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Calguns LEOs LEOs; chat, kibitz and relax. Non-LEOs; have a questions for a cop? Ask it here, in a CIVIL manner.

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  #121  
Old 07-24-2009, 5:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Vtec44 View Post
Those are the 2 main factors that I generally don't get involved unless it's a life and death situation. It's a sad attitude, I know.
All the officer has to say is posse comatatus covers your aiding him in the arrest & detention of the perp.I did arrests for 32 years some were easy some weren't but I usually had backup or sometimes civilian volunteers who got involved detaining the suspect.
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  #122  
Old 07-25-2009, 10:26 PM
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I'd jump in for sure. Im not the type to look for trouble myself but I have always made it a point to take a good look at traffic stops as well as motorists that break down. I gues Im one of the few left out there that will actually stop to help a little old lady or a mom with three kids in the car to fix a flat or figure why there car wont go. I hope to see allot more folks responces saying that they would. LEO's have kids and wifes that look forward to hearing them come through that front door just like the rest of us.
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  #123  
Old 07-26-2009, 9:50 AM
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Originally Posted by Fire in the Hole View Post
Good that's a start. Now uncross it.
So, I'm one of those who would help out if I could be of help. However, the fear that we could be mistaken for a bad guy is a real fear. Only I know in my own head that I am here to help - but outside observers may not know that. I'd love to rest easy and never fear that coming to the aid of someone would put me in danger with the responding authorities - but I don't think that is something you or anyone could ever guarantee. Just for the sake of discussion, could you kindly explain your comment of "now uncross it"?

Turby
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  #124  
Old 07-26-2009, 10:14 AM
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....and how did they do that?

Was open carry legal? (I'm thinking CCWs didn't exist in Tx then...)

.
They are called CHL's in Texas and they exist.

You are also permitted to open carry and keep gun racks in your car if you choose to.

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  #125  
Old 07-26-2009, 10:30 AM
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Once while leaving a Target store I saw a dirtbag acting suspicious, right as he got out the door two security guards tackled him. I thought to myself "this could be interesting" so I put down my bag and stood right there just waiting. The security guys were having a hard time with the crackhead and I'm a fairly big/strong guy so I figured if I thought they needed help I would comply. Well one say "HELP!" I didn't hesitate, Dropped my knee right into the morons back and he let out a sound of "UUUUUUHHH!" It was strange as I started to work this dude over with wresting moves I learned in high school that I thought were long forgotten but came back to me so vividly. We got the cuffs on him, he was bleeding and I said a few choice words to him. So I decided I should go before some one asked my name and had a law suit coming my way. But WOW what a rush I got from that. As I was walking away with Wife and Kids I tell my wife "man that was fun!". You should have see the looks on the bystanders faces.

So yeah, I don't think I could not help an LEO
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  #126  
Old 07-26-2009, 4:46 PM
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So, I'm one of those who would help out if I could be of help. However, the fear that we could be mistaken for a bad guy is a real fear. Only I know in my own head that I am here to help - but outside observers may not know that. I'd love to rest easy and never fear that coming to the aid of someone would put me in danger with the responding authorities - but I don't think that is something you or anyone could ever guarantee. Just for the sake of discussion, could you kindly explain your comment of "now uncross it"?

Turby
I'd love to. It's a valid question. My answer may be long, but I feel it deserves a comprehensive answer. Okay so here goes. Like many others, my thoughts and comments are based upon my own life experiences.

Gryff posted that the thought of responding LEO's mistaking him for a BG had "CROSSED" his mind in the past. My reply to him was to "UNCROSS" this part of his mindset for the future. Reasoning: I have had a few concepts drilled into my mind by those responsible for my training in both the military and in LE. One of those concepts is "He who hesitates is lost." If you are letting something "Cross" your mind, this leads to hesitation. We have learned from scientists that it takes 3/4 of a second to percieve a hazard, and another 3/4 of a second to react to it. That's 1 1/2 seconds to live or die. Fairbain writes extensively about this, as does Ayoob.

