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Optics, Mounts, Rails and Sights If it aims your firearm, post about it here. |
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#1
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ART v. Super Sniper?
Hey all. I just picked up a M1A with some match grade components. I am now looking into optics. I haven't done much long range shooting and don't want to blow the bank on optics out the gate.
I want to be able to use the scope from close up distances ~100 yards out to about ~500+ yards. I know the Super Sniper is a fixed optic so that has me a little worried but I haven't really heard much about the ART scope (other than it's the original M21 scope). I also really like the warranty that Leupold offers but I don't know if I'm ready to drop $1k on optics yet... ($500 maybe). I am open to any and all constructive comments. Thanks! Currently I am looking at the Leatherwood ART http://www.leatherwoodoptics.com/index-leatherwood.html and the Super Sniper http://www.swfa.com/c-231-super-snip...le-scopes.aspx |
#2
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I have owned a couple of ss and they are very good. Once you start looking at higher end scopes you will see the issues with the ss but it will get the job done, especially at those distances. I would actually go with this guy
http://www.libertyoptics.com/index.h...d=39173.826389 It may be more then you are looking to pay but should take you from cqb to 1000. I have no experience with ART scopes. Also calling Scott will probably get you a better price as well as the updated exposed knob version. |
#3
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The newer ART scope is a Chinese scope. I would not put it in same league as even a SuperSniper.
Save your pennies and get a Leupold or IOR or US Optics scope and quality mounts.
__________________
Bill Wiese San Jose, CA CGF Board Member / NRA Benefactor Life Member / CRPA life member
No postings of mine here, unless otherwise specifically noted, are to be construed as formal or informal positions of the Calguns.Net ownership, The Calguns Foundation, Inc. ("CGF"), the NRA, or my employer. No posts of mine on Calguns are to be construed as legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer. |
#4
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You need a scope that will withstand the stress a semi puts on it - forget the ART - at the least a SS will fit the bill - there has been many M1A with them - from there look at Leupy MK4, Nikon Tactical, Nightforce, IOR or US Optics.
For your price range, <500.00, go with the SS. |
#5
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Have any specific rings in mind? I'm thinking I will want a quick release mount so I can convert to irons without trouble if I should feel so inclined. There is SOOO much stuff out there and reading it all only gets you moore confused. I was told the 10x SS (it comes in several flavors) is the way to go for 100 - 500 yards and that going with the 16x would provide too much magnification. BTW: I hear everyone on the higher end models... just don't want to spend $1k on optics as a long range beginner. |
#7
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As Timberwolf and many others told me. You only cry once. It is often better to save up and but the higher end and never need to buy another one. That being said the SS 10x is a great beginner scope as is the Nikon Buckmaster 4.5-14x40 mildot with side focus and is actually cheaper then the SS and a variable optic with better glass. The SS has nicer knobs though but they can be finicky if you have to re-zero the knobs. Last edited by Prc329; 11-11-2007 at 9:37 PM.. |
#8
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Here's mine.....shoots between 1/2-3/4 MOA with my loads. Shoots 1 MOA with FGMM.
Leupold 4.5x14x50mm LR/T mil-dot with ARMS quick release rings and and ARMS mount. They start at about $699 and go up from there for the LR/T's. http://www.opticsplanet.net/leupold-...fle-scope.html Oh...I recommend staying with 40mm...as my scope is super close to the heat shield. Last edited by Whitesmoke; 11-11-2007 at 10:36 PM.. |
#9
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Like others have said stay away from ART. The SuperSniper is nice for the money but I don't like the fixed magnification. We carry a full line of Leupold, Nikon, Simmons and others and have the lowest prices. We would be more than happy to earn your business and help you choose the right scope.
Http://www.ShootForLess.com
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Http://www.ShootForLess.com We will match or beat anyones price on anything we carry or can get. Sales@ShootForLess.com |
#10
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For the super sniper price, you could get the Nikon buckmaster 4.5-14 with SF and mildot reticle. Much better glass for the money.
If you still want a fixed 10x, the SS offers nothing over the Bushnell 3200 10x except a higher price. |
#12
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I was told the Lupy was the only scope that comes near (although not in) my price range that's worth owning. Looks like there may be others. I'll check out the Nikon and give Optics+ a call. |
#13
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Leupold has a good reputation but IMHO it is not always deserved. I owned that Nikon and only sold it because I had to sell the rifle. It is a very good scope and will leave that $500 is good shape to buy ammo.
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#14
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The Bushnell scope is a fine scope as well, has knobs, good reticle, clear glass, etc. However, it does not have the adjustment range that the SS scope has. For 500 and under, it would be fine, even out a bit further, but if you want to have the maximum options for elevation and windage adjustments the SS is better. In summary: The Buckmaster is great but it has limited capabilities. The Bushnell is good, better option than the Buckmaster. The SS scope is a dang fine scope for the money, cant go wrong. You will eventually upgrade. Leupold, Nikon, USO, S&B, all are better with a higher price tag. Save your pennies! |
#16
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While discussing the lower end scopes such as Buckmaster and the 3200 one word of caution should be expressed. This scope will be mounted on an M1A not a bolt gun. The M1A (or any semi for that matter) puts more stress on a scope than a bolt gun due to the forces exerted during its cycle. That said though I've seen 3200s, Buckmasters etc on boltguns give excellant results and service I have to question if they're stout enough to last on a M1A. Just food for thought.
