The Ladies Forum

[Kestryll]

A while back, I'm sorry to say it was more of a while than I care to admit, I received a Report post notice I believe it was about the Ladies forum and thoughts on expansion or revision.

At the time I was caught up in another issue but it's been percolating in the back of my mind.

Okay, Gmail rocks and so does it's search feature, I found the email.
It was when there was a Mary Kay thread going.

so, what says the "management"?

seriously, please consider having a "for sale" thread stickied in the Ladies Forum.

i also think this would give we women more ways to connect and support each other. it would also allow for us to get a better and more rounded picture of each of us. it would allow us to not have to go to the other more male dominated sales/marketing areas.

i'm not sure if i'm going about this right and i'm betting i'm not. i'm betting there is a procedure somewhere that would tell me how to make this suggestion and to who.

i think its time for the Ladies Forum to grow/expand/evolve.

So I guess the question becomes what kind of growth or evolution would be of interest?

A stickied thread, a sub-forum or a specific category with defined forums?

[8bitnintendo]

I personally don't see much of a point of having too extensive a ladies marketplace section -- what would be the intended category of things for sale? The Marketplace subfora are categorized by type of item (ammo, firearm parts, etc.) It seems like most items that would go in a Ladies Marketplace sticky or subforum could equally well be included in the existing marketplace categories... and if I had something "girly" I wanted to sell, I'd want to put it in the marketplace forum that gets the most views (or cross-post it to both, if that is allowed.)

Having a stickied thread that we can post to with links to marketplace items we think are more relevant to the Ladies Forum might not be a bad compromise...

[movie zombie]

confession: i was the one that sent the e-mail. several of the women calgunners have an "artsy" side and/or business side that does not necessarily fit in with the other for sale items: whether it be Mary Kay products, original art work, etc.....there could be an interest amongst ourselves that would not be shared by the general male population of calguns. i know one female calgunner posted somethings for sale that i was unaware of because it was buried over in the other sale areas....i'd never have thought to look for them there.

i appreciate 8bit's perspective....however, i was not talking about gun related items, hunting equipment or even pink pistols.

i personally do not have a business or artsy side interest so i'm looking at it as a way to support through use of my $ female gunowners and/or get to know the women of calguns better. perhaps this is merely my own need and not shared by the other women of calguns in the Ladies Forum. i also thought it might prevent another "Mary Kay incident".....

keeping business separated out from the discussions works for the rest of calguns. i think it would be appropriate and effective in the Ladies Forum as well.

just more thinking out loud on my part.......

[Tlc.norcal]

Seriously? Mary Kay on the gun list?

[Fundamentals]

Instead of having it as part of the ladies forum, why not make a specific subsection under "private non-firearms related" for poster manufactured items? That way men can join in too, the views will still be high, and posts won't get lost as easily.

[movie zombie]

such an area already exists and it is very easy for a post to get lost if there aren't a lot responses. its still pretty heavy male interest oriented....although i just checked it and a calgunner does have paintings of guns for sale.

the Mary Kay incident could have been avoided had there been an area in the Ladies Forum for her to list her products. again, for me at least, this is more about supporting the women of calguns in their other non-gun related interests and about incorporating more women into calguns.

the other for sale areas are still dominated by male interests and pretty much still gun related in one way or another. nothing wrong with that at all. i support that as well. what i'm suggesting is another way to make the Ladies Forum stronger and to avoid alienating another possible female particpant.

i want to thank Mr K for even getting back to this and considering it. if there's no interest by the women of calguns, then there is no interest. but i do think there is an opportunity here to support one another in more ways and perhaps have a broader appeal to women who are considering a gun or are already a gunowner looking for like minded souls. think of it this way: making it a friendlier place by putting out a welcome mat.

i'd also say that it would be ok for the men of calguns to post non-gun related and appropriate items for sale as well. i'm betting there is some calgunner making some lovely holsters, belts, etc. sure i could go to the current for sale areas but i probably won't. why? i don't want to have to dig through all the posts to find what i want and i find the search feature doesn't always give me the results that will lead me to my goal.

again, this is more about strengthing and supporting the Ladies Forum. think of it as an extension of the creation of the Ladies Forum which was an outgrowth from OT. i'm sure there are many that think having a Ladies Forum in the first place is not necessary. i for one am glad it is here.

again, thanks to Mr K for even considering the idea.

[8bitnintendo]

Originally Posted by movie zombie

i'm betting there is some calgunner making some lovely holsters, belts, etc. sure i could go to the current for sale areas but i probably won't. why? i don't want to have to dig through all the posts to find what i want and i find the search feature doesn't always give me the results that will lead me to my goal.

