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  #241  
Old 05-11-2017, 4:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kemasa View Post
Then you need to be more clear or start a different thread since this thread is about a specific person/issue.

It is impossible to talk about something if you keep changing what you meant. There is no issue with a person somehow getting an off-roster firearm and then later selling it. If they do it often, then things change because it then is a business.
I don't know...I thought the question was pretty clear (see below), and applies to the issue perfectly well, as the issue is selling off roster pistols via PPT and that a portion of the issue is the outrage at the people who do it.

Especially considering that I, Spyder, have NOT changed what I meant, OR what I said, a single time in this thread. I asked a very simple question and was answered with a bunch of nonsensical and non applicable assumptions.

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Originally Posted by Spyder View Post
I'm curious. If some guy who was able to purchase off roster handguns, and then turn around and sell them PPT to people who could not, and did it for no profit but only covered his expenses with the sales price, would you folks still think he was a bad person?
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  #242  
Old 05-11-2017, 5:50 PM
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Default Pasadena police spokesman busted for off-roster sales

This thread delivers. Me being new to 2A, i didn't know the history of the relationship that the LE orgs had with the start and enforcement of the PRK roster. I understand the laws, and the politics of how we got here, better due to the context brought in here. I also personally know a couple of LEOs that don't agree with the roster or the anti-2A environment we live in. But I never asked them to sell me an off roster item, and I'm glad I didn't.


As an individual, I'm glad to have acquired an offroster item, just because damnit I should be able to.
Overall, it's a damn shame that the roster exists. This LE officer, being in a public highly visible role, will hopefully (I can hope) be a test case to point out the stupidity and unconstitutionality of the roster.

Last edited by 357manny; 05-11-2017 at 5:53 PM..
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  #243  
Old 05-11-2017, 6:02 PM
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357, welcome aboard! Buncha good folks here, even if we get ridiculous about bickering. Me included.
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  #244  
Old 05-11-2017, 6:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Spyder View Post
No. I specifically used "some guy", to indicate "some guy". Not a LEO. But that was pointed out later in the thread.
Yes, somebody else pointed that out to me later about your post. I apologized for missing the point you were attempting to make; the subject was about a specific person and in this case a LEO. "Some guy" is a very large "set" and includes LEO's, licensed FFL's--- probably just about anyone other than prohibited persons. A lack of specifics in your comment was misinterpreted by me. Maybe I should have just asked you to define "some guy" before I responded, but I believed I was responding to a question about the subject matter. It sounded to me like you were giving this LEO a pass, sorry you were offended.

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Originally Posted by Spyder View Post
Besides your ASSumption, what law is broken by someone who can lawfully obtain off roster firearms and then at some point in the future PPT them to those who can not? It's clearly not to a prohibited person, as PPT was the method of transfer in my original statement.
Nothing wrong with your question, however the personal rancor is not necessary (the part in assumption that you felt you needed to capitalize). Besides, I believe a few FFLs here have already answered this question better than I can.

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Originally Posted by Spyder View Post
We know that the main points of this thread are applying to a LEO. But that is not the question I asked nor does a LEO have anything to do with it. A whole lot of folks are unreasonably pissed off about the situation, for various reasons. Some think he's a criminal and should be jailed, and some think that the law is ridiculous and should be repealed. All I want to ask of the people who think he is a bad person, would think the same if he wasn't a cop, and/or if he did it with zero intentions of, or realization of, profit.
Why would it be "unreasonable" (talking about the LEO to be clear) to 1) follow the laws, 2) follow the spirit of a law, 3) act in a manner in his off duty life that we should expect as a sworn officer of the law?

Since he is a LEO, I wouldn't find any of these concerns to be unreasonable.

In terms of a non-LEO, a different standard may apply. For me personally it would come down to either an honest mistake, or a willful intention to violate the law AND profit from that. We all here agree the law is CRAP, but we all have to follow that law or we are doing so at our own risk... they call those people "outlaws". And again, I may personally not have a issue with even that, but we all understand that if that is the choice, then nobody should complain when they get caught and are faced to pay the consequences of that.

