*MEGA THREAD* Responses to PERUTA decision by issuing agencies

[curtisfong]

I'm betting O.C. will not issue solely based on SD as GC.

[Untamed1972]

Originally Posted by Fatgunman

If the county sheriff denies your first application will that go against you if you resubmit another application in the future?

Also I do not believe that the ninth circuit's decision will be challenged, for the same reasons that Chicago did not challenge the court's decision forcing them to issue permits.

Would depend on the reason for the denial....and if the denial was pre or post-Peruta.

Personally I think anyone denied for lack of GC pre-Peruta should go in and demand their previous app be reviewed and issued upon with no further fees being paid.

Post-Peruta....if they're denying based on anything other than you're prohibited from possessing guns...they need to be sued each and every time.

[9M62]

Lots of pessimists here.

At least he flat out said they would be accepting applications and mentioned the Peruta case in a POSITIVE light.

He could have said what many other Sheriffs have already said: "We won't change anything until this goes further, we don't care what the 9th says."

To me it seems pretty reasonable. He's flat out saying that you do NOT need to list a "good cause" statement, and that "self-defense or personal protection" is sufficient instead of a good cause statement.

People should be telling him good job for at least accepting the ruling, even if he doesn't like it, and changing his policy so he can adhere to the current law of the land per the 9th.

But, no, people will still complain that he didn't knock on their door and hand them a CCW permit for free.

:rolleyes

[SWalt]

Originally Posted by gds12fu

I'm still having a hard time what that all means. Is OC CCW friendly?(compared to the rest of the counties, at least?) I am really wondering if now is the time to apply, or wait.

I know some of these questions have been beaten to death, but can't find too much info, as far as Orange County is concerned. So any help or direction is appreciated.

The next OCSD election just got a hell of a lot more important.

Nope, one of the worst is my understanding.

But them including self defense as a reason tells me they are seeing the handwriting on the wall. I guess we will find out if they truly accepting self defense for cause or if they throw up new road blocks. Time will tell

[SWalt]

Link

http://ocsd.org/about/info/services/ccw

[e90bmw]

Looks like they are waiting to see if en banc is granted, if not they will process as submitted.

[blackberg]

well right now, pre enbanc, its is in effect right?

so they have to accept it to comply, they know very well that it will either be accepted to go in enbanc or go to the Sumpreme, and everything will be delayed, or if SD loses again they have to accept applications anyways.

-bb

[e90bmw]

Originally Posted by ooja3k

Looks like Orange County Sherrif has changed their policy in accordance to the courts ruling!

Time to make an appointment!

But reserves the right to ask for "good cause" if en banc is granted.
Hedging his bets.

[CCWFacts]

No, this means that they are going to issue for personal protection, until / unless Peruta is stayed. This means it's time to apply for all OC residents. Your risk is that Peruta will be stayed before your app can be processed. Honestly that's a significant chance, but still, you might want to get your app in.

[valdier]

Originally Posted by e90bmw

But reserves the right to ask for "good cause" if en banc is granted.
Hedging his bets.

Strange, their website still says Bring a good cause statement and failure to do so will have you denied.

https://cms.ocgov.com/gov/sheriff/ab...structions.asp

[SWalt]

I'm hoping Riverside's Sheriff Snif will take note. He is suppose to be pro 2A

[beerup949]

I just got my appointment - basically, Melissa stated that it's business as usual because the decision is being appealed. I aksed if it has been approved for appeal or not? She couldn't answer the question....because she didn't know.


Just because there is mention of a possible appeal, they will continue to break the law. How these people are cops is beyond me.

[finyllw]

A little too late. I'm moving to Denver in the next few months. Co is a "shall Issue" state. It also has an agrrement to honor 35 other states CCW.

I hope this does work out for all of Ca. as I will be visiting quite often.

[rodH]

Originally Posted by gds12fu

I'm still having a hard time what that all means. Is OC CCW friendly?(compared to the rest of the counties, at least?) I am really wondering if now is the time to apply, or wait.

I know some of these questions have been beaten to death, but can't find too much info, as far as Orange County is concerned. So any help or direction is appreciated.

The next OCSD election just got a hell of a lot more important.

I kind of wonder if, since OC is fairly conservative compared to other parts of the state, the Sheriff may feel a little pressure to keep his/her job, and thus might be a little more willing than if you were from SF or LA?

[Motorola]

I read it as being we are good to submit an application using only personal safety/self-defense as the GC.

OCSD Policy 218 outlines personal safety and self-defense (generalised fears) as being insufficient for issuance. So, submit now on personal safety, but if en banc/SCOTUS occurs, Policy 218 will be guiding until further dispo.

Sounds like they're playing twister to limit exposure to people with fingers on the 'sue' button.

