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California 2nd Amend. Political Discussion & Activism Discuss gun rights activism and 2A related political topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #2721  
Old 06-19-2017, 11:54 AM
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Originally Posted by Crazed_SS View Post
Yea this is not something new or out of the ordinary at all.

On the flip side, pro gun groups write legislation in free states that help gun owners.
Indeed, this shouldn't surprise anyone - the only surprising thing is them publicly admitting it.

Everyone knows our legislators are boneheads who, if left to their own devices, would write legislation banning shoulder things that go up and 30 caliber clips that you can fire in half a second.
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Last edited by cockedandglocked; 06-19-2017 at 11:56 AM..
  #2722  
Old 06-19-2017, 11:59 AM
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I hope they delay the registration until July 2018 that way I can plan my escape and GTFO of this state and not register nuuuttthhhing! That would be great, plan my move now and just before deadline, crossover the Colorado river into Free America flipping off this place!
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  #2723  
Old 06-19-2017, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by ESPONDA View Post
I hope they delay the registration until July 2018 that way I can plan my escape and GTFO of this state and not register nuuuttthhhing! That would be great, plan my move now and just before deadline, crossover the Colorado river into Free America flipping off this place!
There's about a 99.99999% chance that it will be extended to 7/1/2018. It's a rider on the budget bill, which is about 8 million pages long, passed by both houses already and sitting on the governor's desk just waiting for his signature. He won't even read it. He'll just have his staff look it over to see if it looks like a budget bill, then he'll sign it.

On 6/13, Brown said this about AB-103:

Quote:
"This budget keeps California on a sound fiscal path and continues to support struggling families and make investments in our schools. We've come together on this balanced and progressive budget and I'm confident that we can do the same to extend our critical cap-and-trade program," said Governor Brown.
That doesn't sound much like he's even considering a veto.
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Last edited by cockedandglocked; 06-19-2017 at 12:09 PM..
  #2724  
Old 06-19-2017, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Bryan259 View Post
Will a Mean Arms AR Loader combination with a ARMAGLOCK be enough to allow me to not register my rifle too california while:

1. Removing my BB
2. Leave my collapsable stock
3. leave my pistol Grip.
4. I dont have any other evil features on my rife but possibly a angled fore grip. Not sure i want one, but America so.... maybe...
Yes you'll be GTG.
  #2725  
Old 06-19-2017, 1:20 PM
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Originally Posted by cockedandglocked View Post
Everyone knows our legislators are boneheads who, if left to their own devices, would write legislation banning shoulder things that go up and 30 caliber clips that you can fire in half a second.
Every time I hear these quotes I laugh at how stupid politicians are. It literally never gets old. They have absolutely no clue what they are spending all their efforts trying to ban.
  #2726  
Old 06-19-2017, 2:16 PM
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Politicians are not stupid. They know exactly what they are doing. Gathering money and votes.

Banning shoulder things that go up and getting on a stage drunk to ramble about 30 caliber clips in half a second loses them exactly zero votes.

Same as Trump tweeting at 3 am and writing about how he is not under investigation and launching tomahawk missiles at Syria and using the MOAB and ranting about winning has lost him exactly zero votes so far fro his supporters.

