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Rimfire Firearms .22, .17 and other Rimfire Handguns and Rifles |
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#1
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Calling all Phoenix HP22a owners
My understanding is that you're never supposed to dry-fire a rimfire gun.
The 22a doesn't lock the slide back after the last round is fired.. doesn't that mean that unless you count your shots, you end up dry-firing with every mag? |
#2
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In the name of absolute piece of mind I think making sure your rimfire is unloaded trumphs firing pin wear. I think, but am not certain, rimfire mfgs refer to dry firing more in the sense of frivolous dry firing.
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#3
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How much is a firing pin replacement? Two dollars? Three dollars? Five dollars? Ten dollars? I would rather pull the trigger 11 times for every time I shoot a ten round magazine and have the last trigger pull go "click" than have an accidental discharge.
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#4
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Ok..
Let's get off the accidental discharge trail. I'm posting to see if that's indeed how it works with this pistol, that's all. And to see if there are workarounds, or how many 10-round mags before the firing pin needs changing. Based on the design, I'm surprised nothing turned up in the reviews regarding requiring frequent firing pin exchange. |
#5
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Check and see if the FP is somehow given a block of some sort to prevent damage. I do believe that the 10/22 has an FP block and can be dry fired because of it.
Also, a primary concern is scratching the chamber, not just firing pin damage. |
#6
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I have over ten 22's and I dry fire all of them except my P22. |
#7
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It's funny how you get such varying opinions with regards to this stuff. I've had a gun shop tell me you're not supposed to take apart a ruger mark III. He actually laughed at the idea, brought his body over, and they both had a good laugh that someone would do that. |
#8
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I thought dry firing the P22 with the safety on was ok... do you just choose not to? Sorry, guess it's a thread jack. But yes, xdrox hit it on the dot for the most part.
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#9
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I don't see any firing pin block on mine. It just sits there free floating. I have dry fired my HP22A so many times just fooling around with the slide rack after I opened it up and modded the internals to get rid of the stupid California safeties that came with the pistol which rendered the gun practically worthless.
Anyway, I don't concern myself with the cost of the firing pin because a) the gun is so affordable anyway, I got mine with 2 barrels for like 150 bucks and b) Phoenix Arms will gladly repair or replace your pistol for free for life! I love mine. Never a FTF or FTE in the last 750 rounds with a mix of ammo. Like I said, it was the infernal safeties that turn off most people on this pistol but once you defeat them, the pistol acts and behaves like any other SA pistol. |
#10
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OMG - you're right about those safeties! Actually makes the gun less safe, because you don't know what the heck is going on.
I read the book, and states specifically do not dry fire this gun. Quote:
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#11
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WTF kind of retard doesn't check the chamber before setting the gun down after firing? Unless I'm doing some rapid fire/drills I usually count my rounds down range so I don't drop the hammer on an empty chamber. Because rimfire guns have an offset firing pin, the FP will strike the edge of the chamber when empty. It will start to peen the chamber and cause a burr to form. I've got a 60+ year old High Standard that clearly shows this happening. There are tools out there to ream or swage the chamber out to eliminate this, but I haven't found this necessary on any of my firearms. Theoretically dry firing may also damage the firing pin, but I've never seen it happen. If it does, Phoenix will take care of it. I wouldn't worry too much about it. By the time something like that might happen, you'll have received your money's worth from the gun 10 fold.
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#12
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With all my guns I'm not 100% sure that damage is not being done, but I will argue that the damage is so minimal, we'll be long dead before dry firing does any damage that needs repairing. Life's too short to worry about dry firing IMO |
#15
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oh boy did he ever look authoritative calling other people retards. that took alot of guts there jeffM...
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#16
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#17
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I got mine new in 1998 great little gun I havve put a few thousand rds thru it with very little problems only thing I found is it dont like sub sonic ammo but other than that it igreat. I just found a youtube video a ffew months ago and learned how to fix the safties now I love it even more. I do wish the slide locked back but it dont so I almost always dry fire the last round never been a problem yet. I am not worried about it because I think I got my $80 out of it by now. LOL
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#18
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Phoenix Arms is a great company. They really stand behind their product and warranty. I miss my HP22 which I sold to finance something else. Honestly, I preferred Phoenix over the much more expensive Walther. Among 22lr handguns, Phoenix, Ruger 22/45, and Browning Buckmark should be on top of the list. My only complaint, like most others, is TOO MANY safeties!!!
Last edited by Esquire; 01-05-2011 at 3:25 AM.. |
#19
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Go here for more info and for info on disabling the "safety" mechanisms:
http://www.bryco-jennings-jimenezarm...34b53568d62a02 The danger to your gun from dry-firing is peening the chamber as mentioned above. You can put an expended cartridge in to prevent this and dry-fire until the empty cartridge needs replacing. The worst case scenario from a peended chamber is a case blow-out in the area peened away by the firing pin during dry-firing.
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Winchester Canyon Gun Club -- Life Member N.R.A. -- Life Member Santa Barbara County CGF Sponsor |
#20
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To the OP, if you are really worried about dry firing your Phoenix, get some Aguila ammo, the one that is primer fired (no powder), and just load the first round in your mags with one of these. The round will fire but it will not cycle the action. There's a video on you tube of a guy doing this.
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When You Go Home, Tell Them Of Us And Say, For Their Tomorrow, We Gave Our Today" |
#21
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Thanks, I saw that video, and that's what got me thinking..