Now for my personal application. When I read Gryff's post, it brought back a point in time for me. I was just 20 yrs. old. In Army Airborne School, Ft. Bragg, NC. It was my first solo jump, even though from a static line. I remember at abound 10 thousand feet, the Jumpmaster came on the loud speaker and anncounced, "Okay girls, it's time to fish or just sit on the pier and cut bait. In a few seconds you are gonna stand in the hole and do something completley un-natural. You are gonna jump into the sky, and leave the safety of a perfectly good airplane. Now I know that many of you have heard the only two things fall from the sky. Bird s***, and fools. That stuff just clouds up you thinking. Don't allow it to cross you mind for one second! Uncross it now. If you hesitate to think about all the what if's that could go wrong when you're standing in the hole, you'll not only "f" yourself up , but you'll "f" up your partner and everyone else standing behind you. You know what to do. You've been trained. Now go do it!"

So to re-cap, my comment to Gryff was to encourage him to get his mind clear, "Uncross it." Crossed up thinking is bad.

studiojon has posted that he will not help out. I'm actually okay with that, in as much as he has apparently thought it out, made a decision, and can be counted on not to help. At least I know where he stands.

As to being confused for a BG by responding LEO's: I know of hundreds of cases where a citizen has come to the aid or rescue of an LEO in distress. Yet I know of no such cases, where a citizen has been mistaken as a BG by responding LEO's and subsequently shot, tazed, batoned, etc. I'm sure that someone will come up with an example that they've heard about at some time and some place, but I know of none. While there may be some initial concern for this, academically at least. This is the time now to address it, before it becomes a reality for you. This is one of the great things about a forum such as this. Let's discuss it now, make up our minds one way or the other, then act on it. I can not for one second, in my wildest imagination even concieve of not helping an LEO or other citizen in dire straights. The thought would not even "Cross" my mind. It's not how I was raised, trained, or lived.

Turbinator, no one can grant you a guarentee when it comes to human beings. It's just not possible. I wish I could do that for you, but I can not. However, in conclusion I'll close on this thought: We are all adults, we have all seen things, we have all heard things, we have all lived things. Now go do the right thing.
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  #127  
Old 07-26-2009, 5:30 PM
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physically without hesitation...and if I was UOC at the time, by locking & loading/firing center mass in 1.5-2.0sec if the situation called for it. God Bless our LEO's! they deal with so many scum bags on a day to day basis. sometimes...to many times...it's hard for them to tell us LAW ABIDING GOOD GUYS from the bad guys. especially when it comes to firearms.
remember, citizens are police and the police are citizens. it's the LEO's job to confront the criminals. hopefully when needed, a citizen is there to back them up WHEN the need arises. so many instances of one citizen CCW or UOC having been able to save so many lives. the list goes on and on and the trend seems to show it will continue unfortunately.
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  #128  
Old 07-28-2009, 11:34 PM
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I wonder also sugi942
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  #129  
Old 07-28-2009, 11:52 PM
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Originally Posted by cedew View Post
Great thread, fun reading!

I would definitely help out. I would ask for permission unless the LEO was getting worked, in which case I wouldn't want my presence to be known by the BG.

The original question by the OP was "gang-bangers", as in, more than one. What do you do when the LEO is ridiculously outnumbered? Where one more person on his side isn't going to do anything.

And to take it a step further, what if the situation is like this: http://www.modbee.com/local/story/648161.html
That is one of those situations where it is possible for you to draw your weapon and start firing from the right and work your way left until they are all dead or you.
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  #130  
Old 07-30-2009, 2:38 AM
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Imo, I wouldn't hesitate to help out since I want to be a LEO and am in the selection process. Unfortunately, I feel that if an officer has put himself in a life threatening situation he can not overcome himself, he has not been trained properly in the academy and by his FTO. I understand certain situations arise, and peoples lives are already at risk with the criminal at large, but what if the helping citizen is harmed or killed. The LEO is S.O.L. and is a liability to the deptartment. Now if your an officer reading this or asking this question because you are wondering what if... then you need to find another job, becuase your not ready for the streets and you will be a victim of your mistakes.
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  #131  
Old 07-30-2009, 3:23 AM
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Originally Posted by 3rd° View Post
Imo, I wouldn't hesitate to help out since I want to be a LEO and am in the selection process. Unfortunately, I feel that if an officer has put himself in a life threatening situation he can not overcome himself, he has not been trained properly in the academy and by his FTO. I understand certain situations arise, and peoples lives are already at risk with the criminal at large, but what if the helping citizen is harmed or killed. The LEO is S.O.L. and is a liability to the deptartment. Now if your an officer reading this or asking this question because you are wondering what if... then you need to find another job, becuase your not ready for the streets and you will be a victim of your mistakes.
Have you served in the military? Or were you a LEO elsewhere? I'm just curious is all.

