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  #1  
Old 09-07-2014, 6:58 PM
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Default My Customer Experience at Red Seal Guns

I visited Red Seal the other day for the first time. They had a pretty good selection of AK47 pistols, AK rifles, decent amount of ARs, they had an RPK, an FN PS90, some other non-typical guns, their handgun selection was decent too. A whole wall section of 10/22s was nice to see. No complaints about their gun selection, for a new, small shop, nice selection overall.

But I have to say, if the way they treat all customers is to ignore them after buzzing them through the door, I give them 3-4 months and they will go under. I was in the store for twenty two minutes, there were three employees in the store. One was watching tv, one was on the Internet and one was talking about personal stuff with his wife/girlfriend. No greeting, no offer to help, no conversation, they pretty much ignored me. No eye contact, no words exchanged. I have enough money to buy any guns in the store. Perhaps I would have, I went in with the intent to buy an expensive new rifle and a couple of Glocks from the new store in town as a welcome to Ventura gesture. But I will not buy from retailers who provide crappy or no customer service. I like to see new local gun stores succeed, we need to root for them and hope that they don't go under like WD and McBride have recently. Gun sales are down nationwide, but they seemed oblivious to this fact. They had a decent selection of accessories too but with zero customer service, no engagement of the customer or attempts at building rapport, they will fail and fail quickly unless they are merely a tax write off for someone.

I have eleven years of retail sales experience, managing 130 employees in a 23 million dollar a year retail sales organization and three years of learning design and consultancy for sales teams and executives. It makes me sad to see someone who can carry the ball 70% of the way down the field (securing a location, permits, FFL, local politics), yet fail to score because of substandard execution. Not sure if one of the guys goofing off in the store was the owner but if they weren't the owner, he/she should sack the current staff and hire competent professionals, the guys at Turners and IVE were 100% better than these guys and even they are not objectively that great, but they are at least somewhat professional, make eye contact, engage in a sales conversation. If the owner was one of the people goofing off and ignoring me, then the market will eventually give them what they deserve if they treat other customers the same way.

I hold no malice or ill will toward Red Seal, it is just such a waste of opportunity to see someone make the connections and fight hard to open in such an anti-gun area, then to see them waste that opportunity to succeed. I will give them one or two more chances as a "mystery shopper" to see if that day was just a fluke but I have a feeling it was business as usual for them. I will report back within the next few weeks after I stop in again to see if they have gotten their act together or they want to function as mere disinterested order takers. I'm hoping they succeed.
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  #2  
Old 09-07-2014, 7:11 PM
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I've gone to IVE several times they have always treated me well. The only drawback is the 80 mile drive each way so I don't go as often as I'd like.
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Old 09-07-2014, 7:44 PM
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Thanks for the heads up, I'll pay them a visit on ky day off. Capybara, do they have any ar15 pistol for sale?
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Old 09-07-2014, 10:31 PM
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How did you manage to spend 22 mins in a small store window shopping without saying a word to anybody or anybody speaking to you? Seems unsettling and I think I would have seen everything and left within minutes.

If you truly were planning on buying an expensive rifle and mutiple Glocks go to a competitor and buy them and send them a copy of the receipt and explain why they lost the business. I've never bothered doing something like that though. I do frequently vote with my wallet though and spread negative word of mouth if warranted. Yelp is always an option but I don't do it.
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Old 09-07-2014, 11:17 PM
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Was thinking of trying them out
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Old 09-07-2014, 11:24 PM
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Thanks for the report capy. Worth it's weight in gold to those who have ears to listen.

Sales is a tough game to play, let alone sales in a way over regulated industry with hoards of do gooders hoping for your failure at every turn.

Young guys/gals aren't born experts at CS, therefore owners should either put in the effort to train them up or avoid them in general. Leaving them to their own devices is a bad recipe.

I also wish them the best. Access to arms and places to use said arms is, IMO, one of the biggest obstacles to a healthy 2a in this state, so we need GREAT FFLs everywhere we can get em. They're in a tough industry and surrounded by tough competitors, gonna have to stand out and make your mark.
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Old 09-07-2014, 11:29 PM
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How can you DROS "a couple" of Glocks and an "expensive" rifle at the same time??
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Old 09-08-2014, 12:02 AM
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Did you say anything to them? Maybe they assumed you wanted to be left alone to browse. I personally would find it odd for a customer to walk into my shop, spend 22 minutes on the floor, and then leave without saying a word.