Processing time will afford the OCSD opportunity to stall...but it sounds like they will comply if it all ends in our favor.

[JonW]

Originally Posted by 9M62

Lots of pessimists here.

At least he flat out said they would be accepting applications and mentioned the Peruta case in a POSITIVE light.

He could have said what many other Sheriffs have already said: "We won't change anything until this goes further, we don't care what the 9th says."

To me it seems pretty reasonable. He's flat out saying that you do NOT need to list a "good cause" statement, and that "self-defense or personal protection" is sufficient instead of a good cause statement.

People should be telling him good job for at least accepting the ruling, even if he doesn't like it, and changing his policy so he can adhere to the current law of the land per the 9th.

But, no, people will still complain that he didn't knock on their door and hand them a CCW permit for free.

:rolleyes

FYI - The OC Sheriff is a "she", not a "he"....lol.

I agree with your sentiments though. Why would they post anything like they did if they weren't going to abide by the ruling? I feel this is a positive direction. We'll just have to wait and see.

[Doc Hawk]

Originally Posted by 9M62

People should be telling him her good job for at least accepting the ruling, even if he she doesn't like it, and changing his her policy so he she can adhere to the current law of the land per the 9th.

[GMONEY]

So I had a CCW and then that b*tch Hutchens prematurely ended it for no reason? Does that mean I should re-apply?

[beerup949]

Originally Posted by GMONEY

So I had a CCW and then that b*tch Hutchens prematurely ended it for no reason? Does that mean I should re-apply?

Why not? Appointments are into April now FYI.

[GMONEY]

Ok so I am going to put my good cause as personal safety!

[CZ man in LA]

Originally Posted by hermosabeach

Marin County could add a urine test for CHL applicants...

Weed

Considering that marijuana is used for medical purposes in CA and likely a topic to be decided whether to be 100% legal soon as in WA and CO, I doubt they can deny a person from CCW on the basis of using marijuana for that long.

If marijuana becomes 100% legal and served as a basis for denying CCW, then they can also say that "do you drink alcohol" or "do you smoke cigarettes" or "do you take aspirin" as a cause for denial.

[Untamed1972]

Originally Posted by JonW

FYI - The OC Sheriff is a "she", not a "he"....lol.

I agree with your sentiments though. Why would they post anything like they did if they weren't going to abide by the ruling? I feel this is a positive direction. We'll just have to wait and see.

Because we know how nit-picky these folks can be. Notice their statement said "we will ACCEPT applications" with SD as GC. It did not say they would ISSUE based on SD. Previously they wouldn't even accept an app with SD as GC. So now they can't require more cause then that to accept an app.....nothing they said indicates they will issue though.

[ryan_j]

Who are the two in SF? Feinstein and Pelosi?

[heyjerr]

Isn't there a timeframe in which they must approve a submission? Or is it legal for them to drag out the approval process indefinitely to allow for a ruling on the en banc?

Originally Posted by finyllw

A little too late. I'm moving to Denver in the next few months. Co is a "shall Issue" state. It also has an agrrement to honor 35 other states CCW.

I hope this does work out for all of Ca. as I will be visiting quite often.

Reciprocity is a whole different issue. Not sure CA will suddenly start allowing CCW with a license from another state.

[Untamed1972]

Originally Posted by heyjerr

Reciprocity is a whole different issue. Not sure CA will suddenly start allowing CCW with a license from another state.

Reciprocity will require a legislative change or a legal challenge of not allowing any means for out of stateers to obtain a CA permit cuz as it stands right now because CA law does not allow for recognition of out of state permits nor can a non-resident apply for a CA CCW.

[email]

http://www.lasdhq.org/contact_us/inq...mit-local3.htm

LA still says "Good Cause" is required.

I hope they get the memo soon.

[email]

Originally Posted by heyjerr

Reciprocity is a whole different issue. Not sure CA will suddenly start allowing CCW with a license from another state.

You mean like driver's licenses and wedding licences?

[jrock]

Hutchens has been notoriously anti ccw...and really bad with her reserves deputies...(ie, crappy retirement badges, lack of available duties, etc)
One extreme to other vs the prev sheriff.

[Harley Quinn]

Los Angeles County will be having a new Sheriff after the elections. I have a feeling Mc Donnell, who is from LAPD and now Long Beach PD Chief has the best go at it...LAPD was not known for giving out CCW back in the day. It will be a hard climb to the top of the hill imho...(getting ccw in that county)...