Not so. Sometimes an officer can be ganged up on by someone he thought was just watching. Maybe the guy is pumped up on some sh*t and doesn't mind breaking off his left hand, and is working his way out of restraint. Adrenaline plus drugs are funny that way.

YOU may one day be that "liability" you speak of because for whatever reason, with all your planning for that day, you run into the one mothereffer that just came out of left field with the goal of f'n your day up.
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  #132  
Old 07-30-2009, 7:02 AM
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3rd- These are humans, not robocops. It's nice you will hold yourself to high standards but if you make it to patrol Im sure you will make mistakes..just like the rest of the humans
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  #133  
Old 07-30-2009, 7:49 AM
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Originally Posted by 3rd° View Post
Imo, I wouldn't hesitate to help out since I want to be a LEO and am in the selection process. Unfortunately, I feel that if an officer has put himself in a life threatening situation he can not overcome himself, he has not been trained properly in the academy and by his FTO. I understand certain situations arise, and peoples lives are already at risk with the criminal at large, but what if the helping citizen is harmed or killed. The LEO is S.O.L. and is a liability to the deptartment. Now if your an officer reading this or asking this question because you are wondering what if... then you need to find another job, becuase your not ready for the streets and you will be a victim of your mistakes.
Wow....absolutely no intention of being rude but I must ask these couple questions....

- What experience do you have for you to make these comments?
- Do you have any street experience or military experience?
- Is this something you have read in a book(s)?

Comments like you have made above indicate to those of us who have been on the streets that when you get hired and go to patrol your learning curve is going to be very steep. Good luck in the hiring process during these difficult economic times.
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I don't feel a thing when some cop gets ghosted.
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  #134  
Old 07-30-2009, 8:03 AM
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I think it depends. If I felt comfortable helping out, I would. But if the guy was slashing around with a knife or shooting, I'd run.
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  #135  
Old 07-30-2009, 8:19 AM
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Originally Posted by cedew View Post
Great thread, fun reading!

I would definitely help out. I would ask for permission unless the LEO was getting worked, in which case I wouldn't want my presence to be known by the BG.

The original question by the OP was "gang-bangers", as in, more than one. What do you do when the LEO is ridiculously outnumbered? Where one more person on his side isn't going to do anything.

And to take it a step further, what if the situation is like this: http://www.modbee.com/local/story/648161.html
WOW! Broken radio, a mob of 60, and an assult rifle. I cant imagine what might have been going thru the officers mind. I salute this officer for his bravery and service.
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  #136  
Old 07-30-2009, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by 3rd° View Post
Imo, I wouldn't hesitate to help out since I want to be a LEO and am in the selection process. Unfortunately, I feel that if an officer has put himself in a life threatening situation he can not overcome himself, he has not been trained properly in the academy and by his FTO. I understand certain situations arise, and peoples lives are already at risk with the criminal at large, but what if the helping citizen is harmed or killed. The LEO is S.O.L. and is a liability to the deptartment. Now if your an officer reading this or asking this question because you are wondering what if... then you need to find another job, becuase your not ready for the streets and you will be a victim of your mistakes.
Initially, I was going to delete your thread for leo bashing when I first read this. Upon re-reading it, I realized it really is not; you are just naive. If you make it thru your testing and then thru the academy, your learning curve will, indeed, be very steep as yzernie said.

There will always be someone out there who can beat you; either because they are stronger, crazy or on some drug. If you don't understand that, I feel sorry for you.

When PCP was really going hot back in the early 80s, I got into a wrestling match with a 18yr. old kid who was about 5" shorter and 50lbs. lighter than I. I was in excellent shape at the time. I was trying to cuff him and it turned into a wrestling match. My FTO hit him in the back with the baton on two occasions and his only reaction was a blink; it didn't slow him one bit. I finally got him cuffed as the calvary showed up and it felt like I had just run 10 miles.

When he finally came down from it while booking him at MCJ, he had no idea where he was or what had occurred.

So, please do not tell us who have been or are still in le, that we should have or should get out of the work if the type of situation arises you referred to occurs.