Maybe you gave them a "I have eleven years of retail sales experience, managing 130 employees in a 23 million dollar a year retail sales organization and three years of learning design and consultancy for sales teams and executives" vibe and they just didn't feel like serving you. Who knows?
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Old 09-08-2014, 12:35 AM
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So how much money exactly were you prepared to drop? 2 Glocks about $1000-1200 pus how expensive is the rifle you were planning to buy? I sometimes bring a few thousand cash with me when browsing gun shows and gun stores but I figure the vast majority of CGN can't or won't do that.
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Old 09-08-2014, 7:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FX-05 Xiuhcoatl View Post
Thanks for the heads up, I'll pay them a visit on ky day off. Capybara, do they have any ar15 pistol for sale?
I didn't see any AR pistols for sale, but they could have had some hiding. They had so many AK pistols that they were stacked on the wall two or three deep so there were pistols behind that I didn't see that I suppose could have been ARs?
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Old 09-08-2014, 7:20 AM
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Originally Posted by I Swan View Post
How did you manage to spend 22 mins in a small store window shopping without saying a word to anybody or anybody speaking to you? Seems unsettling and I think I would have seen everything and left within minutes.

If you truly were planning on buying an expensive rifle and mutiple Glocks go to a competitor and buy them and send them a copy of the receipt and explain why they lost the business. I've never bothered doing something like that though. I do frequently vote with my wallet though and spread negative word of mouth if warranted. Yelp is always an option but I don't do it.
It kind of became a game for me of, "I wonder how long I can hang out in here before someone has to talk to me?" After twenty two minutes, I became bored and left. I even stood near where the one guy was yakking with his wife/girlfriend. He was listening to her and she was not slowing down, complaining about one of her girlfriends or something. It felt like I wandered into someone's garage on a saturday and everyone was just sitting around doing nothing of importance. Frankly, it was weird for a brand new retail operation that has obviously spent a lot of money to open.

As far as buying, I am at the point where I don't need any guns, I kind of already have too many really, but I have a few I could sell that I don't shoot and replace them with these new guns. I am looking at a long distance bolt gun and a Glock or two or perhaps a Beretta 92FS? I guess you could say I am at the point where I am refining my collection. I like most of my guns but there are a few that I am lukewarm on so I may sell or trade them. So buying anything there was strictly an option if I found what I was looking for at a decent price. But no real need. Truly shopping around, which is rare for me, I usually do tons of research, competitively shop and buy in one day, it's like a mission, but this was one of those times when I left the house thinking I would check out the new kids in town, if they were cool and had what I wanted, I would drop some money and if not, at least see what they were all about.

I don't want to bad mouth them, just relate my experience, which I found baffling. They will fail or succeed on their own merits and customer service. Based upon what I experienced, if that is how they react to customers, they won't be around too long.
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  #12  
Old 09-08-2014, 7:28 AM
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Originally Posted by sunrisefordrene View Post
How can you DROS "a couple" of Glocks and an "expensive" rifle at the same time??
FFL03 + COE is 1 in 30 day exempt for handguns (although the DOJ has been spreading lies that this is not permitted any more except according to the PC and laws, it is). If not, I have bought up to three handguns at a time before I had my FFL03 + COE, the dealer just took a deposit to hold and I took delivery three months in a row.
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Old 09-08-2014, 7:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jdben92883 View Post
Did you say anything to them? Maybe they assumed you wanted to be left alone to browse. I personally would find it odd for a customer to walk into my shop, spend 22 minutes on the floor, and then leave without saying a word.

Maybe you gave them a "I have eleven years of retail sales experience, managing 130 employees in a 23 million dollar a year retail sales organization and three years of learning design and consultancy for sales teams and executives" vibe and they just didn't feel like serving you. Who knows?
Maybe, although that would be a lot be conveyed with just a look. Like I said, nobody made eye contact and all I said upon entering was, "Hi, how are you guys doing today?" No response. It was weird. It felt like intruding into someone's garage who you didn't know. Not very conducive to a retail environment. At least the employees at Turners and IVE will make eye contact, smile, ask you what you are looking for?
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Old 09-08-2014, 7:31 AM
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So how much money exactly were you prepared to drop? 2 Glocks about $1000-1200 pus how expensive is the rifle you were planning to buy? I sometimes bring a few thousand cash with me when browsing gun shows and gun stores but I figure the vast majority of CGN can't or won't do that.
I recently sold a few guns and am selling a few more so I was planning on $3-$4k probably?
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Old 09-08-2014, 10:21 AM
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It is unfortunate that you were treated that way. As a former gun store employee/manager I know some days can be rough, but there is no excuse for 22 minutes of silence. We always tried our best to greet customers as they walked through the door whether we were busy or not.

