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FFL's Forum For open discussion between FFLs and polite questions for FFLs. |
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#1
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SOT, cans and featureless builds.
Being a SOT, I have an integrally suppressed, non-SBR .300 BLK upper coming in several months. The question is whether this would be usable in a featureless AR build? Would a can be defined as a flash hider? Thoughts?
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Check out our e-commerce site here: www.ebrworks.com Serving you from Prescott, AZ Last edited by EBR Works; 10-10-2012 at 1:19 AM.. |
#3
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Gonna say no.
If you look at the process the CADOJ would use to test for flash suppression you will see that they use the statement "particular feature or deviced". They don't say muzzle brake, flash hider etc. It could be argued that a can is just a different type of device that is screwed onto a barrel. But in this case I see yours is internal so it may fall under a "particular feature". In SB23 Final Statement of Reasons (FSOR) you can see earlier writings of the law. At a point they made it clear its not what the device is called but if it actually does suppress flash, if so then it is a flash suppressor. (Notice FSOR is not the law, but it is a good reference) Is a can a feature or device that suppresses flash? The CADOJ might say yes. But who really knows. On a featureless its always best to err on the side of caution... Quote:
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#4
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How is an integral barrel a flash suppressor? Wouldn't it be argued that a regular crowned barrel is a flash suppressor because it redirects the flash away from the shooters field of vision by going straight out the barrel?
The truth is the state has no clue what a flash suppressor is.
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www.tenpercentfirearms.com was open from 2005 until 2018. I now own Westside Arms. |
#5
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Quote:
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"The police cannot protect the citizen at this stage of our development, and they cannot even protect themselves in many cases. It is up to the private citizen to protect himself and his family, and this is not only acceptable, but mandatory" Jeff Cooper Last edited by rrr70; 10-10-2012 at 6:32 AM.. |
#6
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We all know that flash hiders make the shooter invisible so, if a surpressor makes the shooter invisible, it could be considered a flash hider.
Wes, While I think I follow your logic about integral surpressors, how would you clssify a permanently attached flash hider? Would it be just part of the barrel and no longer considered a "flash hider" or, would it be a barrel with an integral flash hider?
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NRA Certified Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun and Metallic Cartridge Reloading Instructor California DOJ Certified Fingerprint Roller Ventura County approved CCW Instructor Utah CCW Instructor Offering low cost multi state CCW, private basic shooting and reloading classes for calgunners. CCW SAFE MEMBERSHIPS HERE KM6WLV |
#7
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my guess would be no as well.
Remember that the feds considered cans to be flash hiders and counted as an evil feature during the fed AWB. I would assume that CADOJ would take the same position.
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Jack Do you want an AOW or C&R SBS/SBR in CA? No posts of mine are to be construed as legal advice, which can only be given by a lawyer. |
#8
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Quote:
In your case of a permantly attached flash suppressor, the flash is re-directed from exiting the muzzle with the bullet to exiting through established slots in order to redirect the flash. Well at least it sounds good.
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www.tenpercentfirearms.com was open from 2005 until 2018. I now own Westside Arms. |
#9
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I talked to Jason Davis. He said it would most likely be a test case. I guess no featureless + can for me...
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Check out our e-commerce site here: www.ebrworks.com Serving you from Prescott, AZ |
#11
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Quote:
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I've got to play with a few models with intergral surpressors and they are much more fun than having to screw a can on and off. A friend of mine has had a MP5SD in his safe since he bought it for $1200 in 1969. Another friend has a Ruger MKII that I'd love to be able to own. He also has a MP5K with a can and a transferable FCG that he used to shoot yotes with from his back porch.
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NRA Certified Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun and Metallic Cartridge Reloading Instructor California DOJ Certified Fingerprint Roller Ventura County approved CCW Instructor Utah CCW Instructor Offering low cost multi state CCW, private basic shooting and reloading classes for calgunners. CCW SAFE MEMBERSHIPS HERE KM6WLV Last edited by CSACANNONEER; 10-10-2012 at 2:51 PM.. |
#12
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I like Wes' logic.
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www.franklinarmory.com info@franklinarmory.com ONLINE STORE: http://franklinarmory.com Franklin Armory - Manufacturer of Quality, California Legal AR's, the F17 Series rimfire rifles in 17 WSM, the Drop-in Fixed Magazine (DFM), and the CA7, CA11, and CA12 Rostered AR Pistols! |
#13
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Quote:
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www.tenpercentfirearms.com was open from 2005 until 2018. I now own Westside Arms. |
#14
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He bought it from a firend of his who had just purchased 5 of them and didn't need them all. He also hemmed and hawed over spending that much on something he isn't really into. Now it just sits in his safe with his +98% first gen Colts, sub cal (.12-14 cal guns), etc.
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NRA Certified Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun and Metallic Cartridge Reloading Instructor California DOJ Certified Fingerprint Roller Ventura County approved CCW Instructor Utah CCW Instructor Offering low cost multi state CCW, private basic shooting and reloading classes for calgunners. CCW SAFE MEMBERSHIPS HERE KM6WLV |
#15
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I'm just curious why it was so expensive. They cost less than that now
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Artist formally known as CEO of Tracy Rifle and Pistol |
#16
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I don't think he's talking about .22 one. ;-)
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"The police cannot protect the citizen at this stage of our development, and they cannot even protect themselves in many cases. It is up to the private citizen to protect himself and his family, and this is not only acceptable, but mandatory" Jeff Cooper |
#17
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I know. A dealer sample MP5 is still less or about that. Complete Semi MP5s in 89 were much less than that.
In 69 a Full auto Mp5 should have been way less than 1200
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Artist formally known as CEO of Tracy Rifle and Pistol |
#19
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Then either old Sonny's memory is going or mine is. I could have sworn he said '69.
__________________
NRA Certified Pistol, Rifle, Shotgun and Metallic Cartridge Reloading Instructor California DOJ Certified Fingerprint Roller Ventura County approved CCW Instructor Utah CCW Instructor Offering low cost multi state CCW, private basic shooting and reloading classes for calgunners. CCW SAFE MEMBERSHIPS HERE KM6WLV |
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