I sincerely hope you make it thru an academy if you are hired. I also hope you are safe and never experience a situation such as you mentioned. If you ever do tho, please return here and let us know if you decided to quit if a subject was able to overpower you.
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  #137  
Old 07-30-2009, 1:23 PM
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Originally Posted by 3rd° View Post
Imo, I wouldn't hesitate to help out since I want to be a LEO and am in the selection process. Unfortunately, I feel that if an officer has put himself in a life threatening situation he can not overcome himself, he has not been trained properly in the academy and by his FTO. I understand certain situations arise, and peoples lives are already at risk with the criminal at large, but what if the helping citizen is harmed or killed. The LEO is S.O.L. and is a liability to the deptartment. Now if your an officer reading this or asking this question because you are wondering what if... then you need to find another job, becuase your not ready for the streets and you will be a victim of your mistakes.
WOW dude its not a video game
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  #138  
Old 07-30-2009, 2:43 PM
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If you ever do tho, please return here and let us know if you decided to quit if a subject was able to overpower you.
Fixed it for you Bill...I think you meant to say "when a subject is able to overpower you". It really isn't a matter of "if", it is a matter of being prepared for 'when' it happens, because at some point in everyones career it will happen.
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I don't feel a thing when some cop gets ghosted.
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  #139  
Old 07-30-2009, 9:59 PM
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Originally Posted by 3rd° View Post
Imo, I wouldn't hesitate to help out since I want to be a LEO and am in the selection process. Unfortunately, I feel that if an officer has put himself in a life threatening situation he can not overcome himself, he has not been trained properly in the academy and by his FTO. I understand certain situations arise, and peoples lives are already at risk with the criminal at large, but what if the helping citizen is harmed or killed. The LEO is S.O.L. and is a liability to the deptartment. Now if your an officer reading this or asking this question because you are wondering what if... then you need to find another job, becuase your not ready for the streets and you will be a victim of your mistakes.
You are extremely naive...we don't usually put ourselves into those situations the public at large calls us there. Who else are they going to call when when a father is totally crazed on PCP and rapes his 12 year old daughter? If you make it into the field you will learn that numerous people call us into situations that they themselves caused or allowed to deteriorate.
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  #140  
Old 07-31-2009, 2:00 PM
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Default Helping police officers.

Police officers unlike us, have to go to trouble. We have the option of retreat, they don't.

There was a case in San Fran where a homeless person started to beat up on a Female SFPD officer and a crowd formed around and just watched.

My view is that we as civilians for the most part should stay out of the way of police officers and let them do their jobs.

That being said, if it is obvious that a officer is in trouble, we have a duty to step up and help them in anyway we can.

Criminals need to fear that when they attack the police, they also attack us.

As more and more cops are saved by CCW holders which has happened across the country, support for our rights from Cops will increase.

Nicki
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  #141  
Old 07-31-2009, 2:07 PM
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sorry just wanted the no to stand out as the answer to the question.. so it really is just a plain ol no. and yes it is only a no for LEO as I have helped many an average citizen in distress and will continue to do so
Curious why you would help "an average citizen" and not help an LEO who needs assistence.
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I don't feel a thing when some cop gets ghosted.
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  #142  
Old 07-31-2009, 5:57 PM
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I have my reasons
i hope they order you to, then when you don't, they take you in
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  #143  
Old 07-31-2009, 8:52 PM
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Actually, police officers can retreat, they just don't have to.

835a PC.
Any peace officer who has reasonable cause to believe that the person to be arrested has committed a public offense may use reasonable force to effect the arrest, to prevent escape or to overcome resistance. A peace officer who makes or attempts to make an arrest need not retreat or desist from his efforts by reason of the resistance or threatened resistance of the person being arrested; nor shall such officer be deemed an aggressor or lose his right to self-defense by the use of reasonable force to effect the arrest or to prevent escape or to overcome resistance.

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Police officers unlike us, have to go to trouble. We have the option of retreat, they don't.
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  #144  
Old 07-31-2009, 10:09 PM
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i hope they order you to, then when you don't, they take you in
Tho we may not agree with studiojon's answer and his lack of explanation, it is his answer. Please don't let this thread degenerate into something bad. The above is going down that road.
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  #145  
Old 08-01-2009, 12:17 AM
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  #146  
Old 08-01-2009, 2:12 AM
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To help get the thread back on track...
Part of me getting involved in a situation would be to make sure I am accually helping, and not getting in the way of the officer. If the officer is getting the crap beat out of him/her , or if he/she is alone with no back and trying to get a suspect under control I would jump in and assist the LEO in anyway possible. However, I find it important to make sure I am helping, and not hurting the officer. If the LEO looks like he/she has the situation under control.. then there would be no need. If things appear to be going south, I would approach, and make it clear that I am there to HELP. By doing so this means following the officer's directions to the letter. If he or she says they have it under control. Then just back off... Maybe observe from an accessible distance incase things go south from there.

