CALGUNS Politically Progressive Thread

[Ericb760]

I appreciate all of the information that this site has provided me. However, it is obvious that a good portion of posters here would be considered Conservative in their political beliefs. While I appreciate those views, the fact remains that I am politically a Progressive, a typically Californian Leftist if you will, although I differ with the average Democrat on 2A issues. I am an Air Force Veteran, a believer in the first amendment as it pertains to the separation of church and state, an avid supporter of the 2nd Amendment, a gun owner, a father, and a patriot. It would be nice to communicate with likewise progressives that share my support of the 2nd Amendment. I know from talking to people that there are a lot more of us than the right wing would suggest. So, my suggestion would be for a forum dedicated to us on the Left, so that we can join the discussion on how best to preserve our 2A rights.

[TacticalPlinker]

Huh? I think you're on the wrong forum?

By the way, 1st Amendment has nothing to do with the seperation of church and state. In fact, I don't recall any of those words last time I read it.

Best of luck to you.

[Ericb760]

Originally Posted by TacticalPlinker

Huh? I think you're on the wrong forum?

By the way, 1st Amendment has nothing to do with the seperation of church and state. In fact, I don't recall any of those words last time I read it.

Best of luck to you.

I meant simply that the 1A allows for every citizen to freely proclaim their belief, be that religious or political. It would seem by your sarcasm that this is unacceptable. Best of luck to you also.

[TacticalPlinker]

Nope. I'm an athiest who doesn't believe in the feeedom of speech or religion. In fact, I don't believe in the 2nd Amendment either. Guns and loud noises scare me.

I'm only here to mock the right wing tin foil hat wearing anti-government racist baby killing gun owners.

Is that the response you're looking for? I sure hope so. Maybe now you can sleep tonight.

[monk]

Well, the 1st protects you from government infringement of free speech. It also protects everyone else who would choose to criticize you for you voicing your opinion.

[CALI-gula]

There already is a forum for that:

http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/f...splay.php?f=71

It's for EVERYONE; it doesn't discriminate between political beliefs, other than separating between the PEOPLE and the GOVERNMENT.

.

[CessnaDriver]

Call it what you want, it's still liberalism and it's sinking this nation fast.

[California44]

"If it ain't broke, don't fix it." Words a progressive never heard as a child.

[Ericb760]

Originally Posted by TacticalPlinker

Nope. I'm an athiest who doesn't believe in the feeedom of speech or religion. In fact, I don't believe in the 2nd Amendment either. Guns and loud noises scare me.

I'm only here to mock the right wing tin foil hat wearing anti-government racist baby killing gun owners.

Is that the response you're looking for? I sure hope so. Maybe now you can sleep tonight.

No, that was not the response I was looking for. I was looking for an adult conversation.

[Hoologan]

Originally Posted by TacticalPlinker

Huh? I think you're on the wrong forum?

Divided we fail. Everyone is entitled to their own beliefs, so if the man is a proud gun owner and supporter of the 2A, perhaps welcoming him on this gun forum to talk about guns/gun rights and agreeing to disagree on other issues would be more appropriate.

[warthog1984]

Originally Posted by Ericb760

I am politically a Progressive, a typically Californian Leftist if you will, although I differ with the average Democrat on 2A issues. I am an Air Force Veteran, a believer in the first amendment as it pertains to the separation of church and state, an avid supporter of the 2nd Amendment, a gun owner, a father, and a patriot.

That's neither a Californian Leftist nor a "progressive". That's a solid libertarian/conservative viewpoint.

If you think the Gov should get involved with everything; or that service & parenthood (sperm donor hood?) mean nothing, THEN you are a Leftist.

[joe_gman]

Originally Posted by Ericb760

No, that was not the response I was looking for. I was looking for an adult conversation.

Unfortunately, adult conversation is often lacking on this site. Or at least on OT.

California is an overwhelmingly a liberal/ progressive State, as we can see by the vast majority of elected officials tend to lean to the left. As a gun enthusiast myself, it is sad to see so many of these officials introducing restrictive laws that do nothing to fix the problems that they claim to address.

As a political moderate with both liberal and conservative tendencies, I can often agree with much of the positive legislation that has improved the rights of citizen minority groups in California, as well as some of the environmental improvement standards. I see the need for government services that allow for broader access for all citizens, not just those who can afford to pay a premium for them. I understand that public unions are a necessity after having a parent who was a government employee and myself working as a government employee for a few years before starting my own business. Having fought with the district over reduced pay for myself/employees (already paid little in comparison to what we did) while the chancellor and school presidents received massive raises.