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Originally Posted by Spyder View Post

Do you think that grocery stores, liquor stores, Brownell's, Cabelas, or any other large retailer is a "bad guy", as they are driven by profit and can get deals that you can not? Anyone who works with a distributor is a bad guy?
But if they aren't paying licensing fees, taxes or following other statues in pursuit of that profit what is the word we use for that?

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Originally Posted by Spyder View Post
And besides that, who said anything about committing crimes to help others? I VERY CLEARLY mentioned that my hypothetical person could legally obtain them, and sell them legally via PPT. What is illegal about that? How is that committing a theft?
Sometimes laws aren't always so clear. Sometimes it takes case law to vette out a statue and send to an appeals court. I think a lot of FFLs I have known already understand the grey areas, some may push at limits, but most I know just opt to avoid all of that. These guys are trying to run a business, pay their bills, support a family. They could end up right, but at what potential cost. Government has the ability to wear someone down in court. If the law is bad or potentially ambiguous, it needs to be fixed. To me the roster thing is a sham anyway, but how do you fix it without going to the Supreme Court-- or changing the political power in Sacramento--- which we all know will never happen.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Spyder View Post
Anyway, if someone is legally able to receive off roster handguns and legally register them to themselves, and then at some future date lawfully sells them to private non-exempt individuals via PPT, then WHAT laws are being broken and who thinks that the person is doing wrong, a "bad person", or deserving of either criminal or civil charges?
If they are purchasing/acquiring them with the intent to flip them for a profit and then transfer them then they are taking the risk. I have no judgement on them (other than a LEO) as to being "bad". I just question their sense of good judgement.

Personally I don't see too many people looking to make a profit trying to set themselves up as a martyr for a cause. That usually isn't what gets them going in the first place.
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  #245  
Old 05-12-2017, 4:37 PM
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Wondering if changes to PC 32000 via AB 2165 (Bonta)... have relevance to this officers situation. And how the changes effect off-roster PPTs, sold by LEOs...

32000.
(a) A person in this state who manufactures or causes to be manufactured, imports into the state for sale, keeps for sale, offers or exposes for sale, gives, or lends an unsafe handgun shall be punished by imprisonment in a county jail not exceeding one year.

(b) This section shall not apply to any of the following:

(1) The manufacture in this state, or importation into this state, of a prototype handgun when the manufacture or importation is for the sole purpose of allowing an independent laboratory certified by the Department of Justice pursuant to Section 32010 to conduct an independent test to determine whether that handgun is prohibited by Sections 31900 to 32110, inclusive, and, if not, allowing the department to add the firearm to the roster of handguns that may be sold in this state pursuant to Section 32015.

(2) The importation or lending of a handgun by employees or authorized agents of entities determining whether the weapon is prohibited by this section.

(3) Firearms listed as curios or relics, as defined in Section 478.11 of Title 27 of the Code of Federal Regulations.

(4) The sale or purchase of a handgun, if the handgun is sold to, or purchased by, the Department of Justice, a police department, a sheriff’s official, a marshal’s office, the Department of Corrections and Rehabilitation, the Department of the California Highway Patrol, any district attorney’s office, any federal law enforcement agency, or the military or naval forces of this state or of the United States for use in the discharge of their official duties. This section does not prohibit the sale to, or purchase by, sworn members of these agencies of a handgun.

(5) The sale, purchase, or delivery of a handgun, if the sale, purchase, or delivery of the handgun is made pursuant to subdivision (d) of Section 10334 of the Public Contract Code.

(6) Subject to the limitations set forth in subdivision (c), the sale or purchase of a handgun, if the handgun is sold to, or purchased by, any of the following entities or sworn members of these entities who have satisfactorily completed the firearms portion of a training course prescribed by the Commission on Peace Officer Standards and Training pursuant to Section 832:

(A) The Department of Parks and Recreation.

(B) The Department of Alcoholic Beverage Control.

(C) The Division of Investigation of the Department of Consumer Affairs.