I assisted a CHP officer while on duty as an armed guard who had a traffic stop behind my building. She had a car with mutiple male subjects (4 I recall) and was by herself. I approached with my hands and plain view, after getting flashlighted quickly, I exclaimed quickly "Security! May I be of assistance?" She asked me to watch the subjects while she ran some info. I did so until she ticketed the driver and sent them on their way. She thanked me and I went on my way.
She was noticably nervous when I approached her, as it was dark, in probably one of the worst hoods in Sacramento. I am sure she was glad to have my help.
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  #147  
Old 08-01-2009, 2:18 AM
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Been there done that when it comes to being first on scene at an accident. I'm no hero and the suv never blew up.

Most of the time you just let the pros do their job. If they really need it though, they can count on me.
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  #148  
Old 08-01-2009, 4:52 AM
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Originally Posted by leitung View Post
To help get the thread back on track...
Part of me getting involved in a situation would be to make sure I am accually helping, and not getting in the way of the officer. If the officer is getting the crap beat out of him/her , or if he/she is alone with no back and trying to get a suspect under control I would jump in and assist the LEO in anyway possible. However, I find it important to make sure I am helping, and not hurting the officer. If the LEO looks like he/she has the situation under control.. then there would be no need. If things appear to be going south, I would approach, and make it clear that I am there to HELP. By doing so this means following the officer's directions to the letter. If he or she says they have it under control. Then just back off... Maybe observe from an accessible distance incase things go south from there.

I assisted a CHP officer while on duty as an armed guard who had a traffic stop behind my building. She had a car with mutiple male subjects (4 I recall) and was by herself. I approached with my hands and plain view, after getting flashlighted quickly, I exclaimed quickly "Security! May I be of assistance?" She asked me to watch the subjects while she ran some info. I did so until she ticketed the driver and sent them on their way. She thanked me and I went on my way.
She was noticably nervous when I approached her, as it was dark, in probably one of the worst hoods in Sacramento. I am sure she was glad to have my help.
See now this is an example of just about the perfect way to think and act in such a situation. Way to go leitung!
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  #149  
Old 08-01-2009, 12:50 PM
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Disclaimer: No attitude inflected in the below comment so please do not read one into my words.

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Originally Posted by studiojon View Post
I have my reasons
I can appreciate that. I just don't see any differentiation between a 'citizen' and an LEO. Your obvious dislike for LEOs apparently runs pretty deep and I would encourage you to rethink your logic and remember on occasion, no LEO is beyond needing the help of the community.
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  #150  
Old 08-01-2009, 1:01 PM
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Whether we get help from others or not, we get the job done, for the most parts. It would be just matter of time, how soon we take care of it, or later. It would be nice to get some help when we need it though. Once, I was arresting a guy with a loaded and concealed gun by myself. Two LAPD motor officers saw me and backed me up. I felt good with their presence.
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Old 08-01-2009, 4:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yzernie View Post
Disclaimer: No attitude inflected in the below comment so please do not read one into my words.



I can appreciate that. I just don't see any differentiation between a 'citizen' and an LEO. Your obvious dislike for LEOs apparently runs pretty deep and I would encourage you to rethink your logic and remember on occasion, no LEO is beyond needing the help of the community.
well said
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Old 08-01-2009, 4:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by retired View Post
Tho we may not agree with studiojon's answer and his lack of explanation, it is his answer. Please don't let this thread degenerate into something bad. The above is going down that road.
ok
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  #153  
Old 08-01-2009, 4:46 PM
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While studiojon's answer concerns me, it is his honest answer. There is obviously a story behind a story there. That is what the original question was about. Would you help?

Actually, I respect studiojon's black and white answer more than such answers as: I would unless the distressed officer was a member of the XYZ LE Dept. Or, I would but only if believed the distressed officer was really one of the good guys, and not an instigator, or trying to make a false arrest.

For God's sake, how would you know this information on a spontaneous, spur of the moment, hot scene? Ask to review his personnel file before helping? Convene a preliminary hearing on the shoulder of a highway, to verify if it is indeed a valid arrest?
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  #154  
Old 08-01-2009, 8:03 PM
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  #155  
Old 08-03-2009, 3:43 AM
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I've never had to come to the aid of a police officer, and I'm thankful for that-- I'm sure they are as well. That said, nothing would stop me from assisting any officer or civilian if I felt it necessary. Actually, that's a lie. If they told me they didn't need help, I wouldn't. I would stay close by though... Just in case.

