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Centerfire Rifles - Manually Operated Lever action, bolt action or other non gas operated centerfire rifles.

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  #1  
Old 05-14-2018, 8:25 PM
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Default List of stupid questions

So I got the urge to get a long range (semi) precision rifle. I will not be competing or trying to set world records. I’d like to hit the gong at 1000-1200 yards 7 out of 10 times for giggles. The rifle will be also used for short walking distance coyote stands and pigs spotted from the road. I’m thinking 6.5 creedmore and that’s where things get complicated. I’m left handed.

I’d like to do the build off a Remington 700 action since it has the most aftermarket support and being lefty I need every single option I can get. Should I buy a donor gun (like a .308) or just the action? Planning on throwing it in a MDT LSS chassis as it’s light weight and left hand friendly. Budget is flexible but I’m looking at fun not award winning. I’m aware of the other brands like Tikka and Savage but really want to stick with Remington for options. I’m not going to regret not spending a ton of money. I got a few years of learning the essentials before I really notice the difference.

Last edited by deckhandmike; 05-14-2018 at 8:31 PM..
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  #2  
Old 05-14-2018, 8:57 PM
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Bergara HMR- check it out.
Nutnfancy actually did a review that wasn't 4 hours long on it that was good.
Same foot print as a 700 with a few features (better extractor for one) then Remington.
Better quality too.
After a bear hunt where a case wouldn't extract for a follow up shot I will never touch another Remington rifle, the good days of Remington are gone sad to say. They truly were a great American company.
And yes every gunsmith can work on one, and there plenty that are sweet shooters built for the range, but it's just not up to the level of sako or tikka.
If your going to upgrade in the future maybe consider getting a enclosed receiver you want now and putting a barrel on it and swap up parts as you go along.

My precision rifle quest started cheap....didn't end up that way, and it's not a drop in the bucket compared to the guys with the vision for real long range builds. $$$$$$$


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Old 05-14-2018, 9:18 PM
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Am I missing something? Not seeing a Bergara lefty rifle in 6.5.
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Old 05-14-2018, 9:37 PM
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Mike,

I think your plan of going with the 700 action is the way to go. Hereís what I would do...

1. Buy a standard 700 actin with the .473 (.308) bolt face.
2. But a Timney 510/512 trigger
3. Purely optional but I would also get a oversized bolt knob. It makes cycling the action much easier.
4. Krieger, Bartlein, Benchmark, are all premium barrels. Youíll spend about $400 on a blank.
5. Take all this to Randall and have him put it together.

Youíll have a rifle thatís about 3 steps above a factory rifle and will give you years of learning. Your not going to get full on custom performance, but youíll be close.

Going 7 out of 10 on a 20Ē gong at 1000 isnít easy peasy. Youíll need a gun that can deliver consistent results. Lots of factory guns can produce a 1/2 MOA group every 20-30 rounds. These guns are usually 1 MOA average rifles. Having a rifle that produces 1/2 MOA groups all the time with the occasional 1/4 MOA group every 20-30 rounds is going to be a much better learning tool. The suggestions above will get you 1/2 MOA all day, everyday, gun.
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Old 05-14-2018, 9:40 PM
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1000-1200 yards 7 out of 10 times will require practice unless you are very good already. Not an insult ---just an observation. When I was in practice I could shoot at that range with my 50bmg rifles but since I have not been able to do so in 6 months I doubt I could do so now.

As far as the rifle---You may be able to pick up a donor rifle/action for less than a new action only. That could save you money.

That is all I have except good luck on your project
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Old 05-14-2018, 10:13 PM
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You can get a bare receiver or a complete action from GrabaGun from $200-$350.
A barrel with shipping will run close to $400 and Randall gets another $250 to install it.
So figure a grand for the barreled action.
I use extremely light triggers on my own guns but get any aftermarket trigger and it will be lightyears ahead of a factory trigger.

My only critique is the chambering itself. For 1200 yards I would pick a bullet with a high BC number that is known to shoot extremely well and look for a chamberings that will push it as close to 3000 FPS as accurately as possible.
I tend to read the listings for Lapua brass and then pick the chambering.
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Old 05-14-2018, 11:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deckhandmike View Post
I’d like to hit the gong at 1000-1200 yards 7 out of 10 times for giggles.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NorCalFocus View Post
Going 7 out of 10 on a 20” gong at 1000 isn’t easy peasy.
He never said the SIZE of the gong.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Divernhunter View Post
1000-1200 yards 7 out of 10 times will require practice unless you are very good already.
Most 1000yd gongs are 40" or larger.
That should not be a problem once a shooter has a solid grasp of wind.
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Old 05-15-2018, 6:27 AM
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How much do you want to spend for a giggle? If you shoot often, it may be worth your while to buy a custom action. Buying a donor r700 action and blueprinting it will cost about the same as a new custom action, without getting an integrated rail. I've learned through lots of reading that precision shooting is very much a you-get-what-you-paid-for hobby.
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Old 05-15-2018, 9:45 AM
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But there are almost always bargains to be had it you look in the right places.
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Old 05-15-2018, 2:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Rusty_Shackleferd View Post
How much do you want to spend for a giggle? If you shoot often, it may be worth your while to buy a custom action. Buying a donor r700 action and blueprinting it will cost about the same as a new custom action, without getting an integrated rail. I've learned through lots of reading that precision shooting is very much a you-get-what-you-paid-for hobby.
So what custom action that is the same type as a Remington 700 that comes in lefty should I look at if I went down that road?
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Old 05-15-2018, 2:37 PM
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Originally Posted by deckhandmike View Post
So what custom action that is the same type as a Remington 700 that comes in lefty should I look at if I went down that road?
Lone Peak Fusion or Razor
http://www.lonepeakarms.com/fuzion
http://www.lonepeakarms.com/razor
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Old 05-15-2018, 2:46 PM
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Originally Posted by deckhandmike View Post
So what custom action that is the same type as a Remington 700 that comes in lefty should I look at if I went down that road?


