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Concealed Carry Discussion General discussion regarding CCW/LTC in California

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  #41  
Old 10-12-2017, 10:55 PM
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Everyone around here LOVES paragraph breaks....

Quote:
Originally Posted by rob94133 View Post
Hi, I just joined this site. I have been trying to learn how to have self protection for my home and possibly myself while out in public. I've read that getting a carry permit is almost impossible. But I've also read that SF will honor carry permits if from another county in California.

I am a resident in San Francisco and would like to get protection for my home, handgun, shotgun etc. Not sure whats allowed. I would like to also carry for protection also. I am a law abiding citizen. I'm a medical professional in the hospital here in the city and provide services for other hospitals in the east bay and such.

I have become more concerned about my safety here as I had a roommate I had to have leave because he started on drugs and alcohol then lost his job and stopped paying rent. It took me 4 months before I was able to get him out. During those 4 months he had less than desirable people over the house all the time. Then I found out through talking with them that they all served a good deal of time behind bars at maximum security prison, San Quentin. He would not leave on his own and when I got him out it was not pretty.

At any rate they vowed they would end my life since I got him out which meant him and his friends had no where to squat and do drugs. It was a nightmare here for a long time. I almost moved out. But I was able to save my place. I went and filed a report that my life was threatned but told theres not much they could do with verbal theats. That leaves me waiting for something to happen before the police can do something.

Today I seen one of them standing on the corner of my street, felt like he was seeing if I still lived here. It was almost a year since I got them out. So now I've called my local department and told them of this supsicious person. They drove around the area and did not find him. They called me back and told me they would continue to drive around ithrough the night.

I feel like a sitting duck. Sleep with a knife and a wooden dowel. Hard to sleep. I have to be up in a couple hours for work and cant sleep. I don't know if I'm allowed to own a firearm of any kind like a handgun or shotgun or any gun.

Plus I feel I am going to walk outside and they will be waiting around a corner or something.

Cant believe I moved to this beatuful city and ran into this. I'm not sure what to do at this point. Living under these circumstances leaves me feeling helpless and waiting to get hurt or killed. Theres about 5 of them, all on drugs and I think all but 1 has done between 5-10 years and dont really care about going back.

I look forward to hearing back from anyone so I can feel like I have a chance. I live in North Beach and if anyone knows how to post this message in the LE forum so they could read it maybe they can help also, or let me know how to post this there. I hope this is the right forum for this. Its my first post. I also want to add that I was born here, 40 something guy that moved here from the east coast about 5 years ago for this job.

Thanks for listening.
Sounds like you majorly ----ed up on the 4-S Rule!

(1) Get an alarm for your home. If you rent, there's plenty of good ones that don't require modifying the structure. For example, www.LaserShield.net

(2) A home shotgun is for retreating into the master bedroom and staying there until the boys in blue show up. (While watching for accomplices entering/shooting through the master bedroom windows.) If you live alone, anyone coming through your bedroom door gets a dose. Just make sure they're not cops.

(3) CA bans magazines that hold more than 10 rounds. Next, if you buy new, any handgun must be on CA's handgun roster of approved handguns. (The list is getting shorter every year.) We are challenging the roster in court (Pena case), but who knows if and when we'll win it.

(4) Pepper spray is a good thing to always have on you. CA law limits you to canisters that are 2.5 oz or less, but it does not limit the number of canisters you carry at one time. But pepper spray is known to fail, so don't be surprised if it does.

(5) In CA most knife regulations are local ordinances. Search around the SF city gov't pages for info re them.

More thoughts, incl the 4-S Rule, at:
http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s...d.php?t=424425

Welcome to CalGuns and welcome to the fight for your Right to Keep and Bear Arms!
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Last edited by Paladin; 10-12-2017 at 11:05 PM..
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  #42  
Old 11-03-2017, 10:31 PM
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Rob, moved your post here - http://www.calguns.net/calgunforum/s....php?t=1395330