[Southwest Chuck]

Looks like O.C. is now accepting self defense as good cause:

The Orange County Sheriff’s Department will accept CCW applications which include, in the “Details of Reason for Applicant Desiring a CCW License” (on page 10 of 13 of the California Department of Justice Standard Initial and Renewal Application for License to Carry a Concealed Weapon), that the CCW license is needed for self-defense or personal safety. Applications which include other reasons showing “good cause” for the CCW License as set forth in the Orange County Sheriff’s Department’s Policy 218, License to Carry a Concealed Firearm, will also be accepted.

If the Peruta v. County of San Diego panel decision is withdrawn by a decision to rehear the case en banc in the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals, or a stay is issued by the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals or the United States Supreme Court, we may require applicants to supplement the “good cause” statement for the CCW License in accord with Orange County Sheriff’s Department’s Policy 218.

http://ocsd.org/about/info/services/ccw

[Untamed1972]

Originally Posted by heyjerr

Isn't there a timeframe in which they must approve a submission? Or is it legal for them to drag out the approval process indefinitely to allow for a ruling on the en banc?

There is a point in the process where the clock starts running....I think it's when they run your DOJ check, or live scan....I forget. At that point I think they have 90 days.

But the clock doesn't start at the time of app submission. They could let it sit there for a year and claim they've been too backlogged to get to it yet.

[riderr]

Originally Posted by 9M62

Lots of pessimists here.

At least he flat out said they would be accepting applications and mentioned the Peruta case in a POSITIVE light.

He could have said what many other Sheriffs have already said: "We won't change anything until this goes further, we don't care what the 9th says."

To me it seems pretty reasonable. He's flat out saying that you do NOT need to list a "good cause" statement, and that "self-defense or personal protection" is sufficient instead of a good cause statement.

People should be telling him good job for at least accepting the ruling, even if he doesn't like it, and changing his policy so he can adhere to the current law of the land per the 9th.

But, no, people will still complain that he didn't knock on their door and hand them a CCW permit for free.

:rolleyes

It's her, actually. Not him

[riderr]

Originally Posted by CZ man in LA

Considering that marijuana is used for medical purposes in CA and likely a topic to be decided whether to be 100% legal soon as in WA and CO, I doubt they can deny a person from CCW on the basis of using marijuana for that long.

If marijuana becomes 100% legal and served as a basis for denying CCW, then they can also say that "do you drink alcohol" or "do you smoke cigarettes" or "do you take aspirin" as a cause for denial.

It depends if it becomes state-wide legal or country-wide legal. Marijuana and guns don't get mixed under the federal law. So, if the State of California makes it legal, it will still be illegal under the Federal laws. So, a marijuana addict can potentially get denied from LTC on the federal law grounds.

[riderr]

Originally Posted by jrock

Hutchens has been notoriously anti ccw...and really bad with her reserves deputies...(ie, crappy retirement badges, lack of available duties, etc)
One extreme to other vs the prev sheriff.

She can be whoever she wants, as soon as she complies with the existing law, which apparently she does.

[J.D.Allen]

Originally Posted by smk

I have seen a lot of info on SD, Riverside, LA counties, and others, but I haven't seen anything on Imperial County. IT has been notoriously difficult to get a CCW permit with out current sheriff, Sheriff Loera. The policy requires the standard testing/instruction, psych tests, background check, etc...and more importantly, the good cause statement. (http://www.icso.org/BOF_4012_CCWapplication_112012.pdf)

I have called the Sheriff's Department and asked how the ruling would affect the policy, and two supervisors were not aware of any ruling, to the point where I had to read portions of it to them over the phone.

I am doubtful anything will change in Imperial County, but I am really hoping it does.

You haven't heard anything about Imperial because no one cares about us out here in this barren wasteland . Seriously though, I think Loera might be as stubborn about changing his poilicies as L.A. or San Francisco. There is an election coming up this summer though, and the guy running against Loera, Rick Macken, supposedly would be better on CCW issuance. Maybe not perfect but it might be a quicker option to try to get Loera replaced in the election...

[GMONEY]

This mega thread sucks! Thread should be by county! Confusing!

[Ishooter]

Originally Posted by SWalt

Link

http://ocsd.org/about/info/services/ccw

Thank you.

[Intel0116]

I just got off the phone with LASD, the person I spoke to said nothing has changed with there policy, and that it will not change until "it is written in to law"

[Doheny]

/\ I'm not sure where you get your intel, but I've been told by someone on the OCSD command staff that she does intend to run again. She's through the majority of her treatment and is reporting to work daily.


Sent from my iPhone; pardon any typos.

[Rcjackrabbit]

The website for Orange County says they are now accepting applications post Peruta. Here are the details:

http://ocsd.org/about/info/services/ccw

She took mine away after she took office. I think it is appropriate that she be the one to give it back. Do you think it is worth waiting until after we know more about "en banc" or go for the interview now?