My conservative and business side agrees with the reduction of onerous restrictions and regulations that is hampering businesses. With every step I take as a business owner, I have to shell out money to the city/state, and receive little back other than headaches. I'm against illegal labor, having to deal with it on a regular basis, due to wage suppression and illegal competition. I understand the need for welfare and sec.8 overhaul to allow only those who truly need it, to have access to it.

This being a firearm forum, I think all pro-firearm individuals should be made to feel welcome, despite our political differences. In California, the Democrats are the ones who are in control of the state's government. If more pro-firearm Democrats are made to feel welcomed and embraced by the firearm community, maybe we could shift the current anti-gun stance of the party to a far more favorable pro-gun stance, or at least get rid of the anti-gun politicians and not have to settle for the theocrats or the locusts.

[BudDub22]

I'm just a pro constitution, non idealogic minded human being. Untied by my raising or brainwashed beliefs. All the small distractions detach each other from the real danger. Government. Right or left screws us the same.

[kperry]

Welcome, Ericb760 - there are a number of forumites around that lean politically left/progressive on many issues other than firearms policy/gun control - you just have to develop a bit of a thick skin if you're going to wade into certain spots, like OT....

[pluke the 2]

why you got to make all this so complicated. welcome to the forum. dont let these turds scare you off!@

[97F1504RAD]

Originally Posted by Ericb760

I appreciate all of the information that this site has provided me. However, it is obvious that a good portion of posters here would be considered Conservative in their political beliefs. While I appreciate those views, the fact remains that I am politically a Progressive, a typically Californian Leftist if you will, although I differ with the average Democrat on 2A issues. I am an Air Force Veteran, a believer in the first amendment as it pertains to the separation of church and state, an avid supporter of the 2nd Amendment, a gun owner, a father, and a patriot. It would be nice to communicate with likewise progressives that share my support of the 2nd Amendment. I know from talking to people that there are a lot more of us than the right wing would suggest. So, my suggestion would be for a forum dedicated to us on the Left, so that we can join the discussion on how best to preserve our 2A rights.

The only way to accomplish the bold is to stop voting for progressive Democrats!!

[Merc1138]

Originally Posted by 97F1504RAD

The only way to accomplish the bold is to stop voting for progressive Democrats!!

Maybe one day he'll figure out why trying to vote in 2a progressive democrats in CA is a waste of time.

[AregularGuy]

Originally Posted by Merc1138

Maybe one day he'll figure out why trying to vote in 2a progressive democrats in CA is a waste of time.

Completely agree! No offense OP, but 2A restrictions and stringent gun control are across the board Democrat agenda items. Bread and butter. Might as well get them to try and vote against a pro choice bill, won't happen. There is no changing the policy of an entire party. Can you imagine how short the career would be for a Dem official that voted against the party on any CA state firearms bills? It may have happened but I am unaware of it.

[Ericb760]

Originally Posted by AregularGuy

Completely agree! No offense OP, but 2A restrictions and stringent gun control are across the board Democrat agenda items. Bread and butter. Might as well get them to try and vote against a pro choice bill, won't happen. There is no changing the policy of an entire party. Can you imagine how short the career would be for a Dem official that voted against the party on any CA state firearms bills? It may have happened but I am unaware of it.

I agree that the vast majority of ELECTED Democrats are anti-gun. I am less convinced that the overwhelming majority of Democratic VOTERS are. And it is them that we must reach out to. I have many liberal friends that I have taken shooting. Once they understand that it's more about being a hobby then it is about killing things, more than one has gone on to purchase a gun. Their political views didn't really change, they just started seeing gun ownership in a different light, instead of it being the big, bad, bogeyman. I'd like to see a concerted effort to arrange some sort of "Take A Liberal To The Range Day". Reach out to your friends, coworkers, neighbors, etc. Mention that you are in to target shooting and ask if they'd like to join you sometime. You just might be surprised at their response.

[chainsaw]

Welcome. There are several dyed-in-the-wool leftist liberals here on the forum. Most are quiet about their political persuasions. Some are open about them. As you have probably already seen, any discussion of politics on this site tends to be very one-sided, with little but insults for democrats or liberals. If you want to be a leftie and participate here, you have to have a thick skin.

Originally Posted by Ericb760

I agree that the vast majority of ELECTED Democrats are anti-gun. I am less convinced that the overwhelming majority of Democratic VOTERS are.

