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2nd Amend. Litigation Updates & Legal Discussion Discuss California 2A related litigation and legal topics here. All advice given is NOT legal counsel.

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  #3441  
Old 05-22-2020, 6:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Offwidth View Post
Need to win elections.
Yep!
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  #3442  
Old 05-22-2020, 9:04 PM
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Originally Posted by Elgindy25 View Post
i know there are people
Who hold dual residency in AZ or NV etc and can buy off roster handguns and sell them here for profit.
Sorry, this is wrong. To do that would involve breaking both state and federal law. Both felonies.

Try again with your specious argument.
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  #3443  
Old 05-22-2020, 11:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Elgindy25 View Post
i know there are people Who hold dual residency in AZ or NV etc and can buy off roster handguns and sell them here for profit...
Are you a DOJ plant, or a media troll?
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  #3444  
Old 05-23-2020, 2:44 AM
Elgindy25 Elgindy25 is offline
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[QUOTE=pratchett;24300915]Are you a DOJ plant, or a media troll?

Neither, i thought if someone had dual residency in Ca and another state they could bring off roster stuff here? I have had several co workers in the past tell me that they have done this as they worked in other states yet still had residency here, i was not aware that you could not do that. On that area i may have gotten it mixed up with something else, and if thats the case my bad.
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  #3445  
Old 05-23-2020, 6:03 AM
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Originally Posted by exnds View Post
How many times can they keep kicking that can down the road?

The road is ten miles long and we are at mile marker 1. Buckle up it will be a loooooong and bumpy ride.
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  #3446  
Old 05-23-2020, 7:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Elgindy25 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by pratchett View Post
Are you a DOJ plant, or a media troll?
Neither, i thought if someone had dual residency in Ca and another state they could bring off roster stuff here? I have had several co workers in the past tell me that they have done this as they worked in other states yet still had residency here, i was not aware that you could not do that. On that area i may have gotten it mixed up with something else, and if thats the case my bad.
California Penal Code
27585.
(a) Commencing January 1, 2015, a resident of this state shall not import into this state, bring into this state, or transport into this state, any firearm that the person purchased or otherwise obtained on or after January 1, 2015, from outside of this state unless the person first has that firearm delivered to a dealer in this state for delivery to that resident pursuant to the procedures set forth in Section 27540 and Article 1 (commencing with Section 26700) and Article 2 (commencing with Section 26800) of Chapter 2.

United States Code
18 USC § 922. Unlawful acts
(a) It shall be unlawful-
(1) for any person-
(A) except a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, or licensed dealer, to engage in the business of importing, manufacturing, or dealing in firearms, or in the course of such business to ship, transport, or receive any firearm in interstate or foreign commerce;

Last edited by mrdd; 05-23-2020 at 2:44 PM.. Reason: Formatting
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  #3447  
Old 05-23-2020, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by aBrowningfan View Post
Doesn't sound like there is a consensus on a positive outcome if the case is granted cert.
There is no way you can know this since the SCOTUS could very well combine some of the 2A cases together if they feel it needs to be done. With 10 cases to look at, it could be a logistical issue.
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  #3448  
Old 05-23-2020, 10:59 AM
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Originally Posted by taperxz View Post
There is no way you can know this since the SCOTUS could very well combine some of the 2A cases together if they feel it needs to be done. With 10 cases to look at, it could be a logistical issue.
That's what I am hoping. Perhaps they want to select one or two that will cover all the rulings.
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  #3449  
Old 05-23-2020, 1:25 PM
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investment?

if you call a few hundreds or a few thousands investments, you misused the word "investment"
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  #3450  
Old 05-23-2020, 3:52 PM
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[QUOTE=Elgindy25;24301071]
Quote:
Originally Posted by pratchett View Post
Are you a DOJ plant, or a media troll?

Neither, i thought if someone had dual residency in Ca and another state they could bring off roster stuff here? I have had several co workers in the past tell me that they have done this as they worked in other states yet still had residency here, i was not aware that you could not do that. On that area i may have gotten it mixed up with something else, and if thats the case my bad.
Then I apologize for being harsh. Please read up, be lawful, and be safe.
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  #3451  
Old 05-24-2020, 6:55 AM
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It's amazing that it has been over 11 years since the initial complaint. The wheels of justice truly turn slowly.
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  #3452  
Old 05-24-2020, 7:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taperxz View Post
There is no way you can know this since the SCOTUS could very well combine some of the 2A cases together if they feel it needs to be done. With 10 cases to look at, it could be a logistical issue.
Unless they take this case on specifically and the ruling is "California's handgun roster is unconstitutional and no longer enforceable", it won't go away. If the ruling requires any kind of interpretation you can bet Kali will interpret it in a way unfavorable to you. No different than the respect Heller has been getting. Just my 2 cents.