Is it possible that the design is so flawed, as to do something harmful to the gun with every mag? Those Aquila rounds are not cheap, and should not be necessary. Quote:
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#24
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#25
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zoom snap caps are not for dry firing
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These blue snap caps were designed to teach loading and unloading but they did not recommend actually firing on them, especially on a rimfire pistol where the pin hits the edge of the snap cap instead of the center again and again. I bought these snap caps to teach my wife how to load/unload her Airlite 22LR revolver. |
#26
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I agree, this gun, as delivered, is like 'WTF??' were they thinking? It doesn't operate like anything else, and is actually unsafe. Luckily there is a quick fix. See youtube for the quick mod. Haven't done it yet myself, figured I should try it first.
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#27
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http://www.pachmayr.com/plastic-caps.php
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http://images1.opticsplanet.com/180-...caps-03200.png
__________________
"I would kill for a Nobel peace prize." Steven Wright" Board Member CGSSA Donate now! NRA lifetime member Last edited by ivanimal; 01-07-2011 at 10:51 PM.. |
#28
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my HP22A holds open after the last round.......
__________________
Most civilization is based on cowardice. It's so easy to civilize by teaching cowardice. You water down the standards which would lead to bravery. You restrain the will. You regulate the appetites. You fence in the horizons. You make a law for every movement. You deny the existence of chaos. You teach even the children to breathe slowly. You tame. People Should Not Be Afraid Of Their Governments, Governments Should Be Afraid Of Their People ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑΒΕ |
#29
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I mean, it's supposed to, right?
But from what I've read here and seen in videos, it does not. Maybe yours is a unique specimen? Haven't tried mine, but I'll update when I do. |
#30
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to my knowledge
i believe that the hp22 was not designed to hold open on the last shot. but its possible that your gun has had a hold open kit installed. just read about that being available a few days ago. lol... but dont ask me where...
im in the search right now for a new hp22, actually 2, one for me and one for my little lady. (she is a little afraid of guns, but does well with 22's. i have severe arthritis so really dont want bigger right now.) its been about 40 years or a little more since i have fired a gun of any kind. (gave 'em up for the first wife, geesh what a mess that turned out to be! lol...) but with the sad state of affairs of the world these days, and who knows what our country will be like by the end of this next administration, i figured its about time to get back into firearms and getting a concealed carry permit. (i live in Ohio btw) i do like the hp22, i recently held one and it fit well and looked great. the owner said he's put about 2,000 rds of bulk federal thru it without one hiccup, except for a few times he didnt have the mag seated all the way. just thought i would drop by and say hello! |
#32
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I remember reading about a kit, I think it was a replacement follower for the magazines, that acts like a last round hold open. I remember them being pricey for what they were, something like $14 a piece. I guess if you really care about not damaging a $130 gun that much, especially when it has a lifetime warranty, it might be worth the investment. You could always experiment and find a subsonic load that won't cycle and load that as the last round in each magazine, so you won't be able to dry fire it(since the gun has a SA only trigger if the slide doesn't cycle it won't reset the hammer, so you won't be able to dry fire it).
My GF has one of these guns, she likes it, but isn't crazy about it, she hates the fact that there is no last round hold open and she thinks its kind of sad that she was able to be more accurate with my XD9SC at 15 yards than she is with her HP22. We are going to order the 5" barrel kit for it to see what kind of improvement we can get out of it, but more than likely if it doesn't make it any better it will be showing up in the market place very soon.
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Any man who afflicts the human race with ideas must be prepared to see them misunderstood. - H.L Mencken Hokey religions and ancient weapons are no match for a good blaster at your side, kid. - Han Solo "Moms Demand Action" sounds less like a gun control group and more like the title of a porn flick from the mid-90s. |
#33
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weird, mine doesn't.
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J'les entends crier à la tolérance par des insultes L'histoire lorgne d'exploitation de l'aveugle par le borgne. |
#34
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Used them many times before, no issues.
__________________
J'les entends crier à la tolérance par des insultes L'histoire lorgne d'exploitation de l'aveugle par le borgne. |
#35
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#37
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I would agree with the idea to use Aguila Super Quiet Colibri's, they dont contain powder only fired by the primer. They make a really funny noise, letting you know that you have fired the last shot.
They do not come with a last round bolt hold open. Advice for HP22a owners DO NOT fire high velocity ammo. I have read in reviews that it is fine to use, just dont use super velocity. THIS IS NOT TRUE. I put 750 rounds through mine all high velocity, hammer ended up breaking. Luckily I took it to the factory (in ontario), and they gave me a new one, plus two free mags. Also to get around the safeties. You can do it with no mods. Just remove the mag, Put it back in until it stops, about halfway in, and then you can move the safety freely, allowing you to rack the slide with no mag.
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"Bangarang Peter!" |
#39
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There are Last Round Hold Open Kits available, two different ones, but they are special order. As far as I can tell only 1 company makes them. They sell them on ebay. Sellers name is topstar76. If you contact him personally he will send a link to order without having to do the ebay bid. One is a Magazine Follower Replacement Kit which allows you to keep 10 rnd capacity. Runs about $20 + shipping per magazine, or you can bid on ebay and get it cheaper maybe. Second is a insert in the magazine that has similar size a 22 round which stays in the magazine and takes up the room of one round. This reduces your capacity to 9 rnds. Runs about $8.50 + shipping or try bidding. I just bought a few of the second kind, haven't tried them out yet, should get them this week. I will update with what I think. |
#40
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Not sure if Phoenix still has these available, but I hope so:
http://phoenixparts.mypressonline.com/hp22aloc.html Im picking my HP 22a up in a week so I'd like to figure this out as well, or I'll hopefully remember to get some snap caps. |
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