Iím building a lefty bolt action right now and I went with a bighorn origin. 825 for the action, but they arenít shipping until August. You could also look for sick deals on snipers hide. They have a lefty sales section.
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Old 05-15-2018, 3:06 PM
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No need to get all crazy and spend a bucket of money having a rifle built. Bud's has just what you want for $943, except it's not a Remington.

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/...ducts_id/41900

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  #14  
Old 05-15-2018, 3:27 PM
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Originally Posted by sigstroker View Post
No need to get all crazy and spend a bucket of money having a rifle built. Bud's has just what you want for $943, except it's not a Remington.

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/...ducts_id/41900

Damn, didnít know they made that in a lefty! That might make a very good starter gun for what I was looking to do. Anyone heard anything terrible about these?
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Old 05-15-2018, 3:33 PM
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Originally Posted by sigstroker View Post
No need to get all crazy and spend a bucket of money having a rifle built. Bud's has just what you want for $943, except it's not a Remington.

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/...ducts_id/41900

Are the Savage BA chamber and extractors any better than what is found on the 338BA?

I had an extra 338BA that was used as a loaner, it was not shot much but never did extract well.. Run hot loads and you needed a cleaning rod. The entire experience was a pain in the butt.. At least in that caliber the BA had know issues in this regard. New bolt faces, extractors, detents and springs, it got better but was never what it should have been.

Even though this was a low use extra, I swore I would not buy another Savage centerfire for long range.
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  #16  
Old 05-15-2018, 4:02 PM
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Originally Posted by sigstroker View Post
No need to get all crazy and spend a bucket of money having a rifle built. Bud's has just what you want for $943, except it's not a Remington.

https://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/...ducts_id/41900

https://grabagun.com/savage-111.html Looks same for $809, last one it says
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Old 05-15-2018, 4:10 PM
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Savages are known to have failure to eject and feeding issues. Most guys running them nice n easy at the bench and donít notice it. But run it hard and youíll find out real quick.

Also that buttstock is not friendly to using a rear bag. There is nowhere for the stock to ride on top of the bag. So youíll likely be changing that out as soon as you get the gun.

Last edited by NorCalFocus; 05-15-2018 at 4:12 PM..
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  #18  
Old 05-15-2018, 4:15 PM
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Originally Posted by deckhandmike View Post
So what custom action that is the same type as a Remington 700 that comes in lefty should I look at if I went down that road?
Defiance, Surgeon, and Bighorn come to mind.
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Old 05-15-2018, 4:32 PM
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Damn, didnít know they made that in a lefty! That might make a very good starter gun for what I was looking to do. Anyone heard anything terrible about these?


I actually have that same rifle. Itís a good rifle, but the stock on it is horrendous in my opinion. It canít take a rear bag. I immediately changed it out to a magpul prs.
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Old 05-15-2018, 7:46 PM
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I actually have that same rifle. It’s a good rifle, but the stock on it is horrendous in my opinion. It can’t take a rear bag. I immediately changed it out to a magpul prs.
Any ejection issues? Randall, how many of these do you see in your shop needing help? Lynn jr you see anyone making decent shots with this gun? And yes, that stock is going into the trash. No biggie.

Say the gun shot mediocre, is it worth upgrading after I shoot the barrel out or is it a dead end purchase?

Last edited by deckhandmike; 05-15-2018 at 7:55 PM..
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  #21  
Old 05-15-2018, 7:51 PM
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https://grabagun.com/savage-111.html Looks same for $809, last one it says
Price went up to $957.15, still says last one, lol.
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Old 05-15-2018, 7:54 PM
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I have a Savage 110 7mm Rem Mag, it has never had any extraction or ejection issues no matter how fast or slow I work the bolt.
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Old 05-15-2018, 8:07 PM
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Price went up to $957.15, still says last one, lol.
Yeah, F me. If anyone sees one again for 800$ let me know and Iíll pull the trigger.
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Old 05-15-2018, 8:28 PM
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Any ejection issues? Randall, how many of these do you see in your shop needing help? Lynn jr you see anyone making decent shots with this gun? And yes, that stock is going into the trash. No biggie.

Say the gun shot mediocre, is it worth upgrading after I shoot the barrel out or is it a dead end purchase?