This is a question of some debate. The reason for the debate is that "anti-gun" and "pro-gun" are not absolute statements, but questions of degree. For example, in the pro-gun camp we have people who claim that everyone (including convicted felons) should have access to all guns, up to and including nuclear arms. In the middle we have people who are in favor of what they consider sensible gun control laws, which may for example include licensing, psychological fitness tests, registration, assault weapons bans, and bans of high-capacity magazines. On the other extreme end we have people who want to ban all guns. Most democratic voters fall somewhere in the middle of that spectrum. Whether you want to call that pro-gun or anti-gun is in the eye of the beholder.

On this forum, the overwhelming majority of the posters, and therefore the tenor of the discussion are on the extreme pro-gun end (this is highly correlated but not identical with extremely conservative political positions). The style of discussion can be very abrasive. A considerable amount of all posts on here are flinging invectives in the general directions of people like President Obama (occasionally referred to as Barry Sotero, supposedly a Kenyan-born Indonesian citizen and impostor in the office of president, or referred to by insults like Obummer and 0bama), or Attorneys General Holder and Harris, or Governor Brown (whom some people here hold in high esteem, while most refer to him as Moonbeam or "if its brown, flush it down"), or the California legislature, or liberals in general (often referred to as "libtards", which gave rise to a discussion forum called "guntards", a self-defined group of liberals with guns). Again, as I said above: you have to have a thick skin if you are willing to out yourself as a liberal here.

I'd like to see a concerted effort to arrange some sort of "Take A Liberal To The Range Day". Reach out to your friends, coworkers, neighbors, etc.

Let me exaggerate a little bit: Some members here seem to be of the opinion that the only use for liberals in shooting is as targets. Now seriously, I have not seen much call for murder of liberals, but as you have seen from a few posts in just this thread, many posters want to stay at least at arms lengths from liberals.

[Merc1138]

Originally Posted by Ericb760

I agree that the vast majority of ELECTED Democrats are anti-gun. I am less convinced that the overwhelming majority of Democratic VOTERS are. And it is them that we must reach out to. I have many liberal friends that I have taken shooting. Once they understand that it's more about being a hobby then it is about killing things, more than one has gone on to purchase a gun. Their political views didn't really change, they just started seeing gun ownership in a different light, instead of it being the big, bad, bogeyman. I'd like to see a concerted effort to arrange some sort of "Take A Liberal To The Range Day". Reach out to your friends, coworkers, neighbors, etc. Mention that you are in to target shooting and ask if they'd like to join you sometime. You just might be surprised at their response.

Ok, so you believe the majority of democrat voters aren't anti gun. Fair enough.

Guess what? They need to stop voting for democrats in CA. There are pro 2a democrat politicians, in other states. They aren't in CA. Voting for democrats(and sometimes republicans) in CA = anti gun. "some more laws" and "just a little more restriction" is absolutely unacceptable. You and your friends can enjoy owning guns, shooting guns, great, we need more gun owners. However casting votes to anti 2a politicians... you might as well be shooting yourself in the foot. In an ideal world you might be able to be pro 2a and vote democrat, but not in this state.

[Ericb760]

Originally Posted by chainsaw

Let me exaggerate a little bit: Some members here seem to be of the opinion that the only use for liberals in shooting is as targets. Now seriously, I have not seen much call for murder of liberals, but as you have seen from a few posts in just this thread, many posters want to stay at least at arms lengths from liberals.

Well, therein lies the problem. If these types refuse to even engage with liberals on the general topic of guns, and continue with their "us vs. them" mentality, they will watch what remaining "rights" they have left, eroded to the point that their Red Ryder's become illegal. Kind of stupid really, considering the political makeup of the state that they have chosen to live in.

[Merc1138]

Originally Posted by Ericb760

Well, therein lies the problem. If these types refuse to even engage with liberals on the general topic of guns, and continue with their "us or them" mentality, they will watch what remaining "rights" they have left, eroded to the point that their Red Ryder's become illegal. Kind of stupid really, considering the political makeup of the state that they have chosen to live in.

Let me guess. You believe letter/email writing campaigns to Pelosi, Boxer, Newsom, Feinstein, Yee, DeLeon, etc. could possibly make a difference?

[Ericb760]

Originally Posted by Merc1138

Ok, so you believe the majority of democrat voters aren't anti gun. Fair enough.

