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Coronavirus/COVID19 Temp Forum This is a temporary forum for discussion, debate, sharing and helping each other during and in relation to the Coronavirus/COVID19

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  #41  
Old 01-21-2021, 12:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by balgor View Post
What you are looking for are deaths in excess of 263 per day.....but I have little faith you anti-vaxxers will believe or bother with trying to figure out the difference between baseline and deviations from baseline numbers.
You might want to read the article.

“Our goal is to provide the COVID vaccine safely, swiftly and equitably,” Pan said in a statement. “A higher-than-usual number of possible allergic reactions were reported with a specific lot of Moderna vaccine administered at one community vaccination clinic."
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  #42  
Old 01-21-2021, 12:33 PM
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Originally Posted by balgor View Post
Little math, which I'm sure some of you will denounce as liberal lies:

326M people is USA, 2.85M die per in a normal year, .0024% of population dies per day.

11M vaccinated X .000024 = 263 people per day will die on average after being vaccinated. (probably higher b/c vaccinated population >65)

What you are looking for are deaths in excess of 263 per day.....but I have little faith you anti-vaxxers will believe or bother with trying to figure out the difference between baseline and deviations from baseline numbers.

If someone is old, gets covid and dies the death was caused by covid. However, if someone is old gets the vaccine and then dies it was not caused by the vaccine, right?
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  #43  
Old 01-21-2021, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by UCT View Post
If someone is old, gets covid and dies the death was caused by covid. However, if someone is old gets the vaccine and then dies it was not caused by the vaccine, right?
"I have little faith you anti-vaxxers will believe or bother with trying to figure out the difference between baseline and deviations from baseline numbers."

Thank you for proving my point!
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  #44  
Old 01-21-2021, 1:01 PM
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"I have little faith you anti-vaxxers will believe or bother with trying to figure out the difference between baseline and deviations from baseline numbers."
More condescension from a pseudo-intellectual. People seem to be getting sick and dying because of the vaccine..... irrespective of your "baseline and deviations from baseline numbers" abstraction/diversion tactic. Do try to keep up.
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  #45  
Old 01-21-2021, 1:04 PM
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Hint, here's what a deviation from baseline looks like:

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  #46  
Old 01-21-2021, 1:12 PM
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Hint, here's what a deviation from baseline looks like
Again - People seem to be getting sick and dying because of the vaccine..... irrespective of your "baseline and deviations from baseline numbers" abstraction/diversion tactic. Do try to keep up.
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  #47  
Old 01-21-2021, 1:13 PM
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Originally Posted by balgor View Post
(useless chart deleted)
Again - People seem to be getting sick and dying because of the vaccine..... irrespective of your "baseline and deviations from baseline numbers" abstraction/diversion tactic. Do try to keep up.
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  #48  
Old 01-21-2021, 1:18 PM
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Originally Posted by balgor View Post
"I have little faith you anti-vaxxers will believe or bother with trying to figure out the difference between baseline and deviations from baseline numbers."

Thank you for proving my point!
Moronic to assume I am anti-vaxxer, since I have taken every vaccination recommended by my doctor except flu, which is only 50 percent effective in a good year.

However, having a degree in microbiology and having seen your posts, I am certain I know more about the subject than you.

Drug companies chose to use the mRNA for the entire protein structure of the spike because they know that is what the body creates antibodies against after coronavirus infection. It therefore follows that any autoimmune disease or complications that would occur from exposure to the coronavirus is likely to occur from exposure to the vaccine. Simply logic even for those without the training. So one would expect the same proportion to die from the vaccine as die from autoimmune reaction to the virus.
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  #49  
Old 01-21-2021, 1:23 PM
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Originally Posted by UCT View Post
Moronic to assume I am anti-vaxxer, since I have taken every vaccination recommended by my doctor except flu, which is only 50 percent effective in a good year.

However, having a degree in microbiology and having seen your posts, I am certain I know more about the subject than you.

