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Ammo and Reloading Factory Ammunition, Reloading, Components, Load Data and more.

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  #1  
Old 01-12-2018, 7:31 PM
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McGuiver McGuiver is offline
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Default Reloading 22 Spitfire / 5.7 Johnson rounds...

Has anyone out here ran across reload data for the 22 Spitfire / 5.7 Johnson?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.22_Spitfire

http://weaponsman.com/?p=32990

It is basically a 30 carbine case necked down to accept a .223 caliber bullet. I will be wildcating with some load data. I have some CFE BLK powder on hand for 22 Hornet. I want to find somewhere to start for 5.7 Johnson case.

******

Case size comparison...load data...

***

CFE BLK powder

22 Hornet - smaller load data (12.1 grains of CFE BLK)



5.7 Johnson - ?

222 Remington - larger load data (18.1 grains of CFE BLK)



***

H-4227 powder

22 Hornet - smaller load data (9 grains of 4227)



5.7 Johnson - 14 grains of 4227 from web...?

http://www.imageseek.com/5.7mm/reloading.html

222 Remington - larger load data (14 grains of 4227)



***

The closest round I could find...



http://www.surestrikesystem.com/technical/loadData.php



This is 30 carbine brass necked down to .223 caliber bullet.

Looks like Accurate - 1680 powder was the most accurate for him. CFE BLK is right near 1680 powder on the burn chart. I know the weights will be different.



Info on forming the Garin 22 cal brass from 30 carbine...

http://www.surestrikesystem.com/docs...%20Forming.pdf

***

Any help on other powders or loads would be helpful.




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Last edited by McGuiver; 01-12-2018 at 8:33 PM..
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  #2  
Old 01-12-2018, 9:24 PM
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alpha_romeo_XV alpha_romeo_XV is offline
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I had a chance to buy a new IAI M1 carbine in 5.7 Johnson several years ago for a nice price, but passed because I didn't reload. I've been reloading over 10 years now and regret not buying that rifle. What rifle do you have?

For my Inland M1 carbine in std 30 cal I just tried different loads till I found what it liked. Just start out conservative.
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  #3  
Old 01-13-2018, 12:06 AM
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I found six old manuals publishing data. The three editions of the Pacific manuals (Pacific Gunsight Company, Pacific Tool Company, purchased by Hornady) from 1967 to 1969 ( 1st Ed., 2nd Ed., Revised Ed.). The books have it as 5.7mm Spitfire. Lists loads for 40 and 45 grain bullets using 2400, IMR 4227, and IMR 4198.

The other references are Ackley's "Handbook for Shooters and Reloaders" Volume 1 and 2, and Donnelly's "Handloader's Manual of Cartridge Conversion". Many of the Ackley loads in his books are worked out on a Powley slide rule, not pressure tested or actual data.

The Internet Reloading Manual Index lists the 6 reference books on row 142 under .22 Carbine.

I will see about scanning and posting the pages from the six books tomorrow if time allows, later if not.

Criss

Last edited by CCrawford; 01-13-2018 at 12:19 AM..
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Old 01-13-2018, 1:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alpha_romeo_XV View Post
I had a chance to buy a new IAI M1 carbine in 5.7 Johnson several years ago for a nice price, but passed because I didn't reload. I've been reloading over 10 years now and regret not buying that rifle. What rifle do you have?



For my Inland M1 carbine in std 30 cal I just tried different loads till I found what it liked. Just start out conservative.


I ended up picking up a IAI M1 for a good price because the lack of ammo available to the general public. I remember in the 80's and 90's when IAI was pushing these to trying to make a come back, but were still not popular. This is a gun for Reloader's only.


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  #5  
Old 01-13-2018, 10:42 AM
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Here is some info for you

Donnelly


Ackley Vol. 1(1964?)


Ackley, Vol 2 (1966?)


Pacific (all three books have same data, late 1960s)


Cartridges of the World, 4th Ed. (1980)


Hope that helps,

Criss

Last edited by CCrawford; 01-13-2018 at 11:59 AM.. Reason: Added
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  #6  
Old 01-13-2018, 2:22 PM
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Thanks guys. That should get me started. Looks like a fun little round.


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  #7  
Old 02-01-2018, 8:30 AM
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Default Reloading 22 Spitfire / 5.7 Johnson rounds...

Quote:
Originally Posted by CCrawford View Post
Here is some info for you

Donnelly


Ackley Vol. 1(1964?)


Ackley, Vol 2 (1966?)