Guess what? They need to stop voting for democrats in CA. There are pro 2a democrat politicians, in other states. They aren't in CA. Voting for democrats(and sometimes republicans) in CA = anti gun. "some more laws" and "just a little more restriction" is absolutely unacceptable. You and your friends can enjoy owning guns, shooting guns, great, we need more gun owners. However casting votes to anti 2a politicians... you might as well be shooting yourself in the foot. In an ideal world you might be able to be pro 2a and vote democrat, but not in this state.

Politicians take their cues from their constituents. I wouldn't go so far to say that the majority of democratic voters are pro 2A. Rather, it's not really an issue that the majority focus on. As in anything, however, it is the squeaky wheel that gets the grease. A better plan of attack is educating democrats in the sporting aspect of firearms. If we can show enough of them the other aspects of firearm ownership, like target matches, camaraderie, bonding with their children over a shared hobby, building an AR like a proverbial Erector Set, etc., then just maybe they will stop and question the entire anti-2A stance of their elected representatives. This generation of elected officials is probably a lost cause. But if we can get more dems like me in to shooting, maybe the next generation of politicians would be more level headed when it comes to the issue of firearms and gun control.

[Ericb760]

Originally Posted by Merc1138

Let me guess. You believe letter/email writing campaigns to Pelosi, Boxer, Newsom, Feinstein, Yee, DeLeon, etc. could possibly make a difference?

No, those politicians have sold their souls for gun control. But they will not be around forever. Feinstein's what? 80? Pelosi and Boxer are not that far behind.

[Merc1138]

Originally Posted by Ericb760

Politicians take their cues from their constituents. I wouldn't go so far to say that the majority of democratic voters are pro 2A. Rather, it's not really an issue that the majority focus on. As in anything, however, it is the squeaky wheel that gets the grease. A better plan of attack is educating democrats in the sporting aspect of firearms. If we can show enough of them the other aspects of firearm ownership, like target matches, camaraderie, bonding with their children over a shared hobby, building an AR like a proverbial Erector Set, etc., then just maybe they will stop and question the entire anti-2A stance of their elected representatives. This generation of elected officials is probably a lost cause. But if we can get more dems like me in to shooting, maybe the next generation of politicians would be more level headed when it comes to the issue of firearms and gun control.

Considering how CA has gotten consistently worse regarding new democrat politicians regarding 2a over the past 30 years, not gonna happen. If you and your friends want to support 2a, stop voting for democrats. You cannot vote for these anti 2a democrats and call yourself pro2a, it doesn't work.

[Merc1138]

Originally Posted by Ericb760

No, those politicians have sold their souls for gun control. But they will not be around forever. Feinstein's what? 80? Pelosi and Boxer are not that far behind.

I mentioned more than 3. You don't seem to realize just how much money is involved in this stuff. Even if you had openly pro 2a democrats running for office, they'll get eliminated from the running via lack of money and support from the party. Like I said, it works in other states, not CA.

[Ericb760]

Originally Posted by Merc1138

I mentioned more than 3. You don't seem to realize just how much money is involved in this stuff. Even if you had openly pro 2a democrats running for office, they'll get eliminated from the running via lack of money and support from the party. Like I said, it works in other states, not CA.

With a defeatist attitude like that what do you hope to accomplish? Like I said, politicians take their cues from the voting public. It will not happen overnight, obviously, but if we can change gun ownership in the eyes of even a few democrats from "Oooh! Big scary guns!" to "How about we go shoot some targets this weekend, son?", we can maybe stem the tide. WTF do you have to lose except every right that you hold dear? I am a DEMOCRAT and I am explaining to you a way that I feel other DEMOCRATS could change their minds about guns. You want to piss that away? I don't see much else on this board suggesting ways to combat the erosion of 2A rights other than waiting for laws to pass that we "hope" get deemed unconstitutional. Not really proactive now, is it?

[Merc1138]

Originally Posted by Ericb760

With a defeatist attitude like that what do you hope to accomplish? Like I said, politicians take their cues from the voting public. It will not happen overnight, obviously, but if we can change gun ownership in the eyes of even a few democrats from "Oooh! Big scary guns!" to "How about we go shoot some targets this weekend, son?", we can maybe stem the tide. WTF do you have to lose except every right that you hold dear? I am a DEMOCRAT and I am explaining to you a way that I feel other DEMOCRATS could change their minds about guns. You want to piss that away? I don't see much else on this board suggesting ways to combat the erosion of 2A rights other than waiting for laws to pass that we "hope" get deemed unconstitutional. Not really proactive now, is it?