You know, now you put it that way, I withdraw my original objection -- it would be nice to be able to find things which really are more relevant to women (women's sleeping bags, woman-shaped holsters, etc.) more easily. And there are plenty of other things that women are predominantly interested in that men are not (Diva cups are great for long backpacking trips, but I imagine most cis men wouldn't be interested in hearing about them.) I missed the whole Mary Kay thread that apparently started this -- I hope it didn't run off anyone who was involved.

I read the original post, and had a knee-jerk reaction that it would either be very under-utilized because universal-gender items would be posted to the general marketplace, or (perhaps due to perceived underutilization) become a kind of "pink ghetto" where well-meaning members would start posting links to commercial deals and products because they "seemed girly".

It will be interesting seeing how the rules (official or otherwise) end up shaking out for a Ladies Marketplace -- would it be only for individuals and/or vendors selling products designed specifically for women? Would we have threads we could post testimonials to about particular products that worked well for us? I think being able to sticky threads to, for example, discuss which holsters we've tried and like vs. our body types and the dimensions of the gun in question, could be a great add to the Ladies Forum. I don't have any good ideas on how to organize or moderate that kind of informational sticky though.

[movie zombie]

Originally Posted by 8bitnintendo

.........It will be interesting seeing how the rules (official or otherwise) end up shaking out for a Ladies Marketplace -- would it be only for individuals and/or vendors selling products designed specifically for women? Would we have threads we could post testimonials to about particular products that worked well for us? I think being able to sticky threads to, for example, discuss which holsters we've tried and like vs. our body types and the dimensions of the gun in question, could be a great add to the Ladies Forum. I don't have any good ideas on how to organize or moderate that kind of informational sticky though.

all good points/ideas/questions. i too do not have any good ideas on how to organize such a thing.....

[CSACANNONEER]

As far as another marketplace forum goes, I would think it would be detrimental in the end. Just because there are mainly males on this forum, it doesn't mean that we never buy feminine things for our mothers, wives, daughters, girl friends or ourselves. If you had a seperate for sale forum, you'ld loose +99% of your potential market base.

Originally Posted by Tlc.norcal

Seriously? Mary Kay on the gun list?

I was at the largest gun shop in Taft this last Sunday and they had a whole display case full of Mary Kay.

Originally Posted by LdyApxr

How about password protecting the ladies forum so the men can't come in and do their "Me Tarzan, You Jane" bit....

So you want a "ladies only" forum? That wouldn't be fair unless we also had "mens only", "gays only", "lesbians only", "transgendered only", etc. forums. Besides, what would you discuss in a "ladies only" forum other than you soft, gentile hummers? Also, having to get a password only to access the ladies' forum would probably discourage some females from joining.

[MrsRazz]

Originally Posted by LdyApxr

How about password protecting the ladies forum so the men can't come in and do their "Me Tarzan, You Jane" bit....

You'd be punishing the guys that come in and behave themselves.

That's like banning guns because criminals use them.

[movie zombie]

CSA, there would be no reason the guys couldn't come into the Ladies Markeplace...heck, they should be able to list appropriate things for sale there.

there is a missed opportunity here: the current for sale threads are male dominated for male "things" and i just don't want to take the time to have to sift through them all to get to what i want. i'll take my $ elsewhere....time is $, remember?

again, my vision is/was that there are talents that could be highlighted in a Ladies Marketplace....whether those products are female or male made makes no difference. i also see this as a place where the Mary Kay products and/or the more talented artistic female calgunners among us [not me, no art ability at all] could display their wares/products and we could support them. the example of a Diva cup was excellent, than you, 8bit!

i also see this as a place where we could post good experiences re purchases from businesses....or leave feedback re specific places not being female friendly [a certain gunshop comes to my mind].

my suggestion has nothing to do with stopping men from participating in either the Ladies Forum or the suggested Ladies Marketplace. a password for the Ladies Forum is NOT necessary. the women of calguns are strong enough to tell the guys when they are out of line and the mods have their ban hammer when its appropriate. there have been many male calgunners that have contributed w/o the testosterone laden attitude found in OT and their contributions are valuable.

and i see this as a way of getting know the women of calguns better. if there is an artist or handicrafter, i'd like to know it....call it that "female thing" about forming a group or whatever. remember the group of women over in the central valley looking for support? they got pretty well trashed by the men....had a marketplace existed, perhaps they could have posted there instead. so, of course, it means perhaps a Ladies Marketplace with sub-areas for want to buy, want to sell, free services, seeking assistance, etc.

i believe that by incorporating this into the Ladies Forum we could become a better group, a more supportive group, and perhaps even get more female traffic from those new to gunownership or considering it.

the face of calguns is very very male. nothing wrong with that. but with upswing in women buying guns, why not take advantage of that and try to get to know each other better and increase our membership?

random thoughts so early in the morning perhaps not very well thought out or written.....