CA politicians know exactly what they are doing. You are nothing more than the gum on the bottom of their shoe.
  #2727  
Old 06-19-2017, 11:42 PM
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  #2728  
Old 06-20-2017, 6:41 AM
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I'll definitely agree with you that they are gathering money and votes. That's exactly what they are doing. Every single decision they make is to fatten their own pocketbooks. But I am not in agreement they are intelligent. No one will ever sway my thoughts regarding that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whiterabbit View Post
Politicians are not stupid. They know exactly what they are doing. Gathering money and votes.
Im also aware of this.....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whiterabbit View Post
You are nothing more than the gum on the bottom of their shoe.
  #2729  
Old 06-20-2017, 9:36 AM
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Guys, I've been perusing this thread for awhile, as well as all the other RAW threads, reactions to the new laws, etc etc... I don’t own an EBR but was considering it before all the recent hubbub so I have some basic interest here. I carried one in the service, believe it should be your right to own one, and most definitely not on the side of the state on this issue. But regardless we live here and need to abide by the laws. I think some folks here need to get real in some ways. Just a couple of observations:
1) Every time I see someone complaining about the "misconception" that "AR stands for "Assault Rifle", that that is somehow meaningful to anyone on the anti-gun side, I do like a triple face palm. That is meaningless. All the general public sees is evil black rifles, they don't care if the actual name of the rifle is the Colt "My Little Pony" or the Colt "Go Postal Special".
2) Register your stuff guys. In my view, this might be the only way to legally shoot ANY black colored rifle in a few years (or any semi-auto rifle).
3) I am firmly in the camp that believes "Featureless" is a class that will be outlawed in the future, especially after the inevitable mass shooting somewhere in the state where some idiot goes on a rampage with a featureless rifle.
4) If you don't intend to register, what exactly are you going to do with your unregistered and illegal weapons? Even if you go to the range and (probably correctly) assume that nobody is going to check the legality of it, what happens when you get into a car accident and your stuff is strewn all over the highway and the cops start digging into those EBRs?
5) I tend to be amazed about the level of debate here about how dumb it is that the lawmakers conflate a BB and a std mag release in some way; "It just goes to prove that these laws are dumb and written by idiots. If they are equivalent then why can't I add my std mag release back on if I register?" So what? It's pointless, the majority of the public sees it as a loophole, the lawmakers are pandering to that thought process, and you are only shooting yourselves in the foot when some make observations about BB work arounds like magnets and stuff.
6) If I had an EBR I would register rather than go featureless. In short:
-As I mentioned I think featureless is not gonna be a thing in the future and I doubt CA is going to open up a new registry in the future.
-Are you adding yourself to a potential confiscation list in the future? Possibly. I think you need to play the odds that one of 2 things will happen:
a) all semi-auto rifles will be outlawed/banned except for those already registered
or
b) all semi-auto rifles will be outlawed/banned INCLUDING for those already registered.
If either of these comes to pass, you will either be on the wrong side of the law unless you registered or you will be on the wrong side of the law regardless. If there is a chance you can stay on the right side of the law by registering, it seems like you should register.

If you are thinking that you will become a 2A crusader and fight when they come to take your EBR, then:
a) Please don't be under the misconception that anyone will view you as a defender of the constitution. You will be branded a domestic terrorist and you will have few if any allies, including those folks who you arm-chair fantasize with about banding together and heading off to the hills with to fight “the man”
b) Others have correctly surmised that such a confiscation would not be a door to door type of deal, but rather a low burn type of situation where the state of CA won’t accept your tax return until you prove the disposition of your EBR, and then when you don’t, they will prosecute you for failure to submit a return to the franchise tax board or something. You’ll actually be fighting nameless bureaucrats in cubes somewhere, not SWAT teams.
I don’t mean to sound harsh, but many folks in these threads seem to not realize they are posting in an echo chamber and you need to start viewing this as the rest of the population does, if you want to have any sort of realistic understanding of what is going on in this state.
  #2730  
Old 06-20-2017, 10:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fn2187 View Post
Guys, I've been perusing this thread for awhile, as well as all the other RAW threads, reactions to the new laws, etc etc...
fn2187,Couldn't agree more. Good post.
  #2731  
Old 06-20-2017, 10:14 AM
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Originally Posted by fn2187 View Post

6) If I had an EBR I would register rather than go featureless. In short:
-As I mentioned I think featureless is not gonna be a thing in the future and I doubt CA is going to open up a new registry in the future.
-Are you adding yourself to a potential confiscation list in the future? Possibly. I think you need to play the odds that one of 2 things will happen:
a) all semi-auto rifles will be outlawed/banned except for those already registered
or
b) all semi-auto rifles will be outlawed/banned INCLUDING for those already registered.
If either of these comes to pass, you will either be on the wrong side of the law unless you registered or you will be on the wrong side of the law regardless. If there is a chance you can stay on the right side of the law by registering, it seems like you should register..