So now you're telling me that we have you to thank for voting in anti 2a democrats?

Thanks

Sorry, I've already pointed this out to you, but I guess I need to repeat myself again. Voting democrat in CA = anti 2a. Vote something other than democrat if you want to vote pro 2a(I also pointed out that we've had anti 2a republicans as well. Shwarzenegger and Reagan off the top of my head). You can complain to us all you want about being thick headed, defeatist, or whatever you want, but if you keep voting for antis, you are actively working to abolish 2a in CA.

[Ackrite]

Originally Posted by Ericb760

I agree that the vast majority of ELECTED Democrats are anti-gun. I am less convinced that the overwhelming majority of Democratic VOTERS are. And it is them that we must reach out to. I have many liberal friends that I have taken shooting. Once they understand that it's more about being a hobby then it is about killing things, more than one has gone on to purchase a gun. Their political views didn't really change, they just started seeing gun ownership in a different light, instead of it being the big, bad, bogeyman. I'd like to see a concerted effort to arrange some sort of "Take A Liberal To The Range Day". Reach out to your friends, coworkers, neighbors, etc. Mention that you are in to target shooting and ask if they'd like to join you sometime. You just might be surprised at their response.

The bolded is exactly where your comrades at DU fail. Gun ownership and 2A are not more about being a hobby, that just happens to be a secondary reason for gun ownership and the 2A. The Second Amendment is NOT a silly little hobby that we are clinging on to, it is a civil right and it should be treated as such. That is why you will often hear the mantra "Not one inch". You might be fooling yourself, but you will not convince many other on CG that you care much about the 2A if you continue to vote for Leftists, Progressives, or Democrats in general, at least here in California.

[Merc1138]

Originally Posted by Ackrite

The bolded is exactly where your comrades at DU fail. Gun ownership and 2A are not more about being a hobby, that just happens to be a secondary reason for gun ownership and the 2A. The Second Amendment is NOT a silly little hobby that we are clinging on to, it is a civil right and it should be treated as such. That is why you will often hear the mantra "Not one inch". You might be fooling yourself, but you will not convince many other on CG that you care much about the 2A if you continue to vote for Leftists, Progressives, or Democrats in general, at least here in California.

Agreed. That's the mentality people use that makes it ok for someone to shoot skeet, but not ok for someone to have a firearm to ventilate dirtbags.

2A is not about a hobby, it is not about hunting, it is not about games or sport.

[Ackrite]

Originally Posted by Ericb760

With a defeatist attitude like that what do you hope to accomplish? Like I said, politicians take their cues from the voting public. It will not happen overnight, obviously, but if we can change gun ownership in the eyes of even a few democrats from "Oooh! Big scary guns!" to "How about we go shoot some targets this weekend, son?", we can maybe stem the tide. WTF do you have to lose except every right that you hold dear? I am a DEMOCRAT and I am explaining to you a way that I feel other DEMOCRATS could change their minds about guns. You want to piss that away? I don't see much else on this board suggesting ways to combat the erosion of 2A rights other than waiting for laws to pass that we "hope" get deemed unconstitutional. Not really proactive now, is it?

That's another fail. Anti-2A Democrats have to feel something and have their heartstrings tugged on in order for them to react. It's impossible for your kind, generally, to think with any reasonable amount of logic, but rather they act and vote on their emotions. Try to explain on DU that they should start thinking logically rather than emotionally and you will be labeled a heartless baby-killer enabler. That's the reality of what pro-2A civil rights organizations and gun owners are dealing with.

[Ericb760]

Originally Posted by Ackrite

That's another fail. Anti-2A Democrats have to feel something and have their heartstrings tugged on in order for them to react. It's impossible for your kind, generally, to think with any reasonable amount of logic, but rather they act and vote on their emotions. Try to explain on DU that they should start thinking logically rather than emotionally and you will be labeled a heartless baby-killer enabler. That's the reality of what pro-2A civil rights organizations and gun owners are dealing with.

And you completely miss the point that I am one of those gun owners also. And I am mad as hell that Democrats in this state have done so well at demonizing me and my hobby. While it might help you sleep at night, making knee-jerk statements on how illogical democratic thought is, really serves no purpose in the debate. We all recognize that we see issues differently. Insulting me says more about your character than mine. And the chance of this state turning red anytime soon is about the same as you getting chosen to head Planned Parenthood. Sometimes it seems that conservatives can only do one thing, and one thing only. And that is to ***** about Democrats and bang their spoons on their high-chairs like some insolent baby. Protip, pal: You will continue to lose this argument in this state if you refuse to even engage with your fellow citizens on the important topics of the day. Gun Control/2A being one of the most important.