[MrsRazz]

Originally Posted by movie zombie

the face of calguns is very very male. nothing wrong with that. but with upswing in women buying guns, why not take advantage of that and try to get to know each other better and increase our membership?

I agree with this. The guys here on Calguns complain that women don't like guns and don't want to be here. But, the behavior by some members on the other forums are boorish and misogynistic. I think having a marketplace that doesn't have to deal with sexist comments would be nice.

[Kestryll]

Originally Posted by movie zombie

all good points/ideas/questions. i too do not have any good ideas on how to organize such a thing.....

I might have an idea or two on that score.

Originally Posted by 8bitnintendo

It will be interesting seeing how the rules (official or otherwise) end up shaking out for a Ladies Marketplace -- would it be only for individuals and/or vendors selling products designed specifically for women? Would we have threads we could post testimonials to about particular products that worked well for us? I think being able to sticky threads to, for example, discuss which holsters we've tried and like vs. our body types and the dimensions of the gun in question, could be a great add to the Ladies Forum. I don't have any good ideas on how to organize or moderate that kind of informational sticky though.

There are several ways to go about this:

1) Make sub forums to the existing Ladies Forum like so;

Specialty Forums
-Ladies Forum
--Sales forum
--Deals, feedback and recommendations forum

2) Make each section it's own forum;

Specialty Forums
-Ladies Forum
-Sales Forums
-Calgunners in Servive
-Etc.

3) Make a specific Category for women's forums (the 'Specialty Forums' section is a Category);

Women Shooters and Enthusiasts
-Ladies Forum
-Sales Forum
-Deals, Feedback and Recommendations Forum
-Any other forum that would be fitting to the Category

Moderation is pretty straightforward, all the standard Marketplace rules apply with an addition that all items offered for sale must comply with the intent and spirit of the forum and all the rules specific to the Ladies forum apply as well.

Of course there is a trade off for all of this, you don't think this syuff comes free do you?
There is a high likelihood that an expansion of the Ladies Forum means somebody from the Ladies Forum will get tapped to act as a forum specific Moderator. To paraphrase Spiderman, 'with great deals comes great responsibility'.

Originally Posted by LdyApxr

How about password protecting the ladies forum so the men can't come in and do their "Me Tarzan, You Jane" bit....

Password protection is a double edge sword, yes you get a limited access forum but you also get new people feeling excluded and a host of other problems. If we can't do it without password it probably shouldn't be done.
Fortunately I don't think a password is necessary.

[Kestryll]

Originally Posted by LdyApxr

Fortunately, if you get attacked, you get to ban them. If any other woman gets attacked, we just have to sit back and take it or risk getting banned for dishing it right back at them.
No you don't have to 'sit back and take it', you report it and let the Staff deal with it.
If you engage in the same kind of thing you should be reporting then yes you will get banned too.


I understand why you banned me, but I still don't get why the other member was allowed to follow me post to post and harangue me and when I finally had had enough of him and stand my ground and fight back, THEN the ban comes. Yes, both of us were banned but it took me fighting back for him to get banned.
Oddly enough, it wasn't until someone else reported BOTH of you that any of us saw the thread or the issue.
There NEVER was a reported post from you was there?
Then please don't try to blame something not being noticed by a handful of Mods on a forum with 115,000 members and 100's of posts per hour on the Staff when you chose to engage rather than report it.


And then he continued it against last night. What's the rule? Ignore the person if you don't like what they say right? Well again, he hunts me down just to comment that I am useless. Guess you missed that one.
Or I guess not since I banned him for two weeks this time.
Guess you missed that one.

Who would feel excluded? The Men? Certainly not new female gun owners because the men(most, not all) make it very clear that we are a second class citizen.
No offense but drop the 'professional victim' stuff, it makes it hard to take you seriously.
Your generalizations and snide little 'Like you care' comments on the two report post notices you did send really don't lend weight to your words.


