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Competition, Action Shooting And Training. Competition, Three gun, IPSC, IDPA , and Training discussion here. |
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#81
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I noticed while watching 24, the tv series with Kiefer Sutherland and he uses the 'cup and saucer' grip in the first couple shows of the first season at least
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#82
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Absolutely. They released another trailer a few days ago with the full DVD release scheduled for August 2013.
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Their drills are bloodless battles, and their battles bloody drills. - Historian Josephus (AD 37-101) on the Roman military |
#83
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Went and took the kids to go see World War Z. And was shocked that one of the main lines was Pitt's character telling the virologist "to keep his finger out of the trigger guard until ready to shoot". Well the character of course didn't and tripped/ popping himself in the head. BTW it's an ok movie. Good for Netflix or video.
Just maybe some folks Hollywood are taking some safety responsibility after all
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We'll just give them the 'ol number 6. Last edited by DSMeyer; 07-08-2013 at 10:01 AM.. |
#85
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There are things that work well, things that work a little better in some cases, and stuff which is total crap. IMHO, the complete defensive skill set consists of developing good default behaviors, which cover most of the bases, and then (if time/money/inclination allow) filling those in with other skills for specific circumstances. Iso is probably the best overall default technique. IMHO that's where 80% of your training time belongs. Weaver and even CAR certainly "work", and have their places ... just not as general/default techniques.
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| I don't pretend to be an "authority." I'm just a guy who trains a lot, shoots a lot and has a perspective. Check the ZombieTactics Channel on YouTube for all sorts of gun-related goodness CLICK HERE |
#86
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Personally, CAR may have its uses but to teach it as a default method is resorting to a marketing gimmick.
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Their drills are bloodless battles, and their battles bloody drills. - Historian Josephus (AD 37-101) on the Roman military Last edited by ramzar; 07-08-2013 at 11:29 AM.. |
#88
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So unimpressed with CAR. I'll admit I've only made a glancing research on the technique but it seems so lame. First, anyone can correct me if I'm wrong, it was invented by a British cop. Cops in the UK for the most part are unarmed. Even if he was an armed cop how much action did he see to test this technique? Secondly and more practically using CAR blinds your peripheral vision. That's genius, in a shoot out considering you're going to get tunnel vision and now you've just exacerbated it more by narrowing your field of view. Has anyone noticed that this technique is not taught or adopted by anyone else besides Castle's students. That's pretty telling.
I won a free training class form Civilian Arms Training when I attended the Dave Grossman seminar. I looked through their brochure and spoke with the black BDU cladded salesmen at the booth and instantly knew that was not for me. I donated that voucher to the Calguns booth and told them to auction it or something. I wanted no part. |
#89
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I thought from the title that this thread would be about Hollywood films and TV shows!
Like Tubbs laying down covering fire and shooting 11 shots from his J frame while Crockett shoots his Bren 10 with thumbs crossed behind the slide and both right and left hand index fingers pulling the trigger. CAR - how to explain it- picture sitting in your car, while keeping your shoulders against the seat, engage a threat to your left out of the drivers window. You basically are holding the pistol with the gun across your chest using the eye that is on the same side as the gun So you would have the gun in your right hand with your left being the support hand. You would use your left eye on the sights while engaging the threat. At the range, picture with your left shoulder being towards the target. It might be called the evolution of the weaver platform. So back to the thread title- where are the Hollywood pistol techniques?
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Rule 1- ALL GUNS ARE ALWAYS LOADED Rule 2 -NEVER LET THE MUZZLE COVER ANYTHING YOU ARE NOT PREPARED TO DESTROY (including your hands and legs) Rule 3 -KEEP YOUR FINGER OFF THE TRIGGER UNTIL YOUR SIGHTS ARE ON THE TARGET Rule 4 -BE SURE OF YOUR TARGET AND WHAT IS BEYOND IT (thanks to Jeff Cooper) |
#91
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As the OP, I'm good with this thread drifting into & showing any bad techniques, good techniques, outfits to be avoided, marginal techniques & outfits, safety issues and of course good techniques.
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Their drills are bloodless battles, and their battles bloody drills. - Historian Josephus (AD 37-101) on the Roman military |
#92
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#93
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It's perhaps best to have C.A.R. explained by Paul Castle himself:
I agree with ramzar -- it's definitely not the best default technique, but has clear advantages in some cases.
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| I don't pretend to be an "authority." I'm just a guy who trains a lot, shoots a lot and has a perspective. Check the ZombieTactics Channel on YouTube for all sorts of gun-related goodness CLICK HERE Last edited by ZombieTactics; 07-08-2013 at 1:41 PM.. |
#95
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I want a mother ****ing chainsaw backpack.