'Which gun?' is better addressed outside the CCW forum.
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  #43  
Old 11-04-2017, 12:33 PM
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I'm in disbelief right now. I thought it would he a good idea to have these weighted/powder leaded gloves. I bike all over the city and thought I'd maybe wear them riding or at least have them on me since I can't carry a firearm in San Francisco as s form of self defense but those are illegal in California also. I can't believe how things are here. If I got stuck running into a couple of these idiots I thought at least if have those to help. I have a little boxing background and going up against multiple attackers it would be beneficial. Wtf
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  #44  
Old 11-04-2017, 12:56 PM
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Sorry to hear that. It seems that the California lawmakers favor the criminal elements and try so hard to leave the law abiding citizens helpless. Moving to a "green" county may be your only recourse. Good luck.
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  #45  
Old 11-04-2017, 2:13 PM
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Originally Posted by rob94133 View Post
I'm in disbelief right now. I thought it would he a good idea to have these weighted/powder leaded gloves. I bike all over the city and thought I'd maybe wear them riding or at least have them on me since I can't carry a firearm in San Francisco as s form of self defense but those are illegal in California also. I can't believe how things are here. If I got stuck running into a couple of these idiots I thought at least if have those to help. I have a little boxing background and going up against multiple attackers it would be beneficial. Wtf
Unless you are Bruce Lee or Chuck Norris, hand-to-hand self-defense solutions are a last resort. Multiple attackers in a street fight and you're gonna box your way out?

Defense in depth.

You need to establish and maintain distance.

Run. As soon as you can, run. Scream, "FIRE". No one responds to "Help", or even, "Rape", but everybody responds to "FIRE".

Pepper spray/foam. The foam is preferable, as it won't blow back in your face as easily as the spray. (Buy extra units so you can practice at home, and mark the practice canister to ensure you don't carry it.)

After spray deployment, if the attacker moves within contact range, quick deployment and use of a knife. (Check restrictions to make sure you're not carrying a bladed felony.)
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  #46  
Old 11-15-2017, 6:27 PM
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Originally Posted by rob94133 View Post
Anyone have any opinions on the above post with the top 5 guns they recommend for home protection? Also, anyone recommend any gun store close to San Francisco they recommend purchasing?Thx

you aren't an enthusiast, so " get one of all of the above" probably isn't your cup of tea.


1. You can't go wrong with a 12 gauge pump shotgun (unless you are a weenie, or expect your small stature wife to handle it) Mossy 500 or 590 is a good gun I own a 590 - I'd trust it to do the job. the REMINGTON 870 is also a good choice. if you are on a tight budget a Maverick 88 will serve you well.
for Home defense you'll want an 18 or 20" barrel. IMHO, I suggest #4 buckshot for Home use, there are a few schools of thought on that. but #4 is usually recognized as a good choice. there are some who say 00 buckshot rules them all, but in tight housing/sharing walls... those bigger pellets may be a liability

2 if the compact simplicity of a handgun is more your thing.
the Glock 17 or 19 is a definitely a solid bet. 9mm is an easy round to learn to shoot well with, and will do the job. any major brand 9mm auto pistol will do you fine. stay away from sub compact and pocket pistols (tough to shoot well, recoil more) unless you do get a CCW.
a good .357 magnum revolver is a good bet as well - the ruger or Smith are tops choices. if you do go with the revolver, buy a .357 magnum - this way you can shoot .38 special, and .38 special +P out of it but still have the choice of learning to shoot full house Magnum rounds if/when you are ready.

3. carbine rifles - IMHO, and my personal choice. a rifle in an "intermediate" caliber is the go to show stopper... with some caveats.
a military pattern Carbine trumps all for its Practicality, accuracy, ergonomics and effect on target. you can deal with close range threats and longer ranged threats without swapping ammo, soft body armor will not stop it, it will penetrate any large sized man deep enough to put the stop down on him no matter what he is wearing (save specialized rifle armor plates) BUT in Cali you have to deal with too many things to make the military pattern rifle legal, many of which cut down on the ergonomics and practicality. there are a few cali legal semiauto rifles out there that will allow you to swap magazines, and rapidly get back on target... but the AR15 in its "traditional" form is not one of them.
some issues with the rifle: 1. YOU WILL destroy your hearing if you ever use one indoors without hearing protection. 2. depending on what type of ammunition you choose, the caliber of your rifle and your housing situation you may need to be VERY concerned with over penetration of your walls.

there are some who say - "a pistol is only good for fighting your way to the rifle or shotgun you should have brought in the first place"

that's not to say a handgun is useless... any gun is better than no gun when things go south.
but long guns are more powerful, more accurate, and easier to learn to shoot well.

also - I notice you intend to take some classes and learn about safe shooting.
that is great, but it'll take more than a class or three for you and your new weapon to "become one" Buy plenty of ammo of the type you intend to use for home defense - get to a range and practice... alot. practice until you know every nuance of your new gun. then shoot it some more.

just having it isn't enough - you need to know how to use it, I mean REALY use it. to do that - practice.
you are a medical professional - you know what I mean.
you do something over and over till it becomes automatic. the ol' muscle memory. as it is with the tools of your trade, so it is with a gun.

as for where to buy in the bay area? I've been out of Cali since 04' so I don't know where to to go to get treated right, can't help you there.