(D) The Department of Motor Vehicles.

(E) The Fraud Division of the Department of Insurance.

(F) The State Department of State Hospitals.

(G) The Department of Fish and Wildlife.

(H) The State Department of Developmental Services.

(I) The Department of Forestry and Fire Protection.

(J) A county probation department.

(K) The Los Angeles World Airports, as defined in Section 830.15.

(L) A K–12 public school district for use by a school police officer, as described in Section 830.32.

(M) A municipal water district for use by a park ranger, as described in Section 830.34.

(N) A county for use by a welfare fraud investigator or inspector, as described in Section 830.35.

(O) A county for use by the coroner or the deputy coroner, as described in Section 830.35.

(P) The Supreme Court and the courts of appeal for use by marshals of the Supreme Court and bailiffs of the courts of appeal, and coordinators of security for the judicial branch, as described in Section 830.36.

(Q) A fire department or fire protection agency of a county, city, city and county, district, or the state for use by either of the following:

(i) A member of an arson-investigating unit, regularly paid and employed in that capacity pursuant to Section 830.37.

(ii) A member other than a member of an arson-investigating unit, regularly paid and employed in that capacity pursuant to Section 830.37.

(R) The University of California Police Department, or the California State University Police Departments, as described in Section 830.2.

(S) A California Community College police department, as described in Section 830.32.

(c) (1) Notwithstanding Section 26825, a person licensed pursuant to Sections 26700 to 26915, inclusive, shall not process the sale or transfer of an unsafe handgun between a person who has obtained an unsafe handgun pursuant to an exemption specified in paragraph (6) of subdivision (b) and a person who is not exempt from the requirements of this section.
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  #246  
Old 06-02-2017, 2:11 AM
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Looks like CG gets a mention in the news:

http://www.dailynews.com/government-...ast-four-years
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  #247  
Old 06-02-2017, 6:57 AM
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Nice to see a corrupt "more equal" caught in the web he helped create. Perhaps they'll be inclined to restore 2a rights to all citizens, not just those that conspire with the Government to remove ours, in return for the preservation of theirs.
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I am in a sympathy-free zone as well. A leftist brown shirt reaping what he sowed after profiting from it is sweet justice indeed.
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  #248  
Old 06-02-2017, 7:31 AM
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Originally Posted by gogohopper View Post
Nice to see a corrupt "more equal" caught in the web he helped create. Perhaps they'll be inclined to restore 2a rights to all citizens, not just those that conspire with the Government to remove ours, in return for the preservation of theirs.
Snowballs chance in hell in CA. I expect the exact opposite. More restrictions for thenCA citizens while the protected class get more freedoms.
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  #249  
Old 06-02-2017, 7:46 AM
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Originally Posted by gogohopper View Post
Nice to see a corrupt "more equal" caught in the web he helped create. Perhaps they'll be inclined to restore 2a rights to all citizens, not just those that conspire with the Government to remove ours, in return for the preservation of theirs.
There's nothing nice about someone who has not even been charged losing his gun collection.

Forget about the Second Amendment, what the hell happened to the Fifth and Fourteenth Amendments?
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Originally Posted by cockedandglocked View Post
Getting called a DOJ shill has become a rite of passage around here. I've certainly been called that more than once - I've even seen Kes get called that. I haven't seen Red-O get called that yet, which is very suspicious to me, and means he's probably a DOJ shill.
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  #250  
Old 06-02-2017, 8:01 AM
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Originally Posted by gogohopper View Post
@ 200+k a year, ya gotta do something to supplement your income:

