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2nd Amend. Litigation Updates & Legal Discussion Discuss California 2A related litigation and legal topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel. |
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"For California gun-rights advocates, hope rests in U.S. Supreme Court"
Twenty-two groups have filed friend-of-the-court briefs in the latest round of the Peruta case, and the Ninth Circuit set up a website for the press and public “due to the level of interest in this case.”
If the Supreme Court eventually rules that the Second Amendment protects the right to carry a weapon for lawful self-defense outside the home, every state or local policy that regulates the exercise of that right will face tough legal scrutiny. It’s the job of the federal courts to enforce constitutional rights. That’s the difference between rights and policies: Policies can be changed by elected officials under public pressure, but rights are a protection from elected officials and from public pressure. Expect a firefight in the Senate confirmation hearings for the next Supreme Court nominee, and for all federal judges. That’s where the future of Second Amendment rights will be decided. From: http://www.pasadenastarnews.com/opin...-susan-shelley
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240+ examples of CCWs Saving Lives. |
#2
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am i the only one here who thinks the SCOTUS does not give a cr@p about gun rights? when was the last gun rights case they took? how many have the turned down...................
the courts are not going to restore our rights. and if by some miracle the courts actually go our way. 20 more laws will be past before the courts make ruling. 3 guaranteed ways for CA citizens to restore their 2A rights 1-move 2-get a job that exempts you 3-ignore unconstitutional laws
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best troll thread in calguns history http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=406739 burn the circus down cuz the world is full of clowns |
#3
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they're not going to take a case that isn't going to answer some fundamental question but they've got pressure as well to not answer any fundamental questions. Welcome to a locked up SCOTUS. Soon they'll be as effective and independent as congress.
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#4
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If I had to guess the future will look like the present ie that the judiciary will essentially defer to the states when it comes to regulating things like carry as long as there is a system in place to allow some form of carry irrespective of how high the bar is. That's why no issue in Illinois was overturned, while may issue in Maryland, New Jersey and New York was upheld. |
#5
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Many here ask "why vote, there is no difference between Republicans and Democrats". Think again! Who do you think will be better for defending Second Amendment rights? Not perfect, but better? An R, or a D?
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#6
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Looks like 2010, McDonald V.Chicago... On June 28, 2010, the Court in McDonald v. Chicago, 561 U.S. 3025 (2010) held that the Second Amendment was incorporated. This means that the Court ruled that the Second Amendment limits state and local governments to the same extent that it limits the federal government.[14] It also remanded a case regarding a Chicago handgun prohibition. Four of the five Justices in the majority voted to do so by way of the Due Process Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment, while the fifth Justice, Clarence Thomas, voted to do so through the amendment's Privileges or Immunities Clause.[207]
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Come to Flavor Country... Quote:
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#7
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The Chief Justices of the Supreme Court, John Roberts, reassigned DC v. Palmer to Judge Frederick Scullin in order to finally get a decision in that case. And that ruling came out in our favor.
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Achievement of your happiness is the only moral purpose of your life, and that happiness, not pain or mindless self-indulgence, is the proof of your moral integrity, since it is the proof and the result of your loyalty to the achievement of your values. -Ayn Rand |
#8
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Aren't they already?
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#10
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It is a mystery why the SCOTUS has not accepted another Second Amendment case for review since McDonald. A lot of interesting theories on why. There were a few cases which I thought would have been granted, but it was not meant to be. To be frank, at this juncture, I think hope is misplaced in the high court.