Drug companies chose to use the mRNA for the entire protein structure of the spike because they know that is what the body creates antibodies against after coronavirus infection. It therefore follows that any autoimmune disease or complications that would occur from exposure to the coronavirus is likely to occur from exposure to the vaccine. Simply logic even for those without the training. So one would expect the same proportion to die from the vaccine as die from autoimmune reaction to the virus.
But, but, but..... "baseline and deviations from baseline numbers"!!
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  #50  
Old 01-21-2021, 1:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UCT View Post
Moronic to assume I am anti-vaxxer, since I have taken every vaccination recommended by my doctor except flu, which is only 50 percent effective in a good year.

However, having a degree in microbiology and having seen your posts, I am certain I know more about the subject than you.

Drug companies chose to use the mRNA for the entire protein structure of the spike because they know that is what the body creates antibodies against after coronavirus infection. It therefore follows that any autoimmune disease or complications that would occur from exposure to the coronavirus is likely to occur from exposure to the vaccine. Simply logic even for those without the training. So one would expect the same proportion to die from the vaccine as die from autoimmune reaction to the virus.
Everything you posted above is a non-sequitur.

"If someone is old, gets covid and dies the death was caused by covid. However, if someone is old gets the vaccine and then dies it was not caused by the vaccine, right?"

This statement is clearly wrong and demonstrates a complete lack of statistical training. Excess deaths are deviations from baseline by definition

"So one would expect the same proportion to die from the vaccine as die from autoimmune reaction to the virus."

Not borne out by the actual data and crazy supposition to start with. The spike protein isn't the dangerous part of the virus, hence it's usage in the vaccines. It allows biding to ACE2 receptors to allow entry. Where were all the auto-immune responses in the trials? Millions of people have gotten the vaccines, shouldn't we be seeing a spike in auto-immune disorders? Hmmmm? Seriously, you have a degree in microbiology? Really?

Typical I'm not an anti-vaxxer, BaHt Deeze CaViD VaxX R SUpeR DanGerOS!

The vaccines are astonishing safe and effective PERIOD.
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Last edited by balgor; 01-21-2021 at 1:57 PM..
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  #51  
Old 01-21-2021, 1:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UCT View Post
Drug companies chose to use the mRNA for the entire protein structure of the spike because they know that is what the body creates antibodies against after coronavirus infection. It therefore follows that any autoimmune disease or complications that would occur from exposure to the coronavirus is likely to occur from exposure to the vaccine. Simply logic even for those without the training. So one would expect the same proportion to die from the vaccine as die from autoimmune reaction to the virus.
"simply logic even for those without training" except there's a lot of false assumptions in your statement above.

Drug companies "chose" the spike protein to replicate because it was a unique identifier to the rest of the virus. In addition, it also serves as the key it uses to enter our cells to replicate. It was like, the perfect storm protein to vaccinate against. Your body will attack the virus because of the identified spike protein without even looking at the rest of the virus. Plus, if the spike protein mutates and your body no longer recognizes it, it is very likely the mutation will not be able to enter your cells to replicate.

People have auto immune reactions to the virus, not just the spike protein. The virus is entering your cells and replicating, that puts your immune response on high alert. Some bodies over-react. Does the spike protein play a role in your immune systems reaction? Probably, but "logic without training" would tell me it's likely a much smaller portion than the over reactions caused by the coronavirus itself.

The same amount of people will not die from the vaccine as those from the virus. In general, your immune response is pretty standard for "new protein I don't recognize, so it must be bad", but can be much more harsh for a virus that is actively entering your cells and replicating.