I myself am looking for a store to use now but I'm not sure I'll shop locally.
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Old 09-08-2014, 11:35 AM
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Pistolero:

I don't profess to know if this is how they treat other customers, hopefully they don't. I have a short haircut, no tattoos, was wearing slacks and a button up Calvin Klein shirt so I don't think it was my appearance. I am going to go in again over the next few weeks to see if my experience of being ignored is replicated or if they actually act like normal gun shop employees and engage their customers.

In Ventura County, I have had excellent service from www.ebrworks.com Turners and Island View as well as Camarillo Shooters Supply if you want to do business locally.
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Old 09-08-2014, 12:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Capybara View Post
Pistolero:

I don't profess to know if this is how they treat other customers, hopefully they don't. I have a short haircut, no tattoos, was wearing slacks and a button up Calvin Klein shirt so I don't think it was my appearance. I am going to go in again over the next few weeks to see if my experience of being ignored is replicated or if they actually act like normal gun shop employees and engage their customers.

In Ventura County, I have had excellent service from www.ebrworks.com Turners and Island View as well as Camarillo Shooters Supply if you want to do business locally.
We've met before. I believe you brought down some flyers for the reloading class you have. You gave us a quick run down on the class and taught us a couple things.

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Old 09-08-2014, 4:09 PM
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I visited Red Seal last Saturday. Like the OP, I was not greeted right away. I also noticed 3 people "working" there, that were pretty much doing their own thing. One of the guys did finally say something when I walked to the counter in front of the ammo. They do appear to have a good selection of guns, but their people skills can use some work.
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Old 09-08-2014, 6:18 PM
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Thanks for the review capy! I'm here in Hueneme I will go check them out also and see what's up. I do 90% of my business with IVE, did some with WD's but I was late in the game (found them on yelp) now they are sadly closed. I do try to spend love around. But with my work schedule it's hard. I will make every attempt to check them out this week though. Especially since I am unknowingly in the market for "something" lol
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Old 09-11-2014, 10:35 AM
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Honestly not surprised by your experience. That seems par for the course for gun shops in VC. Not surprising that a lot of them wind up closing their doors. However the gun shops in Simi are quite friendly and have attentive staffs. Not sure why the shops in that city are the exception though.
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Old 09-11-2014, 12:26 PM
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Honestly not surprised by your experience. That seems par for the course for gun shops in VC. Not surprising that a lot of them wind up closing their doors. However the gun shops in Simi are quite friendly and have attentive staffs. Not sure why the shops in that city are the exception though.
I have actually seen the opposite in Simi. The only store that I had an ok experience in was Fort Courage Armory... and it wasn't exactly spectacular.
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Old 09-11-2014, 12:51 PM
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Honestly not surprised by your experience. That seems par for the course for gun shops in VC. Not surprising that a lot of them wind up closing their doors. However the gun shops in Simi are quite friendly and have attentive staffs. Not sure why the shops in that city are the exception though.
Smokin Barrel - employees are cool, helpful without attitude