http://transparentcalifornia.com/sal...n%20Gourdikian
His regular gross is about $136K. The rest is overtime, benefits (including health and retirement) and "other" (whatever that is).
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  #251  
Old 06-02-2017, 8:22 AM
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His regular gross is about $136K. The rest is overtime, benefits (including health and retirement) and "other" (whatever that is).
Those of us who pay for our own "benefits" and retirement see no distinction there.
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Originally Posted by cockedandglocked View Post
Getting called a DOJ shill has become a rite of passage around here. I've certainly been called that more than once - I've even seen Kes get called that. I haven't seen Red-O get called that yet, which is very suspicious to me, and means he's probably a DOJ shill.
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  #252  
Old 06-02-2017, 10:48 AM
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My Facebook news feeds were blowing up this morning with local papers reporting that he mainly sold off of Calguns. They had his user name and everything. Looks like we have some reporters in our midst.
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  #253  
Old 06-02-2017, 11:18 AM
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My Facebook news feeds were blowing up this morning with local papers reporting that he mainly sold off of Calguns. They had his user name and everything. Looks like we have some reporters in our midst.
That would explain the increased level of stupidity lately.
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  #254  
Old 06-02-2017, 11:42 AM
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Here are the stories
http://www.pasadenastarnews.com/gove...ce=most_viewed
https://www.pasadenaweekly.com/2017/...eapons-online/
http://www.pasadenanow.com/main/vete...pular-website/
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  #255  
Old 06-02-2017, 12:11 PM
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Originally Posted by gogohopper View Post
Nice to see a corrupt "more equal" caught in the web he helped create. Perhaps they'll be inclined to restore 2a rights to all citizens, not just those that conspire with the Government to remove ours, in return for the preservation of theirs.
This.

I am in a sympathy-free zone as well. A leftist brown shirt reaping what he sowed after profiting from it is sweet justice indeed.
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  #256  
Old 06-02-2017, 1:04 PM
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i guess he was a seller user only. cause i never saw that user name anywhere near the general discussion or off-topic.
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Because -ohmigosh- they can add their opinions, too?
Proof we can all comment on whatever we want if it's at all related to the topic at hand!
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  #257  
Old 06-02-2017, 2:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roger1022 View Post
Looks like CG gets a mention in the news:

http://www.dailynews.com/government-...ast-four-years
So many things wrong in the article it is not funny. The problem is someone who reads it and does not know better will think that it is true.
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  #258  
Old 06-02-2017, 2:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Webologist View Post
This.

I am in a sympathy-free zone as well. A leftist brown shirt reaping what he sowed after profiting from it is sweet justice indeed.
^^^^^^^ sig worthy ^^^^^^^
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I am in a sympathy-free zone as well. A leftist brown shirt reaping what he sowed after profiting from it is sweet justice indeed.
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  #259  
Old 06-02-2017, 2:14 PM
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Originally Posted by kemasa View Post
So many things wrong in the article it is not funny. The problem is someone who reads it and does not know better will think that it is true.
What's wrong with the article? He even interviewed Chuck Michel, which is a lot more than most journalists would do.
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Originally Posted by cockedandglocked View Post
Getting called a DOJ shill has become a rite of passage around here. I've certainly been called that more than once - I've even seen Kes get called that. I haven't seen Red-O get called that yet, which is very suspicious to me, and means he's probably a DOJ shill.
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  #260  
Old 06-02-2017, 2:47 PM
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What's wrong with the article? He even interviewed Chuck Michel, which is a lot more than most journalists would do.
You did not notice all the false statements?

Can you point to the law which bars officers from making a profit on certain firearm sales?

Can you point to the law which makes it illegal for an officer to buy and then resell an off-roster pistol solely to make a profit?

Can you point to the law which makes it illegal to buy a firearm with the intention of selling it to someone else when you buy it? The issue is if you have a buyer lined up prior to purchase, but if you see a deal, there is nothing illegal about buying it with the intention to sell it. This makes the Chuck Michel quote incorrect.

Can you point to the Federal law which requires the seller to go through a FFL to avoid breaking the law? Residents of different states are required to go through a FFL. CA law requires CA sellers/buyers to go through a FFL.


So much false information, yet people don't see it.
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  #261  
Old 06-02-2017, 3:00 PM
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Hey liberal news reporting this forum, go F yourself.


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  #262  
Old 06-02-2017, 3:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kemasa View Post
You did not notice all the false statements?