I have kept up with vaccine news, this was a specific lot of the moderna vaccine that is raising flags. It needs to be investigated as to why this lot is causing higher than expected reactions, but one bad lot does not make the original product faulty.
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  #52  
Old 01-21-2021, 2:17 PM
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Originally Posted by balgor View Post

Typical I'm not an anti-vaxxer, BaHt Deeze CaViD VaxX R SUpeR DanGerOS!
More condescending, insulting dismissal by a self-aggrandizing ECONOMY major. Derrr...... we just ignorant folks round here..... we can't possibly unnnerstand what you high-minded intellectualizers is trying to tell us!!
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Last edited by bigbossman; 01-21-2021 at 2:19 PM..
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  #53  
Old 01-21-2021, 3:25 PM
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And in other news:

https://rumble.com/vczp3z-california...ic-reacti.html

But but but....
Quote:
The vaccines are astonishing safe and effective PERIOD.
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  #54  
Old 01-22-2021, 1:14 AM
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My son's best friend's dad is an ICU nurse in San Diego. He got both doses of the Moderna vaccine, and had minor symptoms. My wife got the Pfizer vaccines on the same days, and the 2nd dose knocked her on her butt. She ended up spending the day after getting the 2nd dose in her office pushing paperwork with a fever, shivering, and wrapped in a blanket. Both had no evidence of reactions the day after that.

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  #55  
Old 01-22-2021, 4:28 AM
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As of 21 Jan there have been 24,037,236 confirmed cases of COVID-19 with 398,435 deaths in the US
https://covid19.who.int/region/amro/country/us

These numbers are under reported as I know people who have come down with COVID and did not report it to anyone. I don't know how deaths are reported.

So, 55 deaths taking the vaccine versus 400,000 deaths without taking the vaccine. And, given the slow roll out of vaccines, and that the CDC recommended injection priorities based on social justice considerations, (that is not whitey!) and not based on those who are most at risk, and the most vulnerable , the US death rate might hit half a million before years end.

Last edited by slamfire1; 01-22-2021 at 6:47 AM..
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  #56  
Old 01-22-2021, 6:51 AM
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But but but...
I thought every life mattered?
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  #57  
Old 01-22-2021, 7:35 AM
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Let me help you out.
From the very artical you posted:

"Health officials on the VAERS website caution that a report to the system doesnít prove a vaccine caused the adverse event, and that no proof that the event was caused by the vaccine is required in order for the system to accept the report."

And in the time it took you to post this nonsense and for me to help you out, A HUNDREDS of AMERICANS died of Covid.
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  #58  
Old 01-22-2021, 7:54 AM
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Put all antivaxxers in a compound let the disease run its course. The survivors will have herd immunity.
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  #59  
Old 01-22-2021, 8:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KHF1222 View Post
First photo is of Tiffany Dover who is critical care unit nurse manager at the CHI Memorial Hospital in Chattanooga, Tennessee
from Tuesday, December 17, 2020 when the ijection was administered.

https://local12.com/resources/media2...stvaccine3.PNG

However, the second photo appears to be an 'in-stock' photo of a cute young asian nurse outside the hospital from Tuesday,
November 24, 2020. Cannot tell if even the same person to the first photo, and the dates appear to be a mismatch to support a
narration for an after photo.

https://previews.123rf.com/images/nr...e-hospital.jpg

Either way, this nurse is doing just fine, and the stupid knowingly false reports on the Internet about her death are just
that, stupid mixed in with anti-vac sentiment.

I see you didnít get the joke here....


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  #60  
Old 01-22-2021, 8:11 AM
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OP is a China troll. Dont feed the troll.
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  #61  
Old 01-22-2021, 9:33 AM
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Originally Posted by edgerly779 View Post
Put all antivaxxers in a compound let the disease run its course. The survivors will have herd immunity.
Just because one wants nothing to do with this particular vaccination, does not make them an "anti-vaxxer". Only a fool or maybe someone who is being deliberately disingenuous would say so.
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  #62  
Old 01-22-2021, 3:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madmox View Post
I see you didnít get the joke here....


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Yep.. That was a bit of a gaffe on my part.....
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  #63  
Old 01-22-2021, 7:56 PM
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Yep.. That was a bit of a gaffe on my part.....