Sure, we all would agree that having a CCW would make things a lot easier-- end the situation quicker-- but we're in California. Open and unloaded carry is one way, but that's nowhere near accepted by society, so it's more hassle that it's worth at this point. Because of that, I *ALWAYS* carry at least one knife on me, and if that is what I have to use to aid the officer or individual effectively, that is what I will use. Though, I will feel no pity for the person who is unfortunate enough to be attacking someone when I'm on my way to or from the shooting range.

It's safe to say that I'll backup anyone, PD or civilian, who is being attacked and either needs help immediately, asks for help, or accepts my offer. I refuse to sit by and let people be injured or killed while the BG gets away. Not on my watch.
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  #156  
Old 08-03-2009, 4:37 AM
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Count me in. Again...

HBPD was nice enough to write me out of the initial arrest / use-of-force arrest report an "unknown, concerned passerby".


I'm in without a second thought.



Well, I was about 30yo at the time that happened... now that 40 has passed me by? F-it, I'm still in.

Last edited by TenSeven; 08-03-2009 at 4:44 AM..
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  #157  
Old 08-03-2009, 4:14 PM
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I would help the officer for sure. I prepare for such an occasion by watching MMA.
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  #158  
Old 08-07-2009, 12:23 PM
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I've got a pretty funny little story: A while ago in the Modesto area my brother-in-law was working as a train conductor for a railroad company. They had been having regular break-ins and robberies in the yard where someone would hop the fence steal some tools and other valuables and leave before the police would arrive.

Well one night he showed up in the trainyard, continued his regular regimen of stealing things. My brother-in-law saw him and took off after him, the guy freaked and ran. Police were already in the area and followed him as he ran down an alley. My brother-in-law was running alongside an officer chasing the same man. That is...until the officer tripped on a pipe. My brother-in-law kept chase and managed to tackle the guy and keep him subdued until the officer caught up and arrested him.

The arresting officer gave my brother-in-law a thank you and asked him to wait a while so he could give his statement.

When the rest of the officers arrived my brother-in-law was still waiting and being given some stern looks from other officers. The arresting officer walked up and extended his hand for a handshake and another thank you, it turns out this guy was wanted for several robberies in the area within the last few weeks.

The officer suddenly had a very odd look on his face and was pulled his hand back, mid-shake. My brother-in-law says "I bet you never would have guessed you would be shaking hands with a Hell's Angel, would you?"

My brother-in-law and the officer both needed to catch this guy, and worked together to do so. Putting aside their own prejudices, they succeeded. Cant we all just get along, haha
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  #159  
Old 08-09-2009, 3:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Liberal View Post
I can't imagine a situation where LE would need help from a civilian...

I can...

A different and non-violent scanario:

One night loooong ago, I heard a call of a traffic accident in the unincorporated area of Torrance (LASD Carson's initial handle until CHP decides to show up). I was in the area so I went to the location to help out if I could.

On my arrival (3rd or so unit on-scene), I saw a civilian man doing chest compressions and a Deputy doing mouth-to-mouth on an unconscious woman who was injured in the collision.

The man doing the chest compressions was very calm, composed and authoritative while directing "who to do what" as needed, he knew what needed to be done and MORE THAN rose to the occasion. I was very impressed...

He apparently came upon the collision just after it happened and lept to render assistance.

So, within a few moments of my arrival, Fire also arrives and takes over and does their thing, but the woman is already dead.

The worst part for me was when a sergeant said "Did anyone get that man's info? He deserves recognition for what he did."

Talk about feeling STUPID! None of us got his info and he just faded into the background and went on his way without a word when Fire arrived...

This man deserved recognition for what he did and I failed to ask his name. To this day I am disappointed about it.

Sir: if you are out there and happen to read this: Well Done, and Thank You.


There are lots of ways to be of assistance to LE...
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  #160  
Old 08-09-2009, 6:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by X-Liberal View Post
I can't imagine a situation where LE would need help from a civilian, they have plenty armaments and force. On the other hand if anyone was getting criminally assaulted I would do something. Certianly would think well before presenting a gun in the presence of cops and fighting going on could be bad for your health.

Have you read this entire thread? If so perhaps you missed posts #69 and #99. Go back read these and that should answer your question.
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