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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #1  
Old 02-12-2018, 8:06 AM
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Default 2018 AB-2067: Armed guards in schools

Here's an interesting new bill. It requires school districts to hire at least one armed security guard to work at each school in its district.

http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/fa...01720180AB2067

Introduced by Assembly Member Gallagher (R)

Coauthors: Assembly Members Brough (R), Cunningham (R), Lackey(R), and Mathis (R)

Quote:
This bill would require a school district to hire or contract with at least one armed security guard, authorized to carry a loaded firearm, at each school of the school district. By imposing an additional requirement on school districts, the bill would impose a state-mandated local program. The bill would provide that a school district’s costs of implementing this requirement shall be reimbursed as a state mandate and shall not be funded with the funding provided to school districts pursuant to the local control funding formula.
I would consider this bill a good thing, seeing as how 2015's SB-707 effectively made California schools into target-rich environments. As such, it stands very little chance of passing - as we all know, the CA left generally doesn't buy into the "good guys with guns" argument. But it's worth a try, and I commend the authors for putting this bill out there.
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Old 02-12-2018, 8:24 AM
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Wow, a bill that's actually 'for the children'

And the Ca Dems will never let it happen, sad
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Old 02-12-2018, 8:28 AM
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I can't argue with it, for the intended purpose; and I know these legislators have good intent as well. However, it's a bit totalitarian when you then also take away the right of the people to carry firearms for personal defense, wherein they are replaced by armed-guards of the State.

However, see all those (R)s? For that reason alone, don't expect it to pass by any of the (D)s merely due to spite, including the "good-guys with guns" cynicism those (D)s have as you mentioned.

Public Safety Committee will kill it.

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Old 02-12-2018, 8:32 AM
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But, But, but, it violates the NO GUNS, School safety Zone? Another exclusion?
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Old 02-12-2018, 8:46 AM
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Originally Posted by CALI-gula View Post
However, it's a bit totalitarian when you then also take away the right of the people to carry firearms for personal defense, wherein they are replaced by armed-guards of the State.
That thought crossed my mind as well, and while the *effect* of this bill (when combined with SB-707) is that armed citizens are replaced with armed government staff/contractors, we have to keep in mind that the two bills were written by very different people with very different ideas.

The best answer is to repeal SB-707 and pass AB-2067, but I'll happily accept only either one of those, if I can't have both. The current circumstances in CA make a repeal of SB-707 extremely unlikely (Brown won't repeal a bill that he signed himself, Newsom certainly won't repeal it, and a ballot referendum is basically impossible to win in this state), and I think the authors of this bill recognize that, and are doing what they can to help make our schools safer.

Another reason I support this bill is that, even if parents with CCWs could still carry on campuses, they would only really be in the area before and after school, not during. I don't have the facts and figures, but I'm betting most school shootings have not occurred during dropoff and pickup times, but rather somewhere in between.
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Old 02-12-2018, 8:55 AM
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Intelligent common sense legislation which equates to it being DOA in the PROG assembly.
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Old 02-12-2018, 8:58 AM
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It's pretty ridiculous when you think of the actual results if this passes. The choices of WHO that armed guard is going to be are laughable. Either it will be a cop which means this is another way for the police to get on campus all the time, or it will be a retired cop who's too old to actually be effective, or it will be an employee of a security company - a pimple faced kid - who works for minimum wage.

Those districts that have budgetary issues will hire 1 guard per campus. That's 1 guard to cover 40 acres of buildings full of people.

Ridiculous.
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Old 02-12-2018, 8:59 AM
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One thing this bill is missing, that I would like to see, is a requirement for enhanced training/background checks and psych evaluations for the armed guards.

Enhanced training, because with hundreds (or thousands) of kids running around in a panic, marksmanship and the ability to perform under extreme stress is of the utmost importance - FAR more important than it is with your typical armed guard at a bank, for example.

Enhanced background checks and psych evaluations, because unlike parents with CCWs whom I would very much trust by virtue of the fact that their own kids attend the school, many of these armed guards likely won't have children/family that attend the school, so they don't elicit the same element of trust, in my opinion.

If my child's school were to have a full-time armed security guard (which I would absolutely support), I would hope that they were thoroughly trained on marksmanship, shoot/don't-shoot scenarios, combat tactics, etc., and submit to thorough psych evaluations annually.

If this bill included those items, I think it would stand a better chance of alleviating the concerns that Dems and parents are likely to have.
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Old 02-12-2018, 9:03 AM
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Originally Posted by rplaw View Post
Those districts that have budgetary issues will hire 1 guard per campus. That's 1 guard to cover 40 acres of buildings full of people.