Hah. Happens to the best of us! Cheers
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  #64  
Old 01-23-2021, 8:33 PM
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Put all antivaxxers in a compound let the disease run its course. The survivors will have herd immunity.
Lock all the scared people in a compound and let the rest of us live life the way we see fit.
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  #65  
Old 01-24-2021, 6:04 PM
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Sooooo same as just getting the rona in the first place?

This vaccine sure seems like a big ol expensive waste of time and money...
Well not if you are Pfizer or Moderna.
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  #66  
Old 01-24-2021, 6:19 PM
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Originally Posted by ibanezfoo View Post
Lock all the scared people in a compound and let the rest of us live life the way we see fit.
QFT
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  #67  
Old 01-27-2021, 10:35 AM
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Make that 56.

https://abc7.com/health/oc-health-ca...cine/10064394/
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  #68  
Old 02-07-2021, 9:44 PM
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That is NOT what that article says. You're peddling horse manure.

55 people died sometime after taking the vaccine, and then they or their health care provider decided to report it as a possible adverse reaction pending an autopsy and other investigations.

If you're saying it's illegitimate to say someone died with COVID but not of COVID, you're right. And, in the same way, it would be disingenuous conspiracy-peddling silliness to suggest that these people died OF the vaccine instead of coincidentally after having received it.

Correlation doesn't equal causality, and if you make one argument the other's made for you.

Stop. trying. to. science.
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  #69  
Old 02-07-2021, 10:32 PM
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I keep hearing "news" stories (aka propaganda) with people saying "I wasn't sure about the vaccine but then I saw people getting it and they were fine. So I got it". People sure are short sighted. They're not even thinking of the long term effects.

I have no idea if the vaccine is safe or not, but I'm going to wait a while and see how things shakeout. I'm not in the high risk category so if I get the Covid I'll be fine.

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Old 02-07-2021, 10:53 PM
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Over 450,000 US deaths from Covid-19 so far, over 28,000,000 vaccinated, 55 deaths - not statistically significant in the least. Not saying it doesn't suck for those 55 people and their families, just saying not much compared to other medication related fatalities. Over 300 people die each year from adverse reactions to other medications, 4,000 die from surgical errors, 7,000-9,000 die per year from medication errors (giving contra-indicated medications or incorrect doses).

Anyone that denies vaccines save lives is not living in reality. Vaccines save the lives of at least 42,000 children a year. The question of whether people should be forced against their will to get a vaccine or have their child vaccinated is a whole other issue.
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Old 02-08-2021, 6:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Pessimist View Post
Over 450,000 US deaths from Covid-19 so far, over 28,000,000 vaccinated, 55 deaths - not statistically significant in the least. Not saying it doesn't suck for those 55 people and their families, just saying not much compared to other medication related fatalities. Over 300 people die each year from adverse reactions to other medications, 4,000 die from surgical errors, 7,000-9,000 die per year from medication errors (giving contra-indicated medications or incorrect doses).

Anyone that denies vaccines save lives is not living in reality. Vaccines save the lives of at least 42,000 children a year. The question of whether people should be forced against their will to get a vaccine or have their child vaccinated is a whole other issue.
As of this week its now about 501 deaths for 39m doses. Thats about 0.00013 chance of death assuming that the vaccine was the actual cause. Based on who is being vaccinated at the moment (over 60s) that seems really good. I could see that number slipping a whole order of magnitude when the younger half of the population are injected.
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  #72  
Old 02-08-2021, 4:19 PM
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This video is an hour long, but worth every minute if youíre considering or may be forced to take the jab. Deaths or no deaths, I for one will not be taking it.

https://forbiddenknowledgetv.net/dr-...-cv19-vaccine/
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  #73  
Old 02-08-2021, 10:13 PM
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The mRNA is experimental and has not underwent the proper clinical trials.
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  #74  
Old 02-08-2021, 11:50 PM
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http://thecovidblog.com/2021/02/07/s...covid-vaccine/

A pregnant Doctor gets vaccinated, a few days later suffers a miscarriage at 14 1/2 wks (less than 1% statistical probability).

Yeah, it's just a coincidence.
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