[Ericb760]

Originally Posted by Ackrite

The bolded is exactly where your comrades at DU fail. Gun ownership and 2A are not more about being a hobby, that just happens to be a secondary reason for gun ownership and the 2A. The Second Amendment is NOT a silly little hobby that we are clinging on to, it is a civil right and it should be treated as such. That is why you will often hear the mantra "Not one inch". You might be fooling yourself, but you will not convince many other on CG that you care much about the 2A if you continue to vote for Leftists, Progressives, or Democrats in general, at least here in California.

I would absolutely agree. But you cannot tell me that every shot you put downrange you do for 2A reasons. I propose minimizing that aspect of gun ownership, at least initially. Take it from me, if you take a lib to the range and start spouting "Molon Labe!" at them, you will have already lost the game. Better to play up the sportsman aspects than try to thump them over the head with a concept that is distant and foreign to them. Has that been working very well for you up to now? And can we please set aside my voting record for now? While I did vote for Obama, I DID NOT vote for any sitting California politician.

[Merc1138]

Originally Posted by Ericb760

I would absolutely agree. But you cannot tell me that every shot you put downrange you do for 2A reasons. I propose minimizing that aspect of gun ownership, at least initially. Take it from me, if you take a lib to the range and start spouting "Molon Labe!" at them, you will have already lost the game. Better to play up the sportsman aspects than try to thump them over the head with a concept that is distant and foreign to them. Has that been working very well for you up to now? And can we please set aside my voting record for now? While I did vote for Obama, I DID NOT vote for any sitting California politician.

So you want us to engage the liberals by pretending that 2a is about hobby, thus giving them even more reason to think their civil right infringing nonsense is legitimate?

Yeah, that worked out so well it got us all of those exemptions and requirements that were basically to allow cowboy action shooting and olympic bullseye rimfire pistol shooting, while everything else got banned. You apparently aren't aware of the history of 2a in this state, so quit trying to preach about what you want us to do, when you're the one voting for a guy who specifically stated he wanted to ban AWs in his second term.

Democrat politicians and 2a do not go together in this state.

[glock7]

Originally Posted by California44

"If it ain't broke, don't fix it." Words a progressive never heard as a child.

hahahaha touche. if you are a liberal you hate guns. you are guilty by association. sorry, but that is the reality of the situation. don't shoot the messenger....

[glock7]

Originally Posted by Ericb760

I appreciate all of the information that this site has provided me. However, it is obvious that a good portion of posters here would be considered Conservative in their political beliefs. While I appreciate those views, the fact remains that I am politically a Progressive, a typically Californian Leftist if you will, although I differ with the average Democrat on 2A issues. I am an Air Force Veteran, a believer in the first amendment as it pertains to the separation of church and state, an avid supporter of the 2nd Amendment, a gun owner, a father, and a patriot. It would be nice to communicate with likewise progressives that share my support of the 2nd Amendment. I know from talking to people that there are a lot more of us than the right wing would suggest. So, my suggestion would be for a forum dedicated to us on the Left, so that we can join the discussion on how best to preserve our 2A rights.

so you'd like to segregate the different viewpoints so you can only hear your viewpoints? of course you would.

[glock7]

Originally Posted by Merc1138

So you want us to engage the liberals by pretending that 2a is about hobby, thus giving them even more reason to think their civil right infringing nonsense is legitimate?

Yeah, that worked out so well it got us all of those exemptions and requirements that were basically to allow cowboy action shooting and olympic bullseye rimfire pistol shooting, while everything else got banned. You apparently aren't aware of the history of 2a in this state, so quit trying to preach about what you want us to do, when you're the one voting for a guy who specifically stated he wanted to ban AWs in his second term.

Democrat politicians and 2a do not go together in this state.

Merc, what you stated above is true. if you read into the meat and potatoes of what every supposed pro 2a left leaner is really all about...they don't support 2a. in my many years of shooting i have never heard anyone at the range yell out molon labe....oh the tactics of the left.

[glock7]

Originally Posted by Ericb760

No, those politicians have sold their souls for gun control. But they will not be around forever. Feinstein's what? 80? Pelosi and Boxer are not that far behind.

yes, but by that time, we will be using our tactical sling shots....but rocks will be banned by name. that igneous rock....very dangerous.

[DBADRAT]

^^^+ forever, thanks glock7