Ridiculous.
Ya, but it's still better than calling the police and waiting 10 minutes for them to arrive. Also, a full-time guard would know the campus layout well, whereas responding officers probably have no idea where the library (or whatever) where the gunshots were reported is located exactly, or the best way enter, etc.
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Old 02-12-2018, 10:29 AM
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Bahahahahahahahaha in the Democratic Peoples Republic of Kaliforniastan. It's much more effective to pass another gun free school law.
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Old 02-12-2018, 10:33 AM
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Government "requiring" a business to employ someone?

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Old 02-12-2018, 10:54 AM
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Originally Posted by wpod View Post
Government "requiring" a business to employ someone?

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Public school districts aren't businesses. Sure there are private schools that are also sometimes businesses, but they are not a part of any public school district, thus are not subject to the bill.

In any case, this bill would also provide the districts with the funding required to hire the new security staff, as required by the California Constitution specifically because this bill would be a State mandate.
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Old 02-12-2018, 11:26 AM
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Originally Posted by DolphinFan View Post
But, But, but, it violates the NO GUNS, School safety Zone? Another exclusion?
Armed security guard is already exempt from GFSZ laws. [PC 626.9(m)]



Penal Code 626.9
(a) This section shall be known, and may be cited, as the Gun-Free School Zone Act of 1995.
(b) Any person who possesses a firearm in a place that the person knows, or reasonably should know, is a school zone, as defined in paragraph (4) of subdivision (e), shall be punished as specified in subdivision (f).
(m) This section does not apply to a security guard authorized to carry a loaded firearm pursuant to Article 4 (commencing with Section 26000) of Chapter 3 of Division 5 of Title 4 of Part 6.
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Old 02-12-2018, 6:29 PM
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How about we close the public schools down and save tons of cash and countless lives?
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Old 02-12-2018, 6:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Cato View Post
How about we close the public schools down and save tons of cash and countless lives?
I think what we need are more "gun free zone" signs posted around schools. But first they need to be updated for 2018, with a gender-neutral stick figure for any non-binary gunpeople.

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Old 02-12-2018, 7:46 PM
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Actually I love it. Dem's reject it they are saying the don't care about children. If they vote it in it opens up lots of interesting discussions
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Old 02-17-2018, 11:30 PM
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Definitely a good political tool if we can get it in the news if Dems do what they like to do
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Old 02-18-2018, 12:03 AM
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Definitely a good political tool if we can get it in the news if Dems do what they like to do
Absolutely. "So, Mr/Mrs Senator, why do you condemn armed guards at schools while you have the very same posted outside your office as we speak? Care to explain? Do you value your own life more than our children?"

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Old 02-18-2018, 12:09 AM
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Being a "common sense" measure "for the children" to prevent "blood in the streets", I would absolutely LOVE to hear what they come up with to explain why they don't support this bill.

This bill is absolutely genius, because it is a win/win. If it passes, then the antis will have conceded that good guys with guns are, in fact, a viable solution. If it fails, the antis expose their hypocrisy for the world to see - that their agenda isn't actually about saving lives at all.

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Old 02-18-2018, 12:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cockedandglocked View Post
Being a "common sense" measure "for the children" to prevent "blood in the streets", I would absolutely LOVE to hear what they come up with to explain why they don't support this bill.

This bill is absolutely genius, because it is a win/win. If it passes, then the antis will have conceded that good guys with guns are, in fact, a viable solution. If it fails, the antis expose their hypocrisy for the world to see.

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Hoping we have someone with the balls to do this and handle it as such
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Old 02-18-2018, 1:20 PM
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It's not going to pass. It's against "California Values" to have any firearms on campus.
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Old 02-18-2018, 1:39 PM
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It's not going to pass. It's against "California Values" to have any firearms on campus.
Oddly, though, we have University police departments all across the state. So apparently kids' lives aren't valued until after 12th grade.

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Old 02-18-2018, 1:40 PM
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DOA.....can't have real solutions to problems in the People's Republic of Kaliforniastan.
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Old 02-18-2018, 1:40 PM
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High School Map.jpg

Would an "armed guard" help? It's hard to say.
I've copied an image of the HS where I teach.
I don't know how many acres we have - but we have over 3000 students and staff. We have a police officer (SRO) on campus some days - share him with another district school.
I believe the Florida school had an armed guard that did not encounter the murderer. He was on campus for less than six minutes.
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Old 02-18-2018, 2:05 PM
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http://www.nydailynews.com/news/crim...icle-1.3822777



MEH.......it didn't help in the Florida shooting.