Can you point to the law which bars officers from making a profit on certain firearm sales?

Can you point to the law which makes it illegal for an officer to buy and then resell an off-roster pistol solely to make a profit?

Can you point to the law which makes it illegal to buy a firearm with the intention of selling it to someone else when you buy it?
18 U.S. Code § 922

This is the code section under which Ryan McGowan was convicted and it is probably the code section that will be used to charge Gourdikian. According to the Federal complaint, all of the above constitute dealing in firearms without a license. You may disagree, but your opinion, it might pain you to learn, carries a lot less weight than that of a Federal compliant in the eyes of a journalist or just about anyone else on the planet.

The differences between what you list above and what are truly illegal are subtle ones, and it is revealed everyday here on Calguns that not even seasoned gun owners can properly understand them. Yet you expect dissection of complex legal minutiae in a newspaper article penned by a layman.

You need to reset your expectations.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kemasa View Post
Can you point to the Federal law which requires the seller to go through a FFL to avoid breaking the law?
Can you point to the part of the article where the author stated Federal law requires the seller to go through a FFL to avoid breaking the law?

I think it's a pretty damned good article. The journalist, unlike 95% of his colleagues, actually did a little research and found the Calguns angle. That's newsworthy. He also provided a few details on the parallel case in Sacramento.

And also unlike 95% of his colleagues, he called an NRA attorney to get some facts, instead of automatically speed dialing the VPC, which I suppose is what you would have preferred.
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Originally Posted by cockedandglocked View Post
Getting called a DOJ shill has become a rite of passage around here. I've certainly been called that more than once - I've even seen Kes get called that. I haven't seen Red-O get called that yet, which is very suspicious to me, and means he's probably a DOJ shill.
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  #263  
Old 06-02-2017, 3:38 PM
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On a pajama boy curve, it's decent.

Don't get it twisted though, plenty of "reporters" call NRA, if they get a non-generic response is another thing. They're constantly trolling for sound bites and other "gotchas."