Why do some people believe that they would not open the registry to featureless? Why are they opening it to bullet button AWs? Because BB AWs followed the law, and were legal before the new law was passed. Likewise, featureless rifles follow the law now, and are even outlined in the regulations. If several years down the road they want to ban them, they will have to open up the registry again.
  #2732  
Old 06-20-2017, 10:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fn2187 View Post
Guys, I've been perusing this thread for awhile, as well as all the other RAW threads, reactions to the new laws, etc etc... I don’t own an EBR but was considering it before all the recent hubbub so I have some basic interest here. I carried one in the service, believe it should be your right to own one, and most definitely not on the side of the state on this issue. But regardless we live here and need to abide by the laws. I think some folks here need to get real in some ways. Just a couple of observations:
1) Every time I see someone complaining about the "misconception" that "AR stands for "Assault Rifle", that that is somehow meaningful to anyone on the anti-gun side, I do like a triple face palm. That is meaningless. All the general public sees is evil black rifles, they don't care if the actual name of the rifle is the Colt "My Little Pony" or the Colt "Go Postal Special".
2) Register your stuff guys. In my view, this might be the only way to legally shoot ANY black colored rifle in a few years (or any semi-auto rifle).
3) I am firmly in the camp that believes "Featureless" is a class that will be outlawed in the future, especially after the inevitable mass shooting somewhere in the state where some idiot goes on a rampage with a featureless rifle.
4) If you don't intend to register, what exactly are you going to do with your unregistered and illegal weapons? Even if you go to the range and (probably correctly) assume that nobody is going to check the legality of it, what happens when you get into a car accident and your stuff is strewn all over the highway and the cops start digging into those EBRs?
5) I tend to be amazed about the level of debate here about how dumb it is that the lawmakers conflate a BB and a std mag release in some way; "It just goes to prove that these laws are dumb and written by idiots. If they are equivalent then why can't I add my std mag release back on if I register?" So what? It's pointless, the majority of the public sees it as a loophole, the lawmakers are pandering to that thought process, and you are only shooting yourselves in the foot when some make observations about BB work arounds like magnets and stuff.
6) If I had an EBR I would register rather than go featureless. In short:
-As I mentioned I think featureless is not gonna be a thing in the future and I doubt CA is going to open up a new registry in the future.
-Are you adding yourself to a potential confiscation list in the future? Possibly. I think you need to play the odds that one of 2 things will happen:
a) all semi-auto rifles will be outlawed/banned except for those already registered
or
b) all semi-auto rifles will be outlawed/banned INCLUDING for those already registered.
If either of these comes to pass, you will either be on the wrong side of the law unless you registered or you will be on the wrong side of the law regardless. If there is a chance you can stay on the right side of the law by registering, it seems like you should register.