No one wants to go in to California Handguns or the LTC thread to ask a question and then get attacked by the guys because they consider it a stupid question. A ladies only forum would give new female gun owners a place to ask questions and get information without being attacked, told they were stupid or "Look it up" or any of the other ways the men have to imply that we are simply not on their level.

I take it you've missed how frequently EVERYONE, regardless of gender, is told 'look it up' by some of those who have been here a long time.
It's an unfortunate aspect of forums, burnout does occur and people get tired of answering the same questions over and over.
Fortunately the guy that asked that question 6 months ago now knows the answer and isn't burned out so he answers the question and the torch is passed.

I do agree that there are several rather juvenile members who like to act like 'Mr. Macho' when they post, again it's the nature of a large community. The funny part is I'd bet a case of ammo that most of them when confronted by a strong woman in person curl up in the fetal position and don't know what to do.

The idea behind the Ladies Forum and the current discussion about expanding it is entirely about making Calguns and the shooting sports more accessible to women and to find out not what I think you all want but to hear what your input in your forum(s).

[CSACANNONEER]

OK, if the ladies feel that they should further segragate themselves, it's their loss. Well, it's everybody's loss. Some of the best shooters I know are females. The best shooter I've ever met is a female with 5 Olympic medals. Really, you gals shouldn't let a few imature guys with little ....... complexes run you off. Instead, be more mature and just laugh at them. In the end, we shooters need to stand as one entity and quit segragating ourselves.

[paul0660]

I think having a marketplace that doesn't have to deal with sexist comments would be nice.

Do you have an example? It is already against the marketplace rules, and it takes a simple report to a mod to rectify.

It would be nice to increase the number of women in shooting sports and firearm self defense, but CSA is right. Women can and do stand up for their side of an argument in other forums, idiots who pester them impress very few, and the contribution by female members in other forums would be reduced.

[MrsRazz]

Originally Posted by paul0660

Do you have an example? It is already against the marketplace rules, and it takes a simple report to a mod to rectify.

It's not out right attacks, it's the little snipes that are derogatory towards women:

Originally Posted by Ross

She's selling his man-card for $1.99 on a softball site.

Comes with bats and bases, but no balls.

I've had no problems in the other forums. And when I get to the misogynistic crap, I usually just feel sorry for the guy that is afraid to tell his wife he bought a Glock. But, honestly, I own two businesses and won't post either of them in the forums because I don't feel making myself a target for random snipes.

[DaveInOroValley]

I have to say that I am sorry to see this type of issue occur. Surprised that it does? NO, but just the same I wish it did not. Many good points have been made on both sides and I can understand as well both sides.

It does interestingly reflect what happens when a group doesn't have the largest representation in the community. Maybe we can all change that by just taking a moment to think about what's being said before hitting the reply button? I know in the past I have likely posted something that I wished I hadn't.

The board as a whole needs to be a cohesive group. While there will always be those that don't care or adhere to that hopefully they will be the minority and not the other way around. Just my .02

[em9sredbeam]

What Mary Kay thing...... No comment. I can say that it would probably be a nice thing for the women to have. Not to segregate, but to make it easier to find things that cater more toward them. I am sure some husbands wouldn't mind either if it makes it easier to find something for their wive's.

[CSACANNONEER]

Originally Posted by LdyApxr

It's not about segregation. But to some women, guns are intimidating enough without having to run the gauntlet of men with small complexes and insults. I know a lot of women shooters and some young women(through 4-H) that are great archers and shooters but if you are new to guns and new to gun ownership, do you really want to be somewhere that you get attacked or made to feel stupid so some guy can satisfy his ego?

Maybe you're seeing it differently than I do. When I make someone feel stupid (or when someone makes me feel stupid), it has nothing to do with gender, sexual orientation, race, color, religion, physical handicaps or even age. Then again, instead of coming here for instant answers to simple questions, I surfed this forum for over two years before I asked my first question.

BTW, if there's ever a shoe sub forum here, I'll never have a place to get away from my wife.

[Kestryll]

Perhaps I need to rephrase this.

Guys, I'm not asking if you think it's a good idea.

I'm asking the Ladies what THEY want.

[8bitnintendo]

Originally Posted by Kestryll

There are several ways to go about this:

1) Make sub forums to the existing Ladies Forum like so;

Specialty Forums
-Ladies Forum
--Sales forum
--Deals, feedback and recommendations forum

I vote for this option with no limited access. If someone comes in the forum and is condescending/rude with no value added, their post can be deleted and they can lose access, similar to the other forums. I think there is value to having a sales and a reviews/recommendation subforum where we can find things that will physically fit without having to try to wade through the 95% of stuff that won't.