Fort Courage - great staff and owner, but not a great selection most of the time

Greta's - they have their reputation for a reason, I do not even browse there anymore despite their good selection
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  #23  
Old 09-11-2014, 12:58 PM
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I think every gun store has it's moments of good and bad service. It usually comes down to the individuals that are working and how good/bad their day has been. Every once in a while a good store will hire a real turd that usually doesn't last very long. It sounds like Red Seal hired three guys that don't understand basic retail economics or are just anxious to go back on unemployment.
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Old 09-11-2014, 3:31 PM
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I've never had a bad experience at Gretas. But I've only been there 6-7x.
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Old 09-14-2014, 8:50 AM
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Where is this place? I want an ak pistol
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Old 09-14-2014, 9:36 PM
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Where is this place? I want an ak pistol
Don't bother. I called regarding a ak pistol. The guy on the phone didn't have a clue what the price was. He said he was going to call the owner. After I called 2 minutes later he said what price have I seen that particular gun at. I told him around $599. He then told me that he didn't want to tell me what price the owner told him because it was even close. I told him I wouldn't do business with price gaugers. I don't think they will last long
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Old 09-15-2014, 9:51 PM
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I went there friday. Same service as others. Ak pistols were 899.
Also had a bb rifle with a drum mag inserted. A cust asked if it was blocked and they said no, L E only. Didnt seem to know the laws very well.
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Old 09-16-2014, 12:01 PM
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Thanks lakers, I wanted to check out so ak pistols but guess I'll go somewhere else
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Old 09-16-2014, 3:46 PM
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i went to this place a couple sundays ago, they were nice enough just seemed kinda shady. something about them I didn't like. Normally i like to keep my money local. but i would not spend a dime with these guys just because i don't trust them.
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Old 09-27-2014, 6:51 PM
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Sounds like a shifty spot.
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Old 09-29-2014, 3:48 PM
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they are right around the corner from me, I'm interested to see why they suck so bad. I'll let you know what I find.
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Old 09-30-2014, 2:54 PM
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I went in today and there was one kid behind the counter, he was helping a lady with selecting .22lr for her bugout bag (yes 500rd bricks .22lr in stock) when I walked up another guy came from the back, greeted me and asked if I had any questions or needed any help. I asked about an ar pistol on the wall and when the guy couldn't answer a voice came from the back and answered with confidence. Tony (owner) comes out of the back and happily answered all of my questions and we chatted about his new business and some of the flack they faced from the city prior to opening. For a mid-city gun store they have a hell of a selection and high prices on ammo. Since this was their first big haul of ammo I'm sure they will get better pricing as things progress. Tony said they will be looking at doing more bulk ammo as well. I liked that they weren't shoving guns in my hands to hold, but made sure that I knew they were there if I had any questions. accessory inventory was nothing special but for a little new shop I was pleasantly surprised. I'm glad to have them in the neighborhood and hope they stick around.
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Old 09-30-2014, 6:47 PM
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What was the brick worth to them?
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Old 10-02-2014, 10:47 AM
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If I'm not mistaken it was 79 way more than what I would pay lol
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Old 10-12-2014, 7:10 PM
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So I made it here on Saturday while out and about with the wife, like everyone I walked in cruised the counters on both sides Of the store, then I wanted to grow them a Little bone. I wanted to purchase a magpul enhanced trigger gaurd and I waited for about 5-6 minutes while the 2 fellas behind the counter in front of the ammo shot the shat about a factory upper (unknown brand) gas tube was straight. After I was standing there kind of staring at them one guy asked if I can be helped. I made my $8.99 purchase just not to make my trip worthless. All in all the place could have potential but CUSTOMER SERVICE is the most important part. They gave me absolutely NO reason to drive past islandview or order from Amazon. Just my opinion
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Old 10-12-2014, 7:12 PM
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So I made it here on Saturday while out and about with the wife, like everyone I walked in cruised the counters on both sides Of the store, then I wanted to grow them a Little bone. I wanted to purchase a magpul enhanced trigger gaurd and I waited for about 5-6 minutes while the 2 fellas behind the counter in front of the ammo shot the shat about a factory upper (unknown brand) gas tube was straight. After I was standing there kind of staring at them one guy asked if I can be helped. I made my $8.99 purchase just not to make my trip worthless. All in all the place could have potential but CUSTOMER SERVICE is the most important part. They gave me absolutely NO reason to drive past islandview or order from Amazon. Just my opinion if if
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Old 10-12-2014, 7:14 PM
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Sorry for the dupe post. Technical issue with tiny hand held device
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  #38  
Old 11-04-2014, 9:00 PM
MarioG MarioG is offline
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I had a similar experience to Capybara when I went in a few weeks ago. I wanted to support the business since it is in my neighborhood, but they gave me no reason to. Three guys behind the counter, but no one said anything when I came in. I had to ask for someone to help me with some ammo. I tried to talk to the guy about the shop, but he had no interest in talking to me or even acting like he cared that I was there. It was uncomfortable and I won't be going back.
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  #39  
Old 11-08-2014, 2:23 PM
Pelicandriver Pelicandriver is offline
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I visited on Friday. Elijah and Anthony were working. I was greeted immediately by name (I've known Elijah since he was in junior high) and had a nice visit. Another customer (who they didn't know) came in and was greeted right away.

I can't speak to the gun prices since I haven't priced guns in a while. .22 ammo was about $.13/round. Pretty high, but at least they HAD some! I wouldn't hesitate to do business with them if the prices are reasonable.
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  #40  
Old 11-26-2014, 1:13 PM
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steelrain82 steelrain82 is offline
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Where is this place located?
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