1 rent a cop is not enough......who knows where the hell this one armed guard that was confirmed on campus at the time of the shooting was while chit was going down?




Bare minimum 2....I'd prefer...depending on school size....4 or more per campus.

More would be better.

And no rent a cops.....either real or retired cops..not desk jockey cops..experienced beat or better yet Swat.

Or Military...preferably with security forces experience at least.
Actual fighting experience even better.

We don't need one Paul Blart Mall cop with only a sidearm....a sidearm he has mainly only shot at qual time....protecting our kids from a nut or multiple nuts with long guns/machetes/trucks/cars/bombs or whatever.

We need trained,well armed security.

...
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Old 02-18-2018, 9:57 PM
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Originally Posted by sgk View Post
Of course all these security guards, CCW holders, etc.. are really just the last-ditch, final line of defense. Kinda like a ship's CIWS Phalanx system or an ICBM defense at the terminal phase. You have to do what you have to do, but it is an inferior solution. Much better to nip it in the bud.

The defense of our children needs to be multi-layered. The closer that we allow the bad guys to our schools the harder it is to protect our children.
Great concept but how?
This latest turd was obvious (in hindsight) but in other cases like the Vegas shooter, there was nothing, no sign at all that he was going to do what he did.
That bum was less predictable than lightning.

In cases like the Vegas case, all we can do is hope the police or some armed good guy can react fast enough, but there will be victims.
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Old 02-18-2018, 9:59 PM
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We need at least 2 with full police training.
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Old 02-19-2018, 12:07 AM
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Why not bring some pysch evaluated soldiers home and put them to protect our kids?
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Old 02-19-2018, 10:56 AM
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They are weapon detection software that can be use with security cameras. The video feed can be centralized in command centers (like home alarm companies). Once weapon is detected on campus, alarm can be sent to have the school lock down and mobilize LEO into location reducing response time. It can also relate real time location of the active shooter for on campus arm guard response if avail.

For schools that has fire doors, it can be activated to prevent shooter free access around the hallways or even trap the scumbag.

Why don’t we already have these type of system installed is beyond me.

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Old 02-19-2018, 11:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cockedandglocked View Post
Here's an interesting new bill. It requires school districts to hire at least one armed security guard to work at each school in its district.

http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/fa...01720180AB2067

Introduced by Assembly Member Gallagher (R)

Coauthors: Assembly Members Brough (R), Cunningham (R), Lackey(R), and Mathis (R)

I would consider this bill a good thing, seeing as how 2015's SB-707 effectively made California schools into target-rich environments. As such, it stands very little chance of passing - as we all know, the CA left generally doesn't buy into the "good guys with guns" argument. But it's worth a try, and I commend the authors for putting this bill out there.
I’d volunteer to be armed security school guard for free. Perhaps we who can, as a group, draft our own petition and submit it to Congress, Governor, State Legislators, School districts, LEO. We, as a group, are constantly blamed for acts of the criminally insane.We rightfully object to the failed policies of more gun control. We have consistently called for secure schools and have been met with the “it cost too much” augument. I, and many others, would gladly risk their lives and spend our time free of charge to end school shootings and the endless finger pointing debates that accomplish nothing other create deeper division in the country.
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Old 02-19-2018, 12:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walmart_ar15 View Post
They are weapon detection software that can be use with security cameras.
I don't know anything about such software, but there is absolutely no way any software could use a regular security camera to reliably detect concealed weapons without a gazillion false alerts.
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Old 02-19-2018, 12:15 PM
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Only one armed guard is a joke. I like the idea and support it but this should have happened a long time ago..
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Old 02-19-2018, 12:32 PM
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How about a volunteer program of trained and checked folks that have limited peace officer's status who's function is simply school security.
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Old 02-19-2018, 1:04 PM
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Default A better solution

It will take a lot more that one security officer. So the question is how to pay for what is needed. I have a simple funding scheme that does not require new employees or contractors or new taxes.