I'd volunteer to help moderate the forum... but I may not be a frequent enough visitor to really stay on top of it. Plus I would be tempted to ban people just for being obnoxious, as opposed to breaking a specific rule.

[movie zombie]

Originally Posted by em9sredbeam

......... Not to segregate, but to make it easier to find things that cater more toward them. I am sure some husbands wouldn't mind either if it makes it easier to find something for their wive's.

^^^^this.

is it that the men of calguns don't think there should be a Ladies Forum in the first place? i think Mr K made a good decision when he decided to do so. men can post here.....if they follow the rules as set down by Mr K. it is my understanding that some of the men of calguns do not like being held to those rules.... reminder: all of calguns is Mr K's sandbox. his sandbox, his rules.

i like #1 and #3: i think things need to be under this Ladies Forum. the less one has to search, the better.

i'm rather sad that Mrs Razz won't list either of her businesses here but she has a valid point. and it gets old being the "complainer".

note to Mrs Razz: the quote you provided is exactly why Mr K started this forum. that particular guy probably thinks he's funny. most men don't get it why this offensive to women. and they will continue to wonder why women don't suport them and 2A rights. denigrate women and then expect them to support your issues?! stupid is as stupid does.....unfortunately, divide and conquor also comes to mind.......

[StormRaven]

I guess I'm lucky in that, so far, I haven't been on the receiving end of any chauvinistic hog slop on the forum yet. Maybe it's because unless I call it out, I'm assumed to be a guy. Been that way for decades on the internet (and before that, BBSes). I /have/ gotten irritated at the short bus candidates who happen to think that the horrible state of the world is all due to "them damn liberals"... but, I digress. I'll just continue to shoot better than them and leave it at that.

So I am on topic... the original idea has merit, IMHO. I don't feel strongly about it one way or another, but I don't see any harm in it. Might be nice to patronize some women-owned businesses or more easily be able to find clothing and accessories geared more toward the female physique.

I wouldn't be upset if it didn't happen, but I'll throw my support behind those that want it.

[movie zombie]

Originally Posted by StormRaven

............I wouldn't be upset if it didn't happen, but I'll throw my support behind those that want it.

though it was my idea, i won't be horribly disappointed if it doesn't happen. however, i do think it is an opportunity for calguns to have a broader [sorry, actually no pun intended!] appeal.

[Fundamentals]

Originally Posted by movie zombie

such an area already exists and it is very easy for a post to get lost if there aren't a lot responses. its still pretty heavy male interest oriented....although i just checked it and a calgunner does have paintings of guns for sale.

Good point. I did not realize that female exclusivetivity might be a good thing. Must be the tomboy in me.

Originally Posted by Kestryll

I might have an idea or two on that score.

I like both option 1 and option 3. Option one is just straight forward sales, but option 3 gives flexibility on cross-issues.

[paul0660]

I guess I'm lucky in that, so far, I haven't been on the receiving end of any chauvinistic hog slop on the forum yet.

It is actually rare.

I'm assumed to be a guy

If someone hasn't read something into your handle or avatar.

Having raised several sons and daughters to the point they have sons and daughters, I think females who cannot take jibing from inept dummies without bleeding from thin skin are wasting their time, other than getting a semblance of power from whining.

Simply putting "ladies" into any Marketplace offering should get things straightened out as far as that goes.

If there is to be a determination about this perhaps there should be a poll, so that the same half dozen people don't drive the decision.

[beb]

I think having a sales/deals section in the ladies area (maybe just a sticky) would be cool.

It can be a section where we discuss the 'girly' things. I can discuss guns on the main forum, discuss guns with ladies in the ladies forum, but if I could discuss girly things on a forum I frequent for gun stuff.... why not?

I dont think we need anything crazy. A whole section for sales and one for deals might be too much.

If we can discuss skin care (I totally missed the Mary Kay thing, so curious!), shoes, whatevers... I can skip on some of my facebook time to do that here! Plus if we ever get to meet, we may have some common interests to chat about.

How about a trial with just a sticky? See how it goes for like 3 months?

[movie zombie]

Originally Posted by Kestryll

Perhaps I need to rephrase this.

Guys, I'm not asking if you think it's a good idea.

I'm asking the Ladies what THEY want.

^^^^^worth repeating.....


i think whatever gets done will be a slow start and take some time to develop and/or get used to. i think it will be a slow start for "sales" items as well. note what Mrs Razz said above as to why she won't be posting for either of her two businesses.

beb said, "we may have some common interests to chat about." yes, that was my thought as well.