Last edited by Mr. Snuffalupagus; 11-16-2017 at 11:57 AM.. Reason: Winchester 870?! I'm an idiot... lol
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  #47  
Old 11-15-2017, 8:10 PM
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^^^pretty good laydown^^^

For new shooters, a smaller gauge shotgun, 20 or even 410 might be a better choice for home defense. Lighter, quicker to handle, less recoil, but 3" chamber provides substantial lethality at short range.
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  #48  
Old 11-15-2017, 8:15 PM
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Move to Vallejo Rob, Solano county issues.
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  #49  
Old 11-15-2017, 10:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Snuffalupagus View Post
Buy plenty of ammo of the type you intend to use for home defense - get to a range and practice... alot. practice until you know every nuance of your new gun. then shoot it some more.
I like to have a 10:1 mix of ammo for my defensive handgun/EDC. That is, I buy and fire about 10 rounds of FMJ at the range during practice for every 1 round of JHP that I carry. I do practice with JHP, just not nearly as much as FMJ due to the cost. That stuff gets pricey! However, I would recommend practicing with the same grain weight in both (e.g. 124gr FMJ and 124gr JHP).

I know everyone knows this, it is for the benefit of new shooters
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  #50  
Old 11-15-2017, 11:11 PM
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Originally Posted by ScottyXbones View Post

Any round capable of stopping a bad guy is going to be able to penetrate walls.
Where do you people come up with this nonsense? A good hollow point round is not likely to penetrate walls and hit someone behind your target. They are designed to enter the target and expand on impact to cause as much damage as possible, remaining inside the person.

1. Take a firearms safety course to learn proper handling, basic gun laws, etc.

2. Find a range that rents guns. Shoot a variety of guns to see what you like.

3. A good 9mm with a quality home defense round will suit your needs.

4. A Glock 19 would be an excellent starting point. Quality with a proven history.

5. Make sure you can secure your gun from theft while you’re away from home. A small safe that can be bolted to a stud

I’ve seen hundreds of gunshot wounds over a 32 year law enforcement career. Rarely did the rounds exit the body. Over penetration is over exaggerated, especially on CalGuns.
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  #51  
Old 11-16-2017, 12:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Snuffalupagus View Post
you aren't an enthusiast, so " get one of all of the above" probably isn't your cup of tea.


1. You can't go wrong with a 12 gauge pump shotgun (unless you are a weenie, or expect your small stature wife to handle it) Mossy 500 or 590 is a good gun I own a 590 - I'd trust it to do the job. the winchester 870 is also a good choice. if you are on a tight budget a Maverick 88 will serve you well.
for Home defense you'll want an 18 or 20" barrel. IMHO, I suggest #4 buckshot for Home use, there are a few schools of thought on that. but #4 is usually recognized as a good choice. there are some who say 00 buckshot rules them all, but in tight housing/sharing walls... those bigger pellets may be a liability
There is no such thing as a "winchester 870". Remington makes the 870. I have the 870 and of course prefer what I have, but there is nothing wrong with the Mossberg ("Mossy") or the Maverick 88 that can't be fixed with a few bucks. The plastic tang safety needs to be replaced with a metal one.

A 12 gauge may be overkill and the OP may find it easier to control a 20 gauge. I also prefer a pump for defense, but the modern semi automatic shotguns are very reliable if you stay away from the bargain basement.

Also, if you are limited to one gun I would go with a handgun, but the combination of a handgun and a shotgun is hard to beat. I would stay away from a rifle.

Other than that your advice seems fine.

One thing that I am surprised everyone has failed to mention. Get a DOG. I have a family member in SF who is a physicians assistant and wants nothing to do with guns, but she at least has a massive pit bull. Of course, that can be a problem if you aren't allowed to have a dog. It is really a good idea, since your place is less likely to be broken into while you are out, if you have a dog, and you sure don't want your gun stolen.

Last edited by Chewy65; 11-16-2017 at 12:35 AM..
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  #52  
Old 11-16-2017, 12:40 AM
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Ron Solo,

You are talking about rounds overpenetrating a person. That isn't an issue if the rounds miss the bad guy is it? I thought the greatest problem was when they pass through a wall and strike an innocent.
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Old 11-16-2017, 12:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 38Special View Post
I hope you aren't suggesting he lie about his residence to attempt to get a CCW.
If that is the way my comment sounded, it was not meant that way. Obviously if a person used an address he did not live it would be fraud. The laws are clear in SF, I wouldn't incourage anyone to commit fraud.
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  #54  
Old 11-16-2017, 8:28 AM
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Originally Posted by SoCal P320 View Post
You can have two residences for counties. Looks like it's time to get a place in Napa or Solano. You can probably buy a place for very cheap given that most of the homes there are burned down. Terrible thing to say though. I have a friend who lost everything Napa.

the only problem with this map is the wording,
"almost no issue"
should read,
issue to only those with money given to politicos in charge.