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Sandstorm Custom Rifle Slings : Custom Paracord slings 10% off slings for calguns members. PM for details. Like us on facebook! |
#96
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Yes. I've used it under limited circumstances without knowing that somebody had "named" it! Useful when you can't turn around or in a car. Usually, tight confines. You just automatically adapt. However, to teach this to beginners is just not cool!
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Their drills are bloodless battles, and their battles bloody drills. - Historian Josephus (AD 37-101) on the Roman military |
#97
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It would seem to me that for a brand new pistol shooter you are loosing out on the pure fundamentals of marksmanship and instilling "different" habits. I have no dog in this fight since I've never done CAR...
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Please visit my firearms training website at http://www.stcrispian.com |
#98
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Are you going to try and extend your arms if you don't have room to extend them? I hope not. That's not a system, that's common sense. I don't think the CAR techniques as a whole are superior to more generally accepted best practices for basic handgun marksmanship. By that I mean working square to the target, aiming with both eyes, arms extended, etc. If you are an experienced shooter and want to mix it up then I could see it. Otherwise, meh. One mans opinion. |
#100
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Last night I sent Paul Howe an email regarding CAR asking whether it was valid or if it was gimmick, this is what he sent me back this morning:
Charles, Gimmick. It was outlawed in many states by many training agencies as officers shot themselves in the bicep. The guy who developed it was a British Police Officer who could not carry a gun. Take care, Paul Funny his last sentence was exactly what I posted earlier... Going back to the Hollywood theme: |
#101
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We were briefly introduced to CAR during a POST training I attended in Sacramento a few years ago. It seemed clumsy and designed to look cool but didnt seem to function well.
On the issue of weaver vs. isoceles, it seems like a silly war to wade into. I don't feel either is hands down superior to the other. I stick with training folks to use modified weaver as it fits with protecting your strong side and I only train cops. Seems simple to me, others may disagree...
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Buying a safe and sane firework is like paying a hooker for a hug. I do not see the appeal in it. |
#102
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CAR works fine for what it's designed for, close quarters, retention, etc. I've even put good groups down to 25 yards with it. It's just another tool in the box...
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#103
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Makes sense to me.
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| I don't pretend to be an "authority." I'm just a guy who trains a lot, shoots a lot and has a perspective. Check the ZombieTactics Channel on YouTube for all sorts of gun-related goodness CLICK HERE |
#104
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[QUOTE=ZombieTactics;11775582]You'd be surprised what I have seen in person. A lot of "common sense" goes right out the window when people are under any kind of even minimal pressure. Most default to either a) Doing whatever they have repeatedly practiced, or b) Near apoplectic inaction. In between, there is a vast landscape of "oh no you dint!" behaviors.
Seen the same thing many times.
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These folks writing the gun laws are weapons grade stupid |
#105
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Their drills are bloodless battles, and their battles bloody drills. - Historian Josephus (AD 37-101) on the Roman military |
#107
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Wurd.
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| I don't pretend to be an "authority." I'm just a guy who trains a lot, shoots a lot and has a perspective. Check the ZombieTactics Channel on YouTube for all sorts of gun-related goodness CLICK HERE |
#108
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That's definitely an effective technique.
Now, show us with a pistol!
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Their drills are bloodless battles, and their battles bloody drills. - Historian Josephus (AD 37-101) on the Roman military |
#109
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YES!!!!
Thank you!!! I needed a good hard chuckle for today. Thats one video to pass around.
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We'll just give them the 'ol number 6. |
#112
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LAV is a great instructor, has encyclopedic knowledge and experience about weapons and tactics but at the age of 50 he's fast becoming a grumpy old prima donna.
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Their drills are bloodless battles, and their battles bloody drills. - Historian Josephus (AD 37-101) on the Roman military |
#113
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The shooter appeared to be rather........sloppy.
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http://dynamicarmament.com/games.asp : : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NM_US...eature=related |
#115
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Oh lord, this is spilling over here as well? I'm popping smoke before someone gets my number and discovers my agenda.
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| I don't pretend to be an "authority." I'm just a guy who trains a lot, shoots a lot and has a perspective. Check the ZombieTactics Channel on YouTube for all sorts of gun-related goodness CLICK HERE |
#117
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Exactly. It is therefore important that one chooses a caliber one can handle...especially SHO. Don't get caught up in caliber and pick one you can shoot well.
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"Find out what works for you...and evolve." "It's not how fast you shoot. It's how you shoot fast." |
#120
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Next at 11:00, the shooting on the move portion, do they really teach people to cross their legs while moving? That's all I watched and that was enough for me to learn enough about these guys. Man the more I research this "system" it proves to me its a joke and ha no real world applications. If any one is looking into these guys all I can say is do what you want and spend your training money (and ammo) wisely. |
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