Last edited by exnds; 05-24-2020 at 10:54 AM..
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  #3453  
Old 05-24-2020, 4:21 PM
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I would gladly loose half the value of my off roster guns To have the roster go away. The nation would be sold out of handguns for several years with the buying frenzy this would cause. Let freedom ring!
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  #3454  
Old 05-25-2020, 6:45 AM
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Originally Posted by Bogart View Post
It's amazing that it has been over 11 years since the initial complaint. The wheels of justice truly turn slowly.
Next time we need to claim there is a cake involved and we will get to SCOTUS in record time...
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  #3455  
Old 05-25-2020, 7:38 AM
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Originally Posted by sfpcservice View Post
Next time we need to claim there is a cake involved and we will get to SCOTUS in record time...
Funniest thing I have ever read on Calguns. Fell over laughing. So very, very true. For F%$k's sake, a CAKE of all things! There's got to be a meme or a gif out there on this. If not, it's time to make one.
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  #3456  
Old 05-25-2020, 8:39 AM
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Originally Posted by mrdd View Post
California Penal Code
27585.
(a) Commencing January 1, 2015, a resident of this state shall not import into this state, bring into this state, or transport into this state, any firearm that the person purchased or otherwise obtained on or after January 1, 2015, from outside of this state unless the person first has that firearm delivered to a dealer in this state for delivery to that resident pursuant to the procedures set forth in Section 27540 and Article 1 (commencing with Section 26700) and Article 2 (commencing with Section 26800) of Chapter 2.

United States Code
18 USC § 922. Unlawful acts
(a) It shall be unlawful-
(1) for any person-
(A) except a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, or licensed dealer, to engage in the business of importing, manufacturing, or dealing in firearms, or in the course of such business to ship, transport, or receive any firearm in interstate or foreign commerce;
Wait, so if someone was moving into California then they have to bring their firearms into the state thru an FFL?! If this is true then how the world are people supposed to know this when they're moving in?! And what about those folks that move here and pack their moving truck with their firearms, what are they supposed to do?? I thought you had 60 days to register what you're bringing into the state after you've claimed residency here.
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  #3457  
Old 05-25-2020, 8:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mrdd View Post
California Penal Code
27585.
(a) Commencing January 1, 2015, a resident of this state shall not import into this state, bring into this state, or transport into this state, any firearm that the person purchased or otherwise obtained on or after January 1, 2015, from outside of this state unless the person first has that firearm delivered to a dealer in this state for delivery to that resident pursuant to the procedures set forth in Section 27540 and Article 1 (commencing with Section 26700) and Article 2 (commencing with Section 26800) of Chapter 2.

United States Code
18 USC § 922. Unlawful acts
(a) It shall be unlawful-
(1) for any person-
(A) except a licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, or licensed dealer, to engage in the business of importing, manufacturing, or dealing in firearms, or in the course of such business to ship, transport, or receive any firearm in interstate or foreign commerce;
"Resident of this State" ? what if your a resident of Nevada visiting a shooting range in California ?
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  #3458  
Old 05-25-2020, 9:01 AM
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Originally Posted by cre8nhavoc View Post
Wait, so if someone was moving into California then they have to bring their firearms into the state thru an FFL?! If this is true then how the world are people supposed to know this when they're moving in?! And what about those folks that move here and pack their moving truck with their firearms, what are they supposed to do?? I thought you had 60 days to register what you're bringing into the state after you've claimed residency here.
Here's the information you're looking for. Essentially, that law applies to residents, and one precondition of residency is physically existing in California. So the law about importation by residents cannot apply to someone until they've become a resident here. Generally, one needs to physically stay in California in such a way as a reasonable person would conclude the stay is permanent, rather than temporary or transitory. If you're moving from another state, you can bring firearms with you provided they're not outright illegal to own. While an off-roster handgun would generally be legal, so-called "assault weapons" (sic) would not be lawful to import even if lawfully owned in the state from which one is moving.

Also, I'm not an attorney so nothing I just said is legal advice.
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  #3459  
Old 05-25-2020, 9:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bogart View Post
It's amazing that it has been over 11 years since the initial complaint. The wheels of justice truly turn slowly.


Because it's engineered that way.


Infringements of rights should be pretty quickly demolished, but they don't want that.