If you are thinking that you will become a 2A crusader and fight when they come to take your EBR, then:
a) Please don't be under the misconception that anyone will view you as a defender of the constitution. You will be branded a domestic terrorist and you will have few if any allies, including those folks who you arm-chair fantasize with about banding together and heading off to the hills with to fight “the man”
b) Others have correctly surmised that such a confiscation would not be a door to door type of deal, but rather a low burn type of situation where the state of CA won’t accept your tax return until you prove the disposition of your EBR, and then when you don’t, they will prosecute you for failure to submit a return to the franchise tax board or something. You’ll actually be fighting nameless bureaucrats in cubes somewhere, not SWAT teams.
I don’t mean to sound harsh, but many folks in these threads seem to not realize they are posting in an echo chamber and you need to start viewing this as the rest of the population does, if you want to have any sort of realistic understanding of what is going on in this state.
If they come up with a BB2.0 or featureless ban won't they be forced to open up another registration period? Both featureless and BB2 are legal so to take them away they would need to pass new laws. If those laws don't allow grandfathering current legal guns they would need to confiscate them. I strongly doubt this would happen for two reasons. First it would be really bad press for Uncle Bloomberg in the other states he is trying to get this crap started. If the road leads to confiscation then pro gun groups in this other states are going to fight to the death or at least have an easier time to raise money again Bloomberg. Second if they confiscate they will run into a "takings" which basically means California will need to pay market value for each gun. Do you believe California would pay millions if not billions for every center fire gun in the state? I think not so they will be a huge fight in the courts. During which fight the confiscation efforts will be stalled.
My suggestion is avoid registration so long as the work arounds are acceptable to you. As we have seen California will try to keep the gun as it was when you registered it.
  #2733  
Old 06-20-2017, 10:33 AM
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Essentially I believe that the inevitable next time someone commits a mass shooting with an EBR, or 10/22, or Mini-14, or M1 carbine, the political climate will become one of "enough is enough" and CA will have free political reign to outlaw semi-auto outright.

I don't think the concept of "bad press" regarding not opening up registry 3.0 would even register in the climate that would ensue. It would be lost in the noise completely.

And finally, given that this state is run by the FAR left at this point, I can easily see them getting a confiscate and you'll get $1 for your trouble and like it bill passed.

This state is populated in the majority by the "protect me from myself because its too scary for me to take personal responsibility for anything" crowd, so keep that in mind.
  #2734  
Old 06-20-2017, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcwatchdog View Post
Why do some people believe that they would not open the registry to featureless? Why are they opening it to bullet button AWs? Because BB AWs followed the law, and were legal before the new law was passed. Likewise, featureless rifles follow the law now, and are even outlined in the regulations. If several years down the road they want to ban them, they will have to open up the registry again.
This is likely true.

I've seen people argue that the democratic supermajority that we have now (that we didn't have when the 2016 ban was written), combined with the likely future Newscum regime, would easily allow the left to pass a new ban without any concessions such as grandfathering.

However, if such a bill were to pass, the events which follow would not go too smoothly. First, there's that whole compensation for takings issue. Fair market value is what, probably $1000 per rifle on average? Depending on where you get your info about how many of these rifles exist in CA, that's no less than $5 billion (and probably much more than that) just in compensation alone that they'd have to pay out to CA gun owners. That's money they'd have to raise by making substantial cuts from other state programs, or a significant new tax increase (which wouldn't be viewed too favorably right now given the anger everyone in the state still feels for the new gas tax). Neither choice would be very popular.

So, if such a bill were to pass (which I agree, it easily could), I would bet that the logistics of actually implementing it would prove to be so obscenely difficult and disastrous, that the whole idea of banning already-owned rifles would just get scrapped, in favor of a concession that only future sales are banned.

And thus, for the sake of simplicity, registration would probably be allowed again. But make no mistake - the next round of registration won't have any of the shortcomings or mistakes that this one has. (No I won't comment on what those mistakes or shortcomings might be, so please nobody ask)
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Last edited by cockedandglocked; 06-20-2017 at 11:10 AM..
  #2735  
Old 06-20-2017, 11:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fn2187 View Post
Essentially I believe that the inevitable next time someone commits a mass shooting with an EBR, or 10/22, or Mini-14, or M1 carbine, the political climate will become one of "enough is enough" and CA will have free political reign to outlaw semi-auto outright.

I don't think the concept of "bad press" regarding not opening up registry 3.0 would even register in the climate that would ensue. It would be lost in the noise completely.

And finally, given that this state is run by the FAR left at this point, I can easily see them getting a confiscate and you'll get $1 for your trouble and like it bill passed.

This state is populated in the majority by the "protect me from myself because its too scary for me to take personal responsibility for anything" crowd, so keep that in mind.