The sad part is, he probably spent hours putting that together and in the end, comes up a little short. That's not necessarily his fault, more like the nature of our nonsensical web of firearms law.
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  #264  
Old 06-02-2017, 4:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hermosabeach View Post
2017 from Vasken Gourdikian in Sierra Madre, CA for forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. Section 924(d). 17-ATF-007739: Colt Commander Pistol CAL:45 SN:CJ07182, valued at $849.00, seized by the ATF on February 16, 2017 from Vasken Gourdikian in Sierra Madre, CA for forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. Section 924(d). 17-ATF-007740: Springfield Armory, Geneseo, IL Operator Pistol CAL:45 SN:NM294678, valued at $950.00, seized by the ATF on February 16, 2017 from Vasken Gourdikian in Sierra Madre, CA for forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. Section 924(d).
17-ATF-007741: Smith & Wesson M&P 9 Shield Pistol CAL:9 SN:HAS7827, valued at $350.00, seized by the ATF on February 16, 2017 from Vasken Gourdikian in Sierra Madre, CA for forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. Section 924(d).
17-ATF-007742: Sig Sauer (Sig-Arms) P226 Pistol CAL:9 SN:47A045529, valued at $979.00, seized by the ATF on February 16, 2017 from Vasken Gourdikian in Sierra Madre, CA for forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. Section 924(d). 17-ATF-007743: Glock GMBH 27GEN4 Pistol CAL:40 SN:TZR808, valued at $539.00, seized by the ATF on February 16, 2017 from Vasken Gourdikian in Sierra Madre, CA for forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. Section 924(d). 17-ATF-007744: Glock GMBH 22 Pistol CAL:40 SN:LYK339, valued at $339.00, seized by the ATF on February 16, 2017 from Vasken Gourdikian in Sierra Madre, CA for forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. Section 924(d). 17-ATF-007745: Smith & Wesson Airweight Revolver CAL:38 SNCW7120, valued at $311.00, seized by the ATF on February 16, 2017 from Vasken Gourdikian in Sierra Madre, CA for forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. Section 924(d).
17-ATF-007746: Glock GMBH 41GEN4 Pistol CAL:45 SN:BATU462, valued at $500.00, seized by the ATF on February 16, 2017 from Vasken Gourdikian in Sierra Madre, CA for forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. Section 924(d). 17-ATF-007747: Critical Capabilities NC 9 Receiver/Frame CAL:Multi SN:CC901232, valued at $150.00, seized by (Continued on next page)
Quote:
Originally Posted by hermosabeach View Post
the ATF on February 16, 2017 from Vasken Gourdikian in Sierra Madre, CA for forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. Section 924(d).
17-ATF-007748: Wilson Combat Unknown Receiever/Frame CAL:Multi SN:WCB2370, valued at $299.00, seized by the ATF on February 16, 2017 from Vasken Gourdikian in Sierra Madre, CA for forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. Section 924(d).
17-ATF-007749: Colt Commander Pistol CAL:45 SN:4089WCA, valued at $849.00, seized by the ATF on February 16, 2017 from Vasken Gourdikian in Sierra Madre, CA for forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. Section 924(d). 17-ATF-007750: Springfield Armory, Geneseo, IL EMP Pistol CAL:9 SN:EMP32134, valued at $1,000.00, seized by the ATF on February 16, 2017 from Vasken Gourdikian in Sierra Madre, CA for forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. Section 924(d).
17-ATF-007751: Spike's Tactical LLC ST15 Rifle CAL:Multi SN:SCR-022865, valued at $100.00, seized by the ATF on February 16, 2017 from Vasken Gourdikian in Sierra Madre, CA for forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. Section 924(d).
17-ATF-007857: HS Products (IM Metal) XD45 Pistol CAL:45 SN:S3225712, valued at $550.00, seized by the ATF on February 16, 2017 from Vasken Gourdikian in Sierra Madre, CA for forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. Section 924(d).
17-ATF-007859: Springfield Armory, Geneseo, IL Professional Pistol CAL:45 SN:CRG4415, valued at $2,000.00, seized by the ATF on February 16, 2017 from Vasken Gourdikian in Sierra Madre, CA for forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. Section 924(d).
17-ATF-007862: Glock GMBH 19 Pistol CAL:9 SN:BAUA688, valued at $519.00, seized by the ATF on February 16, 2017 from Vasken Gourdikian in Sierra Madre, CA for forfeiture pursuant to 18 U.S.C. Section 924(d).

And it goes on for several more pages...
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Old 06-02-2017, 4:27 PM
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Personally, I appreciate the Ofricer's efforts to provide what the shooting public wants.
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  #266  
Old 06-02-2017, 4:46 PM
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I must've missed this when it first came up. It's greed, pure & simple. As others have mentioned, there are approximately ZERO LEOs flipping off-roster guns at cost cuz they love freedom. This guy was making BART janitor-level money, no reason to break the law hustling for extra.

The tax thing might be a big reason folks change their "for sale" threads to remove the price.

"Though most of the listings were later edited to remove the price when a buyer was found, a tally of 21 posts in which the asking price remained totaled about $31,000."

LT should've changed them all if he was trying to dodge taxes, though.


But really I just wanted to say that Vasken Gourdikian is a great name for a movie villain, right up there with Keyser Soze. For general awesomeness, Ulysses S. Grant Early IV ain't bad neither.
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  #267  
Old 06-02-2017, 5:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Mitch View Post
18 U.S. Code § 922

This is the code section under which Ryan McGowan was convicted and it is probably the code section that will be used to charge Gourdikian. According to the Federal complaint, all of the above constitute dealing in firearms without a license. You may disagree, but your opinion, it might pain you to learn, carries a lot less weight than that of a Federal compliant in the eyes of a journalist or just about anyone else on the planet.
You did not answer the questions. Dealing in firearms without a license is illegal, but that is not the question. The question is not what Gourdikian might be charged with. The questions were in regards to the article.

You can say that I might disagree, but since you did not bother to stay on topic, it does not matter and is completely bogus in an attempt to defend your position.