They being the politicians, judges, etc......
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  #3460  
Old 05-25-2020, 9:09 AM
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Originally Posted by baranski View Post
Because it's engineered that way.


Infringements of rights should be pretty quickly demolished, but they don't want that.


They being the politicians, judges, etc......

I would comment, but I would be attacked by my own breed. Discretion may be the better part of valor.
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  #3461  
Old 05-25-2020, 9:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cre8nhavoc View Post
Wait, so if someone was moving into California then they have to bring their firearms into the state thru an FFL?! If this is true then how the world are people supposed to know this when they're moving in?! And what about those folks that move here and pack their moving truck with their firearms, what are they supposed to do?? I thought you had 60 days to register what you're bringing into the state after you've claimed residency here.
No - new residents have their own reporting scheme; see the wiki, http://wiki.calgunsfoundation.org/in..._with_firearms
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Ono View Post
"Resident of this State" ? what if your a resident of Nevada visiting a shooting range in California ?
The law - PC 27585 - applies only to CA residents.

(BTW, while referring to code in bills might be useful historically, later bills or propositions might amend the code one would see in the bill. Current law will be found at CA's 'official' site,
http://leginfo.legislature.ca.gov/faces/codes.xhtml )
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Last edited by Librarian; 05-25-2020 at 3:59 PM.. Reason: Fix horrible sentence
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  #3462  
Old 05-25-2020, 9:51 AM
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Originally Posted by sulla123 View Post
Funniest thing I have ever read on Calguns. Fell over laughing. So very, very true. For F%$k's sake, a CAKE of all things! There's got to be a meme or a gif out there on this. If not, it's time to make one.
kinda like this one?

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Originally Posted by EM2
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  #3463  
Old 05-25-2020, 12:37 PM
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The Roster won't go away until the entire state government is overturned.
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  #3464  
Old 05-25-2020, 12:58 PM
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[QUOTE=Elgindy25;24301071]
Quote:
Originally Posted by pratchett View Post
Are you a DOJ plant, or a media troll?

Neither, i thought if someone had dual residency in Ca and another state they could bring off roster stuff here? I have had several co workers in the past tell me that they have done this as they worked in other states yet still had residency here, i was not aware that you could not do that. On that area i may have gotten it mixed up with something else, and if thats the case my bad.
As someone already noted, you are incorrect. But, if you have a child or a parent that is a permanent resident of another state, they can purchase an off-roster handgun in their state, and then perform an interstate inter-family transfer to you here in California (child to parent or parent to child). Be aware that an interstate transfer must go through an FFL here in CA and have the normal DROS performed just like buying a new gun. Many gun shops don’t understand this ... they will say all you need to do is submit the DOJ form for the inter-family transfer and pay the fee and you’re good to go. They mistakenly say this because that’s only true when BOTH parties to the inter-family transfer are residents of CA. But an INTERSTATE inter-family transfer comes under federal law ... doing just the CA DOJ form thing would make you a felon. I did this a while ago for a Sig Sauer P365 that my daughter transferred to me from CO. It took me asking four different FFLs before I found someone that knew this key difference and would accept the handgun into their inventory system and perform the DROS, for a fee.
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  #3465  
Old 05-25-2020, 6:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Harry Ono View Post
"Resident of this State" ? what if your a resident of Nevada visiting a shooting range in California ?
Resident of California. If you are a resident of California, you cannot import firearms acquired outside California without bringing them in through a California FFL. The roster applies in this case.

If you are moving here as a new resident, there is a separate section of the law which allows you to import firearms yourself when you move here. You have to report them to the CA DOJ on a form, or on the website (CFARS). The roster does not apply in this case. The AW laws do apply.

Last edited by mrdd; 05-25-2020 at 6:31 PM.. Reason: Clarity
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  #3466  
Old 05-25-2020, 6:33 PM
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Originally Posted by mrdd View Post
Resident of California. If you are a resident of California, you cannot import firearms acquired outside California without bringing them in through a California FFL. The roster applies in this case.

If you are moving here as a new resident, there is a separate section of the law which allows you to import firearms when you move here. The roster does not apply in this case. The AW laws do apply.
Thanks, and I understand your point regarding California resident. However, I was wondering about Non-California resident, as a Nevadian, visiting California for the day to shot in a California Gun range.
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  #3467  
Old 05-25-2020, 6:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Ono View Post
Thanks, and I understand your point regarding California resident. However, I was wondering about Non-California resident, as a Nevadian, visiting California for the day to shot in a California Gun range.
If you are not a California resident, you can bring them on in, as long as they are otherwise legal (not AW, etc.).

Of course, the magazine restrictions apply.
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