All sales taxes and other fees imposed on the sale and/or transfer of firearms and/or ammunition shall be deposited into a fund that cannot be used for any purpose other than as set forth herein and said funds can only be used to supplement existing funding. Fifty percent of said funds shall be used to identify and treat those with serious mental illness that pose a security threat, so long as they are not incarcerated. Twenty-five percent of said funds shall be used to train certified school teachers and administrators, who have concealed carry permits, to act as school security personal. Said training shall be conducted by the local sheriff in cooperation with other law enforcement agencies and shall included POST qualification with firearms and other training deemed appropriate by the local sheriff. The identity of said school security personal shall not made public or divulged to anyone who is not responsible for school safety nor shall such security personal wear any identifying clothing or insignia. Said security personal shall qualify with their firearms on a monthly basis and may participate with law enforcement in training exercises involving school security. The remaining twenty-five percent shall be used to supplement existing funding of local law enforcement agencies to further assist said agencies in meeting and addressing the need for school security.
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Old 02-19-2018, 2:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cockedandglocked View Post
I don't know anything about such software, but there is absolutely no way any software could use a regular security camera to reliably detect concealed weapons without a gazillion false alerts.
One quick Google search

https://sputniknews.com/europe/20170...s-recognition/

New technology are being developed. Also, it does not need to be a regular security camera, it can be specialized higher end. There are also thermal camera that can detect concealed firearm on a person.

Technology is there, it is just if the society has the will to implement it.

As for the armed guard, they need to be trained with SBR carried in a consealment backpack. Rifle will offer more control and precision, not to mention more power going up against a crazy most likely armed with a rifle. Last thing we need is some armed guard throwing random lead down range in a school setting. Or becoming the victim being out gunned.
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Old 02-19-2018, 3:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by walmart_ar15 View Post
One quick Google search

https://sputniknews.com/europe/20170...s-recognition/

New technology are being developed. Also, it does not need to be a regular security camera, it can be specialized higher end. There are also thermal camera that can detect concealed firearm on a person.

Technology is there, it is just if the society has the will to implement it.

As for the armed guard, they need to be trained with SBR carried in a consealment backpack. Rifle will offer more control and precision, not to mention more power going up against a crazy most likely armed with a rifle. Last thing we need is some armed guard throwing random lead down range in a school setting. Or becoming the victim being out gunned.
The article stated that it needed images of real guns (thousands of them) and that they were testing it against action movies of the 1990s with 90% accuracy. Sounds like snake oil to me. How is an image of a real gun going to help recognize a concealed weapon, when it cannot see the weapon but only the cover garment?
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Old 02-19-2018, 3:41 PM
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The article stated that it needed images of real guns (thousands of them) and that they were testing it against action movies of the 1990s with 90% accuracy. Sounds like snake oil to me. How is an image of a real gun going to help recognize a concealed weapon, when it cannot see the weapon but only the cover garment?
Also, even an infrared camera could easily be defeated if you know it's there.

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Old 02-19-2018, 4:30 PM
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Its a good idea to make it more difficult for a potential murderer. That said I could never image a democrat being OK with more guns.
I mean the democrat run state government is releasing violent predators into California society via AB109.

Having the good guys even 1 at each school could endanger this diabolical plan to further terrorise disarmed Californians!

Sorry we just attended the Keith Boyer memorial scholarship fundraiser and he was victim to the democrat AB109
Saying this plan will NEVER be passed !
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Old 02-19-2018, 10:45 PM
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Its a good idea to make it more difficult for a potential murderer. That said I could never image a democrat being OK with more guns.
I mean the democrat run state government is releasing violent predators into California society via AB109.

Having the good guys even 1 at each school could endanger this diabolical plan to further terrorise disarmed Californians!

Sorry we just attended the Keith Boyer memorial scholarship fundraiser and he was victim to the democrat AB109
Saying this plan will NEVER be passed !
No disagreement. But if Assemblyman Gallagher, who is my assemblyman, really wants to accomplish something, he should follow my suggestions and sponsor a bill to take all firearm and ammo sales taxes and use them to provide a real security force in our schools. But, as we know, the Dems will never allow it. So the point is to provide ammo (pun intended) to discredit the Dems.
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Old 02-19-2018, 11:00 PM
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For those saying it won't make a difference, you are underestimating the value of the deterrent. Anything that hardens the target is good, and if the psycho's know that every school in CA has armed security, I think that alone will have positive benefits. I would prefer a much more significant security program, staffed by the top young talent in law enforcement, not some fat retiree looking to double-dip. As for detecting concealed firearms, have a look at what Patriot One Systems are doing using radar and advanced algorithms (disclaimer: I'm an investor in that company).

If we are serious about protecting our kids while in school, and doing so immediately, there is no other solution but to put well trained and armed security personnel at every single school, and to do so without further delay. I don't care what it costs, any amount is acceptable to me and I will gladly pay more in taxes to cover it.
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