Do you really think it matters what gun is used? If any gun is used, they will use it to push their agenda. In VT mass shooting, the shooter used 2 handguns. Yet some politicians were calling for a ban on AW rifles. Not sure how they made the connection but they did. The shooting in SF by the ups driver, apparently he used an assault pistol, whatever that is. We probably will never really know the truth, but it doesn't matter, the description as is was enough to fan the flames.

You make an argument to register if I'm hearing you right. What about all the guns that CAN'T be registered? Like the m1a, mini14, keltec su16, etc?

Last edited by jcwatchdog; 06-20-2017 at 11:32 AM..
  #2736  
Old 06-20-2017, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by jcwatchdog View Post
You make an argument to register if I'm hearing you right. What about all the guns that CAN'T be registered? Like the m1a, mini14, keltec su16, etc?
Yeah people who own them are screwed eventually is my guess.
  #2737  
Old 06-20-2017, 11:36 AM
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Originally Posted by fn2187 View Post
Yeah people who own them are screwed eventually is my guess.
So what is the point of registering? If you think we are screwed with M1a's Mini 14s etc, do you really think the state will feel safe with registered black rifles? That's ridiculous!
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  #2738  
Old 06-20-2017, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by jcwatchdog View Post
Do you really think it matters what gun is used? If any gun is used, they will use it to push their agenda.
Also a great point.

Look at the san bernardino shootings. They used that as an excuse to "close the bullet button loophole". Nevermind that the shooters weren't even using bullet buttons; that little detail was irrelevant to them.
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  #2739  
Old 06-20-2017, 11:43 AM
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Mass non-compliance would send a strong message, working in other states.
  #2740  
Old 06-20-2017, 11:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jcwatchdog View Post
Do you really think it matters what gun is used? If any gun is used, they will use it to push their agenda. In VT mass shooting, the shooter used 2 handguns. Yet some politicians were calling for a ban on AW rifles. Not sure how they made the connection but they did. The shooting in SF by the ups driver, apparently he used an assault pistol, whatever that is. We probably will never really know the truth, but it doesn't matter, the description as is was enough to fan the flames.

You make an argument to register if I'm hearing you right. What about all the guns that CAN'T be registered? Like the m1a, mini14, keltec su16, etc?
See points 4 & 6 in my original post.

Guys, I'm not saying any of this crap makes sense, especially given the state we live in. Just pointing out my .02 on the lay of the land.

Honestly, at the end of the day, given the uncertainty about everything, this topic is not far removed from trying to prove the existence of god.
  #2741  
Old 06-20-2017, 11:45 AM
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Default Response to fn2187's Post re: perusing this thread

Didn't want to quote it 'cuz it's so long.

I pretty much agree with what you are saying, but I am a featureless guy that's going to ride it all the way out. Yes, they will probably ban "featureless" SACF, but I believe they will keep it in the evil black rifle arena. In fact, for all we know this whole budget and potential extension to 7/2018 is a smoke screen so that "they" can write another bill that will ban featureless and then include that in the 7/2018 registration. Ya I know, "they can't do that", but BS they're already can't doing an awful lot now. Not quite sure they will go all the way to having to turn them in, but they will continue to come up with new ways to regulate and tax.

My rifles are going to continue to morph to keep legal and unregistered. I have become very accustomed to the Thordsen stock and conventional mag release, and I will be able to adapt to any other changes I need to make. It's the whole "this is my rifle" thing and I am going to keep it that way. Once registered as AW it becomes theirs.