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#17
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My brother in law just bought a 4.5-14 Nikon, he likes it.....I've looked through those and it's nice glass. Thats a good way to go on a budget.
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#18
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For beginning optics, I'd definitely recommend a variable scope over a fixed. The extra flexibility goes a long way in helping you figure out what works best for you.
There are plenty of good scopes under $500, but you'll need a list of must-have vs. nice-to-have options to see if you can fit one in. Mil-dot's easy enough to get, but those target turrets definitely add a bit more, and illumination can do the same if you care about it. For long-range shooting, you may need the extra adjustment a 30mm tube will give you. Make up a chart of critical features and a list of scopes that fill the bill, and it'll narrow it down pretty well. |
#19
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Would like:
Essentially, I am a beginner that doesn't want to break the bank on something I am only learning. I want to learn the ability to somewhat quickly acquire targets from 1 - 500 (maybe more) yards and put down consistent shots. Not really looking to do too much bench rest (other than what's required to learn the basics). |
#20
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http://www.snipercentral.com/menace45.htm
I have no experience with these guys but I keep reading they are good for the money. They are suppose to offer what is called an MP20 reticle which is pretty similar to the Mp8 reticle. |
#21
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#22
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Going with the Bushnell theme, in a variable power scope, I would seriously consider this one:
http://www.swfa.com/pc-9838-184-bush...fle-scope.aspx Its an outstanding scope for the money! As far as holding up on a M1A, they sell the .50BMG rifles with the Bushnell 10x scope installed, I think the Bushnells will hold up just fine. PS- I personally wouldnt buy the Menace scope. |
#24
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The knobs on the buckmaster ARE finger adjustable, zeroable, and even have stadia lines to identify what revolution you're on. They're just not big and tacticool, if that matters to you. |
#25
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I should get out more, didn't know they used the 3200 on Barretts - last one I saw had a Mk4 16X on it.
By the way I just bought a 10X 3200 for use on a .22LR training rifle I'm putting together - they're pretty nice. |
#26
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I asked as a true question. I'm pretty sure they do, and I've seen a few with the 3200's on them. I've read about Barrett doing such, but don't know for a fact.
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#27
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My bad, thought it was a statement . . . ooopsie . . . . I don't know though
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#28
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Wow that Menace 56mm Objective one sounds like a good deal. I didn't think it was going to be released before the end of year considering how alot of vendors always say a tenative release date and it seems to end up with the product being released six months after the initial quote.
Anyone think the Falcon Menace and SWFA SS scopes are made in the same factory abroad, just different names on them due to the importers/final assembly people? The construction of both seems very similar with just minor milling/ knob changes to make it look different. |
#29
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An affordable option with good quality, good support, and tactical features is the Burris Fullfield II Tactical scopes. The FFII has good glass, is solid, and Burris provides very good support and a lifetime warranty. The FFII Tactical has low-profile target knobs and a combo mil-dot and bullet drop reticle, and prices range from $210 to $480. It's not up to Nightforce or Leupold Mk4 level, but doesn't cost like them either. They're only a 1" tube, so whether they've got enough adjustment will depend on the range and load.
http://www.swfa.com/c-1108-burris-fu...le-scopes.aspx Detailed description of the knobs and reticle: http://www.burrisoptics.com/fftactical.html |
#30
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http://www.opticsplanet.net/nikon-ri...s-4-14x40.html What height rings will I need for a 40 mil on an M1A? I prefer a quick detatch style... Last edited by DigglerD; 11-13-2007 at 1:13 PM.. |
#31
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The ARMS 22 low rings will work with the 40 mm perfectly with the ARMS 18 mount.....I'm using the low with my 50mm....but it's damn close to touching. I doubt you will regret the Nikon.....
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#32
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__________________
If you loan someone twenty dollars and never see them again, it was probably worth it. |
#34
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+1 for the Bushnell 3200 10x. I have one on a RRA Varmint A4. Simple no frills mil-dot scope that cant be beat for price (-$200). A good starter scope you wont regret having bought and makes a good backup up/beater when you upgrade. Leaves plenty of moola left over for a good mount too. Internet says Barrett put them on their M99 .50 bolt gun packages so it should be strong enough for the M1A.
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#35
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Where did you get your scope from. I got mine from Midway.
__________________
If you loan someone twenty dollars and never see them again, it was probably worth it. |
#37
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#38
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Quote:
__________________
If you loan someone twenty dollars and never see them again, it was probably worth it. |
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