It was mentioned that there was a law which bars OFFICERS from making a profit on CERTAIN FIREARMS. You really think that is true? If so, point out the law.

It was mentioned that it is illegal for an OFFICER to buy and then RESELL an OFF-ROSTER pistol SOLELY to make a PROFIT. Which law is that? Yes, being an unlicensed dealer is illegal, but that has nothing to do with being an officer, off-roster firearms or a profit. It has to do with the NUMBER of firearms. Am officer can buy an off-roster firearm and decide that they don't like it and sell it for a profit and it is not illegal. Doing it multiple times is a different issue.

There is no law which makes it illegal to buy a firearm with the INTENTION of selling it. If you are buying it for someone, it is illegal. This means that if you have a buyer lined up before you buy it, then it is illegal. If you see a good deal, it is not illegal.

Quote:
The differences between what you list above and what are truly illegal are subtle ones, and it is revealed everyday here on Calguns that not even seasoned gun owners can properly understand them. Yet you expect dissection of complex legal minutiae in a newspaper article penned by a layman.
Sorry, but I think the truth and being accurate is important. If you think that false statements are not important, then you are going to end up with more problems, such as so-called a-salt weapons and people thinking that something is different than it really is.

Quote:
You need to reset your expectations.
Wow. Being accurate and true is too much to expect???

Quote:
Can you point to the part of the article where the author stated Federal law requires the seller to go through a FFL to avoid breaking the law?
Ok, so I misread a sentence. How about all the other issues and more?

Quote:
I think it's a pretty damned good article. The journalist, unlike 95% of his colleagues, actually did a little research and found the Calguns angle. That's newsworthy. He also provided a few details on the parallel case in Sacramento.
He did a LITTLE research. He should have done more. There was a lot added just to push an issue. Like what is the point as to his salary and benefits? He made a lot of money, so is it to say that he did not need to make more money? How does it relate to the issue?

Quote:
And also unlike 95% of his colleagues, he called an NRA attorney to get some facts, instead of automatically speed dialing the VPC, which I suppose is what you would have preferred.
Don't make things up, especially to try to support your bogus position.
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  #268  
Old 06-02-2017, 6:59 PM
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[QUOTE=MrOrange


But really I just wanted to say that Vasken Gourdikian is a great name for a movie villain, right up there with Keyser Soze. For general awesomeness, Ulysses S. Grant Early IV ain't bad neither.[/QUOTE]

LMAO Ur2Funny
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  #269  
Old 06-04-2017, 12:28 AM
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The way "Calguns" is thrown around in that article, makes it sound like we are on track to be labeled a hate group by the SPLC. Extremely negative.

While I appreciate off-roster handguns in circulation, the motivation here was not to support 2A and expanded choice for CA residents. It was to line his wallet by using an exemption to our draconian firearms laws in a dishonest manner. Enriching yourself by taking advantage of a supply chain that you only have access to because of your public employment credentials...sounds a lot like....never mind.

It seems his eventual downfall was due to his posts here, a public forum, where LEOs from all levels of .gov are known to lurk and participate, sometimes while "on the clock". This only confirms poor decision making skills that would disqualify one from a CCW let alone a Peace Officer career.

The reckless exposure of Calguns members who purchased firearms from him, most likely came to a halt when he sold to a LEO around the time of his last login. I actually appreciate that enforcement is not only for the general public.
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  #270  
Old 06-04-2017, 8:51 AM
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I actually appreciate that enforcement is not only for the general public.
Only when it cross some unknown special line.

Consider the BATF letter from Eric D. Harden in which he says:

http://www.trbas.com/media/media/acr...0-13121525.pdf

Quote:
It is our goal to educate, not investigate, to ensure law enforcement officials comply with federal law in order to avoid unnecessary public embarrassment to themselves and your Department/Agency.
Do you think that they have this view of the general public? I know some want to educate so that people don't get in trouble, but I don't know that overall this is the case.