Last edited by arrowshooter; 06-20-2017 at 12:35 PM..
  #2742  
Old 06-20-2017, 11:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fn2187 View Post
Guys, I've been perusing this thread for awhile, as well as all the other RAW threads, reactions to the new laws, etc etc... I don’t own an EBR but was considering it before all the recent hubbub so I have some basic interest here. I carried one in the service, believe it should be your right to own one, and most definitely not on the side of the state on this issue. But regardless we live here and need to abide by the laws. I think some folks here need to get real in some ways. Just a couple of observations:
1) Every time I see someone complaining about the "misconception" that "AR stands for "Assault Rifle", that that is somehow meaningful to anyone on the anti-gun side, I do like a triple face palm. That is meaningless. All the general public sees is evil black rifles, they don't care if the actual name of the rifle is the Colt "My Little Pony" or the Colt "Go Postal Special".
2) Register your stuff guys. In my view, this might be the only way to legally shoot ANY black colored rifle in a few years (or any semi-auto rifle).
3) I am firmly in the camp that believes "Featureless" is a class that will be outlawed in the future, especially after the inevitable mass shooting somewhere in the state where some idiot goes on a rampage with a featureless rifle.
4) If you don't intend to register, what exactly are you going to do with your unregistered and illegal weapons? Even if you go to the range and (probably correctly) assume that nobody is going to check the legality of it, what happens when you get into a car accident and your stuff is strewn all over the highway and the cops start digging into those EBRs?
5) I tend to be amazed about the level of debate here about how dumb it is that the lawmakers conflate a BB and a std mag release in some way; "It just goes to prove that these laws are dumb and written by idiots. If they are equivalent then why can't I add my std mag release back on if I register?" So what? It's pointless, the majority of the public sees it as a loophole, the lawmakers are pandering to that thought process, and you are only shooting yourselves in the foot when some make observations about BB work arounds like magnets and stuff.
6) If I had an EBR I would register rather than go featureless. In short:
-As I mentioned I think featureless is not gonna be a thing in the future and I doubt CA is going to open up a new registry in the future.
-Are you adding yourself to a potential confiscation list in the future? Possibly. I think you need to play the odds that one of 2 things will happen:
a) all semi-auto rifles will be outlawed/banned except for those already registered
or
b) all semi-auto rifles will be outlawed/banned INCLUDING for those already registered.
If either of these comes to pass, you will either be on the wrong side of the law unless you registered or you will be on the wrong side of the law regardless. If there is a chance you can stay on the right side of the law by registering, it seems like you should register.

If you are thinking that you will become a 2A crusader and fight when they come to take your EBR, then:
a) Please don't be under the misconception that anyone will view you as a defender of the constitution. You will be branded a domestic terrorist and you will have few if any allies, including those folks who you arm-chair fantasize with about banding together and heading off to the hills with to fight “the man”
b) Others have correctly surmised that such a confiscation would not be a door to door type of deal, but rather a low burn type of situation where the state of CA won’t accept your tax return until you prove the disposition of your EBR, and then when you don’t, they will prosecute you for failure to submit a return to the franchise tax board or something. You’ll actually be fighting nameless bureaucrats in cubes somewhere, not SWAT teams.
I don’t mean to sound harsh, but many folks in these threads seem to not realize they are posting in an echo chamber and you need to start viewing this as the rest of the population does, if you want to have any sort of realistic understanding of what is going on in this state.
Thanks for your thoughts. That took some time to write up.
  #2743  
Old 06-20-2017, 11:50 AM
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If we do register, are we not just registering the receiver? That is the only part that is considered a firearm.
  #2744  
Old 06-20-2017, 11:52 AM
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If we do register, are we not just registering the receiver? That is the only part that is considered a firearm.
Have you not been reading this thread?
  #2745  
Old 06-20-2017, 11:54 AM
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If we do register, are we not just registering the receiver? That is the only part that is considered a firearm.
DOJ won't accept it this go around.

Read the regs.

Don't ask a followup about non-BB modification. Read the thread.
  #2746  
Old 06-20-2017, 11:54 AM
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If we do register, are we not just registering the receiver? That is the only part that is considered a firearm.
Quote:
Originally Posted by arrowshooter View Post
Have you not been reading this thread?
DOJ is taking the position that you're registering both the receiver AND the bullet button device, and that those two items are not mutually exclusive.

It's a wrong position, and we've discussed that ad nauseum in this thread, but the fact remains that it's the position DOJ has taken. It remains to be seen whether or not their "position" on that matter really means anything or not.