[Lyte-]

Originally Posted by 8bitnintendo

I vote for this option with no limited access. If someone comes in the forum and is condescending/rude with no value added, their post can be deleted and they can lose access, similar to the other forums. I think there is value to having a sales and a reviews/recommendation subforum where we can find things that will physically fit without having to try to wade through the 95% of stuff that won't.

I'd volunteer to help moderate the forum... but I may not be a frequent enough visitor to really stay on top of it. Plus I would be tempted to ban people just for being obnoxious, as opposed to breaking a specific rule.

I second this. option 1 that is.

[MrsRazz]

Originally Posted by paul0660

It is actually rare.

Direct attacks may be rare, but little gems like these are pretty common:

Their like mopeds and fat girls fun to ride until your friends see you on them.

[Merc1138]

Originally Posted by MrsRazz

Direct attacks may be rare, but little gems like these are pretty common:

So hit the report post button the mods can't read every post.

[vision1214]

Interesting thread. The one thing that some men don't understand - most women do not have thin skin - actually we are just fed up with ridiculous remarks by the few men that try to have fun at our expense which usually comes from their own short comings. Walk in our shoes and you might see why women are fed up. I have a number of wonderful males friends - they respect me and I respect them. It is earned....not given. My amazing father - RIP - always taught me, never let them see you sweat and always stand your ground whether it is a man or woman. I have always stood my ground. Thank you Dad - you were one of the good guys.

[movie zombie]

Originally Posted by vision1214

Interesting thread. The one thing that some men don't understand - most women do not have thin skin - actually we are just fed up with ridiculous remarks by the few men that try to have fun out our expense which usually comes from their own short comings. Walk in our shoes and you might see why women are fed up. I have a number of wonderful males friends - they respect me and I respect them. It is earned....not given. My amazing father - RIP - always taught me, never let them see you sweat and always stand your ground whether it is a man or woman. I have always stood my ground. Thank you Dad - you were one of the good guys.

^^^^QFT

[vintagearms]

If the ladies were to get a subforum for ladies only, how would you go about proving their actual sex: IE- require copies of their DL emailed to staff?

[Fundamentals]

Originally Posted by vintagearms

If the ladies were to get a subforum for ladies only, how would you go about proving their actual sex: IE- require copies of their DL emailed to staff?

Women generally make themselves known after a while, and we tend to have a different posting style than men.

[movie zombie]

and once again:

Originally Posted by Fundamentals

Women generally make themselves known after a while, and we tend to have a different posting style than men.

a very different posting style, indeed.

[BonnieB]

I read this whole thread and I THINK I follow it. If so, here are a few points.

1. Women are VOTERS and it's silly to do anything but make them comfortable and welcome on Calguns.net, even if that takes a little special handling.

2. Many women (I myself included) do not want to be 'one of the guys'. I can and will be an outstanding shooter without being 'hardcore'.

3. I don't join "pink ghettos". But I think identifying women's gear to be women's gear is worth it. Certain women's gear is really different from guy's gear. You can make your own examples. I go nuts when I see a T shirt, for instance, that is clearly aimed toward women, but only comes in men's sizes. (On the other hand, there is a kind of lip gloss that comes in shotgun shell packaging.... )

4. I hope all women will not tolerate belittlement or hating or transparent attempts to make us go away. I know the real men, the grown-ups, will stand behind us on this.

5. It's really important that the women here defend other women, new members in particular, from snarking. The best way to do this is to post, saying "Pay no attention to that fool, because s/he's a (fill in the blank)." I know of no better way to get rid of idiots than to make them ridiculous in public.

6. And lastly, if some of the men here would like to have a 'guys only area', I'd be thrilled. And I'll have the good common sense to not look over THAT fence.

The bulk of the men I have met here have been very welcoming and cordial. They're glad to see the membership expanding and like to hear a slightly different viewpoint. Thanks guys! Well done !

I'm happy to be a member, I've met a bunch of great people and I'll be at the Calguns.net table at the Sacramento Gun show in November. And my goal there is to recruit wives, girlfriends, daughters and yes, even a few good men.

[movie zombie]

well written, BonnieB ....and for the record, i really do not like pink

[bob7122]

Originally Posted by LdyApxr

How about password protecting the ladies forum so the men can't come in and do their "Me Tarzan, You Jane" bit....

Originally Posted by MrsRazz

You'd be punishing the guys that come in and behave themselves.

That's like banning guns because criminals use them.

BOOM! 1 one major reason not to.