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#11
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But you've been right in these things more often than I. |
#12
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Best theory as to why not, in a nutshell, I believe there may not be enough votes to win. If that was the case, and a case taken, a decision against carry would be a disaster. As far as personal predictions go, I was only right once that I remember, and that was back in 2012. I think we should take a look at the current circuit split with respect to carry, From Peruta: Quote:
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Last edited by Crom; 01-13-2015 at 1:14 PM.. Reason: updated Peruta cite |
#13
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Im not sure if it’s not enough votes to win after listening to a Ca superior court judge over cocktails recently. his opinion about what SCOTUS is doing or the courts are doing is they are looking at something or a case we aren’t watching closely a vehicle or case that is much more cut and dry and avoids the carry issue while addressing the irregularities in analysis..... be it jackson or a case of as applied by a sheriff vs challenging the statute... he made some interesting points about how it seemed the 7th was shifting the course of the courts then things reverted then the 9th came about with peruta all along he kept pointing out how many cases have been decided with courts stating they assume. the 6th recently chimed in and gave their take on how they would process a 2nd amend challenge but the 9th and 7th are the two to acknowledge without assumption and follow the historical analysis process laid out by SCOTUS everyone else rules on assumption that it might exist but they don’t want to examine that fact. he made clear that when courts avoid an issue instead of ruling on the issues SCOTUS might not take it up immediately but it is percolating and is also a hot topic amongst many black robes. his take was something will give soon but he suggested we are looking in the wrong direction. what that meant i was still a little baffled by.
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NRA Life member, multi organization continued donor etc etc etc Last edited by ddestruel; 01-15-2015 at 9:43 PM.. |
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I think we would all like to see Peruta be affirmed in its latest form by SCOTUS as well though, as it could be a very broad ruling that just affirms the right to self-defense outside the home. But maybe if Jackson is ruled correctly, the lower courts will stop blatantly ignoring the constitution and keep the SCOTUS out of it from now on.
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If SCOTUS ducks a blatant trigger lock infringement contra the clear holding in Heller, then it's going to be harder to imagine that they're going to stand firm on carrying in the clothing or in a pocket. It may be in our favor to wait, however, as Tuesday, November 8, 2016 (actually January 20th, 2017) will be here before we know it. If only the non-Heller-four can hold on until then, we might avoid an undesirable presidential SCOTUS appointment.
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www.christopherjhoffman.com The Second Amendment is the one right that is so fundamental that the inability to exercise it, should the need arise, would render all other rights null and void. Dead people have no rights. Magna est veritas et praevalebit Last edited by Maestro Pistolero; 01-16-2015 at 5:37 PM.. |
#16
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Is Richards that more clear cut case without the confusion of improper intervention
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which is exactly the kind of speculating in the public forum that is just not done by lawyers, not if they are arguing in front of the bench appellate and above, right? So, see if I am making sense here of the judge at the cocktail party - mind reading Scalia, and Kennedy - given that Judge Kennedy 'manages' the 9th, administratively, at least- correct? And per discussion on Calguns on a 2A case, just one back, there was a theory that SCOTUS didnt take it up, because the majority vote was not there. And I believe it was Kennedy that was thought to be soft at that point, due to post Newtown concerns some suggested- correct? But maybe it was because that case didnt speak to the strict-intermediate definitions that the cocktail party intel suggested, above, and I believe it was Judge Kennedy was one of the proponents and adherents of that method, correct? Now, given that SCOTUS sits back and waits for things to percolate, and that the 9th DC is the largest in the land, it seems entirely rational hat they would want to have a clear answer from the 9th, that is: a. argued on the originalist school, that build on Heller and McDonald decision, b. to speak to the missing link- carry outside the home. c. AND speaks to strict-intermediate definitions, once and for all. d. AND politely avoids the complete hash of procedure that Gore/Harris made of Peruta. What SCOTUS wants is a clear decision with clear arguments, that they can rule on for carry outside the home...concealed or open is not an issue, nor should it be. Judge Thomas or other judges might be sympathetic to the whine that Peruta plaintiffs challenge was a 'sneaky backdoor" end-around of the State's authority, and even if not, Judge Thomas was also the fair executor of the en banc process, that thankless detailed job he did for many years, that Judge Kosinki had said he did fairly. Then perhaps that would make Judge Thomas and Judge Kennedy the kind of legal minds who put great importance upon details and rules, and it wouldn't surprise me if some judge of 27 in the 9th whispered to Prietos counsel, in a cocktail party, that they maybe they should get ready... Then the 9th and SCOTUS move forward on the "intermediate scrutiny" standard precedent, along the "public safety" line, AND 2A rights outside the home, with no more politics or confusion factor in the 9th. Then SCOTUS has its clear case, with originalist and historical scholarship building on the same Heller and McDonald thinking, and avoid the Gore counsel/CA AG mess they made in Peruta, while addressing the clear arguments that matter, as precedent. Thomas and the liberal judges on the Richards en banc panel get to reverse if thats what they want, and it goes to SCOTUS, to get what they want, to put this 2A outside the home to bed one way or another for a few years...