Quote:
In some instances, ATF has discovered officers who purchased more than 100 "off roster: firearms that were subsequently transferred to non-law enforcement individuals.
So what do you think would happen if the BATF noticed that a non-LEO bought and sold over 100 firearms?

Quote:
When presented with compelling evidence of flagrant violations of federal firearms laws, ATF is obligated to conduct a criminal investigation.
In seems that he is saying please don't force them to investigate LEOs. The general public does not get a warning letter to not violate the law. They did not send the letter to FFLs to inform them what the LEOs might be violating the law and to watch out for it, as well as to report it, as compared to the general straw purchase warning letter.

To me, this shows a double standard.
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  #271  
Old 06-05-2017, 7:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KahrMan View Post
Personally, I appreciate the Ofricer's efforts to provide what the shooting public wants.
LOL @ the cuck
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I am in a sympathy-free zone as well. A leftist brown shirt reaping what he sowed after profiting from it is sweet justice indeed.
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  #272  
Old 06-05-2017, 8:12 AM
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If he had kept his selling to 5 ppt's per year there would be no issue. Greed got the best of him.
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  #273  
Old 06-05-2017, 9:03 AM
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His regular gross is about $136K. The rest is overtime, benefits (including health and retirement) and "other" (whatever that is).
Standby pay (I don't think cops get this), hazard pay (haz-mat etc), night-shift pay, and a bunch of other situations depending on their MOU fall under "Other" pay for government workers.


On a side note, I've bought and sold accessories to him several times a few years ago and shot the S for a few hours each time. Crazy to see him and CGN on the news and of course seeing CGN portrayed negatively.
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  #274  
Old 06-05-2017, 10:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KahrMan View Post
Personally, I appreciate the Ofricer's efforts to provide what the shooting public wants.
yeah, that's what it was - a deep concern for California gun owners that are being unfairly treated by a bullsh** gun roster

bless his heart






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  #275  
Old 06-05-2017, 10:54 AM
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From the article:

"In May 2015, Gourdikian received a waiver allowing him to bypass the 10-day waiting period to buy a Glock 43 pistol. The waiver, signed by Pasadena Police Chief Phillip Sanchez, states the Glock was being purchased for off-duty use, not for resale.

Seven days later, vgourdik sold a gun of the same make and model on Calguns"



Sounds pretty bad for this Police Lieutenant... sounds like sheer elitism... and a good dose of "not too bright".

I hate the fact that he used this forum to soil his department's reputation regardless of the outcome of this investigation. I also hate the fact that there are some really GREAT LEOs on this forum who are stand up guys/gals, who often help us understand the nuances in enforcement policies and who share great perspectives that may no longer feel very comfortable participating here in the Calguns community because of this one guy's blatant greed.
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  #276  
Old 06-05-2017, 6:16 PM
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Glock 41 Gen4...nice.
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  #277  
Old 06-05-2017, 8:11 PM
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This cop knew exactly what he was doing, why he took such a big risk is beyond me.

Oh well..I don't feel a bit sorry for him
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  #278  
Old 07-17-2017, 8:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kemasa View Post
I have a theory that some LEOs learn that the laws don't apply to them. It starts with their not getting traffic tickets when they violate the CVC. That creates an elite, as does the exemption from the certified list. Animal Farm: some animals are more equal than others.
I have a theory which I have developed over time. It is that law enforcement sees the laws broken and twisted (from their viewpoint) so often with little to no consequence. Seeing society's apparent disregard to punishing people for their actions. "It's not their fault. It is the poor background that they came from." The decriminilizing of acts (marijauna, etc.). The minimization of crimes such as raising the dollar amount of felony theft, etc. If a person goes to prison for one crime you can be sure that they did not get caught for a whole lot of other crimes. Some animals are more equal but is it really the elite.
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  #279  
Old 07-17-2017, 8:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MA5177 View Post
This cop knew exactly what he was doing, why he took such a big risk is beyond me.

Oh well..I don't feel a bit sorry for him
Nailed it
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  #280  
Old 07-17-2017, 9:16 PM
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