I havenít had any issues with it. I think itís a platform that can be upgraded later down the line. I know ptg sells bolts for it, so you could have Randal fit it for you. There are also plenty barrel makers for it too. The only reason why Iím not doing it to mine is because I want an action with control round feed and a mechanical ejector. If youíre ever in the Orange County area, we can go to the range and you can shoot my savage.
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Old 05-15-2018, 9:13 PM
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There is no such thing as successful long range shooting on a budget.
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Old 05-15-2018, 10:47 PM
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Are the Savage BA chamber and extractors any better than what is found on the 338BA?
They are the same.
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Old 05-16-2018, 12:29 AM
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I actually have that same rifle. It’s a good rifle, but the stock on it is horrendous in my opinion. It can’t take a rear bag. I immediately changed it out to a magpul prs.
Yeah, the stock sucks. If you want to go cheaper than the PRS, you go Luth-AR.

They are not the smoothest or slickest actions out there. But they aren't all bad, the Stealth Evolution I played with feels surprising smooth. It might be because it's one of their newest models and they've made product improvements. But if you're more concerned with throwing bullets than racking bolts, it's hard to beat the performance for value of the Stealth. I read an article where a gunsmith tore one down to measure straightness, true, and tightness of threads, and the smith was impressed and did nothing further to the action.

There is apparently sometimes grease and grit in the bolts as delivered, and there's a Vaughn Precision youtube on how to disassemble and clean the bolt.

Last edited by sigstroker; 05-16-2018 at 12:32 AM..
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Old 05-16-2018, 12:42 AM
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BTW, when shopping for a left-handed rifle, it can be feast or famine. It could be a shop had been sitting on a lefty model for awhile, and so then will discount it to get rid of it. My friend found a screamin deal on a .222 that way.

Conversely, they can be hard to find and just a little bit of demand drives the price up.

If you want to shop for a price, try wikiarms.com. You can put in search terms. Use terms like "savage left 6.5" to search.
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Old 05-16-2018, 10:54 AM
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Quote:
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There is no such thing as successful long range shooting on a budget.
Would you consider that savage "budget"? I'm aiming for 1000 yards.
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Old 05-16-2018, 12:25 PM
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BTW, don't let changing the stock scare you off. It's just an AR stock.
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Old 05-16-2018, 1:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by deckhandmike View Post
So I got the urge to get a long range (semi) precision rifle. I will not be competing or trying to set world records. Iíd like to hit the gong at 1000-1200 yards 7 out of 10 times for giggles. The rifle will be also used for short walking distance coyote stands and pigs spotted from the road. Iím thinking 6.5 creedmore and thatís where things get complicated. Iím left handed.

Iíd like to do the build off a Remington 700 action since it has the most aftermarket support and being lefty I need every single option I can get. Should I buy a donor gun (like a .308) or just the action? Planning on throwing it in a MDT LSS chassis as itís light weight and left hand friendly. Budget is flexible but Iím looking at fun not award winning. Iím aware of the other brands like Tikka and Savage but really want to stick with Remington for options. Iím not going to regret not spending a ton of money. I got a few years of learning the essentials before I really notice the difference.
Iím lefty too - understand the draw of a lefty gun. Any chance youíd consider just adapting to a righty? Our options are significantly increased if we can adapt...
You ever try running a right hand Mdt bolt gun? With a pistol grip dropping your left hand down away from the bolt, and the front of the gun supported on a bipod or bag, your right hand can single load, run the bolt and change a mag pretty effortlessly. Just thought iíd bring it up.(Granted, i go back and forth on what i prefer)
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Old 05-16-2018, 2:42 PM
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Haven't thought about a right handed gun. I hate regular right bolt rifles but with a bipod and pistol grip it might not be so clumsy.
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Old 05-16-2018, 2:45 PM
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Yeah, F me. If anyone sees one again for 800$ let me know and Iíll pull the trigger.
Looks like price is back to $809. Kind of weird of them jumping price around.
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Old 05-16-2018, 2:51 PM
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And there's only ONE left!
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Old 05-16-2018, 3:21 PM
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Looks like price is back to $809. Kind of weird of them jumping price around.
Some websites will have prices adjust according to the volume of traffic and time of the day.
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Old 05-16-2018, 3:34 PM
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After reading the reviews of the savage I’m going to have to pass. It looks like I’ll be spending more than a few bucks and I better start saving and doing a lot more research.

Last edited by deckhandmike; 05-16-2018 at 3:48 PM..
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Old 05-16-2018, 4:07 PM
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Compared to Industry Standard Bolt Rifles, the Savage Rifles to which you refer are Pea-Oh- Es-Seys.
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Old 05-16-2018, 8:24 PM
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Tikka T3x Tac comes in left hand...
http://www.tikka.fi/rifles/tikka-t3x/t3x-tac-a1
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Old 05-16-2018, 9:13 PM
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Quote:
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After reading the reviews of the savage Iím going to have to pass. It looks like Iíll be spending more than a few bucks and I better start saving and doing a lot more research.
Wise choice.
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Old 05-18-2018, 8:20 PM
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Buy once . . Cry once but be alot happier in the long run.
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