varmints aren't usually found in a dense forest so wind is always a problem. Squeaks prairie dogs and ground squirrels aren't very wide so wind is a major factor in your hit ratio.
The 204 is 100% a varmint round as it only shoots light bullets.
The 223 is a compromise gun in that it does everything decently but nothing great.
The 22-250 is a 4450 FPS varmint gun with the light bullets and it also crushes the 223 with the heavy bullets.
Barrel life is the downside of any high performance round and each shooter needs to factor that in to there realistic hunting expectations.
Shooting cheap military surplus ammo means less hits so more missed shots and varmint hunting hits is what started the game of Benchrest so I don't think many varmint hunters want less accuracy.
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