Pacific (all three books have same data, late 1960s)


Cartridges of the World, 4th Ed. (1980)


Hope that helps,

Criss


Here is the high definition version of this. I just picked up a new book. I picked up "The Handloaders Manual of Cartridge Conversions" 4th Edition.








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  #8  
Old 02-02-2018, 2:42 PM
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Default Reloading 22 Spitfire / 5.7 Johnson rounds...

I picked up some Redding form sizing dies for this caliber. It will allow me to form the 5.7 Johnson from 30 Carbine brass.



Brass on left side is normal Winchester 30 Carbine brass.

Brass in the middle has been run thru first forming die. It has necked the internal neck to 0.270" dia.

Brass in the right has been run thru second forming die. It has necked the internal neck to 0.220" dia.

I will still have to trim to length and check neck wall thickness. If it is too thick I will have to neck turn before running thru normal reloading dies.


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Last edited by McGuiver; 02-02-2018 at 2:46 PM..
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  #9  
Old 02-02-2018, 4:07 PM
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Default Reloading 22 Spitfire / 5.7 Johnson rounds...

I put my first dummy round together. Waiting on reloading dies, but wanted to see what it looks like with a 50 grain frangible 223 bullet stuffed into it.



Just for size comparison...

Left is 5.7 Johnson (Dummy Round)

Right is Lake City 5.56 brass.



I think I like this new little round. Looks like a baby 5.56 round. Can wait to load some and test at the range.


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Last edited by McGuiver; 02-02-2018 at 4:11 PM..
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  #10  
Old 02-12-2018, 6:04 PM
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Default Reloading 22 Spitfire / 5.7 Johnson rounds...

I got some proper head stamped brass. "5.7 Johnson".



I still need to form the case, but I like the head stamp.






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  #11  
Old 02-14-2018, 5:03 PM
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Default Reloading 22 Spitfire / 5.7 Johnson rounds...

I just got a surprise box today. It has my new reloading dies and extended shell holder. Can't wait to start reloading now.








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  #12  
Old 02-15-2018, 8:22 PM
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Default Reloading 22 Spitfire / 5.7 Johnson rounds...

Got some factory rounds in 5.7 Johnson.









Blue paint marker is from me. It is just to identify the factory loads.



Here is some brass I have formed, and ready for reloading.


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Last edited by McGuiver; 02-15-2018 at 8:27 PM..
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  #13  
Old 02-16-2018, 5:09 PM
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Default Reloading 22 Spitfire / 5.7 Johnson rounds...

Had a very unproductive day at the range. I tried the factory ammo, and my own ammo, and was only able to get 3 rounds fired off. They all showed light primer strikes. I tore down the M1 30 Carbine bolt and cleaned it out. And lubed it back up. I managed to get 3 rounds fired. Only put one on paper. Other 2 were functional test. Then back to light primer strikes. Gun was torn down and cleaned, and re-lubed.
Still no love.

Here is my one and only round on paper with no sight adjustment at 50 yards.



These are one inch squares.

I will now take down the firing pin and measure the OAL of the pin.

Anyone else have any insight to light primer strikes on a M1 30 Carbine bolt?


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  #14  
Old 02-17-2018, 2:05 PM
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Your cases may not be fully chambering and the the bolt is not completely closed. If that is the case when you pull the trigger the hammer falls, hits the bolt, forces it closed but the firing pin doesn't strike the primer with enough force to detonate it.
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Old 05-16-2018, 6:30 AM
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Howdy McGuiver,

Any luck with that light primer hit issue...accuracy?
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Old 05-16-2018, 8:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by smle-man View Post
Your cases may not be fully chambering and the the bolt is not completely closed. If that is the case when you pull the trigger the hammer falls, hits the bolt, forces it closed but the firing pin doesn't strike the primer with enough force to detonate it.
Easy enough to check. Make sure the bolt rotates fully.

OP remove the bolt and check FP protrusion.
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Old 05-16-2018, 2:24 PM
Sailormilan2 Sailormilan2 is offline
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Which rounds did you have success with? Your home loads or the factory ammo? If you had success with the factory ammo only I would suspect a tight chamber, or a weak recoil spring. It a combination of both.
M1 Carbine recoil spring length should be 10 1/4". If it's shorter than that I would consider replacing it.
Also, once you case formed with the second step, did that involve using a sizing die? Or did you ever run your Neely created brass through a sizing die. Brass does have "spring back" and sometimes requires running twice through a die.

Last edited by Sailormilan2; 05-16-2018 at 2:29 PM..
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