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  #55  
Old 11-16-2017, 9:03 AM
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Originally Posted by SoCal P320 View Post
You can have two residences for counties. Looks like it's time to get a place in Napa or Solano. You can probably buy a place for very cheap given that most of the homes there are burned down. Terrible thing to say though. I have a friend who lost everything Napa.
But only one "domicile".

The Raulinaitis case is due to be heard by the 9th Circuit in December and challenges this issue.

Cliff's Notes:
Quote:
1. Does the Sheriff’s interpretation of the term “resident,” as a person who spends most of his time and conducts most of his activities in Ventura County, comply with California Penal Code section 26150, subdivision (a)(3), with respect to the county residency requirement for a person applying to a county sheriff for a license to carry a concealed weapon (“CCW”).
2. Does the record give rise to a genuine dispute of material fact that Raulinaitis was a resident of Ventura County under California Penal Code section 26150, subdivision (a)(3)?
3. Does the Sheriff’s application of the county residency requirement in California Penal Code section 26150, subdivision (a)(3), violate Raulinaitis’s Second Amendment rights?
Quick overview: http://blog.californiarighttocarry.org/?page_id=1568

Opening Brief: http://blog.californiarighttocarry.o...ning-Brief.pdf

Answering Brief: http://blog.californiarighttocarry.o...ring-Brief.pdf

Last edited by Dvrjon; 11-16-2017 at 9:08 AM..
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  #56  
Old 11-16-2017, 9:35 AM
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You can protect yourself at home legally, but if you feel the threat justifies it, move to a more ccw friendly area and apply.
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Old 11-16-2017, 11:54 AM
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[QUOTE=Ron-Solo;20911471]Where do you people come up with this nonsense? A good hollow point round is not likely to penetrate walls and hit someone behind your target. They are designed to enter the target and expand on impact to cause as much damage as possible, remaining inside the person.


Nonsense? sounds to me, that you assume every bullet hits a human target during a Home defense situation..

What about the rounds that DON'T hit a squishy gelatinous hollowpoint expanding human target?

not every bullet fired is going to hit the target - it is assumed that you might actually miss. this possibility of a miss is increased the less skilled/experienced the shooter is. we are talking about a new shooter buying his first gun here... do you really think that at 0 dark thirty when some boogeyman crashes his front door, and rushes the bedroom - every single round he fires will hit said boogeyman? I doubt it. I'm not even confident that I would make every round hit home in a stress situation like that - and I've been shooting since 95' - I'm no slouch. I expect a few misses - which is why I think Magazine capacity restrictions are so insidious...

Check out the "Box o' Truth" good data there on what several popular defensive calibers do when they encounter interior construction. you might find a few surprises there.
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Old 11-16-2017, 11:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chewy65 View Post
There is no such thing as a "winchester 870". Remington makes the 870. I have the 870 and of course prefer what I have, but there is nothing wrong with the Mossberg ("Mossy") or the Maverick 88 that can't be fixed with a few bucks. The plastic tang safety needs to be replaced with a metal one.

A 12 gauge may be overkill and the OP may find it easier to control a 20 gauge. I also prefer a pump for defense, but the modern semi automatic shotguns are very reliable if you stay away from the bargain basement.

Also, if you are limited to one gun I would go with a handgun, but the combination of a handgun and a shotgun is hard to beat. I would stay away from a rifle.

Other than that your advice seems fine.

One thing that I am surprised everyone has failed to mention. Get a DOG. I have a family member in SF who is a physicians assistant and wants nothing to do with guns, but she at least has a massive pit bull. Of course, that can be a problem if you aren't allowed to have a dog. It is really a good idea, since your place is less likely to be broken into while you are out, if you have a dog, and you sure don't want your gun stolen.

Oops... why did I say winchester?! that was dumb, you are of course, correct
edited to fix.

Last edited by Mr. Snuffalupagus; 11-16-2017 at 12:09 PM..
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  #59  
Old 11-29-2017, 7:29 PM
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If you want to get a CCW, and live in SF, your best bet is to move to Solano county. Maybe Suisun or Fairfield and commute to SF. Then once you have moved, you can apply in Solano county which is a pretty good place to get a CCW. With the money you save on rent, you can buy 924 guns and 500 hours of training.

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