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Where there is unity there is always victory. ~ Publius Syrus NRA Lifetime Member, SAF Lifetime Member Last edited by rlc2; 02-02-2015 at 7:01 PM.. |
#18
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Also, these politicians are only interested in furthering THEIR agenda's, not ours. Plenty of R's have helped pass gun legislation and there are D's who have voted against it. If you'll recall, Reagan was influential in passing the Assault Weapons Ban and helping change the mind of one R in the process. http://www.buzzfeed.com/andrewkaczyn...ban#.siYN6J0Ax Hence why my wife and I are planning on leaving this silly state and going somewhere they respect our civil rights. |
#19
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Second would be to B-slap the 9th Circuit simply because it feels so good. Best!
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"The most hated initials in America today ... TSA." Said by yours truly to an audience of nodding IRS employees. |
#20
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Ok I'll admit, reading this kind of gave me a stiffy:
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Do not give in to evil, but proceed ever more boldly against it. |
#21
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Summarized very concisely, can't add a thing.
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#22
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She's right. Our hope, our ONLY hope is in the Federal Courts. Given the way things are going, it is not a great hope. But they're all we got. The Raisuli
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"Ignorance is a steep hill with perilous rocks at the bottom" WTB: 9mm cylinder for Taurus Mod. 85 |
#23
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I reject that notion. We have each other. When tyranny becomes law resistance becomes duty.
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#24
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ΜΟΛΩΝ-ΛΑΒΕ - Go Greek. Lifetime member Kappa Kappa Bang (KKB) Fraternity |
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I should have been more clear. Our only LEGAL hope is in the Federal Courts. The Raisuli
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"Ignorance is a steep hill with perilous rocks at the bottom" WTB: 9mm cylinder for Taurus Mod. 85 |
#27
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4-Press Congress to write landmark Civil Rights legislation enshrining 2A as the law of the land. Take a page from the left and do not stop pushing until its accomplished. We should be doing this despite the current POTUS or Congress. Unless it gives the SCOTUS a reason to think "the people are exercising their right and remedy and we should keep our hands off for now".
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^^^The above is just an opinion. NRA Patron Member CRPA 5 yr Member "...which from their verbosity, their endless tautologies, their involutions of case within case, and parenthesis within parenthesis, and their multiplied efforts at certainty by saids and aforesaids, by ors and by ands, to make them more plain, do really render them more perplexed and incomprehensible, not only to common readers, but to lawyers themselves. " - Thomas Jefferson |
#28
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Hope rests in the hands of a citizenry motivated to do what it takes to protect their rights, not a tiny group of people selected for their willingness to toe the line for whoever nominated them. But by all means, lets run it by the Supreme Court first and/or last.
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First, the judge explains the "test". Quote:
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#35
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A carry ruling by the SCOTUS would be nice, but california will just ignore it. |
#36
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-Brandon
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Brandon Combs I do not read private messages, and my inbox is usually full. If you need to reach me, please email me instead. My comments are not the official position or a statement of any organization unless stated otherwise. My comments are not legal advice; if you want or need legal advice, hire a lawyer. |
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