I believe their position is nothing more than an "official opinion", not an enforceable law. But don't take my (or anyone else's) word for it just yet. All will become more clear in the coming months.

No point in further discussion about it right now.
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  #2747  
Old 06-20-2017, 11:57 AM
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I makes it hard to wait and see, and then have to rush to get it right. I guess that is what they want.

"DOJ is taking the position that you're registering both the receiver AND the bullet button device, and that those two items are not mutually exclusive.

It's a wrong position, and we've discussed that ad nauseum in this thread, but the fact remains that it's the position DOJ has taken. It remains to be seen whether or not their "position" on that matter really means anything or not. "

Thanks
  #2748  
Old 06-20-2017, 12:00 PM
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I makes it hard to wait and see, and then have to rush to get it right. I guess that is what they want.
Bingo
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  #2749  
Old 06-20-2017, 12:02 PM
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Have you not been reading this thread?
No, but I have been sending money to CRPA.
  #2750  
Old 06-20-2017, 12:11 PM
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No, but I have been sending money to CRPA.
And thank you for your contribution.
  #2751  
Old 06-20-2017, 12:27 PM
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No, but I have been sending money to CRPA.
That's what really matters. Thanks

I wouldn't expect anyone to actually read all the posts in this thread - this is just a catch-all for conversations so it's incredibly long and tedious to read if you haven't been following from the beginning.

I recommend checking out the parent thread for a more concise synopsis of what's going on, linked in the first post of this thread.
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Old 06-20-2017, 12:42 PM
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That's what really matters. Thanks

I wouldn't expect anyone to actually read all the posts in this thread - this is just a catch-all for conversations so it's incredibly long and tedious to read if you haven't been following from the beginning.

I recommend checking out the parent thread for a more concise synopsis of what's going on, linked in the first post of this thread.
Thanks, it is really long and I'm trying to stay up on everything.
Just random thought, has there been a push by calgunners to get in the DOJ?
If we can make things happen from the inside, we may see better results.
  #2753  
Old 06-20-2017, 12:43 PM
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See points 4 & 6 in my original post.

Guys, I'm not saying any of this crap makes sense, especially given the state we live in. Just pointing out my .02 on the lay of the land.

Honestly, at the end of the day, given the uncertainty about everything, this topic is not far removed from trying to prove the existence of god.
The problem with what you are saying is that it could have been said of BB rifles. No one thought they were going to open up the registry again. Although they didn't technically open it up. They decided to make a new one. And they would do so again with featureless if they situation called for it. There is no way that featureless would be confiscated without a registration period if it came to that. The reason is simple. There are more featureless semi auto rifles out there than there are bb rifles.
  #2754  
Old 06-20-2017, 12:46 PM
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Just random thought, has there been a push by calgunners to get in the DOJ?
If we can make things happen from the inside, we may see better results.
Perhaps, but the DoJ is run by democrats.
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  #2755  
Old 06-20-2017, 12:55 PM
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Perhaps, but the DoJ is run by democrats.
Yep, and from what I've seen/heard, there actually are some pro-gunners working for the DOJ. Exactly how many, I have no idea. It just doesn't really matter, they don't have enough pull. The AG (who heads the DOJ) will always be an anti-gunner for as long as the state is run by anti-gunners.

Harris was bad, but Becerra is proving himself to be no better than she was. He had a chance to influence real change in the department, after he withdrew these regulations. Instead, he doubled-down on Kamala's stupidity.
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  #2756  
Old 06-20-2017, 1:01 PM
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The problem with what you are saying is that it could have been said of BB rifles. No one thought they were going to open up the registry again. Although they didn't technically open it up. They decided to make a new one. And they would do so again with featureless if they situation called for it. There is no way that featureless would be confiscated without a registration period if it came to that. The reason is simple. There are more featureless semi auto rifles out there than there are bb rifles.
No way any sane person, after realizing that they are trying to sabotage this reg period any way they can, is going to stake their black rifle 2A rights on the idea that they "must" open another reg period. People are going to be crying when Newsome simply forces all to convert to bolt action under penalty of felony arrest.

And there is no possible way there are most featureless than BB, that's silly. There are 1.5 million BB rifles by the DOJ's own admission (how did they get that number, lol, they must have records?). Featureless I estimate at maybe a few hundred thousands TOPS.

Hoping they are going to be reasonable has yielded what exactly in California?

Hedge your bets and cover the bases, all options might be screwed but some less than others. My bet it that featureless is the most screwed, but I will be placing some in that config just to be sure.

Those poo-pooing registration are possibly giving up their best chance.
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  #2757  
Old 06-20-2017, 1:15 PM
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What is the lawsuit breakdown at the moment assuming OAL rubberstamps these?

1. Overarching lawsuit challenging the law going back to 1989 (filed)
2. Lawsuit against the DOJ for exceeding their authority (to be filed)
3. Lawsuit against OAL for failing oversight?

It just seems like there are so many angles involved.
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  #2758  
Old 06-20-2017, 1:30 PM
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What is the lawsuit breakdown at the moment assuming OAL rubberstamps these?

1. Overarching lawsuit challenging the law going back to 1989 (filed)
2. Lawsuit against the DOJ for exceeding their authority (to be filed)
3. Lawsuit against OAL for failing oversight?

It just seems like there are so many angles involved.
That sounds right, maybe even more than that. Lawsuits about requiring high def digital images? There are laws that say there is no way you can require people to have computers (this was done to protect ultra poor and illegal immigrants, lol).

The 26th is the D-Day. There might be a chance of another pulling of regs if things are heating up, but I feel like that's unlikely.

Another milestone is on the Governor's desk as to the budget extension, no word yet on when it will be signed.
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“They’re understaffed, overworked, and uninformed, and it’s only going to get worse,” said Chuck Michel, a lawyer for the NRA and the California Rifle and Pistol Association, about the attorney general’s office.
  #2759  
Old 06-20-2017, 1:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Sousuke View Post
What is the lawsuit breakdown at the moment assuming OAL rubberstamps these?

1. Overarching lawsuit challenging the law going back to 1989 (filed)
2. Lawsuit against the DOJ for exceeding their authority (to be filed)
3. Lawsuit against OAL for failing oversight?

It just seems like there are so many angles involved.
According to the latest CRPA update, and as you mentioned in lawsuit #2, it will focus on the DOJ violations of the APA (Administrative Procedures Act).

As we know, DOJ is claiming a blanket APA exemption on any and all regulations that they write, whereas the legislation clearly defined that their exemption was limited only to regulations relating to the act of registering. Any regulations above and beyond that scope, are not exempt.

I'm not sure that a suit against OAL will be filed. To be fair, their hands are kind of tied - apparently, when an agency claims an exemption, OAL does not have ANY authority to question the legitimacy of the claim. Which is absolutely insane, but that's apparently how our state government works.
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  #2760  
Old 06-20-2017, 1:37 PM
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Originally Posted by arrowshooter View Post
Didn't want to quote it 'cuz it's so long.

I pretty much agree with what you are saying, but I am a featureless guy that's going to ride it all the way out. Yes, they will probably ban "featureless" SACF, but I believe they will keep it in the evil black rifle arena. In fact, for all we know this whole budget and potential extension to 7/2018 is a smoke screen so that "they" can write another bill that will ban featureless and then include that in the 7/2018 registration. Ya I know, "they can't do that", but BS they're already can't doing an awful lot now. Not quite sure they will go all the way to having to turn them in, but they will continue to come up with new ways to regulate and tax.

My rifles are going to continue to morph to keep legal and unregistered. I have become very accustomed to the Thordsen stock and conventional mag release, and I will be able to adapt to any other changes I need to make. It's the whole "this is my rifle" thing and I am going to keep it that way. Once registered as AW it becomes theirs.
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